staff were really trying to probe the truth and particularly looking at the corroborating evidence that he gave, particularly asking for other witnesses that could corroborate him because we are very well aware that he has lied in the past. you know, he came there not as our friend, not as someone who we were there to prop up, but really trying to find the truth of the matter with regard to his involvement with the president and allegations of criminal activity by him and others in that orbit. >> so you're at a point obviously he's produced checks but when he says things like there was insurance fraud, inflation of ais he, or he says it seems very possible that the president knew about the meeting at trump tore, those things, you're not trusting him on anything he didn't explicitly provide backup data for? >> no. and i don't think that -- i'm a former prosecutor. and you're always looking beyond a reasonable doubt. of course that's not the standard in this instance. but i think that it's important for us in oversight to be able to look at those information and to find the witnesses and find evidence that would corroborate