Transcripts For ALJAZ Inside Story 20240711

Sites within 24 hours from the approval. So i would expect maybe on day 2, after approval on the 11th or on the 12th of december, hopefully the 1st people who will be immunized across the United States across all states. In all the areas where this, the state department of health will have to told us where to deliver the vaccine. G. 20 leaders say theyll spend no effort to ensure the Fair Distribution of coronavirus vaccines around the world. Wrapping up their Virtual Summit hosted by saudi arabia. Take a few specifics on exactly helpless and began to eat. They also promised to help poor nations to recover from the economic damage inflicted by the pandemic. If you o. P. s Prime Minister has given rebels of the Northern Tier grave region until wednesday to surrender, Government Forces are threatening an all out assault on the regional capital mechanic. Vote counting is underway advocate of fossils president ial and parliamentary elections. President is seeking another term that is being challenged by 12 of the candidates, and some are already alleging election fold. Legal team is appealing a Pennsylvania Court ruling which dismissed him attempt to invalidate millions of malin votes. It was yet another legal setback in trying to overturn the results of the u. S. President ial election opposition parties in pakistan have held a huge rally, calling on Prime Minister and one khan to resign. The rallies happened in defiance of government bans on public gatherings. Demonstrators say the government is using coronavirus as an excuse to stop them. Those are the headlines and news continues here on aljazeera. The inside story of like a blanket of toxic smoke. Indias capital is suffocating with Dangerous Levels of pollution. And people in new delhi are being warned, it could make them more vulnerable to covert 90. So what can be done to avoid a disaster . This is inside story. Hello welcome to the program and bernard smith, the i call it. Indias capital is amongst the worlds worst in winter pollution in new delhi soars, making it extremely difficult to breathe. The air become still in the thick cloud of smoke settles over the city. Its full of pollutants from vehicles, Construction Industry and crop burning to name a few. These lead to eye and nose infections and lung diseases. And on top of that, theres the corona virus which makes for spiritual illnesses, potentially deadly. The quality of air in new delhi deteriorated dramatically nearly 2 weeks ago. It reached 490 on a scale of 500. A score between 0 and 50 is what the World Health Organization considers safe to breathe. But on november 10th, particle pollutants briefly surged to 30 times the safe limit. The number of people complaining of a spurt or disease in new delhi was reported to have risen. Doctors say 13 percent of the citys recent covered 900 cases may be linked to air pollution. Many new delhis residents have complained of breathing difficulties on days when pollution levels saw. Going to face trouble breathing as well as mild headaches. More than usual, as the winter is settling in along with the rise and pollution, our head hurt even more. It is absolutely impossible to go out and about without masks because of the pollution they would be really going to have diabetes and hypertension. The double blow of covert 1000 and pollution has affected me a lot. I wasnt stepping outside my home because of the bad air and the lack of physical activity made my diabetes get worse. Pollution is posing a lot of problems. I run daily after running on the road. I feel the impact on my life. It feels heavy. I bought this protection mask for that, but the pollution is so bad that this mask in provide adequate protection from polluted air. The level of oxygen becomes low. If we dont wear a mask, we face problems. There is pollution that got slightly better after the rain. It is still there, mike. New delhi is battling both toxic and direct called surge in corona virus infections. Its seen more new cases than any other indian state. More than 7000 people a day, a developing covert, 19, the number of beds available with ventilators is shrinking. The government has flown doctors in from other regions and expanded testing, but there are still Major Concerns over the ability of new Delhis Health care system to handle the crisis. Lets bring in the guests there all in new delhi. We have deeper, senhor, an assistant professor of economics at Ambedkar University in delhi, dr. Sirica verner, an ear, nose, and throat surgeon, and karthik is a Research Fellow at the council on energy and environment and water. Welcome to each of you karthik. Ill start with you. If i may, this pollution appears every autumn. Its not new. Why is it still happening . And why is it getting worse . I think its happening everywhere, primarily because you know, this is when the winter sets in. So its as much a meeting phenomenon as it is a manmade phenomenon. And is it says basically that this pollution exists around. It just manifests itself in such a worse manner in the windows. So the vehicle or pollution, the dependence on private vehicles. They have the management of solid waste in the city state of delhi, incessant burning of waste that happens of because its not collected in this post off in an appropriate manner and construction, dust and debris. All of these big sources of pollution which dont get addressed. Youre around and it just comes up, you know, in a much bigger way, and i think it will be episodic incidences of proper ning, and the valley fire crackers, all of these add to it. So i think theyre, theyre a distraction for the policymaker, honestly, because they focus their attention inordinately on attending to those, you know, for the few weeks in the days for which the, those exists. But then the moment that dies down, everybody feels that weve gone back down to levels which are acceptable. And then for the rest of the year, nothing happens, no news channels cover it either, unfortunately. And in november next year, or in october next election, ill be an op in arms. So i think its basically because the attention is there only for a very start beating on the issue. Were not addressing it in a holistic manner throughout the deeper is that what happens, people kick up a fuss for the few weeks that the pollution is that and then they forget about it and forget to address the root concerns. Absolutely, i completely agree. If you look at the causes for the pollution, much of those apps, ischemic, the congo, anything about them ecological issues. But we all know what that come autumn. This is how its going to be. And then us so many things in domes look for the Behavioral Changes as well. Those institutional structures this need to be done in the much more consolidated memory and the sustainable model of continuously. Well, i guess the pollution and theyll be dont see that happening. But what we see is that those who cannot afford it, if they grow up to get out beautifier out as the season changes, while others upload. But overall, its something thats become like that it doubled. Lets learn whats in the fleet. One thinks of the city and the government said, generally the public seem to be thinking about it only when does either come sorry, can i mention this must be one of the busiest times of the year for you. Can you just explain what the worst the most severe consequences of this pollution are on patients that you deal with . Well, you shouldnt Program Throughout a lot in cities like delhi and the golf was it becomes much wasnt been dull, but were seeing the safety yet only up from september to february. So it does they distressing. Do not do that well at a time, then you know, yell to have base in the back to make the boat one thing which is not done in the body. And then the added pollution makes it much worse. You have this the distress in the latitude basins where the last month and i have been describing medications. The end of lead, because were not fully aware that in november that it is really become much worse. The pollution levels will go beyond control. And oh yeah, well its our children and patients the specifics. This was stocktaking, then it was only ok, collings and pollution act and find them because theyre going to have a minister to disease. Ok. Thank you. A cough think many indian set cities top the global list of the most polluted new delhis the at the top of the list. Why is new delhi particularly more susceptible to this level of pollution than other parts of the country, even though there is pollution elsewhere . What, whats special about new delhi . I think its the geography of course is a very big part of it. Its just, you know, it sits adjacent to like a hurley big dust bowl. Which means that theres always a constant influx of dust coming in from the desert, and from perhaps even from central asia that adds to the ambient levels into the day. But in addition, this is the metropolis thats been growing, you know, in an uncontrolled manner for the last 3 or 4 decades enough. And as a result of back, its, i guess, and doesnt have any abating influences of the coast, right . Which lets them move by a chennai article got to have as a result the pollution basically stays and we dont get this effect of meteorology which you know, with the temperature inversion. And all of that in other, in other parts of the country where the population density is so much an added to that the dependence on private vehicles for instance. And that is phenomenal. There is of course, a lot of public transport available. The metro is great. The pa system is reasonably good, but the number of people using cars to get it on is just, i mean its, its outstanding. So all of that, of course thats to it. And i think the bigger problem really is that the city administration, the state administration and the Central Administration are 3 different bodies that basically control it. And does this no coordination among them to actually make things better . Right. So some roads that are under some administration, some, some roads and others. So because of the lack of coordination, its like, you know, if you handle it, you handle it. And as it is hard to know, but hes handling it, and thats one of the reasons why we have, i think, a plethora of issues that the city faces. Deeper conflict mentions the bureaucratic problems. India has got a central pollution control board and there are state pollution control boards. How effective are they trying to manage pollution in the states but cut in 3, the pollution control birds dont really have that much beef and they had, they not been placed to do this kind of cordon nation among states on policy issues to give an example. One of the external factors in the season is the stubble bonding, which happens in the neighboring state of punjab. So the ag, because of the policy said has to change and the Punjab Government has to reach out its farmers to use alternative technology. That is something that the pollution control board that entries not empowered to add to. It is so consistently behind an ordinance putting, setting up a new commission that is supposed to look into all of this. But once again, this happened only last month after the pollution began. So we do need a better Institution School or at least these issues that n. T. V. Dont have to make this thing along with Building Infrastructure in terms of public transport and so on and Public Awareness as well. I think leave the institutions that the havent or to to have them sirica. Of course, on top of all of this, we now have the coronavirus. How is the pollution making life harder for people who are suffering from coronaviruses . Is it making things worse . He call it 19 or takes that is pretty systematically and reduces the oxygen saturation even in the best of times. Then you have the pollution increasing to such levels. This fitrakis just increases and so even patients who are becoming getting back into one pot and they never home isolation, im not needing to the oxygen. And that is why our big hospitals, us from beds available for every patient. Almost every patient had this issue. Handle of and the oxygen starts dropping if you dont need high oxygen beds. And that is already stretching the existing, very thin interest at the breaking point. And i, even today, i was struggling to get a couple of people and with their 2, its a very different that i am now a, do you see any light at the end of the tunnel . Dr. Is this going to get worse . Do you think review . Well, i mean, you know, then download the struggling. Fortunately, india has sell a lot of mortality. Thats 1. 5 percent compared to us. And europe probably looked at it the reasons or probably because of the well be should have been exposed to different kinds of fire. This is earlier on and that is hopefully our saving lives because bus stations were going to 8595 percent. They say let it go to get all, i think said that pollution needs to be back. And so that the employer gets back to us. The other infant deaths, pollution cause about 1. 26 lakh. Thats well and im still for a disease then you know only, well were 90 happened, then b. And i would stop. And then i, we have had about one point, you know, black and thats in india for a disease that is causing deaths every year. Yet i dont recall because hes not taking it basically just yet. I would like it would lead to that in an emergency. Ok. Deeper referred earlier on to stubble burning as one of the reasons for have in neighboring states punjab and haryana again. That has been known about for a long time, the burning stubble from the rice paddy straw from the rice paddies. Why hasnt the government able to tackle a lot so so were looking at you with the farmers in punjab on this matter. And i think the primary challenges that you know, this generation, a pharmacist country that is so used to this cycle of, you know, rice and wheat that for them to think of shifting away to something as rent. Dick was systemic changes, right . Right from the procurement options for organised of crop that they might so do training regarding, you know, how do you go bar, you know, cropping other in other crops, the watering back down the resources required. All of that needs to start from scratch because the government actually spent a lot of time and money getting them to grow rice in the 1st place. You see they would actually left and youre talking about, you know, through the eightys and. d now, given that the not so much effort and money has gone into actually getting them on board to cultivate place, i think equal amount of effort needs to go into sort of make a new learning all of that and telling them that, well, this is not sustainable. For many of us, the most important of which is the water availability in the state of the job, which is precipitously declining with every passing year. And in the interest of long term agricultural prospects for the state. I think the farmers will have to adapt to growing something else, but that is not going to happen with strict art collector. I will find you if youre born. It has to happen with one holding with, you know, these agricultural extensions as theyre called school. So to say for farmers to go and learn and for them to get resources and to stop them and to get the resources to paint them. And if that doesnt happen, and if the government doesnt, you know, look out of their own market mechanism to provide other crops they otherwise would cultivate. This is probably going to go on for a while until, you know, it just becomes unsustainable. In many other ways to just go to ice and branch out, which would be a sad state of affairs. Because it can be quickly though help us understand why this. Why this process of burning off has enjoyed the governments trying to get farmers to find other methods to clear the field. And i know theres a tight reef seeding pretty area between the harvest. Just help us understand why thats a problem. I mean, the solutions have been developed a home grown, thats the beauty of it, which is, you know, theres this, you know, these happy cedar and, and these are the technologies that help, you know, incorporate the, as i suggested you in the soil. But the thing is that all of these are, you know, implements one on top of the other. One job is already one of the most heavy, mechanized agricultural states and perhaps regions in the world like the per capita ownership of things like operate of, of harvesters and of tractors, probably rivals jadavpur and america. Which means that, you know, i think more and more employment makes it very expensive prospect for farmers to actually continue doing it. And theyre already under serious live with that. So that after we leave, you know, models that are sustainable in terms of whether its leasing, whether its Community Purchase and use it. And then of course the education part of it, as i said its, its happened in 4 years. But every year unfortunately, weve kind of gone with the stick in september of each year saying, you know, do this or you get fined, do the same, you get fined and the political will to sort of brilliant, implement the fine is not then its unfairly right to actually ask them to pay a fine because nothings been done throughout the year. So i think unless we can actually put money where the mouth is and do something about it. And i think in the long run, the better solution is to not even the long run, but money in the medium term to get them away is probably the solution. But i think its happening increasingly when the conditions were seeing. Because a lot of people are saying that the cost of agriculture is already going up significantly in punjab and maybe list come to it that in a farmers the shift and mass as opposed to you know, trying to sort of solve the rice, how do issues that deeper the government does have a National Plan and launching 2019 to, to cut pollution by 20 to 30 percent by 2014. How realistic does that target look now . So like all of the issues that kind of think this talked about in would be this. We have been discussing the dont see in the Actual Movement on the ground or manual says, so if the think that if things continue to read, theyre not then the targets. I think that the important point is for understand that this solution is not the one thing event that this is something that needs a change in many, many things like the act because the policy. So it cannot be that in these months we find the promise and then the rest of the other things go on as usual. Thank building public, the public transport separation of the duction of all of this. And we dont see and use that to be happening. And all this cannot be put on the only individuals and on the public. So advertisement kind of athens, but all of this needs structural support. They need a lot of investment. I mean from the government also, you must remember there is a sense even as a huge number of people who are below the poverty line and the high levels of inequality. And therefore, unless it is support in the longer well infrastructure then maybe as other systems you think one what and in fact one thing if its business as usual, then im not ready will. So reka what is the effect on recovering patients of pollution . I mean, and telling people to get out of new delhi if they recover, what happens to people . Oh, to go there. You know, its always you always enough, but you did it. Well, you did it that uses the, the governor, well, most 50 percent and of your goal to be seen that patients led government from all over the well of many fibrosis and they have a distinctive difficulty. And for even 6 to 8 weeks after their naked eye, b. P. Said negative still and you happy you did it. It just makes it much worse. And with all the festivities that have happened, people ive been out in the boat the out of causing the pollution is just an added burden on the existing problems. And i list the government, the serious about acting well you shouldnt not just with land, but with actual actions. Youre going to be very, very difficult times ahead. China, the government there is aggressively promoting now green vehicles of course, and in china theres a much more top down control over the development of the states economy. But china seems to have seen the future for greener industries. Why hasnt india yet . So i think hes got a fantastic policy by her ford electric vehicles, and thats the sort of to put the iceberg in any case. But, you know, all of those are going to come in maybe, you know, in about 5 to 10 years for 5 to 10 years. All of the scenes are incrementally going in back, you know, each year maybe, you know, 5 percent or whatever it might be. So i dont think its a line on just dollars they dont, industries to come in and replace is likely to solution at all. But thats it. India still needs to do it. And i think theres a whole suite of policies that you have been looking at there. The announcements from the finance ministry, a great performance linked incentives for, you know, industrial manufacturing, particularly annoyed those that represent green nostri is there. Of course, indias been slow to get on the bus primarily because, you know, we dont have the fundamental in us and manufacturing backbone that china has had for now, you know, at least 3 or 4 decades. And unless you sort of build that up, you know, and our degrees, our own reliance on china even for simple compensate, is basically an electronics industry. We will of course find it a challenge. But i think the government is serious about it by many because it understands that jobs in india rely on these industries actually coming in. And thats really the future. And automotive, for specific reasons you talked about cars, is one of indias biggest exporters. And as well as in a big contributor to overall g. D. P. In the country as well. So they are definitely, you know, are serious about it. But you know, that is not going to solve the problem for another 10 years, at least because the stock of because of the having the continuous sales of, you know, petrol and diesel vehicles that are already, you know, are there, were probably, you know, continue well into this decade its so i dont think we should land that to solve the problem. But its something that i think really is being addressed deeply. You seem to have suggested in some area earlier answers that has been a failure by the government to grasp the seriousness of pollution. Do you think the government grasps the importance of a green future of Green Technologies . I think im afraid or tickets all day. And there is definitely much more that knowledge meant all my mental issues now than there was even say about 4 or 5 years back. And they do see many of these coming in. But at the same time i would replace the point that year. And one of the issues is that each of this is to look at it in a different silos and we have to see the link. So be it because your policy, the nutrition policy, the employment policy, all of this has to become creep along with being broke, or like the used to say and 3rd. But it also needs to be looked at from an environmental lens mouse. I think it needs a much bigger change in the publics faith in the really think about what economic progress means and what is the kind of of future that we see for ourselves. And then by the in technology, one rule is one company. So all of this is coming in in piecemeal, why not witches . But they dont think that theyre not having anything. But at the same time, i think the Bigger Picture from thing that and sorry, can i just ask you in terms of honoring also an economist, but clearly the amounts of ill people you are dealing with. These are people who could be working on who should be working, do you and dont take telling people to take a lot of time off work because of the risperidone. Diseases are suffering from the cost of staying at home and looking after a sick bed and is 100 millions of dollars. Unfortunately in india we dont have data but. 6 the economy cost of health, poor health is huge. If the government can be able mindset as to understand the logic big healthy. 6 nation is going to create a lot of hidden economy. The way china has had back the air. Pollution is something that in debt, can definitely learn from that. One thing used to shut down because of bad it. And i think hes already right now. Like what i think of the 5 say we have the plans in place. We have the words in place of you dont have the action to go with those plans. B. Have to start stopping Thomas Blanch like germany is already stopped. Its last bullet fired up. I did 2020 and in guess even now stopping new polygons based on colin and so we have to walk the ball. We have to create open forests. We have to do a lot more than they actually are doing expect the whole your population. And i would also like to add that the Health Budget needs to go up really high before because the guy didnt help get us more sleep out related by the private sector. And the government needs to invest in that as much. Its a difficult things, but this is also there. Well, actually it seems to happen at the policy level in the end, i will as well step back to review it situation. Its a great time playing out to start making massive changes in their policy that every action should be a Sustainable Development so that we can have a healthy up relation and we dont remain of the same policeman next year. Ok, thank you very much for that. We are unfortunately out of time folks, but funks to all of our guests to think going to and thank you for watching. You can see the program again any time by visiting our website, aljazeera dot com. And for more debate, you can go to our facebook page, facebook dot com or slash a. J. Inside story. You can also join the conversation on twitter. We are at age 8, inside story on this era for me, but its made a whole team here. But if you want to help save the worlds sneeze into your own, the b. B. C. s journalism is revered around the world, but its close relationship with the British State has always placed limits on its independence. I love the very existence of a sum of things. It goes to the flow. Phillips explores the little known sentry long tussle between the b. B. C. In the u. K. Government and considers the current threats to its future. If the government has, it in the b. B. C. What they do see, the enemy is on the movers battle for the b. B. C. A listening post special on aljazeera. There is no channel that covers world news like we do. We revisit cases in the state and says here it really invests in that. And thats a privilege. As a journalist, im convinced the top stories on aljazeera. The head of the u. S. Vaccine program says the 1st americans could receive treatment as soon as december 11th. Thats a day after regulators need to decide on the emergency use of the vaccine produced by pfizer and german partner biotech. The plan is to back snake 20000000. 00 people before the end of the year. Our plan is to be able to ship vaccines to the immunization sides within 24 hours from the approval. So i would expect maybe on day 2 after approval on the 11th or on the 12th of december