We want to welcome to our table this morning ken block, shes the author of this book, this proven by unbiasedea campaign. His name may found similar. Mr. Block why did the former President Campaign hire you and what did they hire you to do . Yeah, it was sort of a twopart project. The original request was for me to look for evidence of voter fraud in the swing states in the 2020 election. I was lookingta for evidence of deceased voters and for voters who voted twice once in a swing state and once in some o state. Very quickly, a matter of just a day or two after my contract was signed the campaign attorneys who were doing their due evaluating claims t of voter frd that were coming into the campaign from everywhere, from all over the country, from amateurs looking at data to lawyers whose names we all recognize making claims of fraud and when those claims involved data the campaign asked me to evaluate them and tell them if they were correct or not and in every circumstance they were false. You wri i book, the contract was signed on november 5th, 2020. I had no idea then how finding so little would lead to so much. You signed a contract with the Trump Campaign on that november 5th, 2020, how long did you work for them . 35 days, 35 of what is honestly one of the had. D 35 days. Yeah. In 35 days did you have access to all the data that you needed access to to to determine whether or not there was fraud . So its very nuanced answer that im going give you. The answer is i had access t das available at that time. So i had full access to the data that the rnc had available, whats very interesting about voter data is that no state makes available to anybody who voted in persons, inside that 3035 day window. You get all of the mailin ballot information that you can process but for some reason the inperson votes are not there. Thats a large chunk of the vote that wasnt available however all of that information is made available usually by january or february after the election and just because that data wasnt available to me at that period of time because nobody has gone through it since and determined, wow, there was actually a bunch of fraud, that is not an impactful meaningful problem that i had when i was working in november of 2020. Well, then explain how you could go back to the Trump Campaign and say there is no voter fraud in those 35 days . Well, so i didnt say there was no voter fraud. I told them there wn matter ans an important distinction. We did find some dead voters, we did find duplicate voters but the numbers were very far less than the thousands, many thousands that were necessary inside the swing states and i we discussed the challenges with having access to some data, not having access to other data, i can pretty confident i will sayi reported to specifically alexi cannon who was my main contact had a lot of confidence in the fact that i was being as the thorough as i was and probably numbing his brain with how much information i was educating him about data and the processes that i was going cethrough. I know hee trusted my results ad he communicated thoroughly to mark meadows but evaluating everyone elses claims of fraud and we found nothing that rose to the leverage of changing an election result that would survival legal scrutiny in court. Did you gon back after those 35 days and do a more thorough look at the data after more became available . I didnt personally go back and take a at it. Some of the data is all of the data is available at that point now and for all of the vested interest in looking for sure there were manyon eyes that looked at this data after the fact and nobody has gone through the data and made any determination that contradicts what i had done within the 30 days. The other thing thats important to remember here to file a claim in court you cant file a claim based on data that doesnt exist. Whats only work with out there right now and right now it was mail ballots and there were plenty look at, tens of millions of them and having gone through all of those, there was o look, my job was toit e voter fraud i wanted to be the guy to do it, right. Its a pretty extraordinary thing if you were able to find someone like that and i wasnt h going to ruin my professional reputation with results that i would be humiliate■m■ d in cour. In the contract i put a sentence in there that im going to deliver findings that would stand up in court and unfortunately there was nothing that rose to that. Who hired you, alex con non, i dont know why. Still to this day we didnt have time to talk about that stuff. What is a data special snies. What is a data special mist i own Software Engineering company. We specify in large database applications. I participated ingi an architect in the countrys first online debit card system for food stamps for the state of texas,bi we do a lot of work in the gaming industry so theres lots of transactions thats where we do a lotf data mining for waste and fraud is something that i enjoyed doing and we looked at food stamp fraud and medicare fraud, that sort of thing. As we set up t going to do this, he told me that he was going keep my identity and my companys identity didnt want e knowing who was doing the work. He wanted us to be shielded from people insisted on results because thats not what works for court with a successful really alex from anyone within the campaign. So when you spoke to alex cannon, where did that communication go from alex once you spoke to him, who did he talk to . So at the time i had no idea but with the january 6th■] transcripts i learned that obviously he was talking to other upperlevel campaign attorneys and then most notably the fact that he delivered the tanews to mark meadows that the campaign was unable to find fraud that would matter. And that information went to the former president , correct . After everything there were news reports that mark meadows took the information to thehe ol office. Who did you not talk to . Really just about everybody else. Alex cannon was my eaid helle in the morning i was talking to. What about the lawsuits brought by Rudy Giuliani and others . Yeah, i saw claims that i can confidently same through Sidney Powell. She was helping to push a mathematical theory they were trying to apply the state of pennsylvania to prove voterer fraud and that was wrong. It was about 16, so this is a pattern. All the numbers were hyperinflated because the people who did the analysis didnt understand what they were looking at andth they didnt understand how to make sure they werent making errors and identifying un consistently acre board there was a lack of understanding of what people were looking at and thats why most of the claims were false. Ook, ken block is the author, disproven, unbias search for voter fraud for the Trump Campaign, the data that shows how he lost and how we can improve our elections. Its your turn to ask your questions, give us your comments about what youve heard about voter fraud and have ken block respond. Hes our guest here this morning. Before we get to calls, though, which states did you focus on this book . Its swing state. Geor nevada, wisconsin, michigan, pennsylvania. All right, lets go, joseph in Point Pleasant beach, good morning to you. Good morning, how are you . Yeah, how are you doing, ken, ive seen you before on tv. I have a couple of points to make. The first point is theres nothing that say that about the 7 states that youre talking about. They changed their laws unconstitutionally only the state can do that. You cant tell me thats not right. I dont care how many degrees you have. The second giuliani had affidavit from poll workers that saw fraud and the government and the judges didnt take them up andnd said standing. You keep counting same illegal votes you will get the same number. They were questioning the validity of the votes. I dont care how many degrees you have, thats what happened. Joseph, please hang on the line and listen to the response. Yeah, this is a really important point. So my work was all tasked specifically to creating findings of fraud that would survive legal scrutiny. That means when you bring it to court and the Defense Attorneys are going to come at you with everything they have to try to show that you messed up, that you were wrong, its a very high bar and a lot of what youre talking about isnt data evidence especially about the giuliani thing. Its hearsay evidence and hearsaev evidence that you can bring to court successfully and especially when you want to overturn an election result. It has to be a very different kind of evidence. As f laws and everything, there had been court cases where that was not determined to be aroblem. So i get it and i understand that its upsetting and that the results, many, many people wanted the results to be different. My role in all of this was very narrow and very specific to deliver to the campaign if it existed evidence that would work that could overturn the election and it simply wasnt there. Gordon, in wyoming, good morning, gordon, go ahead. Good morning. Washington journal just has to be required viewing for all three branches of government. Hey have to swear to watch washington journal every yway, im 78 years old. Trump and biden, they need to step aside. Id like to see Vice President harris go against liz cheney. Younger people, please, please also off the subject instead of building a pier in gaza gordon, gordon, can you please stick to the topic here this morning. Do you have a question or comment about ken blocks book . Well, im sure that that trump lost the election for goodness sakes but thats all ive got. Lst gordon, we will leave it there and move onto randy thats in zeth west virginia, hi, randy. Hey, how are you doing . How Many Democrats voted fraudulently and how many blicans voted fraudulently, thats my question . Okay, we will take that. Thats a great question and so im going to expand a little bit because we found a couple a hundred fraudulent votes. We found deceased votes scattered around swing state in 2020, a couple oficate votes whe votes was cast in swing state, if i expanded a little bit and found information i found in 2016 where w identified across 24 states, i want to be clear how much data we looked at. We found about 8,000 confirmed duplicates votes acrs all of those states with most number of votes in florida just over 2,000. Not enough to change any result here and when we look at registrations of the party of the registrants involved in this. It is 5050, its not all republicans. Where people aree voting twice its usually crime of privilege, someone who owns two homes in two different places figureseren exercising twice and highly illegal. Hopefully eliminate as we go along. Explainly highly illegal . Felony wi u five years in jail and 10,000 fine. Debra in westchester, ohio, republic. Taking my call. My concern is not who much who wanted but undermining the integrity of the electio introducing a mass mail ballot without process validation. Now i spent my career as a scientist in process validation mostly over the counter drugs and we should have, we should have separated the mail ballots. It was clearly outside of the states constitutional guidelines, some of the states and thats amicus brief that was written was not taken by the Supreme Court but thats another issue, but in county alone there was 113,000 ballots in pennsylvania that were not accur the addresses. There were all kinds of other things, so we should have taken the mass mail ballots and said, hey, its outside, the system wont be robust and, therefore, we are going count them separately and you to have a copy of your id attached at the time that we receive the ballot we will separate the ib, attach it to the envelope and then we can do an audit and do it separately but thi last election was not a robust validation of an election which ht. Can consider with all thats my concern. Debra hang in the line and listen to the response. Yeah. What im going to tell you i think youre right when it comes to the weak validation that we currently have in place for mail ballots in many places in the country but not necessarily all. When you talk about Election Integrity one of the challenges we have is every state does it differently and many times, mant counties within the same state do the same thi■3■ reay from ead thats inconsistency and integrity are two different words and they mean opposite things in my world. And i have a lot of suggestions in the book for things that we can and should do to improve our elections and i know that there are many congressmen and women who watch this right now and im asking you, begging you to please consider a nonpartisan effort to reallyva operate our elections and make some really necessary changes to eliminate some of the problems that we have right now and i don demonize mailin ballots but using signatures to validate to say who you are casting anonymously i think thats a real challenge and centuryold technology, question do far better than what we are doing right now and i have many, many suggestions along those lines. So i agree with you caller we really need to do better than we are doing right now. You look at pennsylvania and the claim of dead voters, what did you find . So i think ive done something fairly unique in the country. I predicted a couple dead votes in pennsylvania before they occurred. And whats interesting about this in particular is there was i was involved in at all of the registered voters in pennsylvania to see who was deceased. I found a couple who had died years before september 2020 when they had brandnew registrations on the system and looked at those and i said, you watch, these will be fraud. That warning made its way into a lawsuit that was working its way through pennsylvanias courts at the time and sure enough on election day some of those n■ votes, the votes count bud then after the factco the person who created ad ■ each of the votes they arrested the people who made those fraudulent votes and they prosecuted and got convictions for thosee fraudulent votes and whats interesting in the case of pennsylvania, the two casesre im talking about were both republicans who cast deceased votes on family members. Do we know who they voted for . Yes n both cases and this is an important question, im going g answer to it, yes, because the person who committed the fraud admitted that they were republicans and that they had cast the fraudulent votes on behalf for President Trump but whats really important about this whole concept of contesting an electionim based n identifying fraudulent that what i hope most of your viewers understand is when you cast a vote who you vote for is not disclosed. Tie your particular ballot back to you once youve cast your vote. So lets imagine, this didnt happen but lets imagine that i found 15,000 fraudulent votes in georgia. V okay. Had i found those votes im of law would have looked at those and made a determinationad that therefore the election should have been overturnve becaus and document would be that those fraudulent votes worked against President Trumps interests. Those votes cant be shown to harm the campaign because you dont know who those votes were cast for. Its a really important point all of these issues that revolve around fraud without being able to show harm in that those to trumps opponent, youre not going to get an election overturned. So sticking with pennsylvania and the claims by some Trump Lawyers that there were dead voters there, you found what . Oh, i think we probably found i cant tell you, ten, on the high end. And i dont think a lot of them were prosecuted. I think there were only a handful that i aware of, two or three that resulted in convictions. I dont know whatever happened to the rest of them. The Trump Campaign for the fraud i did find as best as i know they didnt forward those results to law enforcement. Go to dan next, south■f dako. Hello. Hi, dan, your turn. Yeah,stion is so trump lost the popular vote by like what 8 million and he lost Electoral College by 50 we have to go back to gore versus george w. Bush and so like what youre saying in your book is that, you know, you try to uncover the fraud and that it didnt come out where it would affect the election and we also got to go back in the time frame that was during covid and so there was a lot more mailin ballots at that time and i think this election coming up in 2024 will be like a lot less, you know, mailin ballots and more had a guy from mississippi come in to our work here in south dakota and said, you know, youre going to make sure that these elections are valid a i said where i go vote in my Little Elementary School here in sioux falls, south dakota, you have to have your id,■ double tn you go in and vote, okay, so there is no voter fraud republicans, okay, my question to your guest is why wont trump and the republicans accept the fact that they lost because al gore had to do it when george w. Bush vote and i think he got screwed in that election. Why dont you think yeah, why dont you think trump wt accept this . Yeah, its a good gee. Questionwhatsoever. Theres probably political answer to it. My role and that everything is happening here is focused on the data and im not going to dive into the political piece of it. Ive run for governor twice in my state of rhode island. I lost a statewide primary by 3,000 votes and it hurt to concede that race. I didnt want to concede that race. It was an ugly race. It was intensely personal but i did. As and, you know, thats what our democracy looks like and i hope as we move forward out of 2020 that we can get our elections back to a more civil and responsible way of conducting our ourselves and dealing with the impact of losing. Are you a republican or■a cr . Im currently a registered republican. Did you run as a republican . In my two runs, my first run i started a centrist Political Party in rhode island in 2009 and after needing to challenge the states Ballot Access laws and federal Court Getting them to clear unconstitutional launching the party we needed somebody to run for governor who got at least 5 of the votes that ended up being me and i ani realize i was pretty good at at the campaigning and i had a lot of ideas i wanted to implement and i also realized in the couple of years between 2010 and 2014 that working via third party just wasnt going too work. Too hard to get traction. People cant put their heads around what it means to be anytng other than democrat or republican and in rhode island, i mean, a reformer, i like to see change, rhode islan