Transcripts For BBCNEWS Victoria Derbyshire 20240714

Members has been passed to conservative hq. And stopping children viewing porn online. An age check scheme designed to stop under 18s viewing it expected to be delayed by the government yet again, but will it work when its eventually rolled out . U nless unless every single household in the whole world is asking for the password before you log in, there is no way to police it. If somebody else has a laptop, what do you do . What is he looking at . Now you have watched something accidentally. Hello. Welcome to the programme. Were live until 11 this morning. So there are four left and one of those four will be your next Prime Minister whether you want them or not. So of the four who would you prefer it to be . Let me know victoria bbc. Co. Uk or message us on twitter. Also later well talk to the stars of itvs new sunday night period drama beecham house, starting this weekend, described as downton in delhi. Tom bateman and bssie carter, are live in the studio at around half ten. Before all that, lets bring you a summary of the news so far this morning with annita. By the end of the day well know the final two candidates in the race to be the next Prime Minister. Conservative mps will whittle down the finalfour, with borisjohnson a clear favourite to make the final cut. He has the support of nearly half his fellow mps, while jeremy hunt, michael gove and sajid javid vie for second place. The final decision will be made in a postal ballot by around 160,000 Party Members. Meanwhile, the chancellor will warn the tory leadership contenders that £26 billion the treasury has built up for extra spending or tax cuts will be soaked up, if there is a no deal brexit. In a speech in the city of london this evening, hes expected to say the future Prime Minister will face a stark choice secure an agreement and protect britains prosperity or risk damaging the economy. A former taxi driver has pleaded guilty at the old bailey to drugging four more women. John radford, previously known asjohn worboys, was almost freed from jail last year. The 62 year old has admitted to four further offences in which he drugged women with the intention of sexually assaulting them. Iran and the United States say that an american surveillance drone has been shot down over the strait of hormuz. Irans revolutionary guard say they brought down the Unmanned Aircraft when it entered its airspace. Pentagon sources say their Us Navy Drone was flying in international airspace. Tension remains high in the region following a number of attacks on oil tankers that washington and its allies have blamed on tehran. The uks First Hydrogen powered train has gone on display in warwickshire. Its hoped the hydroflex will be a major step towards removing diesel trains from the rail network. Hydrogen trains are said to be the greenest trains, giving off zero emissions and their only by product is water. The train will be tested on the uk mainline in the next few months. An age check scheme designed to stop under 18s viewing pornographic websites is expected to be delayed for a second time. The controversial changes, which require users to verify their age using personal identification, was due to come into effect next month after already being delayed from april 2018. The reason for the delay is not clear. Young people under 30 are spending less on their social life than the same age group did at the turn of the century. Thats according to a new report from the Resolution Foundation looking at Living Standards amongst different generations. In contrast, people aged over 65 are spending more of their money on things like restaurants and hotels. That is a summary of the main news, back to you, victoria. Good morning. So whos going to take on Boris Johnson . Its a busy day for conservative mps. Theyre voting right now and will again this afternoon to whittle the final four leadership candidates down to two. Barring some bizarre implosion, one of them is certain to be mrjohnson but who else . Its incredibly close between jeremy hunt, michael gove and sajid javid. Lets talk to alistair burt, the former Foreign Office minister who is supporting jeremy hunt and worked for borisjohnson when he was foreign secretary and nicky morgan joins us from central lobby, who is supporting michael gove, welcome to both of you. Let me ask you, is it because you worked for borisjohnson and you know what hes like to work with that you are supporting jeremy hunt . Because i work with jeremy hunt. I worked with him at the department of health and the foreign origins Foreign Office and im voting for him positively because of the policies ive seen, its not a comparison but i knowjeremy well and he has the right characteristics to do thejob. And he has the right characteristics to do the job. Are you resigned to borisjohnson being to do the job. Are you resigned to Boris Johnson being the to do the job. Are you resigned to borisjohnson being the next uk Prime Minister . Not in any way. When you take the debate to the country and you look at the conservative membership and they get a chance over a period of weeks to examine the candidates, remember, boris has been a bit more shy than he normally is with interviews and the like, so when you go through the process of hustings and interviews to come, i hope people will see thatjeremy is a quality candidate and a serious man for what will be a difficultjob to come. Nicky morgan, have you cast your vote or are you on your way to do it . Im on the way to do it but the polls open five minutes ago. Thank you for stopping to talk to us on the way. Your man, michael gove, seems to be catching jeremy hunt. Why do you think that is . Well, people have been listening to the debates on the hustings and i think many people in the party understand that the reason im supporting michael and he has a strong track re cord michael and he has a strong track record in government, but he also has been an original brexiteers who led the vote to leave campaign and it is important we have people who wa nt it is important we have people who want brexit, and we will have them in the final two, to debate in front of the members and michael is the best placed person to hold boris to account. You will know that philip hammond, your chancellor, says a no deal brexit is going to harm the economy and he is expected to say this ina economy and he is expected to say this in a speech tonight and would devour the £26 £26 billion brexit war chest. Are you clear that michael gove would not take the uk out of the eu without a deal . Michael, like all of the candidates left in the race has said that if it really came to that choice between iio really came to that choice between no brexit and no deal he would have to contemplate no deal. Are you co mforta ble to contemplate no deal. Are you comfortable with that . At the end of the day you cannot compel two sides to make an agreement. There is an agreement on the table that has not passed the house of commons and michael set out a clear plan of how he would try to change that to get the agreement through and in the debate on tuesday night when there was all the other noise between candidates about brexit, michael was the one that cut through with the plan as to what he wanted to do. He emphatically said he wanted there to bea emphatically said he wanted there to be a deal and he has been leading the department most exposed to no deal, so he knows the downsides and was also brave enough to say that it if it takes a bit longer than the sist if it takes a bit longer than the 31st of october, we should take the time to get the deal right and he is correct. Are you clear what his plan is for the lower sales tax . You said he would replace vat and that brought in around £9 billion per year. So how much less will his new tax bring in and how will he make up the shortfall . I dont know the numbers and details. But it is quite important. That is why we will have a members contest and michael, being one of the two will be quizzed on the details. Have you not ask him . Ive talked to him about it but britains taxis are more and more complicated and there is a £12 billion gap between what should have been collected and what was last year. As we know, more and more sales are happening online, so its notjust vat, he sales are happening online, so its not just vat, he talked about Business Rates and as chair of the select committee we are doing an enquiry into Business Rates at the moment and looking at business taxes as well and i think it is right. The world is changing, the world of retail and the tax system has to keep up to date with that. Michael is right to identify that as a challenge for the country. Do you think tactical voting is going on . The idea that borisjohnson once jeremy hunt alongside him in the final two because he seesjeremy hunt asa final two because he seesjeremy hunt as a weaker candidate . final two because he seesjeremy hunt as a weaker candidate . I am shocked, as many people in britain will be, that you have suggested that any of my colleagues are engaging in tactical voting. But it is not a game. The best thing to do is to vote for the people you think will be best to lead the country and ive been clear from the beginning of this that it isjeremy hunt. I dont care what others do. Tactical voting is wrong and there isa tactical voting is wrong and there is a risk of it backfiring and it is the wrong thing to do. We have a solemn responsibility. The people of the uk are not getting their chance to decide who will be the Prime Minister. It will come in time through a general election where there have been changes Prime Minister in government before but we ta ke minister in government before but we take the responsibility seriously and jeremy is a strong candidate to be Prime Minister and i also think that if borisjohnson is the other name on the ballot paper that members of the conservative party will have a chance to choose the best of the candidates and i think with the competence and background, it will be jeremy. Have you picked up it will be jeremy. Have you picked up from people that Rory Stewarts boats are going tojeremy hunt . Up from people that Rory Stewarts boats are going to jeremy hunt . They will be going in all Different Directions Rory Stewarts votes. Would jeremy hunt take the uk out of the eu without a deal . Nicky characterises it well in relation to virtually all the candidates. I thinkjeremy is the best bet to get a deal and therefore not put the uk and the position of having to choose between no deal, something very destructive and other choices. I think that is why it is so important to back a good negotiator and someone to back a good negotiator and someone with a Good Business background and someone who can bring people on board to negotiate an gettis in the position of getting a deal because no deal would be disruptive which is why i am backing him because i think you will avoid the situation. Would you describe yourself as a realist . A pragmatist . Pretty much. I can see nicky smiling. 0k, 0k. Your man reckons he can open up the Withdrawal Agreement with the eu . Sort out the backstop . That is fantasy, isnt it . You have to have people who believe they can make progress from where we are. We have the basic arrangement between the eu and uk, 550 pages between us and that wont all disappear but whatjeremy has said that if you approach people who are facing a common problem, the eu does not want no deal. Ireland does not want no deal and people want a solution. If you approach it reasonably and pragmatically to get that, you have a more strong chance of getting a result. If you approach with a hard line on demand this that and the other, as some of boriss supporters have tended to give the impression in the last three years, you will not get the deal. That is why i thinkjeremy will succeed. Kenneth clarke said on tv last night were that the candidates or robbers because they are pretending they can get a tweak to the deal. He sees the Irish Foreign minister, jeremy hunt, he sees these colleagues in europe and he knows how anxious they are to get a deal and they will work with someone get a deal and they will work with someone reasonable and practical and serious and diligent to get it, and i think that isjeremy hunt. Serious and diligent to get it, and i think that is jeremy hunt. 0k. Nicky morgan, have you picked up that Rory Stewarts votes might go to michael gove . They will go all over the place. We are definitely picking up some support and we will have to see when the result is announced that 1pm. They are not going to go to borisjohnson though, are they . It seems unlikely they would make that switch to boris but i never second guess colleagues and i think we will wait to see what happens at one p m. Alistair burt, as you said, former Foreign Office minister and Boris Johnson said as you said, former Foreign Office minister and borisjohnson said on tuesday night he did not think his mistake in describing the british iranian mum injail mistake in describing the british iranian mum in jail described mistake in describing the british iranian mum injail described as a journalist didnt make any difference. And you were there when he made those comments and potentially had to do clearing up afterwards, so do you agree that is comments did not make any difference . Macro yellow i have met her little girl, her father in tehran and its a very difficult situation. But it might be if boris becomes Prime Minister. The iranians watch every programme and every word thatis watch every programme and every word that is said and i will not say any more. I dont know how hard all of my colleagues over all the time that Nazanin Zaghari ratcliffe has been detained, and there are some in iran who are trying to assist this, but she is not part of the Leadership Campaign. Do you think she is part of the Leadership Campaign . Does it not go to the character of somebody who wants to be your leader and next Prime Minister when they make errors like that . I understand what alistair is saying and hes right, asa alistair is saying and hes right, as a former Foreign Office minister but im afraid it does go to the character of the person and you should leave the details of this very difficult and tragic case, and i thinkjeremy very difficult and tragic case, and i think jeremy has very difficult and tragic case, and i thinkjeremy has done a very, very good job in standing up for Nazanin Zaghari ratcliffe good job in standing up for Nazanin Zaghari ratcliffe and making good job in standing up for Nazanin Zaghari ratcliffe and making the case to the iranians government, but i think the candidates stand on their track record of delivering government and that is why i am supporting michael having followed him into the Education Department where he made a huge difference to this countrys schools but alistair is right, we dont want the details to become part of the leadership contest but decisions made in previousjobs must have a bearing on their suitability for the top job. So you dont think borisjohnson is suitable as a top job Prime Minister asa suitable as a top job Prime Minister as a result chris matt that was one of the factors in the decision but its more about believing that michael is the right person rather than deciding the others are wrong. Would you serve under him . Under boris . I think its extremely unlikely on the basis of everything ive said over the last few weeks or months that this would even be a remote possibility, so im not even thinking about it. Kevin on Facebook Says Boris Johnson thinking about it. Kevin on Facebook Says borisjohnson seems to be the only one willing to fully respect the democratic process. How do you respond to that . Jeremy, like myself, voted to remain in the eu and we have demonstrated our support for the democratic process by supporting the Withdrawal Agreement, triggering article 50 and that demonstrates a great deal of respect for the democratic process. Nick on twitter says sajid javid would appeal to a broader electorate, michael gove and jeremy hunt are safe but could be accused of more of the same. Johnson is a buffoon who cannot be trusted with the diplomacy neededin cannot be trusted with the diplomacy needed in these times. And on twitter says is a conservative voter all my life it saddens me that they cannot offer candidate in which i have any confidence. And malcolm says thatjeremy have any confidence. And malcolm says that jeremy hunt have any confidence. And malcolm says thatjeremy hunt sounds and looks convincing and can be trusted to do looks convincing and can be trusted todoa looks convincing and can be trusted to do a good job as pm. I want to ask a question finally about charisma. People who know Boris Johnson say he is charismatic and, in comparison, somebody like jeremy hunt isjust in comparison, somebody like jeremy hunt is just a in comparison, somebody like jeremy hunt isjust a bit boring. What in comparison, somebody like jeremy hunt is just a bit boring. What do you say to that . I think they will see more ofjeremy over the next month or so as he goes round the country and does the hustings. I think people who have worked closely with him, if you listen to one or two of the people he was involved with at the department of health, that the parents of those children who died and their respect for him now because he has maintained this concern about patient safety, he has change things as far as they are concerned that as matter to them as afamily and concerned that as matter to them as a family and i think that is charisma because it goes beyond politics and is about something deep inside the individual and i think people will also see the international stuff he does well, whether it is dealing with World Leaders across the board or whether it is the more intimate negotiations. This is a character who started his own business with a Service Background with his family and then went into public life, has done big jobs and has got the style and as people see more and more of him, definitely has the charisma to do thejob. Him, definitely has the charisma to do the job. Nicky morgan who said the man you are supporting, michael gove, you want him to be there to hold Boris Johnson gove, you want him to be there to hold borisjohnson to account. What you mean by that . I think michael is the best person to scrutinise boris and debate against him. There will be 16 regional hustings for the Party Members and there is a survey on the conservative website that puts michael as second place and i think it is essential and if you see the stuff in the telegraph about the fa ct the stuff in the telegraph about the fact his campaign do not want to face michael gove, thats why it is essential that michael is in the final two. There is a real debate, both about plans for brexit and michael taking boris on about that but also about an ambitious domestic agenda for the country and people wa nt agenda for the country and people want to hear that as well. Thank you, both. Nicky morgan, supporting michael gove, and alistair bought, supporting jeremy hunt, thank you for coming on the programme. Bob on twitter says i dont want any of them, butjeremy hunt would be least damaging as the continuity theresa may and trousers candidate he would have a go at getting a largely unchanged Withdrawal Agreement through. Michael gove, it says on text, will be forever shackled in the fight against drug abuse by his hypocritical stance about cocaine while being a user himself. He is not Prime Ministerial material. Finally, twitter, boris or sajid javid for pf. If it is michael gove orjeremy hunt i hope we have a general election. And june texts to say thatjeremy hunt seems the most reliable. Iam going i am going to talk to one of Boris Johnsons supporters later. Well be talking to the stars of a new sunday night period drama beecham house. Its being described as downton in delhi and is from the director of bend it like beckham. An inquiry into islamophobia in the conservative party has been promised by all the leadership candidates this week. But how extensive is it . This programme has learnt that the tory party has now been passed more than 130 allegations of islamophobic and racist behaviour on social media by people who claim to be members of the party. Conservative hq have also confirmed to us that theyve suspended another member who was involved in running a controversial chat group on facebook which claimed to be supporting Boris Johnson. The group, which contained racist and islamophobic comments, has now been taken off the site. 0ur reporterjim reed has the story. We are talking about two facebook groups in particular that have around 5000 members and the main one was a borisjohnson Supporters Group andi was a borisjohnson Supporters Group and i should point out that this was com pletely and i should point out that this was completely unofficial and there is no suggestion the candidate was aware in the first place. There was also a disclaimer on this site saying that its not linked to the official campaign, but as you can see prominently featured photographs of borisjohnson so that is the impression you would get. And another of the people involved has been suspended . There are seven administrators of the site and the conservative party have suspended one of them because of comments she made online on some of the sites while an investigation is carried out. These alleged comments have already been passed to conservative Central Office and that includes comments like this one, tow them back out to sea, sink the boat, referring to the migrant crisis in the mediterranean and another one i wa nted the mediterranean and another one i wanted to bring to your attention referring to tony blair saying that this all started with blair and his open door immigration policy. There isa open door immigration policy. There is a word beginning with b that i cannot say, but he should be hung on a long drop. We are not naming the person who made the comments because it is conservative party member and not an elected official. We try to contact yesterday but we received no response. Tell us a bit more about these facebook groups. There are a number of groups that popped up that claim to support conservative mps, candidates for the leadership, so there the borisjohnson one and another one that says it supports Jacob Rees Mogg but i must point out there is no suggestion that the people involved are aware of these groups but nevertheless the comments posted, anybody would describe them as strongly leaning towards islamophobia, especially referring to sadik khan, this is one of the borisjohnson to sadik khan, this is one of the Boris Johnson groups, saying to sadik khan, this is one of the borisjohnson groups, saying it is un british to have a muslim mayor in this country, let alone that racist little, and again, a word i cannot mention on tv. We are not sure if some of the comments are being made by conservative Party Members as we dont necessarily have evidence and it could just be people going on the sites and making comments on the post there. What do the candidates and conservative party say about this . Ijust wanted and conservative party say about this . I just wanted to and conservative party say about this . Ijust wanted to say and conservative party say about this . I just wanted to say that these websites, two of these websites have been taken down. We spoke to facebook this morning and they said they were taken down because of a violation of its policies last week so they proactively took them down after they saw what was on them. Interestingly, the problem is that they popped straight back up under different names. I want to bring this onto your attention, and other Jacob Rees Mogg site, a site that claims to support jacob Jacob Rees Mogg site, a site that claims to supportJacob Rees Mogg. Notan claims to supportJacob Rees Mogg. Not an official one. No suggestion he is even aware of this. Nonetheless, the administrators are the same people that were running the same people that were running the group before so it pops back up again, and comments on this last night, referring to the imam on the bbc debate on tuesday night, again strongly islamophobic by any definition. You are not english, now go back to your little hole. Another comment we found, and i should point out these are not the odd isolated comment and it is easy to find a post like this. Another one saying, they hate us, referring to muslims, they hate us, referring to muslims, they hate us, referring to muslims, they hate dues, so why dont they integrate . Thats the flavour of things you can find on this site. We pointed out the comments to facebook and they have removed the comments as of this morning. You mention the imam who appeared on the bbc Leadership Debate on tuesday night. I will talk about that in a second but a response from some of the people involved has come through. The conservative party said that these facebook groups are in no way affiliated to the conservative party and any form of discrimination and abuse is wrong and they will take action like this very seriously. We understand that a dossier has been passed to conservative Central Office that includes at least 130 comments made on social media by people that the person who provided the dossier thinks our conservative Party Members or there is a suggestion that they might be, so those are the numbers we are talking about. Which is going up for the last time there was a report about the numbers of complaints being passed on . The last dossier was about a hundred, so its gone up by about a hundred, so its gone up by about 30. I spoke to the person providing the information last night and he thinks it could rise easily 250. Those are the numbers we are talking about. The conservatives have suspended people including those we spoke about earlier on, but at least a couple of dozen have been suspended as a result. Boris johnsons Campaign Said there was no link between these independently run online groups and their campaign and allegations of this nature are taken seriously by the conservative party and it it says is passing on information to Central Office and Jacob Rees Mogg repeatedly distancing himself from the group and that these people have no place in the tory party and it is encouraging the action is being taken encouraging the action is being ta ken swiftly. Encouraging the action is being taken swiftly. You mention to the bbc debate on tuesday night, that was one of the guests who asked a question on one of the candidates. After the programme was broadcast it was emerged he had made comments on twitter that were allegedly anti semitic. The bbc said it checked his social media profile before the debate itself and it had been taken down or they could not access that profile and he then restored it out of the programme which is when the bbc says that the comments emerged but they were not visible at the time and if they had been, he would not have been selected to ask the question and he has also been suspended from the school where he is a deputy headmaster. Thank you. Lets talk to Mohammed Amin who is the chairman of the conservative muslim forum and sajjad karim who is a conservative mep and a muslim. Welcome to both of you and thanks for coming on the programme, and let me get both of your reaction, tell me get both of your reaction, tell me why you think people are posting that kind of content thatjim described on an unofficial page supporting Boris Johnson . The conservative party is a Big Organisation with a members and its not surprising that large little parties have some people with unacceptable views. But these are unacceptable views. But these are unacceptable views. But these are unacceptable views are not randomly distributed. The labour party has had many issues with anti semitism but i havent seen issues in the labour party with islamophobic problems, but in the conservative party its the other way round where we havent had anti semitism issues but we have had too many incidents of islamophobic comments, so what is it about our party that causes people who have anti muslim views to think that they belong with us . What do you think the answer to the question is . I think it comes from the tone from the top. Let me give you a positive example. David cameron, shortly after he became party leader, in 2007 he spent several days staying with a muslim family in birmingham and afterwards he gave interviews in the media about how impressed he was with muslim family values. When you have that kind of message coming from the top, clearly people who have unacceptable anti muslim views will tend to keep quiet. When you have a Senior Member of the county party writing an article in the telegraph comparing women wearing the burqa to bandits and bank robbers, people like these is larmour feel legitimised and they start wrote it people who are islamophobic come out of the woodwork. Do you agree that when Boris Johnson writes out of the woodwork. Do you agree that when borisjohnson writes words like that it legitimises islamophobes and they come out of the word . Its abundantly clear that any prominent politician in a leadership position needs to be aware of the effects of any form of wording that they may choose to use. Theres nothing wrong with being challenging in your ideas or challenging in your ideas or Challenging Society per se, but there are direct actions and reactions to the wording that any individual may use and therefore there is a responsibility on anybody that holds high office in the uk, or indeed anywhere else, to ensure that they are not going to be putting forward arguments in a way that could lead to negative repercussions within society. Particularly challenging the very basis on which oui challenging the very basis on which our society is built. Just repeat, borisjohnson our society is built. Just repeat, Boris Johnson and his our society is built. Just repeat, borisjohnson and his team made it clear that those facebook pages had nothing to do officially with his campaign or him. And he has apologised, during this campaign, for any offence he may have caused by previous comments. Is that enough for you . I listened to his apology during the Leadership Debate and i found it completely unsatisfactory. There is no recognition by him of the damage that his words have caused. So an apology is not enough . He hasnt apologised. He said if i have upset you. He hasnt apologised for the fact that mostly women were abused in the street, verbally, sometimes physically, as a direct result of his column. An apology would be to say i write this column, it was a mistake, i wont do it again, that is an apology. Sajid, how significant did you find it that all of the leadership candidates committed to an external inquiry into islamophobia in the conservative party and does it matter that it was triggered by a question from a and imam who himself has posted offensive comments . I welcome the fact that an inquiry of this nature is going to ta ke inquiry of this nature is going to take place and the fact that it came in the way that it did i think is really quite irrelevant. I think anybody who is a member of the conservative party, who believes in an open, tolerant society, will welcome the fact that, quite clearly, there is enough there for an investigation, or to merit for an investigation to be carried out and we now have a situation where all of those people who are vying for leadership of the conservative party have given their commitment that, should they become leader, they will carry it out. Brandon lewis, the chairman of the conservative party, is refusing to confirm that this investigation will kick off immediately. Is there any point in hanging around . Well, i think we are in the very last ages now of an important process, so far is the leadership is concerned. I think as soon as leadership is concerned. I think as soon as that is out of the way, we are perfectly able to ensure that an inquiry is launched immediately will stop at what can happen between now and that time is that some planning work can go in, because this inquiry cantjust start work can go in, because this inquiry cant just start immediately work can go in, because this inquiry cantjust start immediately by itself, it needs a certain element of planning to be done beforehand. So we can get the structures in place and make sure once a new leader is in place, we can get on with it straightaway. You said recently you would leave the conservative party, you would quit the conservative party if Boris Johnson becomes Prime Minister. Since saying that, have you come under any pressure . No, i have encountered no pressure at all, it has been deafening silence. It doesnt mean that people inside the conservative party are necessarily happy with what ive said, i wouldnt expect them to be but ive encountered no personal pressure. Wouldnt expect them to be but ive encountered no personal pressurem there a possibility that you could be pushed out . Anything is possible. No Political Party likes dissent. Alistair campbell has been expelled from the labour party, so anything is possible. Is that what you are expecting, you are expecting to be expeued expecting, you are expecting to be expelled from the conservative party . | expelled from the conservative party . I dont know. 0k, we will see what happens. Thank you very much for coming on the programme. Sajjad, thank you for your time as well, conservative mep joining us from brussels. And thank you for your messages. Rees e mailed to say that for me, sajid javid is the best candidate, with jeremy hunt for me, sajid javid is the best candidate, withjeremy hunt a close second. They both answer questions directly while others talk their way out of them and johnson and michael gove cannot be trusted. Francis says my vote is forjeremy hunt. Bob says i dont want any of the four, howeverjeremy hunt would be least damaging. Ithink howeverjeremy hunt would be least damaging. I think i may have read those messages already, so i am sorry if i am repeating them, i cant remember. I will bring you this breaking news, it is to do with jack shephard, the so called speedboat killer. He hasjust lost jack shephard, the so called speedboat killer. He has just lost a court of appeal challenge for the manslaughter of 20 charlie brown. You may remember, Jack Shepherd went on the run just before you may remember, Jack Shepherd went on the runjust before his you may remember, Jack Shepherd went on the run just before his trial my 20 year old charlene brown. He has lost a court of appeal challenge against his conviction for the manslaughter of 24 year old charlotte brown. He was convicted and sentenced to six years in jail. Speedboat killerJack Shepherd has just lost that appeal to his conviction. Soon, youre soon going to have to prove youre 18 or over if you want to watch porn online but not just yet. Thats because the government is today expected to yet again delay the start date. The age check system could mean handing over your credit card details, address or mobile phone number. Changes were due to start onjuly 15th after being delayed from april last year. But when the new law is eventually introduced, will age verification actually work . Recently on the programme, we brought you a film from newsbeats nick rotherham, as he went on the hunt to find out all you need to know about the new porn law. There are obviously some images in this film you might not think my first stop is a flat above an off licence in watford. Id come to meet industry newbie pax. Hello, pax. How are you . I wanted to see how the people making porn felt about having an age block on their work. Nice to meet you too. Director . Yeah, director. So you are calling all the shots tonight. Im going to try. Do your family know that you do this . They do now. I like to think if i avoid things, they will go away but it doesnt work like that when your porn is on the internet and you have a 19 year old brother. How old was your brother when he when he saw it . He was 18, i think. Do you think the legislation coming in here that might stop people below 18 from accessing it then is a good thing . I dont know, its on the fence. Ever since ive been growing up, you can see porn on the internet so it seems like a little bit too little, too late if you ask me. I mean, im not fully against it and i wouldnt have helped in my situation anyway. To try to stop children from watching films like the one being shot tonight, the governments going to make all porn sites verify the age of each of its visitors. Director nate reckons that will be bad for business. But nate may have no choice. If he doesnt check the age of his visitors, his site could be blocked in the uk. Before, i could technically be in the street peddling porn like, hey, hey you guys, have you got access to a computer . Bye bye have you got access to a computer . Bye bye still. Now, someone is in the street, saying, excuse me, do you want to watch porn . And it is like, let me watch it in peace. I like it, i like it a lot. What you think is going to stop it working . As much as policing it is needed, how do you Police People . It is almost impossible. Unless you start literally, every single household in the entire world, asking them, before you login, here is your password, there is no way to police it. Even then, dad falls asleep in front of the laptop, what you do . Im going to go on that. What is he looking at . Now you have watch something accidentally. You cant stop it, it is impossible. I feel like, ifeel like, i dont want kids watching my porn. I dont want kids watching my porn. I dont want kids watching my porn. A lot of porn stars, they have children themselves and im sure they dont want their friends watching it. You spoke to harley, she told you she has got relative she doesnt want seeing her porn. I am relative she doesnt want seeing her porn. Iam putting relative she doesnt want seeing her porn. I am putting up porn for you, for him, do you guys. You know what imean . For him, do you guys. You know what i mean . Does that mean i should spend more money or, like, you know, be governed in such a way because a p pa re ntly be governed in such a way because apparently i am irresponsible for clearly telling people dont go on my site unless you are 18 . Is porn victimised, is that annoying . My site unless you are 18 . Is porn victimised, is that annoying7m my site unless you are 18 . Is porn victimised, is that annoying . It is probably past annoying but is one of those things, like, who do you explain that to you . As human beings . You would think no one would say that is on the same line. I never want to see a beheading on the bus. That is society, violence is all right but sex, consensual, free living sex, oh, no. We can speak now to jerry barnett, founder of Campaign Group sense and sensorship, author of book porn panic, and he also used to run a porn streaming site. Dr kathy weston, criminologist who specialises in parenting and families. Welcome vote. Your reaction at first that there has been another delay. That is basically the government is realising there are a lot of issues attached to passing legislation like that. As im sure the other guest will allude to, there are a lot of concerns around privacy, that adults are having, so i think that isjust pa rt are having, so i think that isjust part and parcel of the process. 0k. Are you pleased with this delay because you dont want it at all, do you . I have opposed this law and the run up to it for many years, for about a decade and, yeah, the Privacy Concern is one but actually, i have much bigger concerns, which is that this law is being introduced to use a sensuous it like censorship system, the type of which no democratic country has ever implemented. What you think the link is between the law and the wide ranging censorship . Is between the law and the wideranging censorship . As eventually, porn is the beta test for a broad censorship. The Digital Economy act, under which this gaming, effectively forces isps to block sites that they are ordered to block sites that they are ordered to block by the british board for film classification, so for the first time in british history, there will bea time in british history, there will be a blacklist of sites drawn up that dont comply to british law and isps will be forced to block that. I dont see this as about porn at all, it is the trojan horse since the censorship came in and it will undoubtedly go beyond porn once it comes in. So is your issue that the isps will have to do this or that some sites are being blocked at all or that the bb fc are involved . The issue is that democratic countries should not have wide ranging censorship on this scale. There will be millions of sites blocked. Howd you know it will be wide ranging . The rumour is that about 4 million sites will fall foul of this law initially and that is just within porn. Sorry to interrupt, i am trying to understand, why would they fall foul of it . Because most sites in the world which are classified as porn, which include Sex Education and erotic sites, will not implement this age verification because it is only a british requirement, the age verification, so the plan would be that sexual sites, not just pornography, will be blocked. Are you against age verification . pornography, will be blocked. Are you against age verification . I am against implementing it by blocking sites that dont comply, because thatis sites that dont comply, because that is using a sledgehammer to crack that is using a sledgehammer to crack a nut. But are you against age verification . I dont see a great need for it, we have Child Protection systems already. I have two small children and i protect the way they use the internet. Doctor weston, just react to some of the things said there. First of all, there is already protection out there, why do we need these extra age verification legislations . There, why do we need these extra age verification legislations . |j think from my perspective, you know, i work with parents all the time and in lots of my talks, i am telling them, sharing Research Evidence around the consumption of pornography and i would just like to make a few points. First of all, the safeguards thatjerry referred to, they are not working. We are the largest consumers of pornography in this country the largest consumers of pornography in this country are teenage boys. The average age of a boy encountering pornography is 11. The government, even childlike, did some work in 2015 were 12 15 year olds were saying that watching pornography was just normal behaviour. So pornography has become normalised within teenage culture and what i do welcome and very strongly is the government has basically said, wait a minute, what is going on here . We have to do something. Now they are working it out and there are lots of concerns, some of them are being framed within this discussion of democratic rights, our liberties. Iam concerned about the Mental Health of our children, i concerned about the Mental Health of ourchildren, iam concerned about the Mental Health of our children, i am concerned about what is going on within the intimate dynamics. In teenage relationships. A final point thatjerry reyes, if it leads to, as he put it, 4 million pornographic sites are blocked by isps, you say, so be it. From a parenting perspective, that is exactly what i say, because we are not talking here about older teenagers, even, iam not talking here about older teenagers, even, i am talking about the fact that i have met nine year olds addicted to pornography, ten, 11, 12 year olds are consuming pornography easily. Pornhub is one of the most popular sites for 11 and 12 year olds in this country. Most parents, most mothers in particular, have no concept of what we are actually talking about here, what the content is actually like. We are not talking about, you know, the sort of content that was in a magazine like playboy backin that was in a magazine like playboy back in the day. I am going to pause you there, because there is a technological reason, i have to move to our next guest, but im really grateful, thank you for your time and thank you coming for on. Jerry barnett, thank you. At this very moment, conservative mps are casting their votes for who they want to replace theresa may to be the next leader of the party and your next Prime Minister. There are currently four in the race the favourite Boris Johnson, sajid javid, jeremy hunt and michael gove and it is going to be whittled down to the final two today. One of those conservative mps who has just voted is bob stewart. Who did you vote for . Boris. Why . Well, i have been a soldierfor most of my adult life and i commended a battle group and i have been in combat. I know it may sound trite to some but one click way of me assessing people is to ask myself whether i would actually trust any of these people with a platoon of 36 soldiers if they had to do an attack against some way. And the answer was, yes, you would trust Boris Johnson to lead that . It was. Yes, of course, he has done things wrong but i have to ask you, who hasnt done things wrong . What you think he has done wrong . In the past, people have accused him of philandering with people, obviously, ladies, but, you know what, so what . Churchill in 1940 had you know what, so what . Churchill in 19110 had a lot of people against him andi 19110 had a lot of people against him and i actually want a leader of our country, i want someone that is actually going to inspire, someone thatis actually going to inspire, someone that is going to get out there and someone that is going to get out there and someone that has flaws. Yes, eve ryo ne someone that has flaws. Yes, everyone has got floors and i reckon he is the guy flaws. And i reckon hes the guy, when i did my rough and ready, some would say silly but it wasnt silly to me, would i trust any of these four to lead a platoon battle . Any of these four to lead a platoon battle . Boris got top marks. Do you feel comfortable that he seems to say one thing to one person and another thing to somebody else in order to get their support . Goodness me, iama order to get their support . Goodness me, i am a politician. Order to get their support . Goodness me, iam a politician. 0ne order to get their support . Goodness me, i am a politician. One of the reasons i didnt put my name into the heart is i am not political enough. That is what politicians do. Sorry to interrupt, in some cases, thatis sorry to interrupt, in some cases, that is lying, isnt it . Well, it could be. People say, politicians call it economic with the truth. Personally, i never tried to be economic with the truth, that is one of the reasons i am not standing. So you are acknowledging that potentially borisjohnson is a liar and that is ok. No, you are putting words into my mouth. What i am saying is as a politician, he has to put things in the very best light and so does everybody else. All four of them are doing the same sort of thing. He seems to have said to some people, yes, come what may, we will leave the eu on the 31st of october and you may have seen him on national tv the other night saying, well, 0ctober national tv the other night saying, well, october the 31st is eminently feasible. Frankly, as far as im concerned, i read it that we are leaving the European Union by the 3ist leaving the European Union by the 31st of october and boris is going to lead us out of the European Union. One of your colleagues, antoinette sandbach, is an mp3 constituency in cheshire and she says Boris Johnson constituency in cheshire and she says borisjohnson is divisive in the north of england. What you say to her . He is divisive in the south of england, too. Politics is about choice. And frankly, there will people. Might mail is full of e mails from people telling me do not vote for boris. I dont suppose the vast majority of them would vote for me either. How, then, is he going to be the person, if he gets the topjobs, to going to be the person, if he gets the top jobs, to unite the country . Well, i tell you what, when i was in the civic centre in bromley about four months ago, i was withjo johnson and bob neil, fellow conservative members of parliament for bromley and some teenage girls, mainly girls and a few boys, came up to me and they said to me, is that jojohnson . To me and they said to me, is that jo johnson . Is that to me and they said to me, is that jojohnson . Is that boriss brother standing over there . And i said, yes it is, and they said, can you get his autograph for us . And that is called stardust. Boris can appeal to parts of the country, parts of society that others cant, and that is why he is a leader. Who do you wa nt is why he is a leader. Who do you want the other name to be on the final two . Want the other name to be on the finaltwo . To be honest, i dont know. I like michael gove, i like jeremy hunt and i like sajid javid. We will just jeremy hunt and i like sajid javid. We willjust have to wait and see, but it looks like boris is going to be in the final two. But if i had to have a second vote, im not sure who i would vote for and there it is, but all of them, it is a good crack, as they would say northern ireland, where spent so long. Thank you, we appreciate your time and we did contact sajid javids team for a supporter but no one was available. They are probably all voting. Sunday night telly is famous for its period drama but itvs latest offering beecham house is a little bit different. Its being described as downton in delhi and it stars tom bateman and bessie carter. Its set in delhi in 1795 a key moment in Indian History before british rule. And while the story is fictional, the drama features several real life characters, from emperors to military leaders. Heres a clip. Welcome. It is an honour to meet you. News of my arrival has travelled so quickly. India does grow on you, mrs beecham. We will stay here and make a life together. In a garden full of beautiful flowers, i see your eyes have rested on the only english rose. He may not be all that he appears. Why are you holding the child . There has been a tragedy. We have been given a new beginning, we must forget the past. My last home was full of secrets, i will not tolerate the same here. You must not tell a soul. No if anybody sees you, it will ruin everything. I have no one i can trust. You shouldnt have come here. Lieutenant beecham is a traitor its on sunday night at 9pm on itv. Lets talk to tom bateman, who plays the lead characterjohn beecham, a former soldier whos bought beecham house to begin a new life with his family. And bessie carter, who plays violet, a young englishwoman who has moved to india and a potential romantic interest forjohn. Not for him. I dont think he looks at me once. Yes, i come over absolutely gunning for a marriage, hopefully, withjohn. Absolutely gunning for a marriage, hopefully, with john. Ok, fair enough, so it is not necessarily reciprocated. Tell us about the story. So, as you said, it is set in 1795, it follows john beecham story. So, as you said, it is set in 1795, it followsjohn beecham into this new house, which becomes beecham house. He has led to the east India Company because, as we find out, he is very unhappy with the way they are sort of going about things in india. In terms of exploiting. Yes, in terms of exploiting. Yes, in terms of exploiting. I mean, beecham has done an amazingjob, it exploiting. I mean, beecham has done an amazing job, it is not black and white, it is an interesting way of telling the story mike gurinda has done an amazing job. Sojohn mike gurinda has done an amazing job. So john leaves mike gurinda has done an amazing job. Sojohn leaves there and begins a new life in india and as we find out, he has got a new child, we dont know where the mother is and it isa dont know where the mother is and it is a big sort of mysterious character and re meet all of these other characters who have their own motives and secrets. Are you happy with the downturn in delhi . Your dad was in downton abbey, the butler, very famous. I am upstairs, so i am not complaining. He was downstairs. I think Leslie Nicholl said once in an interview, the only sort of similarity is it is an upstairs and downstairs sort of household but even within that, upstairs and downstairs completely intertwine, so it is downstairs completely intertwine, so it isa downstairs completely intertwine, so it is a different time period, it is set in india and it is an honour to be dubbed that, because downton was fantastic but it is a different area of history and it is in india, it is completely different. You were in vanity fair, which was scheduled again ona vanity fair, which was scheduled again on a sunday night up against bodyguard on the bbc. Is it demoralising when you realise that is the case . You know, you have made this thing, you have poured your heart into it and then you think, oh, my gosh, it is going to be up against x oh, my gosh, it is going to be up againstxand oh, my gosh, it is going to be up against x and we will get less attention as a result . Yes i know. We live in a world where catch up tv. I we live in a world where catch up tv. I personally dont watch anything live on television. A bit here and there. Apart from beecham house, nine oclock on a sunday. But for me, i was asked that quite a lot when we were doing the press for it and lot when we were doing the press for itandi lot when we were doing the press for it and i said, well, lot when we were doing the press for itand i said, well, i lot when we were doing the press for it and i said, well, i love that British Television is getting this response and if there is a sort of tug of war between two very successful dramas, then i think it isa successful dramas, then i think it is a good thing, but if you pour your heart and soul into something for months and months and months, you would love it to be watched by everyone, but of course that is not the case. I think a lot of people did watch it on catch up and so even if they dont catch it when it is coming out. You appear in beecham house without a shirt. I dont know on how many occasions but i do know the tabloids have already picked up on this and described you as the new poldark. When you read the script and realise that is part of the deal, what goes through your head . Well, nothing, really, it has been made much bigger. I was having lunch with gurinda yesterday and it is literally seven or eight seconds. So you dont immediately think you have to get to the gym and sort yourself out . Im clearly not one of those actors that goes to the gym. I very much like the reality of the fa ct very much like the reality of the fact that this man doesnt go to the gym, he has a job to do and he wouldnt look the way that maybe captain america would, so for me, it wasnt bad. It wasnt gratuitous, gurinder had it embedded in the story, john is doing something very practical, there is danger and intrigue and he is doing something thatis intrigue and he is doing something that is purposeful. That requires him to take a shirt off . India is so hot. Even doing any manual labour. We find him in a private moment, doing some manual labour, he starts with his shirt on, gets very hot and ta kes with his shirt on, gets very hot and takes it up and as soon as the character turns up, he put it back on, so it wasnt gratuitous. The old heat excuse. You are not on social media at all. No. You are. Why and why . I mean, i have looked at your social media on instagram, it is just you having a nice time with various relatives and friends, rather than amazingly posed, like many on social media. No one cares who i am. I du. Thanks, tom. Many on social media. No one cares who i am. Idu. Thanks, tom. Iam many on social media. No one cares who i am. I du. Thanks, tom. I am on twitter but very rarely use it and i am not on facebook. Instagram, it has been a few years now and i mainly follow friends to stay in touch with them or people who make me laugh, i follow lots of funny poets, daniel piper is a great one and my feed is things i want to see and my feed is things i want to see andl and my feed is things i want to see and i choose them. Tom, why are you not on it at all . I think. Number one, i think i would be bad at it, i am not very good at self promotion. Not that it is only self promotion but i dont think i got anything that interesting to say. Privacy is very important to me and i find that, in ourjobs, we are sort of pulled into a public place which is, of course, part of it and i say that is part of the job and i signed of course, part of it and i say that is part of thejob and i signed up to it, but i draw a line in the sand at certain things where i say this is my private life and im not going to share this. And, for me, it is my own happiness, really. For me, that sort of level of contact feels very unnatural to me and i appreciate the benefits that can be had from it and i think it is wonderful the ways that people can reach people and the Amazing Things that can be done, however, for me, there seems something inherently unnatural about it and something inherently unnatural about itandi something inherently unnatural about it and i think it always does tend to lead towards, like you said, narcissism which i think it is not so narcissism which i think it is not so much a good thing. Good luck on a sunday night, nine oclock, itv, thank you both very much. Bbc newsroom light is next, thanks for your company, have a good day, we are back tomorrow at 10am. Hello, there. Weve got some sunshine across many parts of the uk at the moment, the weather is settling down over the next few days, but we have got some showers around this morning, i will show you those in just a second but look at the scene there injohn 0 groats, plenty of sunshine here, sunshine, too, to the south of england. A few showers into the north west of scotland, a few as well for northern ireland, a band of showers moving south and east, so you might need your umbrella across the far south of his england this afternoon but in between the showers, some sunny spells and temperatures 19 20. A bit fresher than yesterday, we have lost the humidity. This evening, a lot of the humidity. This evening, a lot of the shows will tend to disappear but this evening across the west of scotland, we continue with a few of those end with clear skies tonight, it will turn chilly, so while it will be a chilly start of friday morning, plenty of sunshine, a bit of clay developing as the day goes on, apart from a few shows in the final to scotland, dry for all of us and as temperatures rise just a little bit, it will feel a tad warmer. Bye bye. Youre watching bbc newsroom live. Its11am and these are the main stories this morning. The black cab rapist, john worboys, has pleaded guilty at the old bailey to drugging four more women in order to sexually abuse them. Four become two conservative mps are choosing the final pair of candidates for Prime Minister. Then its up to the Party Membership to decide. Theresa may will attend her final eu summit as Prime Minister later, as her dutch counterpart issues a warning about the impact of brexit. The impact is huge, and many people are underestimating it. You will have a diminished role on the world stage, your economy will suffer, and it will have huge impact on society. An age check scheme designed to stop under 18s viewing pornographic websites is expected to be delayed for a second time