need more. that's the met metaphorical.. we built the interstate highway system on it. we do do a lot of fixes and it hasn't gone up in ages. that's the argument he is making. >> my argument is this, in bridges, if something were permitted in new york. the argument was totals would stop, when the bridge was paid for 300 years ago. so now you are asking like, okay, then what the hell to we pay? >> my point is not to be indifferent but not to compound the problems. >> we have been having this stupid conversation for 40 years. >> it's not too stupid, we were doing a segment on it. >> a stupid conversation on whether we have an infrastructure. i don't know we have a crisis. i get to wherever i have to get to on time. there is lots of taxes. i worked at the bond buyer, i covered how indebted new york