Transcripts For CSPAN Life Career Of Justice Ruth Bader Gin

CSPAN Life Career Of Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg July 12, 2024

These past few days have been painful and hard, and i, like you, have been heartbroken. Justice ginsburg was a giant in the law, a champion of justice ad equality, and she was also treasured member of the Georgetown Law Community for many years, beginning with her husband martys joining the faculty. She was remarkably generous with her time. I will never forget walking into on so many occasions. Every year she spoke to our first year class. Walking with her out onto the stage, looking out at hundreds of students, many of them wearing notorious rbg tshirts and seeing their faces light up and uploading ecstatically as , eventered the room though her Security Team always told us that she would leave right after her talk, she always stayed to talk to students and since friday, i have received so many photos from our students of the selfies they took with her. Notes about what a wonderful memory it was. It has been so lovely to see them. It is so hard to believe that she is gone. Askednights tribute, we some of the members of the georgetown Law Committee who knew the justice well, to come in and reflect on her career. You will be hearing from professors Mary Hartnett and Wendy Williams, her biographers. He will be hearing from two of her former clerks, professor bernstein, and you will be hearing from two federal judges when you her well, judge nina and judge margaret mckeown. If a question occurs during the event, put it in the chat with your name so i can recognize you. After i ask of the questions, i will have a few closing remarks. Joining us. For thank you all of our speakers, and above all, thank you to giving us aburg for life so worthy of celebration. Now, the last time Justice Ginsburg look at georgetown was just before the pandemic. And in february, she came and spoke about the 19th amendment in a conversation in no auditorium with judge migrate mckeown. So it is fitting that we begin with comments from the judge. She is away from her class so she can give some introductory remarks but after she talks, she will have to rejoin her class. Judge, thank you so much for talking to us and we look forward to your remarks. Mckeown thank you. All of us are at a loss now. My time with Justice Ginsburgs book ended by georgetown. When i was a thirdyear law student in 1975, i took one of the very first classes in sex discrimination. But there was no textbook and there were no papers. So the professor said, perhaps you could write to professor Ruth Ginsberg at columbia. I did that. She was incredibly generous in corresponding with me and sending me papers that i could then use to incorporate into my final paper on sex discrimination. It was just that small act of generosity and kindness that i have seen by her over the years so many times. When i became a judge 22 years ago, our episodic conversations and correspondence turned and blossomed into a wonderful friendship. We shared many meals, we shared music. And weeled together talked together overseas on many occasions one of those occasions. , a member of the audience said, what is your success as a woman lawyer, to Justice Ginsburg. Justice ginsburg said, my success and that of the other women here judge mckeown, i and others, is we have husbands who are supreme chefs. So the good news is just as ginsburg recognized limits. That was probably the only limit that i know of. She did not cook. , i, when i became a judge thought many times about things i learned here and there. First of those is i have never seen anyone work harder and more efficiently than Justice Ginsburg. One time we were teaching together and she invited my family and me over to her po ol and her deck in order to play. What that meant was that my husband and i and marty played tennis, pingpong and swam in wrote a lawnd ruth review article. She loved the law. Always learned that there is no substitute as a judge for that hard work. A second thing is looking at her writing. There was such an economy of words and so carefully chosen. It really there is for all of us to go back and read some of her opinions. The other thing that was very important to her and certainly important in any Collegial Court is collegiality. She showed that to the extreme. When those who wondered, how could you be friends with Justice Scalia when you have such a diversion views. She would smile. Of course, he was her friend. They shared music. Hey did not share but that didnt mean it can be friends. She also taught about the value of dissent. She was looking forward. I think one of her most significant dissents in the Lilly Ledbetter case where she suggested to congress that it might get its act in gear with respect to this problem of statute of limitations and sex discrimination. Justices often suggest a congress that they might take such an action, but it doesnt happen very often. Within a very short time, we had the Lily Ledbetter act. Finally, i certainly learned from her the importance of how you write those dissents and the opinions. She never had a cynical view and. Hould never had a mean pen she wrote about the case. She didnt write against another justice. That was so important. One area that is often overlooked with Justice Ginsburg is her commitment to international law, and also the use of domestic law in international courts. She wrote eloquently on those subjects, but more importantly, she traveled widely to visit other countries, to meet with other judges and justices and lawyers, and so many around the world have learned from her, not just those of us in the u. S. System. We can never thank her enough for her contribution to gender equality. She changed the conversation and she changed the landscape and the language of law. Importantly, she inspired future generations of lawyers. Rbg camenotorious out, i wondered, would she think it was inappropriate and undermined the sanctity of the court . No. She embraced it. In embracing that, she brought the Supreme Court to the american public. I think that is emblematic of what you saw this week, so many people went to the Supreme Court spontaneously to honor her. She was a stunning intellect, an incredibly warm heart, generous, playful spirit, and importantly, she had a moral compass that always pointed to justice and equality. I was very privileged to be one of her many friends. Thank you, judge mckeown. That was very beautiful. And lovely tribute to the justice. Thank you for joining us. Judge mcewen thank you. Anor our next speaker will be professor Wendy Williams of the georgetown law faculty. Professor williams . I think we are some technical problems. For a moment, if i could, call on professor dori bernstein, one of the justices clerks. And a member of the georgetown law faculty. And director of our Supreme Court institute. Professor bernstein. Professor bernstein i clerked for thenjudge ginsburg on the wasntrcuit judge, but i a typical law clerk and i didnt get the job in a typical late. In the fall of 1989, i was working for the d. C. Circuit judge they staff attorney, writing memos for motions and pro se appeals. I was seven years out of law school, living with a 1yearold insomniac. I got a call from r. B. G. s chambers, the judge wanted to speak with me. The judge picked up the phone said she noticed my writing and wanted to know if i wanted to clerk for her. To my eternal mortification i didnt immediately say yes. Instead, i wasnt sure i could work the hour she is expected of her clerks because i had a young child. What followed was a prolonged silence from the person who devoted years fighting for gender equality and parents. Then she asked me, what are your hours like now . So i told her, i usually arrive around 8 30 in the morning and i have to leave by 5 30 to get to the Day Care Center by 6 00 or where they start charging 10 a minute in late fees. Once i got home i couldnt work until the baby was fed, bathed, and cajoled into sleeping which usually took hours. She said she thought she could accommodate my schedule and she hired me. So, as a married mom in my 30s, i joined the cadre of mostly male, and newly minted harvard and yale law grants clerking on the d. C. Circuit in 1991 and 1992. Then i got pregnant, and it wasnt pretty. Fors hospitalized dehydration because i couldnt keep anything down, and i stayed home in bed during the course of the Winter Holiday recess. Mery week, the judge called to keep me in the loop about what was going on in court, and when i returned to chambers after the new year, she put me right back to work, assigning me cases just like the guys. I didnt apply to clerk for the d. C. Circuit right out of law school. I wouldnt have scored an interview. But Justice Ginsburg saw in me is potentially didnt know i had. Her belief in me and the opportunity to work for her changed the entire trajectory of my career. R. B. G. Didnt just fight for equality and opportunity in court, she lived it every day as a lawyer, a mother, a judge, and a boss. If i could just add one last thing, r. B. G. Died on that you of rosh hashanah, the jewish new year. On the eve of rosh hashanah, the jewish new year. The justice wasnt at all ofs but her entire life embodied the amendment central to the torah justice, justice, we shall pursue. But first it was her lifes passion an purpose and she retained an unshakeable belief that justice would ultimately prevail. Mr. Treanor thank you. So powerful. Thank you, dori. We will now hear from another one of the justices clerks,. Rofessor thank you for the opportunity to speak this evening. Not surprisingly, my first memory of Justice Ginsburg involves my daughter. I went to law school after completing graduate school and working for a while. My wife nancy and i had rebecca midway through law school. I vividly recall in my interview with the justice that we spoke as much about being a parent while going to law school as we did about the law. She asked how nancy and i managed to care for rebecca while nancy was working fulltime and i was at school. I did my best to surgery the amount of parental responsibility i took on for fear that otherwise i would be disqualified on the spot. She shared her own experience of the demands of being married and kerry for her daughter while in law school. Only later did i learn that one of those demands also was. For marty when he had cancer at the time. I later brought rebecca, then 3 years old, into chambers to meet the justice. She was shy and the justice, perhaps seeing some of her shyness in rebecca, was deliked was delighted when she finally burst out with my teachers let us have ice cream at snack time. The justice smiled and said her teachers never allowed that. Later when rebecca was in middle school, the justice graciously sat with her for an hourlong interview for a school project. Later, the justice spoke of her high school graduation. Many of no doubt that the opportunities rebecca has had would have been denied to her if not for the work of Justice Ginsburg. The justices iron year and work on behalf of women has always had a deeply personal meaning for me. Ben wasonderful son born a couple of years after my clerkship with her, the justice sent a gift to him and also to rebecca. So, as the justice wrote, she wouldnt feel left out. This was enormously thoughtful. As we told the justice afterward , of course, we also took it as evidence that she could help but strive for equality between males and females in every sphere of life. When i clerked for the justice, i confess that it could be a bit unnerving sometimes to offer my analysis of a case, to wait for the initial silence that was common in conversation with her, as those who knew her were aware, and then to hear her quietly utter a complete paragraph that would not require the slightest revision if transcribed into print. That paragraph elegantly got to the heart of the issues in the case. It invariably sent me back to my desk with greater clarity and with a commitment to live up to her example. Is wellknown and rightly celebrated for her work in holding the law accountable for its commitment to equality. What also made a deep impression on me when i worked for her is something that many may not fully appreciate, this was her deep commitment to the idea of law itself. To its integrity, to its promise and her awareness of its , fragility. This led her to approach the law with both vigor and compassion. In terms of vigor, the justice was what we call a lawyers lawyer. She gave close attention to the language of the law, its logic, and the meanings it could plausibly bear. She honored these elements. And would not interpret the law in a way that would do violence to them. On occasion, this led her to conclusions she would not have preferred. She saw this, however, as a way of being faithful to the fragile , whichment that is law requires constant and patient nurture and a spirit of humility. For her, being rigorous was an act of good faith. A way of caring for the law. Justice was well aware, of course, that legal interpretation is a human enterprise. Caring for the law also means being attentive to the aspirations embedded in its language its logic and layers of , meaning. She knew that legal meaning is rarely selfevident. This required approaching the law with compassion. With empathic imagination and with deep appreciation of the human beings for whom law is created. It reflected commitment to words that those in the Georgetown Law Community know are incribed on our library. Law is but the means, justice is the end. I have learned these lessons. She called upon us to meet impossibly high standards with the same combination of rigor and compassion that she modeled for us. Of gracepersonal sense and pain with her death. It is a remarkable testament to the legacy of quiet, softspoken woman who i never heard raise her voice, who believed in the of reason, the promise of respectful persuasion, and the integrity of the law that she is mourned deeply by countless others who feel a personal sense of loss even though they never met her. In our grief, i hope that we are all consoled and inspired by the words of a poem that my law clerk susan williams, sent to me over the weekend by maya angelou, when a great tree falls. In lines that seem to have been written with Justice Ginsburg in mind, maya angelou says that out of grief for the death of great souls, we can move ahead by remembering. ourast lines of the poem they existed. They existed. We can be, be, and be better for they existed. Thank you. Mr. Treanor thank you. So lovely. Professor Wendy Williams, are you there . Very good. Professor Wendy Williams, one of the justices biographers. Williams having california on fire, alabama underwater, the climate changing, the movement of the dignity and equality for the lives of black people in this country, and the most important president ial election, at least in my lifetime, probably in yours, and now we have lost r. B. G. With significant implications for the Supreme Court and the most significant issues of our time. Theres so much to say about her and her life and her work. I had the privilege of knowing her since 1971. Of that movement that she was part of, which was to make women equal in law schools and in the law of the land, and i watched her in action. So i thought i would talk about a bit about what that looks like ,nd what she achieved, which is to use an overly used word, truly awesome. Well, i am going to talk about the time before she became a judge, and before she became a justice, and before she became have thoughtnever back then knowing her , personally, a public icon with songs written about her, plays and movies done in her honor. Books written about her life and work, murals on city walls, mugs and bags and tshirts, even little onesies fur babies, all with her face etched on them. Both of my grandchildren wore their onesies in their young day. Yeah, there was even a grasshopper named after her. She was an extraordinary bright, brave, principled, focused, persistent person. Plus, she didnt require as much sleep as the average person. She couldnt have achieved what she did had she not had all those qualities in abundance. And, against the odds, which notably included, as she said of her early adulthood, she had three strikes against her. She was a woman. A jew. And a mother. Woman and mother proved to be the most significant. Heres what she dealt with and learned from as she entered the Legal Profession. Against the odds always, she was admitted to Harvard Law School which just a few years earlier had begun admitting women. Georgetown law was slow to open its doors, i should point out, to women of color and women people of color. At harvard she was one of nine , women in a class of 500. She was married to marty ginsburg. Later on our faculty. And in 1955, gave birth to a daughter. She had chosen her spouse, or as she called him, her life partner, very wisely and id love to talk about marty as well. I hope somebody else might do that. She applied to a dozen or so new york law firms for a job when she graduated, but not one would hire her, even though she was near the top of her class at harvard and tied for first in her class at columbia, where she did her third year, and she was in the law review. She got a clerkship with a Federal District court judge in the Southern District of new york only because one of her teachers at columbia went all out for her. Promising the judge that if he hired her and was displeased he had, he himself had lined up a male graduate who was ready to replace her. And if he didnt hire her Columbia Law School would send , him no more clerks. She was hired by him and she shone. Although she was recommended by one of her harvard professors for a clerkship with justice frankberger, the justice declined to hire the mother of a small child. Fortunately, she then got a job at Columbia Law School for a special twoyear project

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