A quick recovery have been damaged the country about greece is the worst economic and humanitarian crisis in a decade and critics question the political will to stamp out rampant corruption and human rights abuses my guest this week is involved ways minister of Foreign Affairs and International Trade see both these 2 more you as a former army chief he was also the face of the military coup that propelled among god what to power to zimbabwe ever be able to see genuine political and economic reform. Foreign minister a see both you so much oil welcome to conflict zone thank you. You were the face of the military overthrow of Robert Mugabe back in 2017 as a commander you got on television in your uniform to assure the public of a stable transition back then you were the heroes of the hour now you have an economy close to collapse with fuel food electricity shortages where is the hope in zimbabwe right now. World thank you very much sarah yes the change in 2070. And the advent of the current government which is the 2nd dispensation was as a result of a lot of issues but among those was the issue of the economy and the disappeared the public took over an economy which had been in distress for many years for Different Reasons some of the business could be sanctions and then some of the reasons could be that of management but this me say that there was hope and theres still hope because we have got to take painful decisions to the 5 the economy from where it was and these political decisions are the ones which appear as if theyre making people lose hope but in reality. Getting teams right and i want to talk about you mentioned sanctions you mentioned management of the certainly issues that were going to address but right now the i. M. F. Is saying that youre in an economic and humanitarian crisis the worst economic crisis in more than a decade against that backdrop id like to talk about the priorities of your government right now because you have recently made headlines for splurging millions to purchase top of the range vehicles for nearly 50 ambassadors across the globe while the state is failing to pay Civil Servants a living wage how can you justify such a spending spree when millions are facing hunger. Knows the whole issue. Is is is is best on the fundamentals this economy has got very strong fundamentals if that strong of sentiment those done what was there before and all of the issues which we are before me at the moment as the economys concerned is the. Currency it has been the cottons which has caused inflation but as you are well with the auction system but mr foreign minister just to bring it back to see issue because ultimately you purchase these vehicles and just to give our viewers a bit of context they were between 40. 00 and 50000. 00 per view a call when were talking about the average Civil Servant this is the middle class in your economy they are making the equivalent of 1. 80 a day and youre purchasing 40. 00 to 50000. 00 vehicles on you not out of tune with the priorities and the needs of your population with that money have been better spent elsewhere not our most shores that are which theyre talking about. The very rules which the one thing i announced for the your lens very critical and we have had to ensure that our own deployments. Are more well. And that was quite a serious issue when we took over because the conditions of our diplomats externally was really. Quite ups because they were moving with their were moving with. Something which is not. Appropriate for the deployment we assigned for admission and therefore by variables for the deployments was one of those measures which you were talking to address the situation of our diplomats but you had made it doesnt look good boy it doesnt look good in economy where were 63 percent of the population live below the poverty line yeah but whatever the cost of those their cause was not to necessarily the issue which has caused the economy to be way the court to me has been like this we are changing we are forming a we are undertaking specific key decisions which are oriented to the economy and among them is the stubble as they should of the excited it but were also doing a lot of the economy conforms which ensures that even the Investment Development community is free to come in within the month of open for business lets talk a little bit more about that mantra and those reforms that you have been making in order to get the economy back on track because as you mentioned you promised that the economy would be open for business id like to begin on the economic front with your currency reforms because a really big source of tension right now has been the reintroduction of your local currency last year after a decade of official use of the u. S. Dollar very quickly that local currency rapidly lost value would tend prices rocketing raising fears of renewed hyper inflation but you have been quoted as saying the following that the return of the zimbabwean dollar is basically stabilizing the economy from what it was. Is that really a message thats appropriate to send to the people of your country when the price of almost everything has ballooned a loaf of bread can essentially gobble up a few expansion cell the scenario which is happening on the ground is that this economy had norm wanted out of policy. Way of fixing it it only had to discover the fiscal side and therefore the 2 what one systems of fixing the economy both the fiscal and the Monetary Policy had to be. Adjusted and thats why we head to introduce our own currency and our own currency is critical for our own people in terms of. Planning and in terms of expenditure yes we are facing challenges because of the changes we had to place and the they did challenges have been that our currency was not stable and it therefore we had to have been. Such measures which are to stubble as autonomy in the mire with introduce the. Oh excuse me foreign minister i just want to follow up with you and ask you because to address some of this criticism though in the way that you rolled out this currency because we have a condom a saying that you rushed to reintroduce it without the backing of a foreign currency the i. M. F. Cites missteps in Foreign Exchange and monetary reforms that have failed to restore confidence Chatham House also saying that it is have limited results. Do you have any regrets not at all in fact. It is appropriate and it was an appropriate decision that we introduced the hour or. So that. You can cite with Foreign Exchange operations and the that has been the desire of this government so we are not only trying to eliminate remember we have been in this dollar this should be viewed for some time before and this. Ended up when there was a shortage is when there were issues a lot of issues which would put outside the control independent of the. Authorities because of that it was important that we introduce our currency and our currency which is ok supposed to operate. With the u. S. Dollar just briefly foreign minister id like to ask you because you mentioned in the beginning of our conversation that one of one of the ills that is affecting your economy is sanctions weve actually had your president saying that their impact on our daily lives is a measurable that the consequences are dire but are they really because. Or is there just your government just continuing to perpetuate a false narrative here as a convenient scapegoat the United States for example says they only have. 141 individuals or Companies Companies singled out in your country right now in a country of 16000000 not to do all sarah do all government of sanctions to this country has caused this serious and unintended consequences i have always called it a weapon of mass destruction because this is a dead out which exists now is. To study islam and to act on zimbabwe specifically that it shall not access in the external support from either the i. M. F. World bank or other International Financial institutions and the because of that its means that the risk of. Perceived risk of this country whenever these that hinging us but of assumption means that it is higher it to deter is investors would lend to come into this country despite the fed that is a mole was open for business which is the propagated by president a muslim the governor and therefore we believe that these sanctions are now is relevant it is far as the situation is above with its content but there are causing untold sufferings not probably to the if you did a ship but particularly to the. Mass population of the people and thats what is refuted by the European Union in order the United States however i would just like to ask you because youre continuing that with this narrative and by blaming the west for your countrys problems arent you actually shooting yourself in the foot i mean you mentioned that you need foreign capital because the truth is you need very engaged in order to improve your economy which is saddled with billions of dollars in debt at the advent of the 7 the public. President obama clearly articulated us Foreign Policy objectives and that was a reengagement engagement basically you are saying we must be a friend to everyone and that we must be and they need to know one and that zimbabwe was open for business and the whole objective of that process was to ensure that we are members of the family of nations who can and who can. Allow the companies particularly from the west to come in and invest in zimbabwe and the west is encouraging and that is developed up to drive to ensure that companies from the u. S. From the European Union from all of these countries from germany should come into them so that they can be able to invest and opportunities that have been to say that zimbabwe is probably presenting. The best events middle between to promote investment but didnt just fall in the movers in the International Community however now that is. That investment for Many International partners one of the precursors for that is the fact that many want you to tackle corruption in your country on july 11th president and he once again he declared war on corruption as he did in 2017 post his takeover speech and here in his inaugural speech after the 28000 election so i would like to ask you why should zimbabwe and the International Community believe that these are more than just shallow phrases i mean theyre phrases that have been around for a while these are not just phrases. The president do when he. Particularly made his detriment on the undercard today was clear and in terms of direction which were talking deborah of corruption and a quarter of is something which we are at to mourn and not just something which is the original and you are aware that already. 2 cabinet ministers have been arraigned and go in the not. Liveable how is it not there radical mr foreign minister when youve had when youve had more than 2 years in office and several of arrests have been made but there have been no convictions to date no convictions to date and even the president acknowledges that there is a socalled catch and release system in place yes but remember we have what separation of powers between the digs of the devolved selves and the judiciary and therefore when people have been arrested and will be charged and everything it is then that is the responsibility of the judiciary to handle the cases particularly the prosecution side so that if they do this with the cases. They are being given court dates and did they have been appearing in court of moment and do we believe that we. Should and the not theorizing of the whole process is when many people believe in fact it is the 1st time that she has been handled head on in this country than ever before ok so lets look at a very high profile case a concrete case on corruption and that is the case of coulda tog theory he is the boss of such a holdings it is said to have purchased buses from a Chinese Company and then resold them to the government at twice the price its costing your citizens a lot of money he apparently made a 54000000. 00 profit here tell us is this an example of the type of business practice that needs to be investigated because theres talk that he got this contract without a proper process of procurement. I think that is a misinformed position as far as were concerned and if theres been any. Such kind of complaint it should have been reported to to this mobile and the Corruption Commission but that is what has been reported by the end they are abusing the patients who have done your former youth leaders in fact reported it to your anti Corruption Commission the i. M. F. Reportedly also privately warned zimbabwe that the state payouts were quote undermining trust in the economy you are pushing it and you are talking hiving fears if you are running to the highest levels of government why not just investigate. Earth. Because hes politically connected not at all in fact if you are talking about the issue of buses those buses. A way of bought from. Izzie the supplier of and it was a deal of the bus company here in zimbabwe not even. Out of china direct but through the edge and we had supplied buses be fall into this country and with bill if there were woods it is to contract and these buses were bought when ordered and ordered 3 and it delivered that our transport system is efficient more so under the cover its 90. 6 no there because like there wont be any variation there so everythings above them. So mr foreign minister then let me. Let me ask you about another case where everything does not appear to be above board we also have to mention this high profile case which is currently ongoing that your Health Minister who would fire this month for Inappropriate Conduct after he was accused of illegally awarding a multimillion dollar contract for covert 1000. 00 medical supplies and just to give a Reference Point these masks were apparently costing the government 28. 00 per mask theres been public uproar over this hes facing 15 years in prison if convicted will your citizens see real consequences well that does exist the the testimony all for how the and the corruption drive in this country is because he has been arrested and he has been charged and therefore it means. And what at least. In the normal its not being caught and released remember this is justice in this country hes going to appear in court and of if it is going to be presented and then it to be up to the judiciary. To convict him or not but thats just not it is not the responsibility of of of this sort of. Ok mr foreign minister id like to turn to another issue now and that is the issue of human rights particularly the issue of freedom of assembly has been criticized in your country the president has said that everyone in zimbabwe has the right to express themselves freely to criticize to protest but i just like to bring in one example because these are the protests back in early 2019 Security Forces responded reportedly with lethal force killing at least 17 people raping at least 17 women shooting and injuring 81 people are resting over 1000 suspected protesters during door to door raids that doesnt sound like an ideal condition for people to express themselves freely or does it to you. Well let me assure you. And all the viewers that this government and the constitution of this country clearly article is old the right threats all through the. Freedom of expression and freedom of religion and so on and besides that theres been a lot of emphasis in terms of. Embedding these rights among the people but there is no freedom in the constitution or in demonstrations or protest there is nor freedom. Bending peoples cars and they have a village that but it must be this which respects other peoples rights as well lets talk about other peoples rights out of interfering and also just to acknowledge the violence in this case was against the protesters they were the ones who experienced the fatalities but lets talk about the rights of others and turn to another case. A crackdown on dissent and this happened in may when 3 female opposition activists were on their way to participate in a peaceful protest organized by the opposition. They were reportedly stopped at a Police Checkpoint in harare subsequently abducted by state agents tortured sexually assaulted a very high profile case in your country is this what opposition leaders can expect in your country theyve subsequently been arrested themselves they havent even received an investigation into what happened to them. It must you must be very careful when youre made assertions because in the 1st place we were in because it peeled and because of the cost eat you cannot have done with sessions of or symbol of about 50 people in town now if you breach but the law in that regard and you then cause a danger to the rest of the population in terms of the instructions it is you are fitting other peoples rights to life which is not in up it which is not appropriate and the other step to the issue is that. You believe at the moment that. She is ducted those women but this is a must which is under investigation and this if you are going to start as i have truly been produced as actually been produced by the minister of home affairs which is clearly that this could be leading to one of those issues which is that managed to while the nation are already done event ok but you the United Nations is calling for their release its also not my assessment its the assessment of the un but id just like to ask you generally speaking because international n. G. O. S they describe a lack of political will when it comes to instituting reforms in your country i just like to quote Human Rights Watch it says the following zimbabwes failure to decisively deal with cases of abductions disappearances and torture severely undermines the standing of the country within the International Community the country needs to end impunity if symbolic way is to be respected failure to do so undermines the countrys reengageme