Zahra. It was no reason for anyone to notice that 25yearold trying on that blazer. No one knew she was out of work, behind on rent had lost wifi service at her apartment. Because she couldnt afford it anymore. The name on the overburdened credit card she used to pay for the blazer meant nothing to anyone in that store. Itll be the last time in her life that she could go shopping anywhere in america and not be recognized. In some places, cheered, some places attacked, or threatened. A week later, she combined the white blazer with Rhinestone Earrings from kohls and a necklace she received 12 years earlier on her 13th birthday. And she changed the course of history. Todays witness, miss Cassidy Hutchinson, is another republican and another former member of president Trumps White House staff. In her role, working for the white house Chief Of Staff, miss hutchinson handled the vast number of sensitive issues. She worked in the west wing, several steps down the hall from the oval office. Miss hutchinson spoke daily with members of congress, with highranking officials in the administration, with senior white house staff, including mr. Meadows. With white house counsel, lawyers, and with mr. Tony ornato. Who served as the White House DeputyChief Of Staff. She also worked on a daily basis with members of the Secret Service, who were posted in the white house. In short, miss hutchinson was in a position to know a great deal about the happenings in the trump white house. Miss hutchinsons already sat for four videotaped Video It Interviews with committee investigators, we thank you very much for her cooperation and for her courage. I saw mr. Cipollone read before i walked out that morning. Mr. Cipollone said something to the effect of, please make sure we dont go up to the capitol, cassidy. Keep in touch with me. Were going to get charged with every crime imaginable if we make that movement happen. Do remember which crimes mr. Cipollone was concerned with . In the days leading up to the sixth, we had conversations about potentially obstructing justice or defrauding the electoral count. Now, thanks in part, to her testimony, her boss, white house Chief Of Staff mark meadows, and his boss donald trump, have been charged with obstructing justice and defrauding the United States of america. Before Cassidy Hutchinson testified to the january 6th committee, on live television, there was no Special Prosecutor investigating donald trump for anything, including his actions leading up to and on january 6th. The Justice Department investigation of donald trump, which is now headed by Special Prosecutor jack smith, was following the lead of the january 6th committee. Whose star witness was Cassidy Hutchinson. Cassidy hutchinson was 24 years old, working in the Power Corridor of the west wing of the white house, when the crimes mark meadows and donald trump were now charged with were being committed in those rooms, according to the indictments. Cassidy hutchinson didnt want to do it. The day the world met her on live television, testifying that to the january Six Committee, the very last thing she said, after fighting off a panic attack right before testifying, was do i have to do this . She had been asking herself that question silently for months. She was facing a monumental conflict with huge stakes between personal loyalty and truth. In the end, truth one. That is the story Cassidy Hutchinson tells in her new book, enough. Joining us now for the discussion about that is Cassidy Hutchinson. Thank you very much for doing this tonight. Thank you for having me, lawrence. So, how are you dealing with the Panic Attacks . Last night i saw in the hallway here before going on rachael show. You didnt seem close to a panic attack at all. Is this a calmer process than what you went through with the committee . Im more at peace now. Im still nervous. Its a different type of nervous though. Before i testified to the committee into the country, i felt there was a lot riding on what i was going to say. I was also calmed by the sense that i was fulfilling my sense of duty. This chapter of my life is different, and made the choice to come forward. And share my story. So, theres a natural nerve element to it. As alex butterfields book help me, there have been forces throughout this journey that have helped me along the way in this section of my life. Now, i feel very blessed and honored to be able to be here with you today, to help share that story. Your mother is the first person you think in this book. Shes, throughout the book, as one of her Guiding Lights. She gets you through some very difficult moments in this book. How is she dealing with this week in your life . Where you have now been doing this, ive seen a little bit on some of the interviews weve done so far, about this. This is a whole new stage for your mother. How she doing . Shes doing really well. I think its a difficult adjustment for her to, she is concerned parent, she wants the best for me. I think she also is guided by the sense of peace, knowing that what im doing can hopefully help impact somebody, at least one other person, but hopefully we can help the country as well. In the book, there are times when you are protecting your mother from the knowledge of what kind of pressure youre under. And possibly, the kinds of threats you could face. Especially when you have become cooperating witness in the january Six Committee. The Security Requirements for that change dramatically, and there were moments there we didnt your mother to know just how risky that could be. I suppose. I also think that she knows that there are, its gonna be okay. Ive also made peace with this, even if there are Security Threats now, its not something we havent dealt with before. Her, go and my goal, is to get past this moment in american history. You are free to speak out and tell the truth. Because youre worried that there are people that are gonna threaten your safety and security. Thats not normal. Thats not normal politics. You need to get past that as a country. So, we know, we know from your book, that you testified to deter tierney fani williss grand jury in georgia. She has said she has 150 witnesses for the trial. Against donald trump. Or mark meadows, if theyre trying together. Both of those trials. Are you one of those witnesses . I have cooperate with every investigation that ive been asked to testify to. And i will continue to do so. In any and every investigation moving forward. So, has the District Attorney given you any sense that you might be testifying in this first speedy trial that occurs next month . If he does ask, i will be fully cooperative. So far she hasnt . Theres no word from them about testifying . Ill leave it with my prior state for. Now i understand, some of these questions will have that kind of careful internally you might have to give. I want to do the same thing with jack smiths prosecutions. Jack smiths prosecution in washington d. C. , that might not be occurring if not for the testimony. If not to the january Six Committee will be a witness thats the case of the United States of america versus donald trump. Thats the name of the case. Where he is charged with crimes leading up to leading up to ana jenner six only defendant in that case. Despite a witness in that trial . If jack smith and his team will ask to testify, i will cooperate with that. Is that an index card . It is, not lawrence, i want to be careful not just for my interests, but i think that there is something to respect but institutions of government, and our Department Of Justice is designed to operate effectively behind closed doors. I will not want to get to have anything that the prosecution is doing. But i will say this to you, lawrence. What i think i testified to to the committee was vital, it was important. It was vital and important at the time. There werent a lot of other people testifying. Hopefully, open the door to the people that could potentially provide more information. My next question, which i anticipate the answer to already, is because of the book. Not because anything you said in the january 6th committee. And it is the question of, will you be a witness in the florida case, charging donald trump with violations of the s of the Espionage Act . Obstruction of justice . Also as to codefendants, people who work for him. Who were in their, way similar positions to what youre in the white house with the president. And the reason i ask, it the book is filled with Mark Meadows Burning documents in that fireplace. In the white house Chief Of Staffs office. There is a description of the classified documents being moved around being stored in your desk where youre saying they shouldnt be stored. And then being handed to reporters. All of that raises the question of whether you would have relevant information to that case in florida . And would you be a witness there . Im not sure that have relevant information necessarily directly pertinent to that case, lawrence. But i think what i discussed in the book, and overall, in terms of how the administration, especially towards the, and handle Classified Information, the book helped shed light on that. And also help shed light on how frivolous a certain individuals were handling Classified Information. I cant speak exactly to what was brought down to maralago. I could speak, and i can, speak to how we were not handling Classified Information to the standards of the National Security community would expect. You have descriptions of that, going right up until 15 minutes before noon on inauguration day, with mark meadows. Telling you that hes running over to the Justice Department to try to get document declassified before donald trump loses the powers of the presidency. When you are witness did you see things the help explain explain and to get to. Florida that the fbi found in the search warrant. In hindsight, now especially what we will mark particularly mark was the. I dont know if thats part of the indictment just to be completely frank with. It it still speaks to how documents. Gotten to florida. Made their way down there. I wouldnt im not under the impression that that was necessarily an accident. You mean, just by the general way documents were made in the west wing . Or specifically, where the specific moments you saw, collections of boxes over there in the corner, that You Undersecretary for . I was not directly part of the packing of the boxes process. Okay. This book is so, im gonna say, surprisingly well written. Because these are the kinds of books that come out when someones going through a big events, and they generally chronicle the events clearly. And hopefully, as this book certainly does. You had mark salters, a great writer, collaborating with you on this. He helped john mccain write books. It is an astonishingly personal. Book that you tell us everything there is to know about your family and how that interacts with these events. In this story, you are failed by many men, going through this story, not just mark meadows, your boss. And the president United States but beginning, sadly, with your father. And the way your father failed you in the midst of your desperate attempt to try to get a lawyer and he went to your father to try to get financial help from her father. You brought your january 6th subpoena with you to show to him. I just wanna use your audio book to tell the audience that passage of the book. What is listen to that. I pulled my subpoenaed that i voted in quarters out of my coat pocket, and handed it to him. Police, i just need you to listen. I said, my voice trembling. He looked at me, expecting me to say more, but i couldnt find my words. He threw the subpoena in the trash, ranting that he didnt need to do anything it ask me to do. He had read online that it wasnt mandatory to comply with congressional subpoenas. The investigation was a witch hunt to take donald down. He said. He prayed i wasnt there to ask for money to pay for a corrupt lawyer, any lawyer who didnt work for donald was corrupt. He had raised me better than to turn my back on people who cared about me, people like himself and donald. You didnt raise me at all, was always thought of to say. That scene gets even rougher than that. This is, im sure, it was painful to. Right its painful to read. And it is very much, it seems to, me as a reader, a very clear explanation of the kinds of pressures in predicament the urine. Yeah, you know, that scene was difficult to write. As was a lot of the book, lawrence. When i made the decision to write a book, and about my experiences, i knew going into it, that i wanted to bring people into how actually experience. That i felt that it was quote really critical. I wasnt just somebody that arrived at that moment. On june 28th. I had a lot of trial and error to get to that moment. Ive made a lot of mistakes. I tried my best to take accountability for all of those. But i think whats important to the, reader as mark salter and i, who thank you for your very kind words in these marks alter, is a phenomenal human being. But helped pull the story out of me in a way that i wouldnt have been able to do on my own. When mark and i were writing this, together, we i wanted to write it in a way where i wanted to bring my readers in to the actual moments that helped shape me. That scene, in particular, yes, it was very difficult. Even just hearing that, thats the first line of heard the audio book. Its important help explain how it got to where i was. When i had a trump affiliated count, trump affiliate lawyer, and then when i ultimately made a split. And found new council. In trying to, explain your now trying to explain to the whole country. To a large audience. I know, i know my twitter and the comment last night, with rachel show, and today. There are people in this audience right now, who cant understand why youre a republican. And then they cannot possibly understand why you would work for donald trump. I get it. I worked in washington, you started off and legislative working in with congress, and then it legislative affairs. All with members of the house and senate to try to pass legislation. And you only end up in the white house Chief Of Staffs office in april of the last year. Of the trump presidency. It will be five or six. Yeah, its only a few months before youre at the election. And then its lost. And then theres the manus of the december. But in that process, what i discovered in the book, is that there was one person, there is one person that i can find in here, actually, maybe a couple, pat cipollone, who when it mattered, said, no, you cant do. That i was sitting out here, watching that presence. And wondering is there anyone is there anyone in the west wing who says to anyone above them, in your case mark meadows, impassable on his case, the president and mark meadows, that no, you cant do that . Thats something you are doing a lot . It is. And i took the job with mark with the understanding that we would likely not always agree on everything. And a large part, thats why mark and i had an effective working relationship. Mark but a lot of trust in me. Mark, and i, ideologically, arent very similar and new jersey thank you. But something has to be able to somebody has to be the person to or just give advice you might not want to hear. And it might not be received well. But it was important that i always provide that to mark. I felt i was there to advise him and guide him in that job. Was i a Fish Out Of Water at points . Absolutely. But i think that is how a lot of the Trump Administration fade out. And i think what sometimes i think is lost is that there were a lot of hair on fire. Moments we were swimming to stay afloat. A lot of times we were drawn in. And whether it was passed cipollone, or myself, or a few other staff that were willing to be able to say no, the president s word was still the final word. It was our job to make sure he had the best advice possible. It is so striking in the book how challenging it was for you to get to the spot where, first of all, you could find on his lawyers who would give you that advice. And then tell the whole truth to the january Six Committee. Its also fascinating to see that, when you are getting bad advice from a trump paid lawyer, and you are doing those depositions in the january Six Committee, you are trying to leave them clues. You were giving them incomplete answers, were you were hoping, as you put it, they were bread crumbs that they could follow up with other people. Yeah, its true. I want wanted i felt i was in a difficult position in a lot of ways. Because, when i found my way back into trump world, and i had a trump world attorney, there also is a sense of an understanding in that environment. And i know, because i have been part of that environment. And i spent a year trying to sort of separate from that environment. But there is an understanding that you have a higher loyalty. And i knew how i felt about january 6th. I knew how fervently i disagreed with that. But i also knew that i was or, i felt i was not in a position to be completely empowered to tell the whole truth. But i wanted the truth to be known. And it took a lot of introspection and thinking and reevaluating my decisions. But even on june 28th, i did not want to be the person sitting in that chair. And i dont say that as if i ha