Measures of retaliation outside of tariffs same question to you michael in forest hills here i mean it really is about a paradigm shift one power not wanting that shift to occur and another one feels that its finally reached its place on the global stage i mean the this is these are piers they are genuinely piers now economically but its something the u. S. Has never had to confront go ahead michael well that doesnt stop you needed. Were economic surrender it was china and russia and other countries all could be dependent on United States information technology. Dollar and finance. In their culture so that these countries do something america doesnt like it can impose sanctions on them that will hold whole apart all of the connections of their economy no other economy is going to go along. Yes and china and any other economy is going to say wed better be independent from any ability of the United States to suddenly disrupt their activity by imposing sanctions so were going to have our own arrangements for food for oil or mation technology so the but what was doing is. China together with other countries to make turn to ways to in effect trump is imposing sanctions on the United States well its very interesting because john i mean what i want hang on let me go to john and then we could make it a free for all john made you know what you know with the kind of relationship that is occurring during the socalled trade war here i mean doesnt this give initiative to for the chinese to actually innovate even more if theyre going to be cut off from these technologies and these products and these consumers then they can do it on their own end and in some ways it seems like a kind of a wise move because he does have to swallow the bitter pill now and youll be much better later so i mean i gan i mean kind of echoing what michael is saying right here is that in a sense here by targeting specific companies theyre actually spurring innovation in china itself go ahead john. Well i guess youre talking about targeting while this is actually very true so far in china in the u. S. Being you know working where well in terms of economic integration this you know postrace going on is also very large operation here in china representing Something Like 402500 1000000000 dollars of interest here so that the success of global value chain that meaning global very chim production across the pacific has been credible to successful but so far you know the chinese status of learned that this is in danger now why always a prime example of that this motto is you know you can have blind faith is the motto and this actually drives copper china further into self innovation self indigenous being selfreliant so i think this is a. Very dangerous sign coming out that the global very choose stories in is in shambles right now and also want to get a point. To where theres just said its chu that the United States maintains a very large trade deficit with china some point chinas going to run off goes to put on taro some but porn is there 40 percent of the chinese exports to nanas things actually so she was Corporate America operating here in china and that means that a lot of these types of hitting products that actually imported about American Companies into u. S. And altimeter all paid by by American Consumers you know the studies out there are pointing out that the average burden for American Family is going to be somewhere between 700 dollars to 1000 dollars so sooner or later people going to realize this you know the prices at walmart at amazon dot com is going up and the average american working families up footing the bill for this so its actually not in the americas interest to you know just protests and this is not just one way street i mean the exports coming from china to the u. S. They are all a socialist. The benefits of quitting to copper america and you know the good. American families and the people of this ok how do you want to jump in there go ahead a lots been said. Yeah i mean yeah i guess ill be the one person to push back but im on with 2 professors and i and i am not a professor so i will be cautious all raise my hand in the administration in the us i know that this also hurts us it walmart has said prices are going to have to go up and it also hurts china perhaps even more than the us and as a free market capitalist i mean i dont necessarily like the idea of tariffs or want to impose tariffs but i do understand the us the administration u. S. Trade teams position that china has been stealing our intellectual property for many years and has forced joint ventures if you want to do business with china in beijing where you are john i think you have to transfer you form a joint venture and you transfer all of your trade secrets to them and then they can use that data or they are using that have their data. Join or theyre just a company but if its a joint venture how targeting you know if its a joint venture hows that. Well thats good because china is not supposed to be able to give our trade secrets to their Domestic Companies thats putting our u. S. Domestic manufacturers added disadvantage and thats what were targeting that well we want to have business which we ask people to do during their life i mean basically fair and yeah but they still do the joint ventures why because their profits to be made i mean weve known this for a very long time michael you were disagreeing jump in technology is universal there is no such thing as a trade secret thats like saying that china shouldnt grow its own mood because we grow up grow our food. When theyre talking about trade secrets youre talking about monopoly pricing in the United States once they have other countries china and others dependent on us. Patent rights and monopolies just like the pharmaceutical companies that charge an enormous braces for growth thats not a pretty secret when when a company by a late. Normal free trade in us now which is a monopoly every other country has the right to produce it cos if some other country tries to exploit them by selling it in an exploitative rent grabbing price over and above us ok well john i know youre going what is it like knowledge of good job good job one is the Technology Theft in the socalled theft of intellectual property so were the 1st one to make the point that no country can make any progress significant progress on the technology of phones by just stating and and Technology Transfer coercion them selfs corporate china has to be innovating and they have been climbing the Technology Lead us no doubt about it and also im not going to defend it or snow you know that its an actual property theft in china thats when it happens but a point is that i think the United States was talking about a state sponsored theft of intellectual property so i mean as a distinction here im not sure thats true i mean if you look at the u. S. T. R. Right robert the 2nd 3 all report. He talks about theft of intellectual Property Rights he doesnt distinguish between you know its individual companies or government sponsored a theft seems a very important distinction here i dont think theres a very solid evidence to support the idea that the Chinese Government is engaging the state sponsored saft systematic comprehensive set of Corporate Americas intellectual properties i dont think thats true there was a spot to the Technology Transfer again i want to make this again i mean the finish has a good enough to we have to make a distinction between the government and individual companies when individual company tossed American Companies about for me and joint venture in china of course the chinese side who said look you know what can you offer on the table is there any Technology Transfer you can you can offer us in exchange for something we are on the table and if you call that force Technology Transfer im not sure thats really forced i mean this is a well that is that thats going on thats why you go issue here and thats why i said these companies willingly go into these joint ventures here had to finish out the 1st block of the program to groups like those who are against one maybe 3 against one go ahead 40 seconds have the report we go to break again fly im sorry i just think again no no no problem this is fine its not my position its the President Trump in the u. S. T. R. S. Position and not just a republican or democratic issue when there has been democratically important us from from the past president obama for example has filed 16 cases of what the World Trade Organization about chinese the chinese stealing our intellectual property as well as dumping goods like aluminum and steel on u. S. Soil in those most of those i think have been resolved but Bernie Sanders also saying that they have destroyed millions of u. S. American jobs a bill clinton in recently Chuck Schumer here in d. C. Saying playing tough heather and ahead of them going on china has gotten not just a robot like im very good at letting go of the United States really nice little money to hang on john but the chinese didnt steal any to. Obs it was american corporations that did it it wasnt china ok or im going to just ignore that they are going to going away are going to go to our shores were going to show our grain and after that short break well continue our discussion on trying to trade more say with our team. Looking. Ok. Thanks live. Play. Play. Play play. Play. Play. Play play. Play. Play. And a very warm welcome to you what an awesome task. As an officer. To get up off the ground begin to down. Democrats on the sounds of fighting in a grown man like wrestling essentially. Wish to do away from the officer. Of his crew. The obvious or did they kind of lunge for the weapon once missed and then what happened on 3 swung at the observations didnt hit him i never saw any contact with. Any kind of went back to where they were so the officers back here there try again 15 feet apart at this point and thats when the officer is gone and he did it on 3. Actually as a National Survival stacey lets learn. Lets say. Your Police Response they have to fight street thank you for. The story thats right. Welcome back to cross talk were all Things Considered im peter about oh man you were discussing straight war. Ok let me go back to what i call in forest hills look i am for the president getting a good trade deal with china or whatever that deal is then we have to talk about its nuts and bolts but i do support the American National interest im reaching out to have the right here ok im just trying to kind of peel back some of the kind of propaganda that we hear in the Mainstream Media now i mean you know michael you know him currency manipulation what was quantitative easing ok i mean there are different terms for it ok but you know i mean i always pointing at china my why you know ill be all be ill be very. Controversial here. Michael with a lot of people are just jealous of chinas enormous success i mean it is it is the one of the most amazing economic miracles in such a short amount of time when i was a young man you know china you when you open up like a you know an atlas and you know the f. B. I. Fact book you know like china which is not there to be the most populous country in the world that nobody ever really talked about it except for its commie danced now we have to talk about it a lot. And ive been to china it is a remarkable place to see now. A huge middle class i mean its extraordinary i think you know these people are not really well informed what china is really all about except for its the new adversary which is so boring go ahead michael well china has succeeded and gotten rich by following the same policy that america followed in the 19th century they get rich it has a mixed economy and it uses the Public Sector to subsidize the basic needs transportation Education Health to provide these really so that employers do not have to pay workers a high enough price so that they can afford high priced housing like americans high priced health care the americans cannot acknowledge china is succeeding with a mixed economy which it calls socialist but then youd have to call the American Economy socialist we have the government subsidizing the ip sector of the military sector subsidizing agriculture china is doing exactly what the United States does and the United States cant understand china because it would have to acknowledge that it itself is a mixed economy and that is an anathema to the Free Enterprise academics john is and i want to focus on that one question your mom about to ask john i want to ask heather and michael later is there a win win scenario as we go into this because the even though the terminology we use trade war is it someone has to win or lose i mean its its such a black and white issue the way its portrayed in the media and i find that that is very dangerous because if its a war someone has to win of course you dont want to lose and it could spread into other areas geopolitics in the military and which of course none of us want that to go happen so you know is a win win possible here because of the rhetoric coming out of the American Media and the administration they make it sound like you know this is a an existential threat maybe it will be one day but certainly not now go ahead john. Well the chinese scum has been very careful of using this world war i mean the trade war up until the collapse of 11th which is which was about a month ago when vice premier little hook came to washington d. C. And in a negotiation for appox up to up to that point the chinese come in the press in china most of them you know National Media is actually controlled by the government we have never used a war war to categorize whats going on between states and china we always were talking about your trade friction but now ive seen official mention of this world war so i think the Chinese Governments position has changed it a bit realizing that you know they cant just keep make concessions or concessions some point they have the theres a line they have to join us and we know more any more in. Recently just a few days ago a ministry of commerce issued a white paper lay out 3 conditions very clearly a force that if were going to reach a deal or have to go back to you know before july last year when the tassel impose order additional have to be gone thats the 1st condition the 2nd issue is that. Commitment china scum and has is going to make doing this train a go she has to be reasonable and and the moderates you know words theres a reach between present she and present championing the summit meeting argentina in november that china is committed to buy a soda months and seems the. The trade deficit some u. S. Keeps worsening since last november the american side has made additional amount of demand that we have to increase imports from u. S. Chinas going to say this has to be more the 3rd thing is that the force the macas of digital things from regarding any legislative timetable on the chinese spot chinas government thinks thats infringe upon their busy infringement upon china sovereignty so these are the 3 issues that. You know i have to be resolved and the mother opinion the disagreement is not so much respect to the substance of the americas concern for china structural issues or even the trade deficit among i think. Even this amount that the loan issue right now is god being forced to match because of it or was the enforcement mechanism doesnt have to be going through the legislative avenues they dont have to they have to the canning for him to function is some of the and thats the bottom line thats going to was thats a very subtle things that the chinas going to have very good point how theyre i mean and it was one of the questions that i sent out to all of you here i mean the United States the mending structural changes and how china does business in its own country i mean that is a bit of a reach isnt it i mean it shows a lot of disrespect. To the dominant and submissive country again thats not going to work now i mean like it or not as much as the American Media doesnt understand it china and the United States are roughly peers now ok and you have to start treating it as one go ahead heather well they should be piers i hope so and i dont want to trade war i mean i dont think anyone in the administration wants a trade war but it is our right to point out i think wed all be in agreement that asking china to change things their structural policies for example their state owned enterprises. Is maybe reaching too far like you said i think its a threat to their International Independence and then seen as an infringement on their sovereignty as john rightly point pointed out but the fact is if we are dealing with things that have gone on for decades sense bill clinton helped china to the World Trade Organization in 2001 of stealing intellectual property theft and force joint ventures even though the americans want to do business with china where the 2 largest economies in the world of course the americans want to do business with china we just dont want china to steal. Well billions and billions of stuff from from americans and reckless i was betting that this is really americans eat the west end