Transcripts For CSPAN Justice Ginsburg With President Bill C

Law the dean of georgetown and it is a privilege to welcome you wow. I am the dean of georgetown law and it is a privilege to welcome you to the Second Annual Ruth Bader Ginsburg lecture. The first lecture was held in april of 2018. Our first speaker was Justice Ginsburg. It is a lecture series in which we honor distinguished leaders who is a champion for equality and human rights. Privileged at georgetown to have such a wonderful bond with the justice. You might have seen her portrait as you were coming down into the amphitheater. Was aloved husband remarkable member of our faculty for many years. We have a chair in his honor. The Martin Ginsburg professorship. I have to say, i am often asked, dean, what is my favorite memory . It is what we just saw. Walking into this room with Justice Ginsburg and seeing our students look with such admiration and inspiration on somebody who is one of the great figures in the history of the world but also a cultural icon. [laughter] [applause] when Justice Ginsburg gave the first lecture in april of 2018, everyone was so energized. I said to her, the one not great thing about the lecture series is you gave the first lecture and the second lecture is going to be a disappointment. [laughter] she said, i think i can handle that. So, good job, justice. This is just such an amazing privilege. We are going to have an hour in which we are going to be hearing from Justice Ginsburg, a member of the Georgetown School of Foreign Service class of 1968, president bill clinton. [applause] and secretary of state Hillary Rodham clinton. [applause] normally, when i introduce, i talk about the biographies of the speakers. I think that is pretty unnecessary. Im going to turn matters over. Leading the conversation are two members of our faculty, the authorized biographers of the and marywendy williams hartnett. End, i have questions from students. If i have your question, stand up so you can be recognized as i ask it. What an amazing hour we are about to have. A round of applause again for Justice Ginsburg. [applause] thank you dena, and thank you all very much. The dean mentioned last year Justice Ginsburg was the inaugural speaker in this series. In her usual honest way she asked me to not make tonight all about me. We are going to start with the first question, with president clinton and secretary clinton. I understand, secretary clinton, you gave a surprise gift to rbgs bookclinton of and you issued it with a challenge. Could you tell us about it . First let me say how delighted i am to be here with all of you. Schoollarly at this law that has such a great place, not just in our nations capital, but in our country in the world, and to be here with Justice Ginsburg. There are many things about Justice Ginsburg that should inspire and motivate each and every one of us. We will, i hope, get to talk about some of those little decisions that were groundbreaking legal decisions that were groundbreaking, some of the theories she was the first to put forward, and so much more about her life as an academic and certainly as a judge on the court of appeals and on the Supreme Court. There is one particular book she did not write that has had a ripple effect, and that is the workout. T the rbg [applause] [laughter] sec. Clinton i think it is fair to say a number of us who have seen that book would not want to be filmed trying to do that workout. Copies andout five gave one to my husband. [laughter] sec. Clinton i think it is also fair to say that he is very proud of having nominated her, but he is going to let her do the workout. [laughter] i was fascinated with the book. It is worth reading, even if you are a marathon runner. How, within aeing limited space, no matter how old you are, you can maximize your fitness. I thought, hey. By the time i got it, i was a 71yearold. I said, this would be no problem. I climb, i do weights. This would be no problem. It was a problem. [laughter] pres. Clinton it was a real struggle. It also shows you the remarkable resilience of the body and the , but even as it ages repetition and effort are required. Nobody talks about this very , but im telling you , repetition and effort have a chaos,imposing order on and it was very good. I am extremely grateful, even though i was reasonably embarrassed the first couple times i tried to do a workout. Perhaps i should Say Something about the workout. [laughter] i certainly did not write it, but i did write the introduction. My trainer has been with me since 1999. It was the year i had cancer and after surgery, chemotherapy, said,ion, my dear spouse you look like a survivor of auschwitz. You must do something to build yourself up. I asked around. For me. D just right his day job is he works in the u. S. District court for the district of columbia. Day, i metthis very with him last night. The only one who has gone through the routine in part with me is steve. [laughter] but i think i remember that he was gasping for air. He was. President clinton, can you do the plank . You can . Pres. Clinton she is really good at it. Have you done the entire workout . Sec. Clinton i have. Without cameras. Thats the only condition. We wont ask you to demonstrate tonight. We are going to talk in a minute about the nomination. Before we do that, i wanted to ask Justice Ginsburg to describe, there was a meeting with both of you in arkansas a few years before that. Im wondering if you could share that. I was speakingg at the university of arkansas at little rock law school. I was talking about amending the constitution and in the middle of my talk, the governor and the first lady of arkansas came into i was overwhelmed that they would do this. Immediately called my dear spouse and told him about this. That was my first meeting with the two of you. Meeting was the secretary and my then threeyearold granddaughter. Who was attending the bank Street Nursery School during the president s first campaign. My granddaughter stood right next to you. You were singing the toothbrush song. Have a picture. Justice ginsburg i have a picture frame. I wrote to clara, may you always know where to stand. Nomination, you were generous with your time and gave us this trivia for the upcoming biography. Writtenmore than a book , but its not yet complete because happily, our justice is still doing very important things. Flashback to 1993. You had just been in office barely two months when byron white announced he would retire at the end of the term. That is whyecision we are all sitting here tonight. Can you tell me how and why you Justice Ginsberg for your first nomination . Pres. Clinton first of all, this was a big deal for me. Political dramas, but the human consequences of a Supreme Court opinion are enormous. I knew justice white. When i was attorney general, i had a case in front of the Supreme Court and i let a guy i went to kindergarten with who worked for me argued the case. He said, you went to yale. I went to arkansas. Why are you not doing this . I said, because you worked a case. Im sitting there watching my guy argued the case. Justice white writes me a note saying your boy is doing a good job. [laughter] pres. Clinton that man, he and his wife and his wife in both of their families still have that framed on his wall. It is a big deal who gets to be on the Supreme Court. I have always been abstractly interested because i like the Supreme Courts we had early in the 20th century, where you did not have to be a judge. You could be something else. He did not want the job. He did not want to leave new york. I had interviewed, i had narrowed my choices to three people. The other two people i therviewed, at least in newspapers, everything leaked back then. [laughter] pres. Clinton the reason i was interested before Justice Ginsberg came to see me as a judge is as much before she became a judge as on the bench. Work for womens rights, cases in thet six Supreme Court and won five of whichincluding one or two appeared to benefit the male partners of women even though it was a discrimination in the law based on assumptions about men and women and all of that. A meeting sunday night, i sneaked her in, and thank god nobody in the press felt like working sunday night. It never leaked. We talked. After she had been there 10 minutes, i knew i was going to ask her to do the job. Can you tell us more about that meeting . Justice ginsberg, i would like to pres. Clinton i heard her talk about her judicial philosophy and what she had done. I let her know i had read about all these cases. I just wanted to get a feel for her. I have to say, we just had this event at my library in little rock, and the place where we normally have about 600 people, there were almost 15,000 people there. We had to move it to the basketball arena. There were 15,000 more who wanted to go. They could not get tickets because the fire marshal would not let them in. That i was already worried about how abstractly and free our political life increasingly some of our judicial life is becoming. Judges were seen by many people as an extension of politics and i really believe the essence of any democracy is we all live under the same set of rules. Everything else is basically a detail. It is amazing how progressive you get, to live under the same set of rules you are imposing on everyone else. Like everybody else, i was in aw e because i thought she was smart and knowledgeable and very serious about being a judge and extremely respectful of her colleagues on the then court of appeals. Some of them were pretty far out there. That could be an understatement. Know, this woman is completely on the level. I think the country deserves somebody who is on the level. Facts,l talk about the explain the law, explain the human consequences to the individual parties and to the larger polity of america. I was convinced she would. We talked for an hour and a half i think. Justice ginsberg, your recollections of that meeting, i think you had flown from vermont that morning. Tell us a little bit about Justice Ginsburg yes. The white House Counsel said we will go right from the airport to the white house and i said, then i will be in my plane clothes. He said, thats all right. The president will be coming in off the golf course. Instead, you were coming in from church in your sunday best and i was in my plane clothes. A little embarrassing. The meeting with the thent, did you president told me he really appreciated your sense of humor sneaking into the white house. Can you tell us about that from your perspective . Do have a sense of humor. It is essential in the job. [laughter] Justice Ginsburg it was a wonderful meeting. The president had been i think you were an adjunct member of the university of arkansas law faculty, not in little rock, in pres. Clinton taught constitutional law. We know what you decided. On that sunday. Judge ginsberg and marty did not learn about it right away. They had to wait until late that night. Can you tell us a little bit about why . There was a basketball game. I will give you a hint. Well, it was an important game. [laughter] the nba finals. One of the longest games in history. It went triple over time. You were waiting until it was fullyecause you wanted to savor this moment. I did. [laughter] then judge, ginsberg was home with marty. I dont think you were watching basketball. [laughter] pres. Clinton there is one thing we did discuss. You. L that i should tell inrtion was a big issue 1992. The right to choose. The reason was the court of appeals had decided the webster decision, the court of appeals generally, inand a president ial election, the sortion issue helps decide that the prolife or antichoice when theis stronger prochoice people feel totally secure, then they can find some other reason to vote against you. The reverse is also true. Election, i was one of the first democrats, prochoice democrats to run since roe v. Wade who benefited from roe v. Wade. The decision frightened the other side. She knew this perfectly well. There was a lot of pressure to ,ake sure i appointed someone which i had set i thought was important. But i was factoring in either an article i had read or something i had read on Justice Ginsberg saying that she supported the result in roe v. Wade, but it should have been decided under the equal protection clause, not the right to privacy. I asked her the question entry talked about it as if it was any other issue, this is what i think, and she made a heck case. Heck of a case. I said, you know, this is washington. Everything leaks. Everything is in the media. For her, we were just two people alone and she was telling me what she honestly believed. It made a huge impression on me. Any president that only wants to appoint people that have sussed out in advance what that president wants to hear is in deep trouble. Remember if you ever get a job like this. Everybody tells you what they think you want to hear or they dont want to discomfort , your raise any questions might as well run the place with a the lecture clinton is talking about is the medicine lecture. You might want to read it. There are a lot of interesting things in partiality in judging. It happens to be in Justice Ginsburgs book, but it is also online. It is a terrific piece. Ifretary clinton, what role, any, did you play in the decision . Justice ginsburg sec. Clinton i like to think i played a convincing role. In order to get to the candidates for justice the president would actually interview, you had to go through dozens and dozens of names people were putting forth. From inside the white house and outside the white house. I had followed the work of i wase ginsberg since finishing law school, becoming a lawyer. A lot of the cases she argued were nearly 70s were in the early 70s and i graduated from law school in 1973. When you tell people it had to be the dark ages and i knew all the people who were part of the movement. Her commitment to really pursue and some of the cases work , aught on behalf of of men property taxes exemption. It was a clear view of trying to make the constitution for the in i may havee that. Expressed an opinion or two about people he should bring to the top of the list. Thank you. No nomination would be complete without talking about talking Martin Ginsburg. He was my campaign manager. I think one of your clerks put it best that the Bader Ginsburg [inaudible] , but ifr any scenario it had not been for marty, who knows if it would have happened. Do you or secretary clinton have any thoughts on that . I dont know if any are here today, but there were a group of women activists before bill became president and we worked on equal pay and a lot of things that were important we thought in any effort to try to move towards equality and justice and andhey of course called me called other people and i recall one of them saying to me, i already talked to you once, but Marty Ginsburg said i had to talk to you again. Marshals the field summoning people and asking people to reach out to anyone may new and it only made it sweeter because of his adoring support of justice. We are about to switch. One final question for [inaudible] ginsburgtched justice 26 years. Have your expectations from that sunny day in the rose garden say met for what would you or what would you say . No, they have been wildly exceeded. The opinion on bush versus gore, one of the worst decisions ever by the Supreme Court. Concurred and i think a most recent travesty opinion and the opinion written by her colleague who also started in my administration, saying you can unconstitutionally Supreme Court, but what can you do about it . If you read the things and you should read some of the opinions worthy court is unpredictably divided that she wrote, but if you read any of her opinions, saidill see exactly what i in the interview. These are the facts that i understand them, these are the consequences and i had come out money, noent to nothing, this is it and these are the consequences. Every time i read one of her opinions, im thrilled by it. One thing i hope please the 60 when i i was age was nominated in some people thought i was too old for the job. Year am starting my 27th on the court, so one of the longest tenured justices. Age, itorried about my was unnecessary. You should all know, you probably know this, but it is a serious issue because when president reagan was in office, the republicans were easily bench asmake the conservative as they could and they started sending all these thirtysomethingyearold names. Every democratic senator has a friend, everyone of them was over 60, they wanted to be on the bench and it was a brutal fight to make sure i at least made sure everyone was healthy. By was against im really against age discrimination. I hate age discrimination and i hated it when i was young and now that i am not come i can say that. It and one ofout the most painful decisions i had to make was not putting her on the court with her, just as , one of theher great District Court judges. He had cancer and i was not convinced that the risk was worth it. He was my friend. This was a guy that i played golf with. Sadly, he passed the passed away a few years later and i did not like being right for all the years i have been wrong. I just had a feeling that she had whatever it was that would enable her to do things that no other living person had done. You are crazy not to think about. T [no audio] the risk is plentiful medical minimal. I think when you are making decisions. As momentous as picking judges, the federal bench, the person you consider should have relevant experience qualified the judge. Should be judge qualified that was not worry with Justice Ginsburg, but we have recently on therginally chosen basis of age and therefore longevity and politica