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Support vanishes. so if the biden campaign is there saying look, were doing great in south carolina and they are doing great in the polls in south carolina right now, the real big question is what will that number in south carolina look like if hes third in iowa, third in new hampshire, something like that? >> we also, again, transparency, play a role in that confidential on those nights, iowa and new hampshire. you wrote, and i read your book on this subject more broadly. and that is which love...

Whats the problem with that where democratic party political history is concerned? >> the problem is if you dont win iowa or new hampshire, if you dont win at least one of them the track record in the modern era of winning the democratic nomination, basically nonexistent. one case where it happened it was bill clinton in 92. but iowa was uncontested that year. so i dont really count that. otherwise, every nominee in the modern era of democratic politics has won either iowa or new hampshire or bo...

So i dont really count that. otherwise, every nominee in the modern era of democratic politics has won either iowa or new hampshire or both. and the reason its so critical is i think folks at home know how these campaigns go. if you win that first one, all the new media attention you get, all the money you get, all of the momentum. everybody wants to join the bandwagon. if you win the second one after winning the first one, that bandwagon is suddenly ten times as big. if youre on the losing end ...