Susan Caroline Scott harrison was born in 1832 where she met Benjamin Harrison. She grew into an accomplished artist, interested in womens issues. Although the harrison presidency has been rated as fairly unsuccessful by some historians, those who tracked first ladies considered Caroline Harrison as one of the more underrated to serve in this role. Well learn why in this segment of first ladies influence and image and here to tell us more about the story of Caroline Harrison, our two guests who know the office well. Edie mayo, thanks for coming back. And bill seale, white house historian, has spent his professional career understanding the history of that building. Bill and edie are both members of cspans Academic Advisory Committee for this series. Were going to start with an illustration tonight. The white house itself is one of the most iconic buildings in the world. If Caroline Harrison had had her way, it would like different today. We have her designs for the white house that wed like to show people at home right now. What were her plans . What was she trying to do with this big expansion of the white house . Dr. Seale well, it was a time of big spending in his administration. The government was spending a lot of money. And she got into it by wanting to create a house, they were crammed in this house. They only lived upstairs. You see, to understand it, on the picture, the middle of the upper picture, the columns and just the four windows to each side of it, the office was on the left. The east room was just below that and the other public rooms on the ground floor, then the other end, the west end, or the right side, was the family quarters which was seven rooms and a bath and a half and she wanted Something Big to live in. But something also to entertain in because the harrisons entertained all the time. And so she had this plan done which you see here. Youre looking at the south, of the back part of the white house with the round porch, where president truman later built a balcony. The center part is the old white House Building that was finished in the 18th century and the white house is on a bank. Its a threestory house on the walkout on the back. About 17 feet, i guess. And so what you see here was a quadrangle with the green houses that they had had, which were really specimen conservetories. See thats dropped. So the windows would still have the beautiful view of the potomac. It would not have been an enclosed area. On the right side was to be, as i recall, the National Gallery or the national museum. It was not washington one. And then there were other public rooms on the other side. The second floor then had guest room, family quarters and such as that to make it a much more livable house, as well as the office. Susan looks a bit like some of the grand houses of europe. This is going to brand the other traditionalists, but are you happy she wasnt successful . Yes, i am. From our point of view. It was basically Theodore Roosevelt who insisted it be restored. Susan edie, whats interesting about the story is this woman came into the white house not being seen as political but she had an innate sense of how the lobby was. She was successful in getting it past the senate. Tell the story of how she put together that Winning Coalition for the senate. Ms. Mayo well, she went about lobbying through her entertaining in the first place. But she also called in the press and showed them the plans and got them to sign on that this was really a good idea. And of course they were in the white house at the centennial of the presidency. So she thought this would be a wonderful plan. As a memorial for the 100th anniversary, the nation had grown in land and in power and she wanted a residence that reflected the global power of the United States. So this was a perfect opportunity. So she called in the press, she got a lot of major people in washington interested. She lobbied the senate. She lobbied the house. And i will let bill tell why it failed. Susan before we do that, she also enlisted the help of a former first lady. Ms. Mayo harriette lane. She brought her in and she also used the name of George Washington and how this would be, you know, a fitting memorial and so forth. Dr. Seale he had built the house. She was just making it work. Susan and hadnt washington also envisioned that it could have been added on . Dr. Seale he did. In years to come. Susan so, she won the senate but in the house she ran into a formidable foe which was the speaker reid. Dr. Seale speaker tom reed from maine. He was a great adversary of Benjamin Harrison. They fought a lot over bills. And Leland Stanford from california was mrs. Harrisons great ally. And he spent the night sleeping in the cloakroom, hoping the appropriation would go through. But speaker reed, he was a very razortongued kind of sharp guy, and he cooked up this story that harrison had appointed a postmaster in maine without his approval and he crashed the whole thing. He wouldnt let it come up. Susan so, lacking her ability to expand the white house, she turned to restoring what she already had. Dr. Seale she redecorated. Thinking and hoping it was a minor thing to do. And she became interested in the Historic House and began researching things. And pulling out antiques and stuff and putting them in the different rooms and she had a decorator in boston make things spiffy. Tiffany had been the last one to do the rooms. And they were very rundown. The special effects and all that nobody could reproduce. Susan she didnt just find Old Furniture that had been stored in the white house. Heres a quote of what else she discovered in the white house. This is from her diary and well be using quotes from her very prolific diary throughout our program tonight. Tell me the story of the rats in the white house. Ms. Mayo washington has a very prolific and wellknown rat community. So they had infested the white house. And were both in the basement and i guess also in the attic. And so apparently the man with the ferrets was brought in to help reduce the rat population. But there was also a man with a gun i think. Who was shooting the rats whenever he saw them. Dr. Seale he would proceed her through attic. Then strangely enough, atic had no access to it. The little back stair that lincoln made famous was taken out and the elevator was put in there and somehow stair access to two floors, so they had to go on a ladder, up above the elevator, and she went, little tiny woman. She went up there with this guard, with the gun, and they began pulling things out of boxes and a rat would appear and hed shoot it. And they were big ones, too. Susan hed shoot, shed scream. Is how the story goes. We would like to invite you to participate. This series, which weve been learning so much and hope you are too, this is our next to last for season one. And wed love to have your comments and your participation and questions tonight. You can do it three ways. You can call us. And our phone numbers in eastern and several time zones if you would like you can also join our social community, our Facebook Page already has some comments coming in. And you can tweet us, but if you do, use firstladies. As she approached the white house, she was criticized by the press for being overly domestic. What was the view of the changing first lady that it would be criticized . Ms. Mayo i think they thought that doing actual housework, which what was rumored, rather than looking for historical treasures and trying to salvage the history of the white house and presidency, it was looked at as she was, you know, actually engaging in housework and maybe, who are, cooking their own meals. And this was seen as very much beneath the dignity of a first lady. But one of the things that she mirrors in the time is the growing Home Economics movement. Which organized itself around 1890. And so she was very much a part of her times in anticipating what was thought to be the professionalization of housework. So instead of being praised for what she did, she was criticized. And she could not fathom why there was all this, you know scorn and mocking and so forth in the press of what she was doing in the white house, but i think people didnt quite understand what she was trying to accomplish. Dr. Seale i would have thought that washington is hard on first ladies. Theyve been a little hard on mrs. Obama. They are until they sort of prove themselves. And she had been around, he been in the senate, theyd been in washington means times. She was a popular woman in washington, socially. But when she got in the house, it was a little different. Ms. Mayo different viewpoint. She was very hurt by the criticism. Susan what we learn is that the press went into a frenzy. It was the booming age of newspapers, there was coverage in magazines. So, the press was prepared to cover this first lady and werent happy with what they were seeing. Heres one quote from her diary. She wrote about the press, i am about the press dr. Seale ms. Mayo she was following this absolutely gorgeous young woman. So that must have been very, very difficult. Dr. Seale and a clever young woman. Young and with a husband who had no use for p. R. So people flocked around Frances Cleveland. Ms. Mayo frances was the sort of Jackie Kennedy of her age. She was quite beautiful. She was 10 years younger than jackie was when she entered the white house. So she was very, very popular. Of course there was this whole thing about this maydecember romance that had taken place with the president. And much speculation before he actually married that maybe he was courting her mother. Then there was the sort of bombshell that, no, he was courting the young and beautiful frances. She was a beautiful woman but she was not Frances Cleveland, franky as she was known in the press, was just to tell a story about how clever she was. You may have had it on this show. Susan she had her due last week. Dr. Seale the president of spain is the first real visitor of state. She was the same as age as mr. Cleveland. There was a reception at the white house and a pretty, pretty woman wore pearls clear to the floor and diamonds and all that stuff. Mrs. Cleveland wore an offwhite silk dress. It was a coup. She stole the show. Susan Benjamin Harrison, our 23rd president , he was the republican cleveland was a democrat. Were going to learn about some of the policies of his administration. But we talked about the fact that wed be reading quotes for her diary and dave on twitter asks, knowing how important the presidency had become, did caroline expect her diary to be made public someday . Were going answer that question about her diaries by visiting the Harrison House. It is in indianapolis. And if you get to the capital city of indiana, visit it yourself. Were going to visit there for the first time and learn more about the diaries. Caroline harrisons white house diary, this is something that we dont have out very often. She kept the diary and you can see very fragile. So shes written in the front here, keeping the diary and the dates. 1889. To 1891 for this one. In the diary she mentions several Different Things she mentions going to Arlington Cemetery and decorating the soldiers gravesite at arlington. She mentioned riding with benjamin to the soldiers home and hospital. Some of the things that were very near and deer to her here were working with orphans and with the hospitals and she continued to do some of that while she was in washington as well, visiting the hospitals and what not there as well. But she also mentioned some of the other events and things that are going none her diary. Her artistic abilities i think. Having the floral arrangements for several different banquets and dinners. She mentions decorations there as well. This is a dinner at the arlington in washington, d. C. , and you can see the table setting had quite a large group. We have the Vice President , the president and where the different delegations were sitting at that particular dinner. She also talks a lot about the centennial celebration in new york for the centennial of George Washingtons inauguration. From 1789 to 1889. Things from the banquets and one of the parades was 7 1 2 hours long. And then also very personal and familyrelated things mentioned in the diary as well. Mentioned how shes feeling, what the weather is like. But one of the things that she talks about is the christening of their young granddaughter Mary Lodge Mckee. And she says that they used water from the river jordan that her sister had brought back from a trip over there. And we actually have some of that water in our collection yet today. So we have a little container here. Actually have, you know, some water in there as well. A bottle with the label there that her sister had brought back. And Mary Lodge Mckee was christened in a private ceremony at that time and she also mentions christmas at the white house and having the tree put up for the grandchildren and the harrisons had the first decorated Christmas Tree in the white house. And she mentioned some of the gifts that were given to her at that time including some opera glasses. So we have her opera glass heres that were given to her as a Christmas Gift that she mentions in the diary as well. Susan so the answer to the viewers question is it looks like she intended for these to be public documents. Dr. Seale but you never know. If she had started much earlier, a person can get so absorbed in a diary, it becomes a confidant or friend. I dont know whether she did or not. She didnt do other things. Selfpromotional or showing her. You know, she and the president both suffered from depression. And eventually it had an impact on her health. But they fought that together very hard by keeping busy. Susan how many children did they have . They had 2. Dr. Seale they lost one. Susan the white house in that time was filled with children but they were their grandchildren, correct . Dr. Seale their grandchildren and their children. The son was in and out. He lived in montana. But his wife was there. And the children and then the daughter, mary, whos called mimi, and the little boy who became world famous for doing nothing. Just being baby mckee. At the white house. Susan right. So what was life at the white house like . Dr. Seale crowded. And lots and lots of entertaining. The evening was absolutely absorbed with it. Remember the office was in the house. At the other end of the hall from the family quarters. So it was there were about 15 servants as i recall. Most federal employees from the agencies and they are paid from the agencies and all these children and the routine of the private house, plus the public activities, it was a very busy place. Susan we mentioned at the outset that the first lady was an artist and were going to learn a little bit more about the kind of art she particularly loved but first lets do a few calls. Well talk to horace from philadelphia. Before ask you the question, would you mute the volume on your tv . Were getting feedback. Caller sure. Thank you for taking my call. Ive been watching the series right along. Im enjoying it very, very much. Can you tell us about her background . Who were her parents, where was she raised . Long before she met her husband, can you tell us about that . Susan sure. Can you take that and were going to spend a segment on it later on. Ms. Mayo well, she was born and brought up in oxford, ohio. Her father had been a minister but at the time he was a professor. At the university, miami university. And then went on to found the oxford Womens Institute which was a college for women. And so her parents were both extremely well educated and her father was a supporter of womens education. So he made certain that his daughter had a good one. And i think that sort of interested her for the future in womens accomplishments and the progress of women. Susan laura is watching in clarksville, indiana. Youre on. Caller why are the first ladies called the first ladies . Susan thats a good question. Ms. Mayo well, i think that started when Zachary Taylor used that term for dolly madson during her Memorial Service in 1849. And he said she was truly the first lady of our land. She was a connection to the revolutionary time period and she keeps coming back to the white house. She was the first in social standing, probably for 16 years. First as jeffersons standin first lady then, first lady on her own. But she continued to have great influence. And so i think thats how it started, that she was the first in stature. And that name carried on. It wasnt really picked up until after the civil war. I think harriette layne had that under some of her photographs in papers and so anyway, but it just means the first among everyone. Linda, bloomington, minnesota, youre on. Caller good evening. I have a question that relates to my own family. I had a grandmother whose name was Kate Harrison and then she married and her name was thomas and she grew up i believe in missouri. There was a story that her mother had been married in the white house and i dont know if theres any truth to this, but i thought perhaps you might know if there was a wedding in the white house during Benjamin Harrisons term there. Dr. Seale it would not be surprising but i dont know that name. Local newspapers would probably carry it. Both in washington and wherever they were from. Thats where i would look for it if i were looking for it. But i dont i know in lincolns time there were marriages in the white house. John adams and some others but i dont know any in the harrison tenure. Susan one more question and then well learn more about the first ladys artistic endeavors. Charlotte from olympia washington. Whats your question . Caller