You cannot overstate how significant this statement was. But hicks describes a meltdown. The impact of the tape and the impact of the other stories has to be driven home to the jury. She just started crying. The tissues came out and the judge said we will take a break. Im not allowed to testify. This judge is totally conflicted, has me under an unconstitutional gag order. Unconstitutionally gagged. He gag me. The judge reaffirmed today that trump has the absolute right to testify. Crackdowns continue on College Campuses across the country. We intend to be here until our demands are met no matter what. Is a radical left lunatics. You have the right to protest but not the right to cause chaos. Nationwide more than 2100 arrests have been made connected with campus protest. Because of donald trump more than 20 states have abortion bands. Strict limits will take effect. Impacts will be held not just in florida, but across the southeast. Former President Donald Trump did this. It evening, once again, im stephanie ruhle, and we are not 186 days away from the election. This week Donald J Trump continued to protest his treatment and his criminal trial here in new york city. Across the nation, protest against the war in gaza expanded to more College Campuses. And some School Officials decided they had enough. With that, lets bring in our nightcap crew. Its a great one. Tom rogers is back. Msnbc and cnbc foundered, now editor of newsweek. And publisher of fast company and inc. Magazine, and columnist for the independent and author of. Com news. And semisage, cofounder and chief creator officer. This was another crazy busy week in his criminal case against donald trump. Donald trump got fined for not violating the gag order. Another gag order hearing. This morning the judge didnt stick it to donald trump, but he made it clear because donald trump has been out there saying im not going to be able to testify because of the gag order. And the judge looked him square in the eye and said you absolutely can, enough of this nonsense. One of the issues, though, there are no cameras in the courtroom. Trump is going to go right back out on the trail and say it is the judges fault. How do you think this whole thing is going . Well, i am still very worried that we have a prospect for a hung jury here. I am very suspicious. Very suspicious of jurors getting on their saying they dont have an opinion of donald trump. I have never met a new yorker who doesnt have an opinion of donald trump. There are two lawyers there, and if either of them are of a camp that favors donald trump, that is something that is going to upset the normal dynamic of the jury room having two lawyers on the jury. So i think the downside here is worse than the upside potential, because the conviction here in this particular case i dont really think is going to matter that much. When you look back at the hollywood access tape, which happened at a much more important time in the political career of donald trump and was an issue today in the trial, that didnt do it. I dont think talking about issues like this now are going to upset donald trump selection. But if you are alvin bragg, alvin bragg would say i am not doing this for anyone to win or lose an election. I am doing this because donald trump broke the law. Thats fine, but what we have to worry about is donald trump coming back as president. And anything that would help his case in a hung jury here, i think he would scream for the rest of the campaign that he was exonerated, there was nothing here, it was a ridiculous case and new york prosecutors couldnt find anything better to do with their time. This is really an issue that i worry we are going to have to confront, and much more of a downside than an upside here. Diane, how do you think the prosecution is . I have to agree with tom. We are going to talk about the hope hicks testimony in a little bit. A lot of people saying this was a slamdunk for the prosecution. I think hope hicks made a compelling case for the fact that donald trump also was concerned about melanias feelings. Whether or not we believe that. But she put it out there, and if you have that juror who says you know, this calls into question this argument that the hush money payment was strictly a Business Engagement and an arrangement designed to help win the election. She provided a counterargument. What did you think about the hope hicks testimony . This was a woman who was glued to Donald Trumps side. His entire administration. People very rarely heard her speak. There she was. Didnt even make eye contact with him. Supposedly hasnt spoken to him for a couple of years. What did you think about it . Etiquette mustve been very frightening for her. I think there are many accounts he was an intimidating person, and he is sitting as far apart as we are from her. And i imagine that she has some sort of emotional attachment to this phase in her life. I imagine there were some things that happened that were, that she has seen that have led her to not speak with him anymore. And i think it was not easy for her to be able to give a completely honest accounting of what happened without feeling like i need to impress them and falling back into that way of being. What did you think . Because trump has been frustrated with his lawyers. He wants them to go tougher. He wants them to be like rogue one who was disbarred and displaced. I think that boosts her credibility. Crying . Being fragile . No, i think are essentially showing that this was an emotional moment for her to be on the stand, under oath, in front of donald trump. Like you said, she has this emotional connection, she has this history. But it was actually compelling because i think she did give evidence that was helpful to the prosecution by saying that under no circumstances did Michael Cohen do this under the goodness of his heart, out of his own volition. And it came to that, this was for donald. This was not something that michael would do in a benevolent nature. Not only that, we have the David Pecker Testimony really tying us to the fact that this is an election interference case which i think makes it more compelling. This was an effort to keep information from the voting public. Hopefully that is what the prosecution is trying to do, seek and prevent a hung jury. When you have some people see the severity of it and see that there was actually intent to, which hope hicks also said, and im going on. But she said it was a crisis in the campaign after the access hollywood. That tells me that his intent. You have that tape and now you need to conceal his information. The theater of how donald trump performs to me is more interesting than the evidence at trial. But do you not think there was any theater to hope hicks . She was crying, she was fragile. She was the person one inch away from all four years. During charlottesville, after january 6. Im not sure i buy this fragile inginue of there, like this is such a difficult moment. I didnt see any difficult moments. She stood next to him the whole time. That is why i think it was a difficult moment. Think of what she mustve experience. Willingly, yes. But a lot of people have trouble with, i dont want to get into and cross this line, but an abusive sort of dynamic. You are extruding that, maybe she was all in. Maybe, but why was she all in . Why is Stephen Miller all in . I think she is testifying against trump, and of all people to testify against trump, she is a good prosecution witness. As i said, at the end of the day i dont think that is what really matters here. It is trump theatrics. And i think what he was trying to do early on was provoke the judge into really hitting him with a Contempt Charge hard that might have involved going to jail. For some hours. So he could really play the card of i am being gagged here, i cant speak, i cant believe the judge to put the former president of the United States and jail for speaking his mind. I think in the last couple of days he may have whacked off of the thought that is helpful. And the reason for that i think has to do with what we will talk about later, all the protests. That chaos in that world hurts biden, in his mind, and he is the guy who supposedly is going to be in control. If you are out of control yourself to the point that the judge has to jail you because you cant behave in a way that is within the decorum of the court system, then who are you to say that you are the guy who is going to be in control here . You are being something deep. Im liking what youre selling. He has backed away from that provocation because of that. The sort of Nihilistic View of any of the, does any of it even matter . A hung jury, whether he gets convicted, everyone will doubled down as they always do. You have the republicans will be like this such a problem, im concerned. But 10 minutes later they are back there at maralago and paying for his meal. My fear is that none of it gets to anybody and people dont have clear information access. And it is just very, very hard for people to get out of their silo. I want to go to my fear, and it weighed a comment. On wednesday trump had the day off of court, he was on the campaign trail, and what did he do . He told reporters he will not necessarily accept the Election Results if he doesnt like them. I. E. , if he doesnt win. I get that maybe somewhere in the back of her mind, oh, we assumed he would do that. That is a huge problem. But trumped always tells you what hes going to do. The Time Magazine article pointed out everything he said he was going to do. People have been, the 2025 project, very clearly spells out exactly what is going to happen if there is a trump administration. And similarly, when trump says that he will not accept the results of the election, we should be prepared for the fact that he is not going to accept the result of the election. It is plain as day. He is going to do exactly as he says. And it will be a very different approach to election denial than it was last time. They learned a lot. And what they learned is you got a stay away from the courts. Can you deny elections and not have it subject to court review . The big difference this time that everybody has to Pay Attention to is that you have mike johnson as speaker, not nancy pelosi. And the fact of the republicans control the house is significant in this respect. There is a view that the house election in terms of who takes control is going to be close. But the democrats have a really good shot. It is the previous congress, Current Congress that certifies house races. And it could be something, and im sure they thought of this. If there are some close races that the democrats look like they have won, but it would turn control of the house to the democrats, they dont certify. Then you end up on january 3rd with the republicans in control. Come january 6th, you have the republicans, and this is a huge issue. A parliamentary packet, which would mean that the electoral count format which was supposed to solve all this to make sure that an election couldnt be stolen by congress, one problem. Those rules have to be adopted by the house, meaning the senate is a continuous body. It has its people who are two thirds of the body that continues every election cycle. The house, its a new house every time. If you dont put the implanting rules of the house for election , for adoption, you have a situation where they could reject the vote in close states, because they have now stolen a house through election denial. If we do not start Serving Vodka when tom rogers is here we are all going down. This is really serious and has to be paid attention to, because they learned a lot. Then are democrats just a few months from now going to severely regret it if they end up saving mike johnson. Marjorie Taylor Greene is trying to oust mike johnson, and it is democrats who could be the ones who keep him in that position. If everything plays out in this deeply draconian way, the way tom is predicting, are democrats going to rue the day they help this guy . There is always the risk of someone worse than mike johnson, if that is even imaginable. If that is the risk, i think that is something they might buffer for and that is what they can do. But really what it comes down to is i like the point you made about how they have learned from last time. And thats a great point. This campaign is so much smarter and more discipline. Even if trump doesnt seem to be, his operation is. And Congress Takes office before january 6, so whatever changes happen there, that is what is going to essentially impact what happens next. Meanwhile, the transition weve been talking about with 2025, they have been, i know you had sam jacobs on a couple nights ago, he mentioned this ideological, intellectual, Legal Framework the project 2025 is doing. Trump has the reverse of that. They are taking his ravings and they are codifying it into calm, deliberate policy that can actually get achieved. They are finding legal avenues to get this stuff done, and i know our last segment we are talking about the dismantling of agencies and the purging of Civil Servants. They have the plans to do so, and that is the other side of this. If they go this route to potentially try and steal the election, now right after you are talking about taking office and purging Civil Servants by Reinventing Schedule F and pursuing this insane agenda that was outlined in the Time Magazine interview that just detailed the Dystopian Future Every American should aware of. Another f is in my mind right now. Nobody is going anywhere. When we return, protest on College Campuses and what it could mean for the 2024 election. And later, are mvps of the week in a very special one to remember those who served this country. We are on nightcap in the 11th hour continues. Hour continues. Sharpen your skills, you can stay on top of the market from wherever you are. E trade from Morgan Stanley power e trades easy touse tools make complex trading less complicated. Custom scans can help you find new trading opportunities, while an Earnings Tool helps you plan your trades and stay on top of the market. 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