this is clear from the filings coming before us right now. >> and the russian guy was helping him tamper with these witnesses, which is also of interest. he's in russia. he is out of reach of the special counsel. so flynn, manafort, cohen all have the same question, jim, why lie? why lie about these contacts with russians and what you did and what you talked to them about if it doesn't matter? why did they all lie? >> well, it matters to manafort because manafort was under investigation and pled guilty to the violations and is going to be sentenced to those. and i think that's where the rubber hits the road on this. it is more about the foreign agents registration. >> which is all the redacted stuff. >> well, we don't know. >> but it doesn't have to do with that. >> that could also be related to that. it could also be related to counter intelligence issues. we don't know if it has anything to do with a campaign and collusion as it related to the trump campaign.