There. Id like to first introduce our panelists including myself. Doctor Michael Pillsbury is one of the foremost china experts in the world. Hes currently senior fellow and director of the chinese strategy at the hudson institution. Its an incentive rate hes distinguished defense and policy advisor highranking official in numerous books and reports on china. I know, i can tell you definitively that mike has really changed the u. S. Militarys thinking. Back a number of years ago he sent to china to collect Chinese Military writings. He was the First American official who revealed that what the chinese were telling themselves militarily behind the scenes was quite different than what they were saying in public about how they wanted to be friends with the world. And it really had a tremendous impact on understanding the militarys review with peoples republic of china. His book is a Landmark Book to replace america as a superpower. This book is really a fascinating look. Its probably one of the only places in public will you will find information about chinese defectors. People within the chinese system reveal whats going on there. Before mike speaks i also want to introduce general Robert Spalding retired from the u. S. Air force. He is a senior fellow at the hudson institute. And he too is a distinguished china expert. He spent time as a bomber pilot and is also been inside of china as a Defense Attache being chased in tracking down the inside story of china. His most recent book is called stealth war, how china took over while americas elite slept. A little bit about myself, as mentioned on National Security correspondent for the Washington Times, author of eight books read my most recent book is deceiving the sky inside commonest chinas drive for global supremacy. Kind of a followon to a book i wrote back in 2000, 20 years ago called the china threat. As a result of that i had gained quite a reputation. Back in 2006 the Chinese News Agency described me as the number one anti china expert in the world. To which i respond, i am very much pro china, pro Chinese People. But very much opposed to the communist party system in china. With that lets begin with our first panelist doctor Michael Pillsbury. Thank you bill. I thought i would begin by revealing a new publication its going to come out and about two weeks from the hudson institute. You will be able to get it online. Its called a guide to the Trump Administration china policy statements. And it has a link to every one of about 200 statements, interviews or tweets by President Trump on the top members of his team. The reason i put this together as i believe there has been a lot of misunderstanding. And the left is also attacked President Trumps chinese policy in many ways to distort what he has done what his team is said and done over the last three and half years. As we begin the next 100 days of the Election Campaign i think we are going to hear more of this. More attacks on the president either that he has been too soft on china, the biting team is already run several commercials where they imply that President Trump then ice pe biden comes on and said if i had been president i would have demanded xi jinping immediately tell us what happened in wuhan with the virus. I will sort of save you against President Trump. I believe the president s policy towards china, i called the three cs. It has been clear, coherent, and comprehensive. If you go through the documents which i have organized according to subject matter, although ive done a special segment just for the president s tweets and his spontaneous interviews. I believe you will agree with me. And i want to give you some examples just to make sure you understand the range of debate among conservatives on china is actually very wide. Not altogether clear where we are going with china policy over the last three decades. Whats going to happen in the next two decades. Conservative reporter is called jesus in beijing came out about ten years ago. He forecast christianity to take over china. The leading largest nation in the world with christians will be china. Totally wrong, he misunderstood some trends. It is a nice effort, it is a positive thought. Wouldnt it be nice, completely false. The others called the coming collapse of china. Vice president penns address this directly in his speech at hudson institute. The coming collapse of china brought for many months the number one book in america on china. The coming collapse of china. Very popular author. I like him very much. His name is gordon chang. I said gordon, dont predict the year that china will collapse in your book. Leave some flexibility. No, its going to be 2012 pretty put 2012 in the book. The book came out into thousand one. Vice president pence in his speech at hudson said since 2001 chinas gdp their economic strength has grown by how much . Ten times. Was an economy collapse . No. So in 2012 Foreign Policy magazine asked gordon give us an article, when is china going to collapse . The feeling that china was going to collapse is very important that means its not going to be a problem very long. So gordon wrote the article. They said give us when it will collapse. I wouldve said maybe general spalding could say 2050 or who knows. Gordon wrote again 2013, one more year. This point of view infects a lot of thinking about china. Begin to get an idea of what the sing he said at least ten times i wont repeat it ten times bill is either tweeted or said these points ten times. Did if Hillary Clinton had won the election, china would be surpassing us now. Thats extremely important. The president and his team see china is coming close to his preview rate of economic growth, their military growth, many other indicators are not to be trifled with and thought of as this is an easy challenge. I also want to mention my own book. I made some mistakes throughout my career. I thought i was one of the original panda huggers. I thought china would align with this. Not only against the soviet union, built in a recently declassified memorandum, president nixon tells chairman and premier we need you to bear more of the burden of global governance. We need china to have more armaments so we can have less. Thats 1972. See how this thinking has consequences over the years . I very much believe that myself. Some uturn turn back to the Trump Administration statements, what are the points they are making is the scale of the challenge. This is not panama or even venezuela. This is not a small country we are dealing with. Nuclear weapons, a serious navy, but most important of all a growth rate averaging more than 10 for 35 years. Looks like no one has an example number looks Like Technology theft to other parts that we could do next. Number one is american capital. We seem to have been the largest investor in china for 30 years. And no one seems to know how to undo that. Theres not even an exact number. Some people think it is several trillion. No, several trillion u. S. Dollars invested in china. Companies, private equities, general spalding begins his wonderful book with the story he puts in a grant wants to write a paper the grant is turned down pretty gets a phone call until the story in the first few pages for the think tank president says sorry we cant fund your projects. General spalding says he looks at it and a member of the board, correct me if im wrong. Billionaires, various people who made money from china. While this is in a normas problems. We are in some sense influence deeply about capital for china, how are you going to undo that . Its going to take legislation which leads to my second point about what we do next and where chinas growth came from. Technology, restricting u. S. Capital, restricting u. S. Investments in china, takes legislation, i have counted more than 80 examples 80 current examples of bills introduced by congressman or senators to impose costs on china. Including being able to sue china legally for damages with the china buyers. Generally speaking, all of this legislation attracts four or six cosponsors. I was a Senate Staffer for ten years print i know how to count on it when senators care about something they can tell the staff go finally cosponsors. I went 50 cosponsors if you want a raise next year, doctor pillsbury i went 60 cosponsors in my legislation. Sometimes they have cosponsors other than one who drafted it. Theres no hearings the leadership doesnt put them up for a vote senators encouragement come on television they can sorely come on fox news the host more and more theyre saying senator how many cosponsors have you got. Thats extremely constructive. Sometimes is called virtual signaling so heres my bill thats it wash my hands working some thing else. Thats another thing the chinese are laughing at us let people i meet with in china have phds are american universities. The harvard daughter understand our system extremely well how are influence inside china to our ambassadors to try to always speak mandarin fluently . Basically it never happens for theres two that are somewhat good but i would not call them Television Show fluent. Neither would they. How about our programs inside china . They are blocks, they are gms. How about a magazine that used to be passed out by usia. No more magazine. Heres a list of what china does for influence operations inside the United States with agi would like to do that inside china. It would be very, very difficult not to mention some centers oppose this some its dead it goes nowhere. It stays live on fox news owen got a plan and the nothing happens i havent had time to promote my own book, but basically it is a history declassified documents of how we got here how naive and delusional american president s in american policymakers including myself got here. And the book has now sold more than 200,000 copies. Translated into eight languages. All of chinas neighbors its a bestseller. So this is my challenge for doctor spalding. His book has sold 33000 copies so im six times more which doesnt mean the quality of my book is higher maybe his book is better, not to mention our moderator, bills book, i dont know the sales figures. But i hate to be delivering bad news. But it seems to me we are in for a long kind of cold war with china. This is the early phases. So far President Trump has turned things around. Scott the successful formula but we are a long way to go before china becomes a kind of china we all thought would happen before. Hows that for an Opening Statement bill. Excellent well said. I would point out that you mentioned legislation for all of the best things that youve done regarding china have been in legislation. Because policies can be changed from administration to administration. But you look at the record and first of all there is the taiwan relations act. Which was passed basically after the u. S. Recognized beijing diplomatically. Then theres also these sanctions that remain in place. Also the military power reports the pentagon has done. Since really important to codify these things. We are beginning to see that with the Trump Administration. Lets turn now to general spalding for your remarks. Thank you bill. So its an interesting thing that Michael Pillsbury talks about. His book was the first one i read when he got to the pentagon 2014. What i would tell people read the concluding chapter you really get an understanding of a synopsis its essentially we had bent over backwards that it currently is. Of course when i got to the pentagon 2014, i was a very much, what i would say. [inaudible] [laughter] infect Michael Pillsbury. Me how to be what he would now say is a super hawk. I dont see myself to be hawkish free to really focus on defending the american people, the american way of life, our constitution. And in fact, you look at in the current National Security strategy and addition to being clear, concise, comprehensive, it is about how we turn things around. And while it has been noted and lauded, it is not been widely understood. And so my book is really about the background and context behind the National Security strategy. You want to know about how successful the president s Foreign Policy has been, i would refer you to the uk decision to reverse decision with regard to allowing while way to have its 5g network. Now the media would have you believe that decision was made overnight. Maybe over a couple of months during the coronavirus but in fact it really demonstrates the power of the diplomatic effort undertaken by the department of state and the National Security council beginning in the First Quarter 2018 after the National Security strategy was released. That diplomatic effort is something that we describe in National Security council in 2017 as forging a new consensus. On really before you saw them address any problem or have a plan or a strategy really need to understand the problem. So the main problem we were addressing was the inability of the United States to get its interest promoted within International Institutions and its a lack of geopolitical power in those institutions. The primary reason was most of the nations in the institution were beginning to look to china and chinas model as more beneficial to furthering their own interests and being aligned few of the world about democracy, human rights, Civil Liberties and free trade. Someone could forge a new consensus similar to the western consensus that sought to really bring democracies together again in a very tight relationship economically, financially, and trade and information. Two matches already Strong Military alliances that successful and how that initiative in diplomacy has been. But we have also gotten a glimpse of chinas response to that Diplomatic Initiative through the coronavirus in the aftermath. With regard to the coronavirus, many people talk about what is the origin of the virus . And i say disregard that. Really we are not going to know. Because we are not going to be able to get investigators into china, into the lab to talk to the researchers that we are working there to understand the line of effort to understand what happened. It was there even any relation between the lab in the coronavirus . That is not something we are going to know. But what we can know with certainty is that the Chinese Communist party recited over the spread of the virus. And it wasnt that they accidentally presided of the spread of the virus. Or it was a manifestation or secondary effect of its institution. It wasnt that they directly spread the virus. On january 7, xi jinping himself said he was in charge of the wuhan crisis. On the 13th of january, theres immediate reports about human to human transmission that come out in china. And in fact, on the 14th of january they World Health Organization tweets about limited human to human transaction. What was going on during this critical time between the seventh of january when xi jinping was in charge of the crisis in wuhan and generally 2d when they shut down wuhan. What was happening was a nun only was a chinese commonest parting putting pressure on the World Health Organization to not discuss human to human transmission. Was also walking down the spread of the information within china. And in fact, at the same time they were walking down in china and locking down outside of china to their proxies. So over the course of a couple of weeks, they began to turn and turn to an into net importer were they had been annexed export of pp and masks. At the same ten they shut down Domestic Travel from wuhan but allowed International Travel to goforth. Now, this essentially has a net effect of putting them into the need position with the regard to the pandemic. They knew it was going to impact the chinese society. But they wanted to make sure it impacted other societies as well. And that they had the memes to really profit from it and have advantage from it. And so what we are seeing today and Michael Pillsbury talks about it is beginning of the second cold war. Im really the pandemic spread by the chinese commonest parting is opening shots of the second cold war. Interestingly, not only do they uncork the spreading pandemic, they also uncork the new form of diplomatic and informational war. So if you go back to, Michael Pillsbury was a very good historian can talk to you about how the chinese commonest party overthrew the nationalist party, but chinese thanks about war whites and viewed within the chinese commonest party thinking about war was opposed to the way we looked at it, specifically between the idea of peace time and work time. And that war is politics by other means. And other words you use warfare to get to a political outcome. And in fact the chinese commonest party thanks the opposite way. That politics is war by other means. In other words the entire war is about the political war. That in fact the coronavirus is the beginning of a political offensive against the free worl world. The diplomatic effort they began to spread the idea that the coronavirus didnt manifest itself in china. But in fact it was sp