Transcripts For DW The 20240702 : vimarsana.com

DW The July 2, 2024

Functions also coming up, joe biden rolls out the red copied for kind of in president william routes. So as the us tries to roll by china is influence in africa. And i believe at this time that you were walking with king deployed capabilities and really like minded democratic countries to set up the cost for democracy. Welcome to the day as well. Most stuff its ministry offensive and rafa under the humanitarian 8 to flow freely into the gaza strip. That was the order from the u. Ns top called the International Court of justice to these right. The government is late. These daughter adds to a growing list of diplomatic and legal moves against these ro and have undermined its international standing. And it comes days after prosecutors that another international tribunal, the International Criminal court goal for the rest of israels prime that is done. And in the same week, thats 3 European Countries to be coordinated steps of recognizing the state of palestine will have expedited legal analysis of todays ruling in a moment. First, lets hear from the president of the International Court of justice. Now i fill out the court, consider that in conformity with the obligation under the Genocide Convention, is that it Must Immediately hold. Its mindy to events and any other action, instead of a government which may inflict on the by assuming a group and gaza conditions of life that would bring about its physical destruction in hold or infill Mary Ellen Oconnell as professor of law and profess of International Peace that is at the university of notre dame in the United States. One of her numerous books is self defense against non state actors. She joins us from Rio De Janeiro and the present a welcome to d, w. A professor. This rolling sounds pretty unequivocal. Not a lot of wiggle room for israel. There is no wiggle room in this order. Remember, its the 3rd order issued by the International Court of john s, as in this case, the 2 prior orders have been defied. People are still dying in large numbers, especially civilians, especially children. The court, like everyone in the world including President Biden, sees this operation against rasa as nothing short of catastrophic. The court has ordered a halt to this operation. What else could it do . Well, isabel has said all along, but it has pursued these actions and the defense of its citizens. Following up the bob, bob rest that time by how much terrorist why wasnt not enough for the quote or israels argument is attempt to justification has flaws in it on a number of levels. On the 1st level, the International Court itself has ruled in 2004 that a war and all out war under the un charters, recognition of the right of self defense cannot be waged against the zone of occupation by the occupier. Of the force is real, can take defensive measures. It can do whatever it wants on its own territory to, to defend from an incoming attach further terrorist attacks. But it cannot launch in all our war. Having launched this war in defiance of the courts, a prior decision, it then has to comply with certain rules derived from the geneva conventions. No one is in or, and International Humanitarian law. That whatever your military objective is, you have to 1st and foremost distinguish between fighters and civilians. You must only carry out those operations that are necessary to accomplish the military objective, not cause disproportionate loss of civilian life. And at all times remember humanity. The humanity of the victims of Armed Conflict and the fighters o. B riley soldiers own humanity. And the court has had evidence brought by south africa that israels not complying with either its prior ruling in the wall case or these fundamental principles of International Military and law. Not allowing food and is sufficiently large, the very high number of deaths which are not destroyed do when you drop a bomb on an Apartment Building in the hope of getting one potential fighter. This is the very definition of disproportionate. The court has said time and again, yes, israel contains defensive measures. It must respond to protect its own citizens, as every country does against terrorism, ok, police measures up to the child. But what does not see, or the court has ruled repeatedly about the israel, so ill conduct what you said. So this is the 3rd ruling. And one of todays rulings was it is robust, allow investigators to establish whether it has complied with a previous ruling. So wherever c o l slick, the Court Control tell it its blue in the face. If israel just didnt say it and says, i dont care. Well, one of the clear consequences is real not complying with the prior to orders. It didnt comply with the 1st order in january, so then the 2nd order came in march. It didnt comply with the 2nd order. The 3rd order has come. And this order, as you pointed out, is really definitive, is as, as clear and as black and white as any board of the International Court as ever issued. It means not only that israel must comply, but every state in the International Community whos law, were talking about the law, the International Community has to assist. The court has to says south africa and in bringing enforcement, we all know that the country most in a position to really help enforce this most recent order is the United States President Biden himself. As warrant is real about this rasa offensive, he has the piece, the last country thats providing really extensive weapons, all sense of weapons to israel. President biden is the person i want to listen to this order and say, okay, we must hold delivery of offensive weapons to israel is real, has to know its alone and believing that what its doing complies that the law because it does not on following on from that does is ruling open up the possibility of International Sanctions against israel as i possibly but i think sanctions are beside the point at this moment. What really needs to happen is for the Israeli Government to listen to its own people, to listen to people around the world saying we do not want this kind of carnage in our name. Thats kind of a failure to comply with the law. We do not want to be lawbreakers. We want to be those who uphold the rule of law that a sanctions are not necessarily a great option. It is thanks. It, of course, for the us to withhold weapons. Lots of countries now have changed fundamentally their position. These are the israel because of its failure to comply with International Law either as it is exemplified or is it as explained by the court or as their own legal advisors have seen this. At this point, we see sanctions not doing as much as they should do to persuade russia. I dont think sanctions beyond withholding weapons are really going to be the thing that moves israel now. Okay, but whatever it takes, im happy to hear governments stepping up. Lets talk about 2 things. Todays a court ruling hasnt ordered. Number one, a cease fire. And number 2, at any ruling on whether or not israel has committed genocide as it cannot, then the 2nd point it cannot rule on that point definitively. Yet these are emergency orders that the court has been ruling these 3 sets of orders are emergency orders provisional measures, pending the outcome of a full case on the merits. So until that happens, israel, the court cannot rule definitively on whether the genocide is occurring or has occurred by the time it rules on the merits. It, as the court said, after its 1st set of orders in january there, theres plausible indications of genocide, but it is in no position. And it would be a defiance of its own rules to make a definitive a finding on that point right now. So thats the 1st one, please remind me of your 2nd, lets face 5 and so no tool in this rule or on the sci fi in the hold of this conflict. As the, remember the 1st 2 orders are more comprehensive, they apply to all gaza and they say the israel has to take all these measures to prevent genocide thats. Thats as much as the is unfortunately from my point of view, its not a case about peace and compliance with the prohibition of the use of force. Its a case about the Genocide Convention. So the court in, before its made its full findings in the, in the case in a preliminary way is trying to ensure that the Genocide Convention is not violated. So its pointed out to israel that its got to take more measures to ensure that the, what israels doing is not uh, eliminating the Palestinian People in whole or in part. And thats a different goal then, perhaps if it had a more general basis for ruling on violations by israel in a gaza. So its limited in terms of the treaty there, which the cases brought. Thank you so much for that. Okay, so that professor, professor Mary Ellen Oconnell from no State University in the United States. I thank you. Lets take a look at that on potential is railey and american reactions to these rules and the atlanta accounts. So somebody can think tank in the field of international affairs, and alyssa poverty is an associate director mid list of programs. She joins us from washington, d. C. Welcome to the w and the can we start with your thoughts on this latest rooting against israel . Of course, and thank you for having me. Um, so this late latest ruling against israel comes in the wake of a week, a week long and a week where weve seen a number of other instances, a cure in the International Community that have been quite outspoken against israel. And so the 1st one was the i c c arrest warrants that were made at the beginning of the week against both is really and how much leaders and on the israel side, those were against benjamin to, to know. And you have to kalonde Prime Minister and the minister of defense. And subsequent to that, we also saw a number of European Union countries that have come out in defense of palestine by baffling and bicycle by its own, my backing, the creation of costing and state. And these are ireland, norway, and spain. And the quote of this much we, we have your but like, you know, your thoughts time short on the say id like your thoughts on todays really of course. So on, on todays ruling, this obviously is, is a ruling by the, by the i c j that, that is trying to pressure israel into not going into raw sign they want. And the i, c, j is eager to see a more international, more International Pressure on to israel. And of course, as youre as the, as, as the person before me cover this will likely hinge on whether the United States will want to support or not. Yeah, i see jays ruling because the i c j on on its own doesnt have so much of an enforcement mechanism onto these onto this ruling. But the way it can in force it is through a united uh, united need security counts the United Nations Security Council resolution. But for that to happen, the united age needs to needs to be in favor of that and cant veto that. A deafening silence so far from the white house. Why do you think that is a deafening silence . They are deciding on the next steps the United States has had somewhat of a big us, um role or in a big us uh, uh, way of, of, of deciding on, on these latest instances when it comes to israel. Weve seen a 2 tier approach when it comes to present invite in specifically where in public in some instances hes been more vocal and critical of israel but in other instances. But hes mostly in practice supported. And israels war and gaza. And so, as of now and also as of now that weve heard of benjamin to, to now agreeing to speak of congress again and in defiance of, of, of payment as of the President Biden. This way, this may bring to a greater was between the relationship between natania hour and by the end of may. And that may have an effect on the way President Biden decides to tackle this latest ruling. Okay, so this, this wedge being driven between the, the leaders of United States and base route, except that when we had the announcement from the International Criminal court prosecute to this week, there was virtually no delay from the United States in condemning this move. That is correct, there is no delay again, the sense is that because benjamin has hung out is going to defy, present, invited in congress and speaking in front of congress. This may be the moment store, President Biden, to strike back against Prime Minister and a 10 year old, but it is also likely that he may not do that because up until now, he has been forceful in his backing and supporting israel through providing military and Financial Support by on veto in un council resolutions. So the sense is that he is waiting to kind of provide more pressure onto biden, but at the end, he will again oppose the ice. Each a ruling is that an argument that benjamin netanyahu, his government, is actually going to fall to ro back. Now, having declared that intention to destroy high mass and rescue the hostages, must they now keep going . The argument on israel side is that um, raw size. The last gold pulse where how mouse is hiding and if they dont continue now, they will not be able to when essentially the war that they started in october, President Biden has said repeatedly that to an extent he, he agrees, but he also disagrees with with it in the sense of, um, wanting to see more wanting to see is will be or cognizant of civilian casualties. Okay. Same time. Yeah. Were going to leave you there. Thank you so much for joining us. I. I this a positive from atlantic council. Thank you so much. I so thank you so much. Well, the wife has started one of his biggest ever state dinners in honor of canyon president william router, whos on the state visit to the us husband biden hoops to find about his countrys interest and the counter. A growing russian and chinese influence in the east african states. The 1st african leader on the state visit to washington in 16 years. William roots as cheap as a sign of the growing importance of the continent. Home to more than a 1000000000 people came here, has long been one of the United States, most important allies in africa and its status is about to get even higher. Good afternoon everyone. Please have a seat. Im proud to announce were working with congress to designate can you a major non nato ally . Thats a film of years collaboration, photos visit is being closely watched back home in a region he by political turmoil like the us and it can, you may be divided by distance. But their leaders say theyre united by their values. My business takes place. I dont the time when democracy seems to be retreating worldwide. The expedited thing due to what redeemed indifference to democratic buttons is that deep concern to us . And i believe it is the time that us walking with king deployed capabilities and really like minded democratic countries to set up the cost for democracy. A democracy has been known to decline in africa. In the past year military coups wars and mart elections brought to power petitions, looking for closer ties with russia. In china. The us wants to advance its interest and countries like can yeah. But to do so, wed 1st needs to decrease africas Financial Dependence on b. G. So today were warranty, what were calling and i robi washington vision. This in this edition is going to bring together in the National Financial institutions and nations. More around the world to mobilize more resources for countries. Settled with that to open more opportunities for the private sector financing mode transfer, sustainable and affordable lending practice. As a basis, just one of the deals can use president will be taking home pop to meeting the top brass in washington. And its such as the us, as its offering a Democratic Alternative of the, to relations with russia in china. His visit may present a chance to turn the tide on the continent distinguish. Lets get more on this from the w correspondence. Janelle do malone in washington and phoenix moving in. I wrote the welcome post i saw with you felix. So the president wrote to come out of his meeting with joe bottom. If anything more than a good dinner on the promise of close relations with the us. Yes indeed, the us had problem is that it will increase investment in can now and Companies Like coca cola has promised to invest billions of dollars in the country to provide the next 5 years. And that will end up creating over 3000. 00 jobs. Microsoft has also committed to creating i did have, i did have within the region which will increase k as for positioning as a digital powerhouse within the region. And the areas of increase investments include areas in health, uh, security, and can now we lots of beginning of the area of infrastructure where the largest, the longest part of the road between neighbor will be a little by side will be built to a tune of, of the 47400

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