Transcripts For DW The Day 20240713

Also coming up in spain a crisis of governments and a crisis of identity for elections in 4 years and still no clear answers from the voters as a big change in the Political Landscape for sure i think that at that an issue has been very much a boat that its threat to this baby and id is something that betty movie many people. Want to our viewers on p. B. S. In the United States and all around the world welcome what we begin the day with what you find when impeachment happens in washington protests are happening in iraq and theres a movie based on a true story with all of these were the answer is the whistleblower this week for only the 4th time in u. S. History public impeachment hearings called by House Speaker nancy pelosi. And against the president will begin it was a whistleblower report that made even the thought of in peaching President Trump possible and it comes at the same time that violent deadly protests continue in iraq angry crowds demanding that the state finally provide basic services such as electricity and theyre also calling for an end to corruption in government some see iraqs Current Crisis and they point to the u. S. Led war in 2003 a war that we know today was sold to the International Community with wide eyes well some of those winds were exposed by a british woman named katherine gun and she was unable to prevent the war but her actions have been called the most important and courageous of all leaks ill speak with katherine gun in just a moment but 1st her story which is now a movie entitled official secrets. The u. S. And britain wanted to attack iraq with the support of a u. N. Resolution when the u. S. Struggled to get support the countrys National Security agency asked British Intelligence to try and win over 6 uncommitted nations on the Security Council and agent at g. C. H. Q. Catherine gunn received the directive but didnt agree eventually she had it sent to britains observer newspaper which then revealed the plan on march 4th 2003. That caused the scandal in britain and beyond. Simply understand im not going to comment on the operations of our Security Services but i do say this we act in accordance with the mistake and International Law and we act in the best interests of this country and all Security Services are a vital part of the protection of this country a couple of weeks later the americans british and other Coalition Forces then decided to attack iraq without the backing of a resolution after giving leader Saddam Hussein and ultimatum. At this hour american and Coalition Forces are in the early stages of military operations to disarm iraq to france people and to defend the world from grave danger. Tens of thousands of people were killed and wounded in the fighting before husseins regime was toppled one month later but violence persists in iraq to this day from terrorist bombings to writing against the government. Catherine gun was eventually arrested and faced a possible long sentence behind bars her story has since been made into a new movie and the film is called official secrets and stars cure and nightly to speak if you do not and you want found with information at any time you will be charged with a breach of the. And the subject of that new film official secrets is katherine gun she is with me here at the big table thousands good to have you on the program again you know ellsberg the pentagon papers leaker says that what you did your leaking im quoting here was the most important and courageous leak that the world has ever seen in part because you almost diverted the war. You agree with them while i was a high praise from a man who has done so much over the areas. To campaign for issues around. Transparency and open ness and so yes im you know his has actually a friend of mine and hes been a great supporter of. Many whistleblowers out of a is so thats a great ana many was so blowers such as there are theres Daniel Ellsberg theres the u. S. Army soldier Bradley Manning theres the former n. S. A. Contractor Edward Snowden do you see yourself. In that group or do you differentiate. When i lose those names would you say that we have to differentiate there. I think in our its important that whistleblowers are protected. And i think in a just society whistleblowers should be able to go to court if its necessary and present their case without retaliation. And if their case stands up in a court of law if its a fast system whereby they do have a defense under the law such as a Public Interest defense that they have that opportunity to present that case to court and determine whether their actions were indeed in the Public Interest oh not and i think you know it stands up in court it should be allowed to stand up in court that will supersede did you take a meeting for example when you joined the g. C. C. H. Q. You took the pledge you know i signed the official secrets act which is a promise that youre not to leak. What is it a secret or high level government its actually a promise that you must never discuss anything asshole basically its a blanket coverage and they a k. So theres nothing theres no scrap of information theres nothing that you can discuss outside of just with anybody who has not signed the official 2nd nondisclosure thats an agreement its completely orning compassing. If as i say its a blanket coverage a draconian piece of legislation that has no defense under the law or so if you if you do see something which is criminal illegal. Fraudulent. There is no defense there is nothing you can do an order to bring that information out for the public to decide for themselves or to see whats going on with the u. S. Whistleblower law that protects the whistleblower in even keeps the identity anonymous if he does the the right approach. I think if there is the danger retaliate in which that often has been you know if it is saying to be it often the case that whistleblowers are retaliated against either by that organizational their company then in some instances i think it should be anonymous but i think we need to move beyond this we need to move beyond a place where whistleblowers as seen as extraordinary and we need to move in a direction where bringing information to the public which is necessary for the public to know what is going on behind the scenes that should be seen as something to be sort of protected and respected and given proper in the court of law rather than for instance in the u. S. Where most of the cases now are being treated with the espionage act which and intelligence circles has absolutely nothing to do with the Public Interest defense either you or well aware that this is a moment in whistleblower history in the United States it was a blower has helped to bring on president ial impeachment hearings that start this week what do you make of whats happening there. Unfortunately i havent really been able to kape. Abreast of the situation in the u. S. Because its constantly changing. And i think its to mark a to really say what really is going on theres a lot of his say and. Its not a clear picture yet so i think until the kara picture its its difficult to comment a lot of the rhetoric about was the blowers coming from the white house today sounds like what we heard coming from number 10 downing street and tony blair back in 2003 take a listen. Its very tempting to see people who want to talk about the work of our Security Services as socalled whistleblowers or people simply in favor of open information but i tell you our Security Services particularly today particularly d with global terrorism as it is perform an absolutely vital task on behalf of this country many of their people work in circumstances a very great danger and it really is the height of irresponsibility to expose them to this type of public questioning and scrutiny in a way that can do absolutely no good to the security of this country so that when the law or is it great you are got it right and the whistleblower because the that the real deal and his lawyer. Said the worst thing possible 3 years ago. I may be praised. And you know you see the similarities there but you what you heard from tony blair height of irresponsibility because lives were put in danger of a point that. Yeah i mean its extraordinary to listen to him quite frankly because he took our country the best person to war on a lie he put hundreds of thousands of British Military men and womens lives at risk in fact 179 British Military personnel were killed in iraq. And many countless more were wounded. I mean frankly its the height of. Now i mean to suggest that its the height of irresponsibility to put people in harms way i mean i think really he should turn the tables on himself and ask himself the same question if you turned yourself and you were charged with breaking the official sea secrets act weve got a clip here from the interrogation in the in the which is based on what you did was take a look at this. With respect with. The others. Yes you get information from peoples phones and computers and you feed that do you say yes eavesdrop on private conversations yes and no europes into being has to do that to members of the Security Council detective. I didnt object to being asked to connect information that could help prevent a terror attack. Which they object to is being to get the intelligence to help fix the vote at the u. N. And deceive the world into go into war. Incredibly compelling scene there. The reviews for this would have been very good putting it in the same league as the movie all the president s men reviewers have called you the hero in this film are you a hero. I dont feel heroic im you know im a person i think how much of ordinary boring. Sort of person. But what i did was i felt necessary to bring information to the into the public arena and you know ive argued this in the past but i do feel more more so as time goes on that under the circumstances i did what i thought was right i did my job which was to to reveal information that i felt was. Revealing what was going on that was illegal. The journalists did their job they verified them from ation and then they published it even though it was against actually their own editorial angle on the paper so we provided that information to the into the Public Domain and there were m. P. s in britain who were against the war. And they voted in parliament against the wall although they were in the minority. I still would like to ask them and none of them have oncet this question or even come forward to discuss these issues with myself or motm by the journalist but why did they not take this piece of information to tony blair at the time and say when this was absolutely crucial a crucial moment in history. Tell us whats going on tony what is this piece of information hair on the front pages of the haves tell us whats going on why are we trying to subvert the vote and get a u. N. Resolution for war. You know and despite your public pronouncements its a point to your point right there weve heard many times also in the brics that the debate people asking why do lawmakers come clean about what breaks it really means but the story goes on. Its a pleasure meeting. You taking the time to talk with us tonight and we look forward to your film official secrets thank you coming out next week next week thank you very much. Former bolivian president evo morales has accused his countrys opposition of staging a coup morale is resigned as president on sunday amid pressure from the opposition. You may remember declared victory in the disputed president ial election back in october that triggered weeks of protests the capital of pause unrest overnight following the announcement from around us buses were burned and there were reports of looting. Stepped down after 14 years as president leaving a sudden power vacuum in the country. Bring in d. W. Corresponded johanan ramirez who is standing by for us in the libyan capital a pause good evening to you so we know that nearly everyone from relatives government has resigned so d do we know who is in charge in bolivia today. Yes after these wafer off resignations nobody. Annulus the former Vice President off the congress and now president of the congress should take over the power on and. Shes but the problem is that to do so she needs the congress should meet to accept his Resignation Letter he was to supposed to happen today but they think they couldnt meet today because of all the problems that have been happening in this city on in the whole country last night we had a real. President and to hold him in the whole country so thats why they couldnt meet today be a schedule to meet again tomorrow and then they should accept this letter before that she cannot take power so in this moment there is no president there is no one in the head of the executive power but this continues to function through their ministries and other public instances in the long term thats a good point because theyre getting a report through that the military have said that it will guarantee that Public Services continue to function at least in the near term what message do you think all of this since to the rest of latin and south america especially to venezuela cuba and also chile. I think that this is a very Important Message for all the countries for all the region that this sausage that this society fire from Political Parties far from the army they can do things to make things change but this is a very interesting phenomenon here because this is actually the society who have put this out of power but the thin is that in other countries i mean believe it has a very strong culture of like doors like trade unions or associations of women also sessions or farmers so they have a really very Important Role in the country and thats not the case in other countries such as venice where she lay already can i work so thats why i think here in bolivia we have this very interesting phenomena and i dont think maybe this is like something that could spread in the region brant ok didnt we use your 100 miras joining us tonight from the libyan capital of johan thank you very much. Well the political deadlock in spain will go along Prime Minister pedro songes a socialist took the largest share of the vote in sundays general election but fell short of a majority yet again the far right vox party which is vehemently opposed to Catalonian Independence made the biggest game but catalan activists blocked a major Border Crossing between spain and france today hoping to trumpet their call this. And to them points and the kettle on government in the aftermath of sundays elections i want to turn now to the kettle on the governments representative to germany maree its good to have you on the show maria and i want to have and i want to ask you about these Election Results the far right vox party its basically doubled its seat numbers in. Parliament they are against kettle on independence so that must mean a huge loss for your calls where we see on one hand that party collapsed basically to 10 seats and im vox party gained a lot of seats so thats like a parallel movement. Of course and i think its frightening for all of us not only for the cattlemans to see a far right frankly as party group or send it in as a 3rd force in the democratic column and in spain and europe in country and 21st century a party that is against womens rights and against. All rights its against all these things we think should be normal in those days and and thats that concerns us not only as a cattlemans about. The progress of spaniards many of the. Former government leaders are either in spanish prisons or theyre in exile outside of the country im sure you know of mr bridge to mull for example so what can the kemah one governments be what can you do what you did prioritise now when you have so many people so many leaders no longer they are. Talks talks talks dialogue is the only thing that the cut and government wants to its and thats the frightening thing as well because that debt off we see in the spanish politics after the elections is the big backdrop where. Somehow the lands and the spanish Central Government are and the last 1012 years so thats a problem and we should be able to to solve political problems with dialogue and negotiations and not by. And prison you have a kings. Against the Spanish Government in a legal case youre suing for alleged spying of your movements you say that the Spanish Government has been following you watching you i mean are you are you surprised what im not saying but gotten the Spanish Government has been following me and what i say is somebody has been following me and i say i want to know who that was a big big you suspect that they have been commissioned by special fora chase them indoors by some way but i well yes of course because im a free a european citizen and i think i should be followed by anyone if in case someone needs to know something about me could ask me for me. And thats why i i talk to my advocate and thats where we are right now you will ripley is let us know what happens and please come back to the program when you maybe have resolution or when theres been some advancement in your court case marie culprits the kettle on government representative to germany ri thank you very much thank you very much to you. Or when you think of an animal that can offer a human emotional support what usually comes to mind dogs cats maybe or probably not a pig lilu is what is called i guess a therapy pig gave sensitive swine shes part of a program that brings trade therapy animals to the airport so that spirits and to ease travel anxiety. Its just another day of work. Shes part of San Francisco International Airport swag brigade shes not catching any flights but a person smiling to help stressed out the past and just relax. People are very happy to get distracted from the travel from their routine whether theyre flying to on their journey or location or work by everybody is usually very happy. I did scenes its not to load a whole bush theres no lipstick on this pig. Just perhaps a touch of nail polish. And people seem to enjoy it. Ive never seen one here so its interesting that its fun i got really excited are you just a person a program they employ. To do tricks like a god. But lou doesnt do just simple tricks she has a knack of bringing people together. We walk in and we find today that most people have their heads buried in their devices theyre not engaged we walk in people start to look up they start to react they respond super positively they start to engage with each other. The program is a hit with florence but is it all a bit of a bore fully lose. The live very well life. To people. By fairy tale and that means that shes happy. It seems everyone is happy including li lu who obviously loves holding the limelight. If they call you a pig you can. Thank you the day is almost done the conversation continues online to find us on twitter news you can follow me at brick off t. V. Dont forget to use the hash tag the day i remember whatever happens between now and then tomorrow is another day well see it in about the for. The full and. Equal india. How can a countrys economy grow can harmony 6 people employment when there are doing worse look at the Bigger Picture india a country that faces many challenges and those people are striving to create a Sustainable Future clever projects from europe and india. Next g. W. And the violence of faith and hopelessness the announcement is a bridge. To mexico a treasure trove for ambitious photographers. We take a stunning visual journey through some of their work. Snapshots of mexico from going 45 minutes on d w. The Sustainable Way discover the bauhaus. Mouse from starts nov 14th on t. W. Earth home to millions of species a home worth saving. Google ideas tell stories of creative people and innovative projects around the world ideas that protect the climate boost Clean Energy Solutions and reforestation. Using interactive content to inspire people to take action good luck demons the environment series of global 3000 on t. W. And online. Of. The world generally its more than 2000000000. 00 tons of garbage annually according to the world bank at least 33 percent of this is not managed in an environmentally safe manner and these growing piles of garbage not only pose a serious threat to the environment but in danger of human Health Worldwide hello welcome