Politics and prose bookstore and we live in muscatine. Bit of a Great Program for you this evening. For those of you not familiar with how this virtual format works, just to be able to ask a question of the author if you would like. To do so, just click on the q a icon at the bottom of your screen. Bob has been observing in washington or half a century. Decades with Washington Post, hes shared pulitzer prizewinning first of the watergate scandal and second in 2003, is a leap reported for coverage of the 911 terrorist attacks. s books also a big news and run any readers. His latest book rage is his 20th book, and all have been national bestsellers. We are accustomed to bobs books taking us behind the scenes of highlevel meetings and into the mind is of those making critical u. S. Policy decisions. This extraordinary are what is extraordinary about rage, but 17 times, while the book was being written, providing a remarkable series of glimpses into the presence thinking at key moments. It conversation this evening will be another prizewinning journalist jane, she is correspondent for the new yorker magazine. Shes been there for 25 years. Also the author of other books that have helped deepen our understanding of such important topics as money behind the why of the radical right and the war on terror, and the iran contrast terror. So taken away. Bulb its great to be with you. Bob thank you jane. I just wanted to start given that there has been so much news the question and get your thoughts on the court and i wondered whether in your work on trump, whether you have gotten any insights into his relationship with Mitch Mcconnell. How do they were together, will they be coordinating closely and illegal the same interest when it comes to approaching filling the vacancy left by Ruth Bader Ginsburg. Bob yes because you have the peace of the new yorker reminds everyone what your piece said. In your idea that really mcconnell was to make sure that he retains control of the senate more than getting another justice is that correct. Jane will i think would you would like to do is to have us do both. My guess is that he will be, he will find a way to do both with some incredible maneuver. He often surprises people with the fine print of the rules in the senate. But i think people i know who i have interviewed about Mitch Mcconnell think that nothing matters more to him and staying majority leader. Put it that way. But i imagine at this point, trump really wants yet another justice, this will be his third in the court. And im sure mitch would like it to but not at the expense of losing his majority in the senate. It and its dicey politics right now. Things are awful. So what you think that is going on. How do they work together. Bob i will release them audio and transcripts of trump talking with me about this very issue. I think we will release them in an hour. It shows that trump and mcconnell really work in tandem much more than we thought. Trump, he has wrapped his mind around this issue of filling the seat, the Ruth Bader Ginsburg seat. He sees political plus infected giant one because what this does is it takes the focus off the virus where his performance is quite frankly, i found a dismal. And he goes to the issue of kenny put another justice on the court. This fits his idea kind of its really. Much a style. People are criticizing him saying that this is not fair. But this is a pr political power play. The mcconnell and trump my followup right successfully. The democrats, a lot of people said wait a minute. They didnt get a hearing, they getting get a vote. And in reality, the Senate Majority leader Mitch Mcconnell can pose these things. So there is much more, i think this is trump luck when one of the long conversations i had with him a couple of months ago, he said he thought in 2016 that he had won the election in the last four weeks of the campaign. And i you can see that. And you can argue that. And i think he is hoping to duplicate that. Jane you have in your book, i conversation that seems with i dont know if youre directly interviewed him but with Lindsay Graham. You say that Lindsay Graham and chief Justice Jon Roberts talk a lot. That was news to me. Because Lindsay Graham is the Senate Judiciary committee right now. Bob pivotal position in all of this for me to all of this but, in the book, graham seems to express that he is worried that Justice Robert to are both worried that the court has become so split and so politicized and so partisan. And they do not want to become more so. Does that suggest, that kind of thinking will have any bearing on him trump fix or how will he make this pic do you think. Bob i think you will pick the woman, the cubanamerican from florida. The makes all of the political sense in the world. She served on the Supreme Court of florida any years. Now she is on the bed roll Appeals Court down there. And that cubanamerican heritage conservative. It is an obvious political pick for trump. But you know, and trump world, you learn to not states much on your predictions because he continually surprises. This is going to be as everyone says, blondie but trump and mcconnell are looking at this as oh boy, we have an opportunity here and it appeals to the evangelicals, it appeals to this idea of the kind of rule breaking that trump loves. In a way theres a tradition of not trying to ram through Supreme Court new appointee in the election year. Let alone the last 50 days in the campaign. I think there is a feeling of political muscle that they will exercise. Jane and you dont see it as any kind of potential for backlash. I know democrats are already talking about if they take the senate, the majority, that they would then also turn to serve radical muscle. And maybe try to pack the court or Something Like that. Do you see any sort of things like that. Bob i know the people who talk about this. Packing the court has a bad odor about it. President roosevelt tried that. And we dont like the way the court is the way the court has been in all of american history. And we are going to now add more justices because we do not like what theyre doing. I dont think thats works in a political sense or in a practical sense. But when you listen to some of the democrats talk about this and just say, this is absolutely awful and unfair. How can trump and mcconnell think about it. When you think. You know this. Jane i think that mcconnell and i dont know, havent spent as much time and certainly not as much time as you have an trump. But mcconnell is somebody who wrote today, the hypocrisy and shamelessness are not only is immune to them, the management style for him. To me missus than institutional for him. They will not care that people say it looks unfair. That wont matter. Bob the news and people that will say its unfair. The democrats predispute if youre right. The democrats. Bob and what. Jane what might make a difference is and i was interviewing from aei. There are a couple senate races with endangered republican incumbents. Susan collins and maine for instance sort of declare that shes not going to vote for innsbruck before the election read for the replacement. And there are a few others could be dicey. It was on the spot of having to choose between trump base which i afford to lose in the moderates and particularly women who might not want to lose. But you will need for who would not vote with mcconnell or republicans. And i cannot count four of them. They might give romney. And markowski and collins. I dont know who the fourth would be. It everybody is watching. Bob but the idea of hypocrisy, what is the hypocrisy. Jane and water their feelings. Bob actually i think it is kind of the wrong word. And is playing ultimate political harmful. And as we know, the democrats will do that as will the republicans. So it is going to be a moment where you have to sit on the edge a receipt because there will be maneuvers. There will be surprises. And trump is sitting back there and we are talking about this rather than the virus. Which is now killed 200,000 people. And i found in my reporting, i had discussions with trump. This all goes back to and if i can take you to i think what is one of the most important meetings in the oval office. And certainly in this entry may be in a long time. That is january 28 at this year when National Security advisor Robert Obrien said to president trump, the virus is going to be enough maybe a going to be the biggest National Security threat to your presidency. And then the deputy laid out the details of how there were sources, and old wall street journalist reporter. A very talented one. Nominated for pulitzer prizewinning for what he did in china for seven years covering the 2003 sars epidemic. And he laid out for trump, he said look, this virus is airborne. People who do not show symptoms can spread it. But most importantly, he said this is not going to be just a little problem. It is going to be very much like the 1918 spanish flu pandemic that killed 675,000 people. They went through the details of this and the president ten days later told me about this. And i was thinking all about he was talking about china. It was not for three months until i learned about that january meeting. And i start my book with this meeting. It is almost like somebody coming to Franklin Roosevelt a week before pearl harbor and sing that the japanese are going to obamas. And just sitting on it and not doing anything. It is shocking behavior. I think there are two pillars in the presidency. The first is, i remember talking to talk about this in her first interview. This was in december of last year in the oval office. The question was, what is the job of the presidency. And trump said, the job is to protect the people. Any failure to protect the people. He couldve done in february coming out and saying, look, i have an authoritative deep morning here. There are things that people can do. He in a state of the Union Address on february 4th going to say, wash your hands. Keep social distance, wear a mask. Dont get in a crowded room with people for an extended period of time. And thats kind of remedial behavior. There are models that say tens of thousands of lives could have been saved by acting in february. Jane so bob, the story of leo here i thank you so talking. An egregious. Why do you think trump acted this way. What was going on in his head. I know he has said he purposely downplayed it to avoid a panic. But as are really at because if he was so concerned about panic in the public. Is been an awful lot of time talking about here about things like race riots. So he doesnt concerned about that particular panic. An agency in your book that is chief of staff meadows was concerned particularly about the stock market may be dropping. How do you account for his failure on this issue that is now killed as of today 200,000 people. Bob if we wer if we had been talking a year ago, you wouldve thought i had gone off the rails. It is a shocking number. Save question on march 19th, i interviewed him. And in 104 any talks over nine hours. And i said why have you acted this way about the virus. This was march. Everyone knew it was airborne. They knew we were in a crisis. At that point, there were 30000 new cases a day. He said he would like to downplay it for 80s and i always like to down play. Dont want people to panic. And i look at that state meant to very direct with you when he said i dont want people to panic. It reflects his failure to understand the people he governs that in this country if people are told the truth, like Franklin Roosevelt parted after pearl harbor said, i know you can be told the worst. It is all bad news. And you will not lose heart. That is the american tradition. If you laid on the line and you say look, this will be difficult. But trump wanted to cover it up. For almost 50 years writing about trying to understand presence. It is the action that really is a failure to lead in any form, a failure to understand his responsibility as we know. During some of this like the experts like they would say it would be okay to go to the gym and them on the movies did and maybe it will be different but i think right now, it will be fine people would say well, they Public Officials both officials lets trump down. But you know this so well. There are two informations routes to the president. What is National Security and the other is the doctors coming in for these Coronavirus Task force committees. But they dont meet. Except trump is the only one who has known all of them. Tina he knows what is going on in the failure to warn is one of the saddest moments in history as best i can tell. Jane do you he could outrun it. The numbers are exponentially taking upwards and spreading through the country. Do you think the people would not notice. Thats what ive been a notable figure out. Bob that is not the way he thinks. He thinks in a very impulsive way as we know of how do i do with this at this moment. It is a failure to accept responsibility. In july i talked with him. One of her long talks. In fact it was the longest one is in the book. So this was two months ago. The virus, with rating would you give yourself. He said i would give myself in a forget a vaccine, and a rated on this day, there were 4 million virus cases in this country. 142,000 americans had died. And he is giving himself in a and then look at some of his comments last week when people asked about him downplaying it. He said will actually leak a play date. Now that is a word i checked that is not even in the scrabble dictionary. Let alone in the real big dictionary. In one moment he saying is a political hijab. He was asked my fox anchor this week. What about the book. He said trump said quality is okay. And upper down or a political it job. And sorry to say this, if you listen to this. Im not sure he knows which way is up in which way is down. That compounds the problem. This is the leader of our country. Jane bob, you covered nine president s. I guess i have to ask the most basic of questions. Is the worst. Bob as a reporter, you want to cover each one in aiken mako kinds of comparisons. Nixon, the first president that i covered. He clearly was a criminal resident. In the Republican Party turned on nixon. He was really forced to resign when he went to the envelope office and he said account of the republicans. And you have only four votes. And among the republicans. None in the democratic party. One of those four votes were you is not me. And goldwater said that. In the next night nixon announced that he was resigning. Each one is different. This is left a gaping wound. And it is not over. Almost a thousand people are dying every day right now. In the failure to plead and describe the things that need to be done. The expert say if trump would just say, everyone should wear a mask. He said is optional. And then he goes into bills rallies or thousands of people are packed together without a mask. What the heck is going on. What i did the first, fear. Since a nervous breakdown of the executive branch. But what you call it now. I call it something that we have almost been to put to sleep. Oh thousand deaths, 142,000 deaths down. Now 200,000 deaths read we need a wakeup call to the populist. This is not a political issue. This is a practical issue and quite frankly a moral issue. Jane i guess the reason i ask about whether you rank trump differently, at the bottom is partly because as far as anyone correct me if i am wrong, this may be the first president we have come out and express an opinion that simply says, this man is not qualified to be our president. Bob what i said in totality, for my reporting, is the wrong man for the job. A. Jane in which case. Bob conclusion is overwhelming evidence. Because in a way, the book is about the truth. Are we going to face the truth. And as i was working on the epilogue, i typed that. And then my assistance, and also my wife elsa will show you know so well. Jane my colleague. Bob yes. And she work at the post. She was a staff writer at the new yorker. She edited this book six times. She repeatedly would take me to the woodshed frankly and say wait a minute. You have not absolutely confirm this. You need to talk to this person. She would give me graphs. And i would have 250 words on a page typed out. And then she would go after it and asked me to write more than 250 words on the page editing and rearranging. I am blessed. If you know her as a friend and i know her as a wife and a friend. Jane most people like elsa. Bob exactly. Jane the question i had, this issue or process that you went through, coming out of your. Much the most famous and accomplished reporter in america. And in out of the tradition of trying to keep your voice neutral. Another reporting tell the story. In this case, you actually spoke up as an individual and said, issued an opinion. And i can imagine, it is a hard step to take for people like you like me maybe who are trained as a traditional reporter. No wonder what is it about trump made you feel this was a time actually have speak up and Say Something about. In the conclusion. Bob not only was i able to do that reporting have the luxury of ten months but he call me at all hours. I could call him anytime. It would come back or he would come on the phone night during the day. If you go to the book. I havent ten generals waiting downstairs, i need to go talk to them. Jane anywhere talk to you. I guess one of the questions of course everyone wonders about is why did he talk to you. Why do people but why did he talk to you. Because he kept saying throughout the book, i know this is going to be bad. You going to do this about. He didnt talk to you got your first book. Did you think it he thought he could win you over and change the mainstream medias view of him. They could sell you on himself. Or did he need somebody to confess to as he rambled from the white house. What you think or what he think you talk to you. Bob what i am doing, reporting this very practical exercise. Over they all my questions and even answer. I would not let him off the hook. You go through the book. One of the most extraordinary scenes for me was going down to interview him on de