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Of ukraine with harsher economic sanctions than in 2014, perhaps even defending ukraine, although not specifically what that entails. in practical terms, what would that actually entail? you would have to think that in president putins mind there is a calculation that he knows america will not come to war against russia to defend ukraine, everything else they can withstand. >> you just put your finger on the basic problem here. look, they can put more sanctions on russia. they can try to do thin...