Hindering handling the coronavirus pandemic. Weve been through hell once. None of us can fathom going through halligan hello again. Again. Mr. Costa welcome to Washington Post live. This morning we continue our leadership during crisis series on how leaders nationwide in both parties are confronting the coronavirus pandemic. Our guest this morning is Governor Phil Murphy of new jersey. Governor murphy is a democrat elected to his office in 2017. He previously served as u. S. Ambassador to germany after being nominated by president obama. Before that post he had a long career in banking. Governor murphy, welcome. Gov. Murphy good to be with you. Thanks for having me. Mr. Costa case numbers are soaring in different areas of the country. Our case numbers this morning in new jersey taking up or down . Gov. Murphy the number of positive cases is holding steady. Today weve got a little bit better news on rate of transmission and how many of those tests are positive, so our positivity rate. We are watching this every minute of every day we we are making our decisions both when we shut the state and now that we are slowly reopening based on the facts and science. Our rate of transmission started to creep up over the past week and so that is a particular reason why we decided to put off indoor dining, as an example. To Face Covering we were the first state to mandate it indoors, we are now mandating it outdoors. We are watching this closely, particularly with and through e speak. Mr. Costa you have those beautiful beaches in your state or people following social distancing guidelines at the jersey shore . Gov. Murphy up give a shout out to the minister polities with which we have worked. The sure is a gem. It is a huge piece of our economy. For the most part and this has been the case for day 1 for the most part folks have been compliant and responsible. We have had some knuckleheads along the way, but we havent had any and the beach is no exception. You look at the school issue, where is your head at on that decision . Will schools be having inperson learning this fall . Gov. Murphy as i sit here on july 10, recognizing dont know whether or not we could have predicted where we could have been six or eight weeks ago, the answer as of today is yes. Commissioner put out guidelines weeks ago. We have many school district. It is the number one Public Education system in america. Tohave asked these districts put together their plans based on our guidance and parameters and come back to us as they reopen with their plans. I think the toughest not we are all going to have to deal with, not just in new jersey, but anywhere there is in Person Education the social distancing, testing, everything we know will need to be a part of this is preventing the spread of the virus from an asymptomatic young person to either an older educator or parent or someone with comorbidity comorbidities. When you say there are guidelines, how is that actually going to be enforced in hallways, and schools where you have grand classrooms . Capacityhy limitations as one of those guidelines. A cramped classroom is no longer going to be part of the lexicon, at least for the school year that is before us. District, the the superintendent on down, to not only put the plans together, execute those plans. The department of education and department of health to spot checks around the state and they do that regularly. And meaningfully. We are living up to the local superintendents and their principles and educators and administrators. We have no reason to believe that they cant do that. They are outstanding professionals. Mr. Costa if those local leaders have discretion over how to enforce those guidelines, who will have discretion in terms of shutting down schools if necessary . Is that still in your hands or is that a local decision . Gov. Murphy it is really both. When we shut schools in march, many of the districts, with our blessing, had already submitted their plans of closure before we made the statewide decision. We wanted to get that decision right. We have to remember, there is an norm us well, there is a Huge Public Health reality. There is also a lot of kids in our state who rely on schools for their only hotmail of the day. There are a lot of kids that dont have access to a device or internet access. As long as we can be responsible on the publichealth front, in addition to the education and riches of that experience, that is also a factor in terms of plans to reopen. Mr. Costa i want to come back to that term knucklehead you had signed this executive order this week having mandatory Face Coverings outside in public areas. How strict is this enforcement going to be . There is possible jail time, finds on the horizon if you dont follow the executive order. Out of will you be in enforcing it . Gov. Murphy this is one of the reasons why we would not have done this earlier. There is really two reasons. Lethalus is a lot less outdoors that it is endorsed. Indoors. That is something that underpin the decisions and sequencing of our decisions. Number two, it is hard to enforce. It is mandatory when social distancing is not practicable. When you are out with your husband or wife, running or walking in the neighborhood or walking your dog, thats not what we are after. What we are after is a crowded boardwalk, you are with other folks who are strangers, you are waiting in line for a slice of pizza, you are congregating. That is folks who are going to get attention. They are going to be warned. This is going to be up to local Law Enforcement. Warningences, first a then a summons of some kind. We would not put this in place if we did not mean business. As you point out, this is probably, of all of the steps, this is the hardest to enforce. We are relying on personal responsibility. Wethat. From moment one folks have been overwhelmingly responsible and compliant. We need them to continue to be. Mr. Costa when you say local Law Enforcement be able to make decisions, are some of them pushing back against this eo . Or are they eager to enforce it . Gov. Murphy im not sure i would say eager, we havent had respect. Folks in Law Enforcement understand this viruses lethal, it is a killer. And that we have no therapeutics, we have no vaccine and, god willing, we get both sooner than later. The only things weve got at our disposal is social distancing, Face Coverings, washing hands, staying away from people if you dont feel well, get tested, built from nothing to one of the highest testing capacities in the nation. Folks get that, including Law Enforcement. God willing we will see the responsible av or by our residents. Mr. Costa some of your republican critics in trenton are heading back in you. Republican said you are acting like an exalted ruler. What is your response . Gov. Murphy i dont pay much attention to that. Those are people trying to score political points. In makingi take joy people cover their face . If it were not to save lives . Thats what we are trying to do. We are making decisions based on the fact. Toont pay any attention political or personal points that people are trying to make. We have no time flat. This thing has killed over 13,000 people in new jersey. Mr. Costa you talked about how you may need to have some new things in classrooms, dividers, and to help teachers. Ich brings us to the issue of congress, the stimulus and state a. How much does new jersey need in state aid if there is another round of stimulus . Gov. Murphy the short answer is 20 billion. Like every state has had to deal with this and now you are seeing states of all shapes and sizes, expenses are going through the roof to deal with this. And revenues have fallen off a cliff. We signed a shortterm budget for only a three plus month period we had to this is to keep this is not some nice to have stuff. This is essential. Believe is number we the number four new jersey. That is to allow us to keep firefighters, police, educators, ems folks in their positions and serving our residents in our hour of need. We need it sooner rather than later. Mr. Costa in the meantime, you are asking your cap to make 15 cuts. Could that number increased in coming months if there is not another round of stimulus . Gov. Murphy yes, unfortunately. Bite out oformous any of these departmental budgets. Up if wer could go dont get the federal cash or, sadly, and i hope this is not the case, that the virus reignite. Ourre only as strong as weakest link in the country right now. The notion that you could bat 1000 inside of your own state and get everything right and still have the virus for cash flow up as a reality. Number could go up for either of those reasons. Mr. Costa you have also talked about revenue raisers. Congress could take their time and coming up with another round of stimulus. When you talk about revenue raisers, are you prepared to raise taxes to try to fill this shortfall . Gov. Murphy i think everything has got to be on the table. We need our legislature to give us the right to borrow from the fed program. We need the federal cash. We are likely going to need revenue raisers. The answer has to be everything is on the table. But, there is no amount of revenue we could raise that comes close to the whole got at the moment. It cant be in lieu of borrowing or federal cash. It is an element to do with this, but it cant be the only element. Mr. Costa in terms of revenue raisers, what is actually on the table . Would it be an increase in tolls . Something else . Gov. Murphy the highway reality is a separate one. Too early to tell, bob. This is not specific to the pandemic, the pandemic has exposed enormous inequities in our state. And i gotted in 2017 elected on the concept we need to build a fairer new jersey that works not just for some, but for everybody. Still have a long way to go. Targetedn of somewhat revenue inherited, particularly racial and socioeconomic lines, those for me, those of the most appealing. This pandemic has had black communities and communities of color very hard. The Washington Post has done a lot of reporting on that. Anyone who travels to new jersey notices there are small towns who have their own police force. Have you thought about moving forward in this racial reckoning to try to consolidate some of the Small Town Police forces . Home rule is both our greatest strength and latest challenge in new jersey. We are the ultimate home rule state, and that extends beyond Law Enforcement. It is Law Enforcement, it is education. Are you still there . Mr. Costa im here. Gov. Murphy i lost your shot there. It is [no audio] mr. Costa we are having a technical difficulty, we will get this going in a second. We are all doing this our best during this pandemic. You may have heard a sound earlier, it was my mailman. We are all dealing with working from home. Evan or, are you still with us . Governor, are you still with us . The program will begin again shortly. We will get governor murphy back in a moment. Thanks for your patience, i appreciate it. Are back, lets we with governor murphy. Appreciate your patience. I appreciate your taking one for the team. Mr. Costa i thought maybe you are trying to escape some questions about President Trump, technical difficulties, but i am glad you are back. Gov. Murphy thank you, bob. Just kidding. Mr. Costa understood. Lets talk about President Trump. What is your level of communication with him at this moment . He seemed to be consulting you and governors a lot early on. Is that still the case . Gov. Murphy we havent had as much direct contact in the past couple of weeks, what i dont ascribe that to anything other than the fires are raging elsewhere, and the fires here are meaningfully better. We are in touch regularly with the white house at the most senior levels. Including the president , Vice President , and senior advisors. When the fire was raging here we were able to find and i will continue to be grateful for that, forever and always we were able to find Common Ground on things like ventilators, but capacity, testing, personal protective equipment, etc. Mr. Costa are you disappointed he is less engaged with you at this time . Gov. Murphy i cant speak for other governors. I have no reason to believe he is not engaged with governors where the viruses raging. Im not disappointed. I do think a National Strategy here on things like base coverings would really help. I hope we get to that. You mentioned some silly political shots being fired in new jersey. You see those around the country. It isnt political, it is based on sirens signed. It is based on saving lives. I would love to see the Current System where i mentioned you are only as strong as your weakest link, i would like to see that transformed into a National Reality on certain principles we all arent hearing two. R adhering to. Mr. Costa should the president where a covering more often . Gov. Murphy i think everyone should. Im not wearing one right now. Butself am a big mask guy, i take it off. I think if you are going to be in a situation where you cannot social distance, i think we should all be wearing Face Coverings. Mr. Costa what do you make of dr. Anthony fauci saying he has not briefed the president since early june . What does that tell you about the state of the federal response . Gov. Murphy lesson, i dont have any insight into that other than, he has been terrific as a role model but also in private exchanges with us. He has been great. We have had very good, consistent lines of communication with folks like him and deborah birx and alex azar and others on that team. Science to time for be the basis upon which we make our decisions. I view him as an extraordinary role model. Mr. Costa what is your plan for the quarantine policy in new jersey for states around, that have seen a spike in cases . Is that going to be extended this summer . Gov. Murphy yes, for the foreseeable future. K, connecticut, and jersey and new jersey without a joint statement that if youre coming back from a hotspot state or visiting from a hotspot state, need you to selfquarantine and get tested. We are the United States of america. In a perfect world, i would be building a wall around the place right now. Folks fromrohibit traveling from one state to another. This is another one where we are asking for personal responsibility. It is going to be a heavy dose of testing and contact tracing. Weve got a Community Core of tracers we are building. Weve already had some examples. This is not abstract. We had a couple of families go to a wedding in myrtle beach, they came back and tested positive. We had some other flareups from other states in hoboken. We were able to track them down. It is another item on the list of overwhelming personal responsibility, in terms of the behavior of folks. Mr. Costa are you going to go to the Democratic National convention . Gov. Murphy at the moment i am not. I believe this is going to be a combination, from what i understand, a combination of modest amount of in person activities, i guess in milwaukee, and then the rest around the country. I am the chair of the Democratic Governors Association and in a normal convention i would have addressed the convention. It is possible i will do that remote rate at the moment i have no plans to be there. Should thewhat democratic nominee, joe biden, have as his message when he speaks to the country this summer in milwaukee . What does he need to say to convince the country to elect him and have a higher profile amid this pandemic . Gov. Murphy it is extraordinary. It is an election unlike any we have ever seen before. We held our primary earlier this week. We had a hybrid election. In light of vote by mail and scaleddown voting. Listen, ive known the Vice President a long time. Im a big fan. He is an American Hero in so many respects. I think hes got to present himself. To what story speaks informs his policies, what he stands for. As it relates to the pandemic discussion, i think he has got to reiterate that he is going to make decisions based on that back and science. I think that is what we need right now. I know that he believes that. Unusual, while it is some things never change and his presentation of his candidacy has to include his vision for our country going forward, both at our not just the pandemic, but our economy, social justice our presence in the world, our Foreign Policy beliefs. Hes got to lay that out, this is who i am and this is what i stand for. Mr. Costa final question here. Would you like to see a real affirmation of nato in the u. S. European relationship from Vice President biden . Gov. Murphy i would. I think our Transatlantic Relations continue to be weve got good relationships around the world, but the transatlantic bridge is the bulwark for the past 75 years. Nato, it just certainly is nato, it is our bilateral relations. I was the u. S. Ambassador to germany. We have no better ally than germany. I think it is our military presence, i think it is our relationship with the european union. The stronger those relations are, the stronger the Global Community is. That is not just a nice thing to stand for, that is all of the above in coldblooded interest of the United States of america. Mr. Costa governor, that is all the time we have. I hope you come back to Washington Post live at some point. Appreciate your time very much. Gov. Murphy bob, great being with you. I would be delighted to come back. Mr. Costa thank you. And thank you all for joining us here at Washington Post live. And having patients, like the governor and all of us, really these days as we deal with working from home and skype connections. We had a good conversation and we will keep having good conversations. Join us on monday at 1 00 eastern. My colleag