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of course it wasn't. is that a defense? why is he saying that still? >> dr. eastman believes very strongly, specifically that there were major problems with election illegalities, is the way he would phrase it, which is different than fraud. dr. eastman's contention is that many votes were cast in many states in contravention of the manner of the election set forth by the state legislatures which has constitutional underpinnings. in that, dr. eastman is not a voice in the wilderness. pence made statements along the same lines. his chief counsel has made statements along those lines. dr. eastman does very much still maintain that view today. >> reporter: secretaries of state, they had the right to change the way the elections wered aministers. there wasn't anything illegal. it wasn't fraudulent. it doesn't mean the 2020 election was stolen.