access to president trump through his son, who is supposedly running his phony trust to resolve conflicts of interest, and who says he talks to the president all the time. and his mission there is to make as much money and sell as many condos as possible. and they've got to keep those condo buyers happy. so what's to keep donald jr. from promising to pass on a message from some foreign national who paid access to him, or worse, some foreign government that paid for access to him? the answer is, absolutely nothing. >> i have to ask you, michael, and consider the rules. as you said, there's no legal application for this. but it goes against all decency and norms. did we just think that we were going to -- in the history of america or in the future of america, that we would always nominate someone who was a decent person? wouldn't trade on the history of the united states? >> we went through our period of naivete in the '70s.