Jack smith has secured his most valuable witness yet, mark meadows. Prosecutors dont hand out agreements like candy. Mark meadows was at the center of so much of this. He could speak to trumps mindset in a very specific way. Welcome, everyone. Im poppy harlow with Phil Mattingly in new york. We begin with the federal election interference case against donald trump. The former president s Chief Of Staff mark meadows we learned was granted immunity by special counsel jack smith and met with his team more than once according to a abc news. He allegedly told investigators he didnt believe the election was stolen and talked about this moment on election day in november 2020. Frankly, we did win this election. We did win this election. [ cheers and applause ] meadows reportedly telling investigators that he believed trump was being dishonest and saying that cnn anchor of the source, kaitlan collins, joins us now. We have been asking for, i dont know, a year plus, whats up with mark meadows . Where is he at . Whet this is big. I think this is what people suspected was happening with Mark Meadows Given his name was not on that indictment that came down when it listed the people involved in these efforts around certainly. He is someone presumed to be on the list. What abc is reporting is he has been granted immunity. Its not clear what kind, how far it goes, it carte blanche, what does that look like. The other part of abcs reporting that is so interesting is what he today jack smiths team what was happening, the conversations that he claimed he told trump he didnt win the election, it was not rigged, it was not stolen. I mean, to look at that and to look at what is in mark meadows book which is a fascination because of the classified documents case, i mean, in the book he writes basically the complete opposite. Of course, its not a crime to lie in your book. I think thats something that investigators have questions about what he said then versus what he is apparently testifying. I do think if he have a fullblown immunity and questions if it came from a court order, what are the terms of it, i mean, it would be incredibly bad for donald trump. I was fascinated by what he told, according to abc, jack smiths team, that what trump said to him after the Supreme Court decision on december 11. Basically, trump admitting privately to him this is the end of the road. Yeah, and acknowledging privately yeah, trump is denying this. He has been posting nonstop since the story kalcame out, Sag Mark Meadows never said any of that to him. Of course, mark meadows word against Donald Trumps, mark meadows is someone when you cover him and he has a reputation of being someone who says one thing to someone, one thing to someone else and a was an issue in the time period because we heard from the january 6th congressional testimony people saying mark meadows you need to step in, youre the Chief Of Staff here, and he basically said trump wasnt listening to anyone who was pushing back on the election stuff. You mentioned the truth social posting from the former president going after saying mark meadows he didnt think he would do this. Inside the trump operation, whats the response to . I think they have suspected something was going on. Questions have been going around washington. They start within the trump orbit and they Know Mark Meadows is silent. His attorney doesnt speak to the other attorneys here. Thats typically something going on is they were reading the tea leaves preindictment in washington to see what was going to happen. The question also is how this Impacts Georgia and whats happening there because, obviously, when that happened and when mark meadows name was on the Indictment List it raised a lot of questions of how it causes issues for jack smith if he is trying to use mark meadows as a star witness. Is it clear what, if anything, mark meadows agreed to plead guilty to with jack smiths team . No. No, right. Its Just Exchange for testimony to immunity . And thats the question because if its full immunity and he cant be charged with anything, that adds another layer. Was it a Proffer Agreement where he could go in and its in that one setting he can say whatever and it wont be used against him. There are a lot to of questions still we are still trying to bear out. Cnn has not confirmed this reporting yet about what exactly the terms of this agreement are because that makes a huge difference. Huge difference. Stay with us. We want to bring in Alyssa Farrow and tim. I want to start with you. To katlyns point, figuring out what that means, the structure, what it would entail, when you read the story, the details according to abc news, whats your takeaway . I think kaitlans right, we shouldnt conflate what would be allout cooperation, Proffer Agreements, sitting down and talking about the entire criminal conduct, everything from what you could be charged with here to a piece of candy you stole when you were a kid. Thats what federal cooperation looks like. Getting community, which is what the report indicates, for testifying in a grand jury is something very specific and that is limited in scope. That could be basically jack smith wanting to get honest testimony on a particular instance about specific questions. That does not mean that mark meadows is going to be in court testifying against donald trump. I think one of the big problems here is that he has massive credibility issues. He going to have to answer the question under crossexamination you have to admit you are a liar and are you lying now or were you lying then . Thats a tough thing. I think is there corroboration for any statements that he told jack smith . And thats whats gonna matter. Did he turn over documents . Did he the January 6th Committee he provided that Treasury Trove of text messages. He likes to text. He does. Those are the independent corroboration that could bolster an otherwise damaged witness here. Is this the mark meadows you know, this mark meadows making a deal like this . The mark meadows i thought i knew is a different man than turned out to be the publicfacing version. I think the most consistent thing folks in washington who Know Mark Meadows will say is that he talks out of both sides of his mouth. He is innately everyone in barbie does that. Right. But he particulars to a sport level. He wants to stay in the good graces of certain people. I will speculate a little bit. Knowing him very well for many years, he is a good attorney, george tur will ger. I think he is giving him tound legal advice about how far he should should go in cooperating with the Department Of Justice but mark meadows wants to be seen as never flipping on donald trump. His public statements may contradict what he is doing behind the scenes. Trump world is aware of this. There has been a year and a half, two years of souring on him and not trusting he is engaging in good faith and he is loyal to the team. I think this is a mixture of a Smart Attorney who wants to keep him out of jail and meadows wanting to be former Freedom Caucus chairman who is Donald Trumps greatest ally. We dont know what this means for georgia. We had timothy pal tori who suggested maybe this is a sign they want to make a deal with fani willis we dont know any of that. It happens at the same time just yesterday we saw jenna ellis in court tearfully not taking responsibility for her own objections to some agree. This is now the third, i believe, person to do so. What effect does this have on the georgia case . It affects how mark meadows lawyers will brapproach this. If he has a jackresolution withk smith, those two offices, jack smith and fani willis, operate independently of each other. They will be looking in saying, okay, he is cooperating on federal side, therefore, he should hop over to this side. Ther those or separate office and they will not be according to that level. So at this time until he actually signs a Cooperation Agreement i would not expect they have any impact on the fani willis case. What i suspect he is probably doing, because he does have are a serious lawyer, he is trying to cooperate enough with jack smith to avoid any future charges here while also trying to get at the georgia case through his procedural mechanisms. I dont think he is looking to plead guilty in either case. Thats thipically going to be required for any kind of cooperation. You see with jenna ellis and the agreement there. She has pled guilty. Thats what cooperation means. Accepting responsibilities. Not merely coming in and talking, not merely admitting to certain things. Its saying what you ask. Frankly, i think he is benefiting from jack smiths approach which is just to charge donald trump now and put all this later on. In a typical federal investigation you would charge the lower level people earlier on to force them to flim. Because that case is focuseden on just the former president , they get the benefit of that. You know trump world better than just about anyone. This doesnt come in a vacuum. We have seen three others flip in the georgia case. Any sense that the walls are closing in . Or no . I think its publicly they will say no, its just, you know, none of this means anything, Sidney Powell wasnt really my attorney, neither was jenna ellis. Jenna ellis was so close to trump world. You cant really even overstate how close she was. She was having direct conversations with trump, out on tv. He loved her Tv Appearances where she was out there pushing back on people who were saying, you know, the election wasnt stolen. So that is one of the most interesting guilty pleas we have seen in the entire thing. Could we play the mashup of the old jenna ellis . Its stunning. Do we have that . This is an elite Strike Force Team that is working on behalf of the president and the campaign to make sure that our constitution is protected. President trump is right that there was widespread fraud. The election was stolen and President Trump won by a landslide. Overwhelming evidence of fraud. All of these false and fraudulent results to your point, less elite of a strike force than perhaps they thought. But she was the person. And in the room. And willing to go on tv and repeat it, which trump loved and, therefore, forged a closer relationship with the two of them. It was fascinating watch her yesterday in court through tears, you know, essentially arguing as you said, she didnt take responsibility. She said that Rudy Giuliani and others misled her, people with more experience. She san experienced attorney. She was this there. She knew what she was doing. Its fascinating seeing her plead guilty and the concerns that trump world has about that. Mark meadows, how thats affecting he was involved in the back and forth with the speaker race yesterday. He is talking to House Republicans. One of the parts of the House Republicans race was whether or not you voted to certify the election. That was disqualifying for tom emmer to be House Speaker. Can i mention one thing on mark meadows, too . There is the friction of the book, which is just chockfull of lies. He called it fake news when donald trump criticized it. Writing something wrong in a book, thats not a crime. Myself, as you remember from the january 6th, cassie hutchinson, testified to the fact and to the Department Of Justice that mark meadows told us things along the line of w lines we are going to stay in power. So i think there is going to be a bit of a friction in testimony they may get from him about him saying the election wasnt stolen and apparently allegedly telling the truth to donald trump and then when he said to other people. He said a number of Different Things to different people on capitol hill as well. Thanks, guys, appreciate it. Overnight qatars Prime Minister saying he is hopeful for a breakthrough. Could intensive talks pay off . Back on the ground in tel aviv with the latest. They are going to give it another shot in a couple of house, the house is going to try to elect a speaker. Israel rejecting calls for a ceasefire and pounding gaza with another series of airstrikes. Listen to this. That was a huge blast a short time ago near our news camera staked out or a rooftop, the bombardment hours after the head of the United Nations called israels collective punishment of the Palestinian People and demanded an immediate ceasefire at a contentious Security Council meeting. Relentless bombardment of gaza by israeli forces, the casu casual casualties continue to mount and are deeply alarming. That to a sharp and fiery response from israels foreign minister. Are you the cause as say before for a ceasefire. Tell me, what is a response for killing of babies . For rape women and burn them . For beheading of a child . How you can agree to a ceasefire when someone spoke to kill and destroy your own existence. How . Also potentially a hopeful development. We will see on hostages this morning, the Prime Minister of qatar says he is hopeful there could be a breakthrough soon in negotiations with hamas to release more of those hostages held in gaza. Lets go to erin burnett live from tel aviv. So, erin, there is that update from qatar. I want to ask you about what president erdogan of turkey said. He defended hamas. He said its not a terror organization. He also went on to say turkey has, no, quote, no problem with the state of israel but called out atrocities. Its a tightrope he is trying to walk here. Reporter you know, yeah, poppy, i mean, look, this reflects the unfortunate schism that you see out there right now. The sort of unfortunate reality that to call something brutal and horrific and depraved and unacceptable, then has to be met immediately its something else, also that, so therefore your original claim doesnt carry as much merit. Its this horrible cycle we are hearing now. President erdogan, i mean, there is no nuance on this. Hamas is not a terrorist organization. He just said in a speech, but a group for liberation and fighting to protect their land and citizens. He said the west got together and seized them as a terror organization. Turkey doesnt owe you. Turkey doesnt have a problem with the state of israel. You know, look, you are seeing him in very explicitly sided with hamas going further, frankly, that dmitry pos could have, the spokesperson for putin. Looking the other way on the atrocities committed by hamas that we have seen from other leaders, including out of russia as well as president xi in china. Extremely direct from erdogan this morning. Speaking of countries playing delicate balance acts, qatars Prime Minister saying he is hopeful for a breakthrough on the hostages held by hamas. Qatar has been a critical component of the negotiations. What do we know about where it stands today in. Reporter talk about playing a different role, right . Qatar, which is allows on its soil hamas, taliban, organizations over time clearly labeled as Terrorist Organizations by the u. S. And europe as hamas is, right, they allow them there but also play a role of mediator. We saw that when they were instrumental in negotiations with the taliban. We are seeing that now. Obviously, the crucial party in natalie and judith raanans release friday night. They they are continuing to play a central role. The National Security advisor Crediting Qatar with that. They are talking about a breakthrough. I did speak earlier to Hostage Negotiator here in israel responsible for the release of the idf soldier held by hamas for five years. He has been speaking to hamas every day. He says there is a big deal on the table that would call for releasing all of the civilian hostages that hamas holds in exchange for Fuel Requirements as well as some sort of a temporary ceasefire which so far have been nonstarters for israel. But nonetheless, there is very clear that there is a deal that has been put on the table for days. There simply has been an inability to get it to the finish line. But significant today that israel came out specifically mentioning the crucial role that qatar is playing and it comes as time is ticking. A stark warning from the u. N. Relief and works agency this morning that says they have to shut down operations in gaza, all humanitarian operations by tonight because of lack of fuel, right. This crucial thing at the heart of any negotiations and also the humanitarian catastrophe on the ground. Six hospitals in gaza have already shut down because of a shortage of fuel. They have run out of the fuel to run backup generators according to the world health organization. The idf says there are 132,000 gallons of fuel in gaza. The u. N. Secretary general Antonio Guterres says the attacks, quote, did not happen in a vacuum. And that statement alone caused incredible ire in israel. The ambassador to the u. N. Said he will block all visas for United Nations officials to israel. Give you a sense how tight the tensions are and erdogan saying hamas is not a terrorist organization but one of liberation. Clarissa ward joins us live from cairo. What more are you learning today . Reporter well, erin, you know, its interesting you mentioned erdogan saying that about hamas because i do think that when you talk to people across this region, that you see that reflected a lot. I spoke to a person in egypt who described hamas as lions, meaning tha