A political bombshell in the making, former congresswoman Liz Cheney, Vice Chairwoman of the January 6 Select committee and the most public facing member of the most conservative republican dynasty in america earlier this week endorsed Vice President Kamala Harris has gone even further, this time saying that she and her father, former Vp Cheney will do something that casually if youre a follower of American Politics may think has phone it over, cheney will vote for the democratic nominee, voting for Vice President Kamala Harris. Here she is in conversation with the atlantic, making this news a short time ago in austin, texas. Your father, a beloved figure among democrats for many many years, do you, if you know who he will be supporting who he will be voting for, or do you care to share . Dicky cheney will be voting for Kamala Harris. [ applause ] wow. Words that i never expected to hear. You know, if you, think about the moment that we are in, and you think about how serious this moment is, you know, my dad believes and he has said publicly that there has never been an individual in our country who is as great a threat to democracy as Donald Trump is. And that is the moment we are facing. I want to show you the news that Liz Cheney made because there is more, but i want to stop here, i worked for them and what Dicky Cheney just did and what liz announced is he made it impossible for Chris Christie and George Bush and Bill Barr to sustain their position. That somehow, in some universe Kamala Harris is worse than donald Trump Or Writing in somebody or doing nothing, but Liz Cheney, they went further, she is also endorsing the democratic nominee for the senate in texas, congressman all read over the republican, Ted Cruz. We will join him in a little bit to react to this endorsement, thats where we start today with some of our friends. Host of the Bulwark Podcast Tim Miller and democratic pollster to tell us what the democrats will do with this, with me at the table the president of the national action network, the host of Politics Nation on msnbc, the rev. Al sharpton and former top prosecutor at the justice department, andrew wiseman. All of them, msnbc contributors. Tim miller, your thoughts . Well in some ways this is a shock, an earthquake, Dick Cheney Voting for the democrats. Not that much of a surprise because of what we have seen from Liz Cheney and the backbone of the cheneys. Lets go back, Dick Cheney cut an advertisement for her in her primary which she lost when she was sacrificed at the altar of Donald Trumps insurrection and in that he said in the 246 Year History of the nation there has never been an individual that is a greater threat to the republic. Nothing more important that liz will ever do then lead the effort to make sure Donald Trump is never again in the Oval Office and she will succeed. I mean, thats as straightforward as it gets, that is classic Dick Cheney. Love him or hate him, he was always clear about what he thought was the right approach. In this case looking at this to say Donald Trump is the greatest threat in the history of the republic. I mean, that is not mincing words. I agree this is huge news, and we should mention now the last two republican Vice President s will not vote for trump, Mike Pence is neutral and Dick Cheney is, sorry the previous republican Vice President will vote against him, that is telling. And worth saying, Condoleezza Rice was on Fox News this week trying to do this two step where she says there are Four Horsemen Of The Apocalypse coming. Isolationism, protectionism, Nativism And Populism and we need to fight them. She is on fox, but she does not say his name like he is baltimore or something. What you talking about . If you think things are perlis and you think those threats are causing peril to the republic and your colleague and the Bush Cabinet things one of these candidates is the greatest threat to the republic then whats The Next Step . Its very refreshing the cheneys have made it clear, The Next Steps. Well i mean, not to talk out of school, but the construct is George Bush, he writes about it in Decision Points and since before he left the residency he has worried about those threats , but the horses are not headless. The had on all four is Donald Trump, Donald Trump is galloping through, not just the republican party, but the world. Cozied up to Vladimir Putin and i think the question for all of them, wherever they go is whats the difference between how you see the world and how the cheneys see the world . I attest there is no ideological difference between Condoleezza Rice and her worldview as it pertains to Vladimir Putin and the cheneys so the variable is somewhere else. Right . Yes, the variable is to speak honestly and deal with the blowback that the cheneys have dealt with. Losing leadership, you dont get invited onto the show. If you say the words, Donald Trump is the one who is the threat at the head of the horses. One other thing. One rationale some of those folks may have given to say why theyre different from dick and Liz Cheney in the past is trump would have people who would align with them around him, but the other big News Story this week is we have learned again, confirmed again that trump has the most isolationist and most dangerous people around him now this time. He chose Jd Vance to be his Vice President at the advice of Tucker Carlson among a couple other isolationists. Tucker who was Platforming A historian saying churchill was the Bad Guy in World War ii. And we know that Jd Vance does not care about the ukrainian citizens, he does not care about them. That will be his inner circle. A bunch of people that, in their view of the free World And Americas role, going from The View of internationalists and the bipartisan national Security Consensus since World War ii. We know now that there will not be other people around him that are more amenable to Condoleezza Rice of the world, so what is it . We know what the choice is, Kamala Harris in line with the bipartisan national Security Consensus, you may disagree or it is Donald Trump who is a threat to it and a threat to the republic. So many horses, i did not mean to make another horse reference, but what you said is so vital. Foreignpolicy views of Dick Cheney alienated him from all the democratic party in large swaths of the republican party as well. Dick cheney sees the World And Americas enemies like that Amir Putin and kim Jong Un and hamas and the threat of terrorism and the threat, economic threats from China And Whatnot more like Kamala Harris does than anything Donald Trump will do prospectively. It is a ideological earthquake that is being felt and reported all around the world. Now i have never covered a republican making the move into the Prodemocracy Coalition without giving credit to the democratic party and the pro Democracy Coalition for having all of us. What do they do with Dick Cheney . Look, i am completely gob smacked. I have to tell you. Many many years ago, i would have never in 1 Million years thought i would be sitting here one day talking about Dick Cheney and the cheneys endorsing a democratic nominee. Thats how incredibly, how incredibly the world has changed over the last couple of years with the rise of Donald Trump. I dont have to tell you this, but i want to lean in with The Viewers, what a big deal this is, theres probably, theres already a few more iconic conservative names over the last two decades than the cheneys. You know, lord knows we can disagree and disagree with Dick Cheney on a lot of policy issues, but we do not think of him as someone who is not patriotic and loves the Country And Fight for democracy and what he believes about america. Right . So he was the Vice President , a republican Vice President and their family is now leaning into support for democrats. That is an incredible, incredible moment in history. We have not seen the likes of this in our modern history. I have grown cynical. We have talked about this on the show. I have grown cynical about how much Endorsements Matter or move people. In the last couple decades, in my mind i think there are a couple that moved the ball that were impactful and one of them was another republican. Secretary, the late great Colin Powell endorsing barack obama. That was impactful and meaningful and in the primaries Ted Kennedy endorsed obama that was a needle moving moment for obama. I think this is a needle moving moment for Vice President Kamala Harris because as you know a lot of republicans have been sitting on the fence talking about the structure. What bigger Permission Structure from conservatives to lean in and vote for the pro democratic movement, then dick and Liz Cheney offering up this Permission Structure and approval points. It is huge, if i were the campaign i would literally be running Television Ads with the cheneys and talking about Bipartisanship And Something bigger than left versus right and something bigger about america. I agree with everything you said. I have 1 Million thoughts about the bus with Josh Shapiro and Dick Cheney, the Campaign Operative wants to be in the room figuring out what should we ask them to do if you want to make their endorsement come to pass. The other piece, the frame on this is, whether she wants it or not, Kamala Harris now carries the banner of the only Prodemocracy Ticket for the voters. Whether she wants to grab it and run with it, that is up to her. There is no other frame under which to assemble her vast coalition stretching from the enthusiastic endorsements from Bernie Sanders and aoc and other endorsements from dick and Liz Cheney. This has never happened before, we have never seen this and we have to stop comparing her candidacy to obama. Obama was a historic phenomenon now this is larger. We dont have the data to say it is deeper, but the comparisons are because of the crowds and enthusiasm, but ideologically this is wider and this has never happened before. It is potentially bigger and more grand because its not at all partisan. Its about fundamentally do you believe in the idea of democracy . Hard stop and i think they are leaning into it. The idea of not going back is leaning into it. I agree and again i worked for obama so this is touchy territory. What we had was special. They have the potential to do something even greater because of the reach of what you said is a coalition with Bernie Sanders and Dick Cheney, that has never happened before. Let me geek out, do you cut an advertisement with Dick Cheney and Bernie Sanders . I spent time with voters who voted obama, obama and trump. Does it make the point that the ticket is not democratic or republican, it is proamerican if you see Bernie Sanders and Dick Cheney making a case . Can you imagine . Imagine. An advertisement with bernie and Dick Cheney. Absolutely. If you can get Dick Cheney to do it, you absolutely do it. Go call somebody. This just happened so i want to play more of Liz Cheney, she made other news endorsing calling all red over Ted Cruz. I think one of the most important things we need to do as a country, as we begin to rebuild our politics is we need to elect serious people. I want to say specifically here in texas, you guys do have a tremendous and serious candidate running for united States Senate and his name is [ applause ] you are stepping on the news. Let her speak. Well, its not Ted Cruz. But, Colin Allred is , somebody i served with in the House And Somebody who really when you think about the kind of leaders that our country needs and going to the point about you know, you may not agree on every policy position, but we need people who were going to serve in good faith, we need people who are honorable public servants. And in this race, that is Colin Allred, so i will be working on his behalf. So, when Dick Cheney cuts his Bernie Sanders at she will go cut for Colin Allred. She might be part of ushering in a prodemocracy movement in november. My quip is you have a Bernie Sanders and Dick Cheney adventure. Stick with me on this now, thinking about my career. So, when the underboss of the campaign flipped and cooperated, there were sort of shockwaves through the Gambino Family and every other New York family. What we saw was a parade of leaders because suddenly it was something you could do, even though these people had taken a new vote. As was mentioned, it is a Permission Structure of oh, i can do this. I think with politics, speaking as a citizen politics, its almost like religion or a tribe. Something so much that is part of you in terms of i am a democrat or republican, you dont think about the ability to step out of it to say im going to vote in a different party. So to see somebody who is as republican as you can possibly get, as Dick Cheney and seeing that he has said, in a way that is more real than just saying country over party. It is giving meaning to it and saying all of those foundational things that you think are impossible. I can switch from being democrat to republican or vice versa. Its really nonsense. There are fundamental principles at stake. So i think this is really huge and i think it is needed because i think it is such a hard thing for so many people to think of themselves doing something so different from how they were raised. You are making the point about Permission Structures and something thats not possible until it is possible and impossible becomes contagious. Exactly, you think It Something you cant do, sometimes not even in your imagination because you have not done it or seen it and thats why i think Liz Cheney and Dick Cheney are leaders. Thats what you want from leaders. Somebody who steps up and also does not do the sort of well, im just not going to vote. The lamest thing ever. I have to sneak in, do i have a minute . Okay. What i thought, the day when i read about Joe Bidens Decision to step out of the race and what i said the moment we were on to be talking is a act of political sacrifice must be contagious and must make other people do hard things, must make the general dig down and say the military should not be political, it must make republicans like dick and Liz Cheney dig down and say i have devoted myself to conservatism but this is different. Dick and Liz Cheney are one of the early examples who have flocked to Kamala Harris candidacy but it does not happen without Joe Biden and Kamala Harris creating this circumstance. I totally agree. Joe biden set the Temperature And Show showed us the Self Sacrifice and i probably have led more marches against Liz Cheney and Dick Cheney than anybody around and for Dick Cheney to do this is shifting the ground. Dick cheney, weapons of mass discussion all of that. For him to say shes not un american. Imagine what Donald Trump and all have been trying to project her as. Unamerican, does not believe in the country, socialism and communism, now Dick Cheney says i will vote for her, he ripped the ground from under Donald Trumps campaign. Now youre not arguing with any aoc or those, you are arguing with Dick Cheney on whether she is a Real American and with Liz Cheney endorsing Colin Allred, i am preaching in houston on sunday for rev. Anderson. Part of what we were dealing with, with Colin Allred, he is a good candidate. He does not have to explain that anymore. The whole thing has flipped upside down. I think who would have ever thought that the cheneys would do it. They have ripped these excuses off trying to paint her as a Black Radical and allred as that, nobody, the most Right Wing would do that other than if they thought it was best for the country and he is somebody i have always disagreed with, but now you have to say he has done whats right for the country. Country. 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If you were advising Kamala Harris going into this debate on monday, monday or tuesday, tuesday with Donald Trump, he is not fun or easy to debate obviously. How do you think she should pursue . Every opportunity that Donald Trump gets to show the american people who he is, he pretty clearly, and the, his Running Mate is doing this too. This is my diplomatic way of saying it. They are misogynistic pigs. [ applause ] i think it is, i think that will become clear. Sometimes you hear from trump supporters they want to let trump the trump and i endorse that, let that Guy Go because the more people see him and frankly, at the end of the day, i think that women around this country, like, we have had enough. We have had enough. A little bit of what you get when Vice President , or im sorry, former congresswoman Liz Cheney and her father former Vice President Dick Cheney endorse you. Liz cheney announcing another endorsement, for congressman Colin Allred running against Ted Cruz for senate in texas. We played her endorsement of you at the top of the broadcast. It was one of the loudest rounds of applause in the room. She is in your state today. Your reaction to her endorsement. Was It Something you expected or sought . Thank you for having me on. Listen, i am honored to have liz s support because i respect her and i respect her because i have seen she has put her country, the constitution over any other consideration. I saw it January 6 when we were on the House Floor together and we immediately came together and decided to have a response. I saw it in the aftermath with everything she went through. I have seen it in the years since then and she is somebody who i have a deep level of respect for so it means a lot to me and i think it also shows that what were doing here in texas and across the country is building a coalition, pro democracy, prou. S. Constitution, proour future coalition. One that is not dictated by party, but by values. Thats why it means so much to me. Will you ask Liz Cheney to campaign for and or with you in texas . As she said shes getting to work and we have plenty of things we can do together. I think her voice is important so i look forward to us being able to do that together in texas and i think she is an incredibly important voice. Who a lot of texans will listen to. This is something where it is an honor, we are at the beginning of this, making sure we do whats necessary to get 30 Million texans a senator who cares about them instead of Ted Cruz only cares about himself. Her endorsement was about you, calling you a serious person which was unsaid, your opponent Ted Cruz is not a serious politician. What is the state of your race against Ted Cruz and where are you making the most ground against him . This is a incredibly close race. Every single day is incredibly important and we are building a coalition in texas. A lot of folks from texas may not know how quickly things can change here. I think you have some understanding of who we are here in texas and folks are ready to turn the page. We have to turn the page and were getting folks to do that understanding we can have an alternative. We dont have to have a senator we are embarrassed by, but one who brings us together, who is serious about the constitution and the Rule Of Law who will not be heart of the things that Ted Cruz has been part of and who will bring us together around shared values. Thats where liz and i fundamentally agree. We have to go back to some of the basics in democracy. Some of the things that tie us together, that we grow up with and forget about that are ingrained in us. When we have leaders who put us against Each Other we forget those things. You know, in talking about all of the republicans who were showcased at Vice President Kamala Harriss convention, you spoke at the convention. It feels like she deserves a lot of credit for assembling a movement that is diverse and also ideologically wide. It seems that your campaign, in some ways, is a reflection of that. Is that a fair description of how you are running for the Senate Seat in texas . Thats right and thats how i got elected to congress. Running in a republican district, represented by a republican 22 years and we flipped it by not just appealing to partisan, but building a broad coalition. You mentioned the convention, Adam Kinzinger had a prominent role. Adam is a friend of mine, now a texan who has moved to houston and i see us as part of a shared coalition of trying to bring Series Leaders back into office who will make sure we bring us together and never have to go through something like January 6 ever again. That we never come that close to losing democracy. Thats a shared value we can all agree on and one that was not just one person responsible. Folks should know this, Ted Cruz was the architect in the senate of that attempt, the objector to the results in arizona. When the mob came and a took off my Suit Jacket and i was going to hold back the mob out the door, he was hiding in the supply closet. Texans understand that and on November 5 we are going in a different direction. Rissman Colin Allred, thank you for spending some time with us on this extraordinary endorsement, Liz Cheney backing you against Ted Cruz. Evan, my guy youre helping them with savings, right . i wish i had someone like evan when i started. Somebody just got their first Debit Card Ice cream on you . Ooo, tacos i got you. Wait hold on, dont you owe me money . What . your money is a part of your community, so your bank should be too. Like, Chase Subject 1 whos coming in the driveway . Subject 2 dad dad, we missed you daddy, hi subject 3 i missed you. 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[music playing] subject 4 join with your Debit Or Credit card now and well send you this st. Jude tshirt that you can proudly wear. Subject 8 [speaking spanish] Subject 9 are you ready to go have some fun . Subject 10 Yeah Subject 9 Yay Subject 11 when we came here, we didnt know what tomorrow would hold. St. Jude showed us that tomorrow, theres hope for our Little Girl to survive. [music playing] subject 4 lets Cure Childhood Cancer together. Please donate now. [music playing] still ahead for us, following the public rebukes of Donald Trump visiting arlington national cemetery, from the united States Army they never do that but they have done that. Thats how bad he is. We will look at the former president s Longtime Contempt for the military and the men and women in it from someone who saw it firsthand, Donald Trumps nephew Fred Trump will join us on the set. Set. This is no longer a partisan thing to say this, but it is a genuine disgrace, a repulsive maneuver that Donald Trump continues to shamefully employ, and every single one of his political campaigns, dragging our nations veterans and their families into the muck with him to be used as political props. After days of trying to deflect outrage after his performative trip to arlington national cemetery during which he posed with goldstar families in an area where photos are prohibited, the Trump Campaign insist President Biden and Vice President Kamala Harris ignored invitations to attend. The White House insist that no such invitation exists or was extended, the Vice President accusing Donald Trump of Disrespecting Sacred Ground for the sake of a political stunt. She goes on, if there is one thing on which we as americans can agree, it is not veterans, military families and servicemembers should be honored, never disparaged and treated with nothing less than our highest respect and gratitude. But, this is suckers and losers we are talking about, his words, whose personal history is painted walltowall, with true beliefs that dishonor the military. Consider how Fred Trump, the disgraced former president s nephew described the way his uncle dodged the draft. I have an idea, fred Trump Senior said, the move involved a podiatrist who rented space on the Ground Floor of a Fred Trump building, after a call from my grandfather the doctor wrote a letter saying that Donald Trump suffered from bone spurs, elm is so severe that this otherwise healthy 24year old male could not serve in the military. Bone spurs . Nobody in the family had ever heard of Donalds Bone spurs, No One had ever seen him hobbling, No One had ever heard him complain. About other things, sure, but not about bone spurs. 20 us at the table, nephew of Donald Trump and author of, all in the family. Fred trump is here with us. This story, of course, cuts me. Every time. I am mad at myself for still being able to feel pain at things that trump does, that your uncle does, but, i was pained, reading about arlington. The first thing i emailed and said to my team as i want to talk to Fred Trump and he is back. At the end of our conversation, you brought me into this room that you remember being in, tell me about this story. He worked hard to not serve. Yes, thank you very much for having me back, a pleasure to meet you. This all happened in what my grandparents call the library which is funny because the only books in there were the yellow pages and the white pages. Many of your audience do not know what those are. It was a very serious thing and i was young, but i certainly remember the atmosphere. Donald had a deferment, when my father helped him get into pennsylvania where my daughter graduated from she is here now. He had two more. When he graduated, as i try to eloquently say is get ready to pack your bags because you are headed overseas. And, thats when the reality really set in. So my grandfather, who is a very powerful guy in the democratic machine in brooklyn and queens came up with, the only word you can use is a scheme and this podiatrist bought into it and donald one from front of the line to 1 y which is, you are safe for now. And of course at the end of 1969 when the Nixon Administration was getting a lot of flack for having just minority serving in the military, you know, the numbers were coming up. Donald was very lucky to have a high number. 360 something, in fact his younger brother, my Uncle Robert had his number called but he was going to boston university. As i mentioned in the book, two things that troubled me about it. Several years after this episode, when it was clear he would not be serving, i went to a little Prep School in queens where donald went also. He never made it to graduation which is why he went to the military academy. I met this young woman who was selling prisoner of war missing in Action Bumper stickers and i do not understand why, the reason why, her father was missing in action. Even at a young age, probably 10 or 11 at the time. I said wait a second, her father, she may never see him again, yet my uncle, through the moxie of my Grandfather And Donald did not serve. The other thing. Who was that person who took his place to serve in vietnam and what became of that person . We will never know, we wont know his Name Or Anything like that. What is amazing to me about what you tell as i remember when the atlantic story broke and they were the first to report that your uncle described the men and women who served and died as suckers and losers. The further reporting about him standing at arlington with gen. John kelly and not understanding why his son would serve the country. And reporting that came out down the road that gen. Millie at a ceremony had to defend the decision to have someone who was wounded, serving the country as part of the ceremony because your uncle said No One wants to see that. It is a continuum, he believes there are suckers and losers when he is 24 and what he said 50 years years later was not an anomaly, it is who he was always was. Have ousted that reveal itself to you . First let me just say my father, Donald Older Brother was at university and then voluntarily went into the international guard. The only one in the Trump Family to ever serve. In fact, i had the honor of using his trunk, his Army Trunk throughout my Summer Camp days. Everything about him and we spoke last time we were here about how i had the honor of Meeting Senator john mccain. No word that has been cheapened over the years but i said to my kids who were there, this is a genuine hero. Make no mistake about it. The fact that donald called him, in essence, a loser, i dont get it. Anyone who is disabled or anyone who he deems lesser than him is a loser. Which, okay, thats the way he is. That aint going to change. Why do you think people in the military support him . I have no idea and i know many people who are in the military and i had the pleasure of speaking on an interview with national Defense Radio which goes to the Armed Services and i told the truth. I basically told the story and i said he does not give a about them, he just doesnt. Its the great godfather 2, one of the last scenes when sonny says country in your blood, kid. He says i dont believe that. Donald believes in donald. Taking a break i want to bring in eddie on all of this. Dont go anywhere, we will all be right back. Ight back. And intel. 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This is how business goes further with tmobile for business. We have got trump on the run, scared. Insults about servicemembers catching up with him. He is panicked, losers and suckers he called us, refusing to be seen with wounded warriors. Refusing to salute the fallen of World War i because he doesnt understand what was in it for them because he was afraid his job might run in the rain, faster than he ran to a quack doctor when the Draft Board called his number, with the likes of Jeffrey Epstein and the sacrifice of those who went in his place to vietnam. Now, maybe the greatest insult of all, turning a military Cemetery Visit into a political stunt. With cameras in tow. I was not here last week when that happened, but it is a remarkable story with so much we dont know. One of the most disturbing things is that the people involved did not want to touch their name to what had transpired because they were afraid of trump. You invoked the godfather. This is another disturbing sign of how effective acting like mobsters has been when the person on the side of angels, the person who literally works at arlington is uninterested in being part of holding this person accountable. They do not want to press charges, reasonably because they did not want to invite Harm Or Threat to themselves or the people they love. It makes sense and we have tolerated this, so one of the things that has become clear and the story makes more clear. He has no idea what sacrifice is or what service is, he foregrounds his own interest above everyone else and it seems to me if the presidency requires a certain kind of character and certain kind of sense of virtue that allows you to at least be open to stepping into statesmanship we know Donald Trump doesnt have it. As you said at so many moments, this is about us, this is how do we tolerate someone and i have always felt that the men and women who decide to serve are better than me. How do we tolerate someone who treats the best of us so shallowly . That is something we have to figure out and every moment over the course of our history. In the moments, in the underbelly of the country exposing itself we throw out these people. Its really fascinating. And so its, its one of the ironic contradictory features of american life. These kinds of characters show up here periodically over history and that requires to look inside. Whats going on with us . This has been primetime weekend, please tune into deadline White House and all of our Prime Time shows weekdays on msnbc. Numberone motorcycle insurer. But do you have to wedge it into everything . What . I dont do that. This reminds me of my bike. The wolf was about the size of my new motorcycle. Have you seen it, by the way . Happy birthday, grandma really . Look how the brushstrokes follow the line of the gas tank. Hey hey brought my plusone. Jamie . Chase knows how to put the hart in your local community. Evan youre helping them with savings, right . somebody just got their first Debit Card Ice cream on you . Your money is a part of your community, so your bank should be too. Like, chase Vo Youve had thyroid Eye Disease for a long time. And youve lived with the damage it caused. So your bank should be too. But even after all these years, restoration is still possible. Learn how at tedhelp. Com. I still love to surf, snowboard, and, of course, skate. So, i take Qunol Magnesium to support my Muscle And Bone health. Qunols extra strength, high Absorption Magnesium helps me get the full benefits of magnesium. Qunol, the brand i trust. Good evening, and welcome to Politics Nation. From houston, texas. Tonights lead debate countdown. Ston, texas. Tonights lead debate countdown. Right now anticipation is building for the next pivotal event and what has
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