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Off. >> and you say you can know that definitively why? >> well, because you have two transponders. if one stops working, you go to the second one. so to have a redundant system and both of them not operating, that means it was done by some human being. >> john, you also think if this new information pans out that human intervention is involved here. >> certainly the sequence of events leads one to believe that there was somebody sequentially turning things off in that airplane. i mean, theres j...

Just kind of projecting where the plane should be, correct? as it moves from one radar station to another, correct? >> there are huge gaps in the radar coverage around the world. and especially over open water. in the north atlantic just every day theres hundreds of flights that go from new york or boston to europe and back. there is a pretty big chunk of the atlantic ocean that that is no radar coverage. and we use other means to communicate. that flight boeing when they built the 777 put satel...

Works but not enough knowledge to know how to stop everything and keep the electricity on. because you need the electrical system working so the airplane can fly. you cant turn it off like you can smaller old airplanes that were piston-driven where you could actually turn off the electrical. you cant do that in these modern jets. >> fran, what do you make of this? the mind obviously immediately turns to terrorism as a possibility. just based on if these devices are being shut off, with time apar...

Great. >> professor, do you agree with what mary just said, or do you focus more on human intervention in this? >> well again, we have to keep all hypotheses open. its hard to find a credible hypothesis where you have the sequence of events that we have here. if there was a problem on the airplane where you had lets say a cockpit fire or something like that, or depressurization, it could explain losing the transponder. it doesnt really make sense to head off in the direction the airplane headed ...

Circuit breaker so you can disable the system. if you knew what you were doing you could pull the circuit breaker on that. youd have to have a fairly sophisticated understanding of the airplane to do that. >> mary, at this point you like everybody else is not ruling anything out. what at this point are kind of the data points that youre really focusing on? >> well, i think for me and looking at it from an investigators eye, you want to look at what makes sense, what fits together the pieces of e...

Appreciate all you being with us. ron, youve flown in the region for years. what does this new information tell you? >> well, this new information is kind of going pack to what i said to you last night. remember i said theres three factorses, the airplane, the crew talking about the pilots and an outside force intervening. remember i said to you that when you program the fms, which is the flight management system to make a flight, its going to fly that flight unless some human being changes that...

But even those on the east coast of the u.s. and other worldwide, i like most of the world really have never seen anything like this. its pretty incredible. >> commander marks, i wish you the best. thank you. >> very welcome. thank you. back with us aviation journalist and former ntsb member john golio. you just heard from the commander major shift westward along with the indian navy now being asked to participate in the search. what do you make of that? the commander describing this as shifti...

Actually an airline internal communication system. originally was sort of like a simple text message that you could get from the cockpit. but over the past few years its been automated so things like automatic engine reporting is put onto the acars link. acars can use one of two frequent sa frequencies. the normal voice frequencies when youre line of sight over land. but if the airplane is equipped it can link the information up through a satellite link. it only does it at a low period or not ve...

Question, but its on a lot of peoples minds i know because people have been asking me about it all day long. people are asking, you can find a cell phone. you can track down a cell phone through satellites these days. would it be possible to do that on any of the passengers cell phones to somehow get a gps location from any of the passengers cell phones if theyre out there? >> no. whats wrong with that youre not getting the signals from the satellite. the cell phones getting the signals from tow...