Transcripts For MSNBC The Last Word With Lawrence ODonnell 2

MSNBC The Last Word With Lawrence ODonnell August 28, 2024

Next hour. As well it should be. The stock market closed at a record high today. Yet another high, during the biden presidency which has been full of stock market highs. They are apparently happy in the afterglow of the democratic national convention and her rise in the polls considering donald trump will not be allowed to ruin the economy with the stupidest tariff proposals in history. Instead of being president trump next year, the stock market seems to believe he will just be defendant trump. Donald trump spent the day ranting on social media about a superseding indictment voted on by a new grand jury in dc. The new indictment in the case of united states of america versus donald j trump, defendant, replaces a previous indictment with the same title and the same list of four crimes. Conspiracy to defraud the united states, obstructive official proceeding, obstruction and attempt to obstruct an official proceeding and conspiracy against rights. The superseding indictment is in effect. The edited version of the original indictment with the edited version incorporating the supreme court's new invention of presidential immunity for official acts by a president. Donald trump spent the day worried about jack smith and other prosecutors ability to close in on him, after he loses the election, the harris for president campaign released this ad. For most of my childhood, we were renters. My mother saved for well over a decade to buy a home. I was a teenager when that day came. I can remember how excited she was. I know what homeownership means. Sadly, it is out of reach for far too many american families. During the foreclosure crisis, i took on banks that exploited people in the market and today, corporate landlords by hundreds of houses and apartments and then turn them around and rent them at high prices. I will fight for a law that cracks down. We will end the housing shortage by building 3 million new homes and rentals. We should be doing everything we can to make it more affordable, not less affordable. We were renters too in my preschool years. For all of donald trump's childhood, his father was a racist landlord that refused to rent apartments to people like kamala harris and her parents. Donald trump, the most racist presidential nominee of a party who did not personally own slaves, grew up to join his father's racist business. It led them both to be charged by the justice department with violating the civil rights of applicants for apartments by viciously discriminating against black people. The new indictment issued by a grand jury today covers familiar ground for regular viewers and for readers of the indispensable book, the trump indictments. The new indictment is 36 pages long, replacing the previous which was 45 pages, gone from the new indictment is the dramatic scene that will be in all of the movies about his crimes. The supreme court decided to allow him to commit crimes that he committed in the oval office on new year's eve on the entire command structure of the justice department threatened to quit. If you went through with the plan to make libs who are official the new acting attorney general to help carry out crimes with donald trump. That scene will be in the movie but not in the indictment. The supreme court ruled that any crime that he conspires to commit in the oval office with appointed members of the executive branch, any of those crimes are crimes the supreme court leaves the founders wanted the president to get away with. The republican supreme court is of course insanely wrong about that. Here's what ketanji brown jackson said to norah o'donnell about that tonight. You wrote the court declared for the first time in history, that the most powerful official can, under circumstances yet to be determined, become a law unto himself. It sounds like a warning. That was my view of what the court determined. I was concerned about a system that appeared to provide immunity for one individual under one set of circumstances. When we have a justice system that had ordinarily treated everyone the same. That was not a product of legal scholarship, it was a product of republican convenience. Every justice that voted in some court is republican. Only one of those justices was appointed by a president that entered the presidency by winning the most votes. George hw bush is the last republican president that entered the presidency by winning the most votes. That was 1988. He gave us clarence thomas. If you live in a democracy, where the candidate with the most votes wins, there would be no other republican justice currently serving. Clarence thomas would be the only one. The current composition of the supreme court stands, in my view, as a stain on america's claim to the world. That it is a democracy. And no other democracy in the 21st century with seven out of 50 states decide presidential elections through an electoral contrive roles, created in a slaveholding country 235 years ago. Contrivance they tried to make sound serious by calling it a college. The electoral college. The electoral college gave us this supreme court, not voters. The supreme court has given donald trump his immunity which in jack's misinterpretation, still allows donald trump to be charged with all of the crimes he committed while president that were not committed in his official capacity as president. The indictment stresses, donald trump and his coconspirators, were acting in a private capacity. In the new indictment, all of his coconspirators are people that were not government officials. Giuliani was number one and the others were all private lawyers turning donald trump's life into crimes. The others are john eastman, sydney powell, and likely boris epstein. On page 12 of the indictment, an unnamed senior campaign advisor, who is not a co conspirator, is quoted by jack smith describing everything donald trump and his co conspirators were publicly saying at the time as quote all conspiracy should beamed down from the mother ship. Leading off tonight is andrew wiseman. Warmer fbi counsel and chief of the criminal division in the eastern district of new york. He is coauthor of the trump indictments, now in need of an update with a new indictment. There is so much to say, including how the supreme court forced the refighting of this indictment. What do you see as the likely way that jack smith tried to thread the needle to get it to trial? one piece of news to pick up on your opening, people that are counting, this makes five grand jurors or grand juries that decided that donald trump is guilty of multiple felonies. It is the fifth time he has been charged criminally. Doesn't start with why this has to be a new grand jury, hearing this for the first time? that is a great point. That goes to the question of why now. What does he gain from this came at one of the things is taking an argument off the table and trying to say, donald trump can't challenge the old indictment by saying the grand jury did not know what the law was and it was somehow tainted by evidence that the supreme court said it shouldn't here. There may not have been a lot of merit but this removes that issue about whether there needed to be a new indictment because now there is one. It is a relatively simple process to represent the case. I think it will streamline the arguments that are going to come. Up to and including, back to the supreme court. This is all an issue if kamala harris wins. Otherwise it is all irrelevant. What does this do to the schedule? we were anticipating a possible hearing or argument about what should be allowed in this case. Has this rewritten indictment in effect and has it become the argument about this is what charges should be? i anticipated he could have done this without superseding. He could've said we are not going to proceed on the following. It is definitely a cleaner way to do it. Donald trump is entitled to raise any and all arguments about it. He will say that there should not be a hearing until after. We will know on friday whether jack smith says no we should have hearings about proceeding, before the election. You could have a lot of issues decided. The key thing that happens in terms of what is added and subtracted, what is subtracted is all of the allegations about the department of justice and internal white house actions are sort of deleted. What is added is lots of language saying mike pence acted as either a candidate or as president of the senate. Not as an official piece of action. And trump was acting in an unofficial way. Donald trump can say i challenge that. I think it is not right and then he could have a factual hearing. That is the last thing donald trump wants. He does not want a factual hearing, at least before the election. That would lead to people like mike pence being able to take the stand and testify that he in fact was acting as a candidate or as president of the senate. That is going to be the battleground. It will be interesting to see whether these were ports that jack smith may not seek that hearing. Whether that is true or not, it is not totally clear. We haven't really heard from the horses mouth. On friday, we should know whether they will be that type of hearing which could be explosives. Because of mike pence position on what he said is not public. One basic interpretation of the supreme court immunity invention, the president, when he is ordering people in the executive branch who he couldn't boss around, whatever he is doing, he is immune from crimes. The trouble is anything occupies an anything occupies an independent constitutional office. He need not ever speak to or listen to the president. This dynamic with jeffrey clark that may have gotten that scene knocked out of the indictment, doesn't seem to have any impact on a similar scene of donald trump talking and trying to get him to overturn the election. What he would argue is it is true what you are saying. When donald trump is acting as president and trying to convince his vice president to do something, as long as he is acting in an official capacity, supreme court decided that would at the very least the presumptively immune. If it is within his core powers it is absolutely immune. To be clear, that is bonkers. In that clip that you played in terms of what this means for the country. The idea that everyone understands, the supreme court said even though donald trump is alleged in the prior indictment, it was sham criminal investigations of opponents, he is absolutely immune to do that. That is the supreme court decision. Sham doj investigations, absolutely immune. That is considered a core presidential function, seeking sham investigations. Just to say it is to refute it. What do you see as a timetable in this case? i think the judge has her work cut out for her if she wants to have a factual hearing with evidence before the general election. On the other hand, that is in large part one of the things they said she needs to do at least on some of these areas. There are factual issues she needs to decide. She could decide that she is going to go forward. The issue will be whether she is helped by jack smith position where he said yes, i am willing to do that or whether jack smith said no, let's do it after the election. As it goes forward and asked the judge decides through one process or the other, what she is allowing to go forward, the trump lawyers are just gonna get up a motion to dismiss everything thing immunity. She is going to say no and then they are going to appeal to the supreme court. It will be hard for them to appeal prior to the factual hearing. There is no question they can delay the ultimate trial, if kamala harris wins, they will definitely go back to the supreme court for additional ruling. It could take a lot of time. The way i look at it is if donald trump wins, we know this is absolutely gone. If kamala harris wins, there is a chance. It just may take time. That hearing where you will hear additional evidence and there will be new material for the public to digest about donald trump and what he was up to. It is something for us to go on in terms of what he did. That is something that should happen prior to an appeal. Will there be a new addition of the trump indictments that will include this one? it would be nice to have something like of book about convictions so we are more at the end of the road. I think the first step is to see what happens in november. I am thinking of the old law books where they used to just stick the supplements inside the back cover. The pocket piece. Thank you so much for starting off our discussion. Coming up, donald trump's alma mater, the university of pennsylvania, joined the plan because it would increase the national debt by over $5 trillion. The chairman of the senate finance committee will be in charge of either killing the trump plan or advancing president harris's economic print plan next year. It's lying dormant, waiting. . . And could reactivate. Shingles strikes as a painful, blistering rash that can last for weeks. And it could wake at any time. Think you're not at risk for shingles? it's time to wake up. Because shingles could wake up in you. 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