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leading the pack in this. we'll see how he stacks up against hillary clinton where he stacks up better than any of the other potential opponents, still lower, but lower by only go points. jeb bush down by seven against hillary clinton. what do you make of it? >> here is the problem. hillary clinton is arguably still dominant. she doesn't have any legitimate challengers yet. that might change. the problem is that the worst and most problematic scandals for any candidate are the ones that reinforce preexisting negative notions about that candidate. that is why the clinton cache foundation money and that scandal, private email and private server, that scandal are essentially serving as tipping points, who said i may have liked her or trusted her in the past but i'm growing to give her a shot because it is her turn first woman. martha: so hard to right that ship. >> but these scandals, martha serve as tipping points for a lot of voters, i was already

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