She talked about the Culture Shock she experienced as a californian attending school in virginia. Civil rightsof a history project initiated by congress in 2009, conducted by this missoni and museum of africanamerican history and culture, the american full life , andr Folk Life Center the university of North Carolina chapel hill. i will go back to my grandparents, if i may, because in a way, it was a civil rightstype activity. My grandfather these are stories that were told to me, and i asked my cousin about it because he is older than i, and he says it is true. My grandfather had 500 invested in the stock market, and of course, he lost it. This is when people were jumping out the window and so forth. My grandparents were teachers. I think he taught languages and music, and i dont know what my grandmother taught, but they moved from virginia to philadelphia. That started the family split the family because my grandparents couldnt get a job. They said they did not hire black teachers in philly. They had black children going to schools, but no black teachers. My grandmother took in washing, and my grandfather refused to do that type work. The family actually split. They were together physically, but not together. The older kids went to college they wereily, and teachers, the two oldest ones. The youngest kid was sent to school by the middle children, who did not go to college. They had to work to help pay. Go about the color line thing. I was born in d. C. My mother was born in virginia. My dad was born in maryland. When i was three, my parents divorced when i was a baby. My dad took the boy. My mother took the girl and remarried, moved to San Francisco. From the age of three on, i grew up in San Francisco. Then she remarried again and moved to san diego. I ended up at virginia union, great,w, which one of my great grandparents was on the board at virginia seminary, and it was great to know that my great, great grandparent had helped to start the school. A little bitd talk more about your childhood ,rowing up on the west coast before you experienced virginia. What was the racial dynamic of life . growing up in San Francisco, i grew up in what is now called the west inch. It was known as fillmore back in those days. Called the west end. Im trying to think was it full of black people . I think probably as a child, you did not even know. I guess thats where the black people lived. Then we moved to the presidio and i went to saint dominics. It was all white. I was the only black child, and every day, i used to pray, i hope a nun doesnt slap me this morning. She would walk down as we were praying and she would slap me. I would pray to god, ive done something wrong. Please help me. I did not know what i had done wrong, never did. And i used to get fs. I was in the second or third grade, and my mother said you need to bring your papers home, and i started crying. She asked what was wrong. I said, im dumb. I get all fs. She said, thats ok. Bring them home anyway. She collected them all, about that many, about an inch and brought them to school and asked why they were marked wrong. I didnt know i was bright. She told me to go outside and play, and i said im not allowed to pray im not allowed to play. I have to go into the church and pray during recess. Ie said to go outside, but dont know what she said to the nun, but after that, the iartest girl in class and were vying for grades. And the nun stopped slapping me. I did not tell my mom she slapped me. I went to a Public School called presidio, and a little boy said a little white boy a little boy said that he could not hold my hand because his mother said he could not hold ers, sorry wentgg home and asked my mom, was i a did not know. I i knew he could not hold my hand. Cliff that was probably the first time you heard the term . i had other experience. We owned a momandpops grocery store, which is typical in San Francisco. They have safeway, but generally, you have little stores. A man came in, and my parents never talked in front of me, but becaused only substitute he had a dishonorable discharge because in world war ii, he jumped off of a ship refusing to fight. He said why should i fight for america when he is not free here . I remember saying that. Mother remember my trying to get a job. Join the her, you union first and you can get the job. Get the job first and vice versa. I remember my mother crying. But not in front of us. It is the little, subtle things. Rope monica had a big across their beach. Unofficially. It is there. Jobs, only teach in the black aria. Black area. It is still there. Had your parents prepare you for what it would be like as you get ready to go across the country . Ms. Grinnell heck no. Ive got in and i sat down at the Soda Fountain and i said i wanted a banana split. One strawberry, one vanilla and if you dont have black walnut, please put another strawberry and no chocolate and strawberry syrup and the cream and nuts. I always get that. The lady went away to make it and she came back and she said we cant serve you. I said are you out . She says no. Oh. Oh. R saying oh, three times because it shocked me i could not get a banana split because i was sitting at the counter. I wasnt thinking, i just sat down. Had you had experiences like that in california . Notgrinnell they are over, covert. You can feel them. Asked when i went to high school, my cousin was filipino. Claudette, might middle name is claudette, she said i want you to come to the filipino picked it. I said no, im not filipino. She said come with me so i went and took my date. We got to the place outside of San Francisco and the guy sat outside the gate and he said i have to let you and, are you sure you want to come . So i had that kind of thing. You people can come in, do you think youre going to be happy . It was presented in a different way. You why you decided to goodrich additionally black why you decided to go to a traditionally black university . Get mennell dont wrong, it was great, but i should have gone to the city. It was too much learning at the time. Being in the south and the mentality. What was that like . I didnt like anybody. The black people and the way people. Young. F all, i was i didnt know anything. In the 50s. Then. Und person, you are very ignorant, but you dont know it. I thought i knew everything. When i went there, i couldnt understand why the white people treated the blacks the way they were treated and why the blacks allowed it. With the blacky people for not sitting in, the kids. I didnt understand but i do now. In, the parents would have been fired. I had no idea. Like inwas the union terms of black consciousness . Teachers that we were talking about . These issues . People,nell i believe its a way of life and they knew how to live within the system. I understand it was comfortable for them, but i think i have a black society which is a way of living. Johnson, who is my favorite instructor there. He had to phds i think. A very bright man. He used to play in a quartet. I dont know, he played violin or something. He said one night he was driving home. He used to tell jokes in class and he had a white woman in the god im goingd my to be killed. He was always saying Something Like that. I dont remember. Im so old, i dont remember. Language ask questions about this i am going to ask questions about this. What kind of conversations were you having amongst yourselves as the students . Ms. Grinnell we were having meetings. Think were the leaders. We were always having meetings about that. Yes. Can you remember what the meetings were like . Ms. Grinnell no, i cant. Being old is a son of a gun. I thought the world was going to change. I was so naive. The Police Person was very nice to me. When we were arrested, he held my hand and he helped me up. I thought that was so nice. Aunt called me my called me and she said icu being helped into the paddy wagon. I was angry with them, because i felt they lived in virginia, they should. I met a woman at the 50 year reunion. She was in the sedans so evidently i knew her but i didnt. They needed pictures of when they were young. Because i havent seen these people in 50 years. Andere sitting at the table tears were coming down her eyes. Too, but i crying dont cry in front of people. She said her father was fired. I had to move out of state. She had to drop out of school. I dont know she ever finished college and i thought you know, thats how naive i was. She was one of the few people from virginia in the sedans. ,uite a few people were there im sure, but i wanted them all to be there. I didnt live in virginia, my parents were in california. What did you want to change . Ms. Grinnell i know that we are all not going to be hunkydory, but i thought there is going to be integration now. , i remember when we got arrested, we went to a courthouse im sorry, we went to jail and we all went into the same south and it was smelly. Cell went into the same and i thought not even a clean cell can you go into. Then, we went into the court and it was segregated. Then i remember a black man came in and he was a drunkard and you could smell him. I thought why did the dredges have to come in . It is going downhill fast. I thought, am i losing my mind . Horrible. Not now that we sat in, we have these attorneys and theyre going to go to court and everything is going to be right and its not going to be any longer. You can change laws, but you cannot change people. That comes about through your. Oing individually created what kind of process is that . Ms. Grinnell what do you think . Think the young kids today, many of them did not grow up during that era. If you get angry with anyone, it is angry not because the persons color it is for some other reason. I think that is great. Many of the kids are that way today. You, you are always going to have an upper dog and a lower dog. How long were you in college before the sedans started . Ms. Grinnell i dont remember. You are asking me difficult questions. [laughter] really, i dont remember. In fact, i was surprised it was so important. Been, the sithave aboutvirginia union was three weeks after the one in greensboro, North Carolina, february 1. It would have been one of the early ones. Aware remember if you are of other sedans . S . Y other sit in ms. Grinnell i dont remember. . Ms. T you were aware grinnell i was going to be a nonviolent person. I am not a violent person anyway. Just my mouth, unfortunately. Thought, isnt fair to have people hate you hit you and you can protect yourself. Its not fair. If i had been a man, i probably would have been angry and retaliated. Trouble . U run into ms. Grinnell no. Dogs and things, but it was fine. Tins were calm compared to other cities. What happened . We went to a Department Store and we sat down, i didnt sit down because i was so tall but they pointed me out. High heel shoes and that made me over six feet tall. They wouldnt serve us. Comparedatively calm to what i have seen on the news and talk to other people. How many students . Ms. Grinnell 34. Were you arrested right away . Ms. Grinnell the first time we work, the second time we were. We walked from school to downtown. I hate to say this, but it was a jovial mood. A lot of kids walking together. I guess we were all going to change the world. I dont know how they felt, but thats the attitude that i had. Were there songs being sung sung . On mar ms. Grinnell yes and dont ask the the names. I had to learn the songs. Growing up a catholic, you didnt know the songs. I had never heard the black National Anthem in my life. To, adam was went a big man and he and my uncle worked together. He came to town to talk and i went to one of his civil rights meetings. In the church, the people clapped and they bank their feet and it scared me because i dont want this on the thing, i had never been in a whole group of black people. Can you imagine . Im black and im scared . That doesnt make good sense. You have never experienced this before. Ms. Grinnell no. You said earlier, when you first got to virginia, did this change for you . I got a better understanding of what was happening. People had to live there. The white people were only going along with the status quo. I knew i was getting the hell out of there. As soon as you could . Ms. Grinnell yeah as soon as i could. Why was that . Ms. Grinnell because i didnt like virginia. I shouldnt say that on camera. Virginia has any fine qualities. I was too immature to really appreciate what was happening. I was too immature. Did you ever experienced any other parts of the deep south . Ms. Grinnell no, that was enough. [laughter] this, wheno follow you finished at virginia, where did you go from there . Ms. Grinnell school wise . City wise . I went to washington, d. C. Boyfriend andman my mother kept saying come back to california. I said when i go back, im not going back to san diego. I dont like san diego, its to country. San diego is flat. I said im going home to San Francisco. She says claudette, please come back. She says i will pay your way back in if you dont like it, you can go back to washington, d. C. , or San Francisco. I come back and im a kid partying and i got a job. Im stuck there for two years, another city i dont like. Then, i moved to l. A. Because im partying and l. A. And i have friends there. I love dancing. Allought i will dance summer and go to all these parties then i will go to San Francisco and get a job. I never did, because i waited too late. I got stuck in l. A. And thats for you stayed. What did you end up doing for work . Next my last bill, l. A. Embly unified School District. I taught people working for masters. You know i have a doctorate in even behavior. I taught graduate students career psychology. At cal lutheran and mount st. Marys. Usa you san diego. My masters at usc. Alifornia im a california person. I want to ask more details sitins. What is the experience you went through their outside of jim crow that was different from where you are raised . Sitins, whatthe did you bring back to california from that experience . Ms. Grinnell that the wheels of. Ustice turn slowly i often thought, what i do it would i do it again . Yes, i would do it again. It did hurt me job wise. I went for a job and the guy said i had to hire you because you made a high score on the exam. But i dont think you will be happy here. He said i see you have been involved in civil rights. I always put down that i have an arrest record. District, they flunked me on training and experience. I was working for the County School district before a game to a unified School District. I asked superintendent, he liked me as a person. I said can you figure out why they wont hire me and l. A. . He says you have an arrest record for sit in and you are going to be a problem. I finally got in because someone mistakenly sent me a contract. I think it was my guardian angel. Maybe it was a black secretary who sent the paper out. You want to talk more about the it was sitins. Uncomfortable. I think i have suppressed that. It hurts to this day. What is it about it . Becausenell it hurts many peoples attitude have not changed. On both sides. Also, when i see these black kids not going to school, it hurts me to my heart. Realizeng, dont they they need an education, they have to vote. Many of them are not doing it. I want to cry. I really want to cry. You told me before we started that looking back at these times made you feel emotional. I was wondering what exactly you are feeling thinking about . Ms. Grinnell the way the whole situation is today and also with obama being president , many feelings that come to surface. Many of what other people feel has come to surface in a negative fashion and i dont like that. The screaming out during sessions, calling him names, comparing him to hitlers and so toph. You always need a dog, i understand that. If we get rid of race, it will be size, height, color of eyes. It will be something. When my brother came back from switzerland, he was the man behind kissinger at the geneva conference. He came back and he said this b. S. I said what . He said we have World Problems to contend with. Ofyou come from a family serious achievers. Ms. Grinnell yes, i do. Any insight . Ms. Grinnell no, not at all. I am glad i did. Your work in the School District and as a counselor, were there racial issues that . Ame up question mar a. Grinnell yes, and i wrote three page typewritten letter. They are going to say its not racial, but it is. We did expulsions. We had a hearing. Brought that did knives, guns, weapons, etc. We would say you were either straight expelled or suspended expelled. That means you are either kicked out of the district or suspended from school. We had a kid who, without any names, who was involved in drugs. Because his parents had money, he was white, they didnt kick him out. I was so angry. I was one of three on the committee. I told the other two Committee People who were white, i said you know he is guilty. They said he is going to go to college. I said so . They said we judge a casebycase. I said dont be that to me. I said dont do that to make. The kid is guilty. Saying theetter innercity kids who are not going to go to college who do the same thing or not as much will be expelled. Its there. So insidious. How did you feel when obama was elected . Ms. Grinnell i was elated, because he was intelligent. Not only because he was black, i have to put that also, but he was intelligent and i felt he was going to do the best he could for everyone. Not just black people, everyone. You cant have someone doing for one group and not the whole group. In working with the School District, were you ms. Grinnell yes, i was on one of the committees and i asked a question. I said why are you only bussing the black kids . He said did you hear what i said . We are bussing the black kids and that was it and he was talking over me. That was it. I remember that. Are the ones they who had to get up early, come home late. Driver far. L. A. , we had in the number one Elementary School academically in my area because the people who lived in my area were educators, doctors, lawyers, black mostly. Our school was tough. My kids went to private school. Anyway, they bust the kids from school bussed the kids. They said why should we bus the kids . Our kids dont need to go to a white school. What the S