Friend, ana cabrera. Right now prosecutors have given the expresident and his codefendants until next friday to surrender. 19 men and women charged with 41 counts in a sweeping 98page indictment accusing them of trying to overturn georgias 2020 Election Results, and accusing them of violating georgias riccio act, something reserved for gangs and mobsters. It could be the televised trial of the century. If convicted, this could be the only case that trumps indictment so far he could not pardon himself for if he takes back the white house. We have a jampacked hour filled with reporters and legal analysts, and it starts right now. Lets get right to our reporters on the ground in atlanta. Msnbc news correspondent, blayne alexander, and garrett haake, and senior legal correspondent, Laura Jarrett here with us in new york. You have been so closely following this investigation. What Unanswered Questions are you still looking into . Reporter well, jose, we are looking towards what happens next. You talked about the sentencing. We are officially on the 10day kind of countdown for the 19 individuals to, under whatever terms, come down to atlanta and turn themselves in. What will the terms of surrender look like . I reached out to a couple of my sources, and those conversations are under way, essentially about what will it looks like, will they be fingerprinted and will there be mugshots . Thats one thing that we are watching. We do know that the posture of the d. A. Gerri willis and even the posture of the sheriff of the county has been that they dont want to treat any other defendant, however high profile they may be, any differently than they would treat any other citizen in Fulton County. Thats been their stance all along, but the judge will weigh in on what happens. The attorneys for the defendants will weigh in on what happens and there will be negotiations on what the surrender looks like. In the hours since this indictment was handed up, we are now hearing reaction from some people around georgia, but people who were central to this investigation, and chief among them, Chief Secretary Of State ratheren burg tkpwur. Basically he says the most basic principles of a strong democracy are accountability and respect for the constitution and rule of law. You either have it or you dont. A couple things stood out to me there and i think you will notice it as well, and he doesnt mention donald trump by name or the indictments and its a generic statement that could be issued on any given day. Sources in his office tell me they are eager to move past this, and they are tired of being attacked by and talking about the former president , and for him guys its likely he wont turn the page very soon because its probable he will be called as a witness when this eventually goes to trial. Laura, there are so many defendants in the case, and it falls under the violations of the rico act. Plainly speaking, what is rico in georgia . Its a fancy name for a pattern of unlawful activity, and you need two or more underlying unlawful acts. Georgia, unlike the federal system has a long litany or laundry list, if you will, of what those acts could be, and if you have two or more of those you can have a case. The indictment here includes a lot of stuff that doesnt even look like a crime. It has his tweets. You would wonder, why is that in there . The idea is to fill out the picture of what exactly this alleged conspiracy was for. It has all of these, what it calls, overt acts to fill out the picture of all the steps that were taken, but it doesnt have to be a crime. The tweet itself doesnt have to be a crime. Thats what she called in the indictment a series of overt acts. What legal weight do overt acts carry, and there needs to be two or more to fall under rico, but how much weight does an overt act . Its required, and you need at least one overt act, and thats to prove the conspiracy. You have to have a meeting of the minds and people have to take action to show an intent to carry out, and in this case its the intent to overturn the election. Its not just what hes saying, its what these alleged, you know, Co Conspirators are doing, right . That will be an important point. We have heard his defense and all his words and the lies, and the defense his team has been using, the First Amendment defense and its not about conduct. Trump is repeating the false claims that the 2020 election was stolen, and what more do we know about what hes trying to do . Reporter trump never changed his tune in public that he believes the election was stolen, and he wants to argue it in the future, and his lawyers suggested arguing that is something in the case they are litigating in washington, d. C. , and you see trump injecting this belief into the case here in georgia. As to the specifics of what he will present on monday, i dont have any for you. Its hard to imagine what could be in a report to do anything that he describes that could exonerate him. One, its another opportunity to rally his political base, to raise money, to get folks to dig in and defend him whether they agree with him or not, the republican party, and, two, it is that he truly believed the election was stolen and it was not a lie he was peddling to stay in power or try to raise money, and the more he is consistent on that a lot of folks believe it will prove it was not a scheme but something he believed when some of the acts that were taking place that are now considered to be illegal. Last night we heard they were looking at the six month period before the process could get under way. On what you know about the Fulton County court, how long do you think it will be . It will take a long time. Gerri willis is trying a rico case right now, and they are still in the process of Seating A Jury and those indictments were handed up early last year, so if that gives you any indication of how slowly this could possibly turn, you know, of course a number of different circumstances there, but, you know, i will use the words of chuck rosenberg, this is a clunky case where you talk about you have 19 defendants, and thats 19 different sets of attorneys, and 19 opening statements, and 19 sets of Cross Examinations if they are all to go to trial, thats something that could certainly take a long time. It will take a long time to get there and play out once the trial gets there, guys. We know trump is often trying to delay, delay, delay. Does he have ways he could try and muck this up even more . Certainly as blayne pointed out, you have 19 different defendants and 18 people who have opportunities to delay, and its their right for pretrial motions and Due Process Rights here, too. Its worth pointing out, she said six months until trial and maybe that was in the heat of the moment last night, and i dont think theres any chance in the world that will hold here. In a complex case like this, in past cases, they have not gone to trial nearly that fast. When you read it, what were some of the things that stuck out to you . That you have people here who are unindicted coconspirators in the room and in law Office Meetings clearly providing some level of material information, and its unclear whether they are cooperating in a more formal way and so to speak, flipped, and theres a serious amount of pressure on these 18 people to cooperate now. They are facing serious time if convicted, potentially five to 20 years, or lesser than that and its up to the judge to have discretion there. And thats a lot of time for people who are not loyal to trump like walt nauta. Garrett, do we know how those in trumps circle feel about the prospect of cameras being in the courtroom this time . Reporter look, some of this may depend on the timing aspect you were all just describing. If this was to go to trial before the election they could make an Argument Cameras would not be a bad thing. Trump has made his view the election was stolen a part of his campaign, and if hes in the courtroom and cant be on the campaign because hes tied down with all these legal issues, thats probably good to have it, and if he were to win the election, its a massive headache, and if he was a twicedefeated former president and then we are degrees off the line here of what would be useful to him or not. Elevating this issue, this question of whether or not the election was stolen is at the heart of Trump Campaign, and anything about that is net positive, at least in his view. Thank you so much for being with us this morning. Thank you, guys. Joining us now with more is a former District Attorney in dekalb county, and its great to see you again. You and i spoke yesterday in preparation and anticipation of this indictment. What is your reaction to what we now know about the shear number of charges and the number of people charged . Have you seen anything like this in your career . Yes and no. Obviously rico cases are ones that are more complex, and they very often include a lot of details so the District Attorney is able to layout the story for the jury to be able to establish the underlying predicate acts that is required by the statute. You will have other charges and you see several whether its false swearing and false statements and some of the Election Code violations, so perjury is one that i think certainly when we were writing the Brookings Report we did not have knowledge of, and that all came as a result of witnesses being sworn or giving false statements under oath. In a lot of ways its very similar to the rico types of cases we have seen before, and that this District Attorney has had before. Obviously the named defendants make this case somewhat unusual, but that does not mean that the d. A. Or the judge or the sheriff or anybody else involved should deviate course. This is still a fact a case about the facts and the law, and the law is nonpartisan and it allows for the d. A. To investigate and hold people accountable for any wrong doing that she thinks she has sufficient evidence to prove. Lets talk about whether there are unusual aspects in another issue, for example, on page 15, the Indictment Points out, quote, the enterprise operated in Fulton County georgia, elsewhere in the state of florida and in other states including but not limited to arizona, michigan, nevada, new mexico, pennsylvania and wisconsin and the district of columbia. Is that unusual . What do you make of the d. A. Touching on criminal conspiracies in other states . Again, georgia rico statute is favorable to prosecutors, and it allows the d. A. To reach crimes or acts that occurred outside his or her jurisdiction, so that allows this d. A. To read some of the Computer Trespass Allegations from Coffee County in georgia, and it also allows her to reference some of the fake elector schemes that happened in other states so the ultimate jurors, whoever will decide the evidence in this matter will be able to have an appreciation for just how large this particular rico indictment or these conspiratorial activities reached across the country. So the d. A. Says shes intending to try all 19 codefendants together. We were touching on this with our other segment, and that could mean it takes longer to get through a trial. What do you think is the strategy that shes trying to have here and how this could really play out . Sure. Again, rico allows the prosecutor to tell the story, and while we have a 98page document, we have 41 counts and 19 defendants, and any good prosecutor could narrow this down to a few things. You have got those charges that relate to the solicitation of Public Officials to get them to do something to violate their oath of office. You have the facts surrounding the fake elector schemes, and that went into the various emails and things that support that. You have the Computer Trespass and the taking of personal information charges that happened in Coffee County, and while having the indictment and it seems to be complex, any good prosecutor could narrow this down to common themes that a jury could understand and see how the pieces of the puzzle fit together to be able to establish the Bigger Picture of this overall rico indictment and conspiracy. How do you see the next ten days going . So its going to be interesting. The d. A. Has given all defendants until august 25th to be able to turn themselves in. I can imagine theres a lot of discussions and things and calls into the d. A. s office now, possibly from individuals that are looking to make arrangements to turn themselves in or talking about plea deals, and that may be a little early until some of the Defense Counsel see the time of evidence through discovery the District Attorney has, and there will be a lot to watch for. We have 19 individuals that will make tough decisions over the next ten days. Thank you so much. We appreciate your insights. Up next, the politics of the indictment. One republican who testified before the grand jury yesterday says, quote, this is a pivot point for the party, but is it . Plus, one of trumps codefendants in another criminal case just went before a judge in florida. Were back in 60 seconds. Youre watching special coverage of trumps fourth indictment right here on msnbc. Despite treatment it disrupts my skin with itch. 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With just eight days to go until the first republican president ial debate, former President Trumps fourth indictment is set to take center stage. Former Lieutenant Governor, jeff duncan, said he hopes this investigation will be a pivot point for the country. My hope is that americans believe us that this election was fair and legal and i think its a pivot point for us. Joining us, former Press Secretary for john boehner, and an msnbc political news analyst. Could this be a pivot point, do you think . It might be in places like georgia where the outcome of the Electoral College there is really important. I dont see it dramatically changing trumps fortune in the primary. Look, this is obviously the fourth time, and there are a lot of Republican Voters who made up their mind that this is all a scam, they are all out to get donald trump and its politically motivated. If you were going to be moved by trumps actions around january 6th, in overturning the election, you probably already made your decision about that. Its not that this is not important. Georgia is a critical state for the 2024 election and it would be hard for any republican, especially trump, to win without carrying georgia. Its a state that has not been very kind to him. They are showing a lot of fatigue. And the Lieutenant Governor is typical of Republican Voters in the state, and they are sick of him and want to move on and this venue is a Perfect Place to tell that story. Vaughn, loyalty has been a Running Theme in trumps circle, and as long as we have covered him, during his presidency, post presidency, and now there are serious consequences for people who have been loyal to him all along. Do you see loyalty breaking now . Right, donald trump has typically remained loyal to those that showed loyalty to him, despite of whatever flaws they may exhibit. This time is different because there are criminal proceedings in their headlights here, and for donald trump you have 18 other defendants that will be codefendants, and theres the reality that some of those individuals could very well flip and work with prosecutors to undermine his own legal defense. Thats why i asked donald trump this question specifically over the weekend when i was with him in iowa. I asked him if he defended and stood by the actions of his allies in georgia after the 2020 election. His response was interesting. He said many of the allies i dont know, because to be honest, we have so many allies so i dont know what you are talking about, we have a lot of allies that i dont know but they are allies nonetheless and i cant speak to that. That was an interesting response, because donald trump right there made the decision to separate himself from the other codefendants. He made it clear he will not enter a Plea Agreement here and will defend himself to the end and he has taken the position of i dont know these people and they acted on their own accords, and dont blame me for their actions. When you look at the racketeering actions, it is clear donald trump will choose to make that defense. Jake, lets talk about capitol hill for a minute. This is what senator Lindsay Graham said on fox news just last night. Are we going to let County Prosecutors start prosecuting the former president of the United States . Is this the republican line on