We as brick and mortar operators are continuously monitored by the Health Department. We have a piece of paper. If hand towels are missing in our restrooms, were in trouble. I have co2 tanks that are so secured that if one of my 7eleven locations, you need a jackhammer. How come these people are allowed to have propane tanks, i mean bombs, on the streets of San Francisco, where you have children and public at large roaming around . Why this bias towards us . Its a little question for the city attorneys office. Why this bias . I need an answer to this. The litter that they create. There is a mess on the streets. These people add to it. Thank you very much. Thank you, sir. Next speaker, please. Are there any other speakers . Good evening. Welcome. My name is patricio. And 21 drum street business. Im my main concern is, well, we have a humungous overheads that we all go through in the business. Im not going to name all, because im sure you are aware of it, what a costs to run a business when you have rent, building, water, electricity, etc. , but my concern being a culinary worker, but my concern is the safety in our area. These carts, where is the restroom . Where do you wash your hands . How do you sanitize . I have a picture here ive seen how they operate. Most of the places i see are carts surrounded by birds. Theyre feces, their drippings, are dangerous for humans. How do they deal with that . Here is evidence of how they operate. Overhead, please. Just face it how you would look at it. Thank you. Thank you. And it is pretty disturbing to see Something Like this when were being inspected by the Health Department. We just got an audit. We had to train people. We had to become certified. Im and certified executive chef. And the gentleman was saying, they have a menu with breakfast and so on. We, do, too. We offer ice creams, and shakes, and i believe that San Francisco is flooded with the cart vendors and street food vendors. 2,000 people die from street food. Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. Hi. You will have it excuse my voice. Im just getting over a cold. Im allison with the California Restaurant Association, Government Affairs director. This concerns us at the cre due to the fact that the mobile food carts are selling similar foods outside of the oasis grill downtown. Foot traffic in San Francisco and especially downtown, as we know, is a huge component in the success of our local restaurants. Restaurants are struggling to succeed given the pressure of health codes, on top of rapidly increasing minimum wage requirements. They provide jobs in food service, but also construction workers, pest control, architects, the lists go on, as youve heard already. If theyre going to give work to everyone, service workers, they need to be on an equal Playing Field themselves. The economy and food Service Communities will not be c congruent with one another without that foot traffic. So having the costs along with the costs of a brick and mortar restaurant is unsustainable to maintain the employees that they do have and in order to grow, they need to hire more people on. Having that fairness and equal Playing Field is so important in keeping this Community Alive and able to thrive. So we ask you that you can consider these implications on the local businesses and create an environment thats fair and equal. May i ask you a couple of questions . Yes. So the problem with your argument, which im sympathetic to, its innuendo and hearsay. Has the California Restaurant Association or like Association Come to San Francisco, done a study that measures from one point to another, lets say 2011 to 2016, the number of food carts and food trucks that have hit the streets. And those material impacts that you allude to but you can not give me a number in this particular dissertation . Have you, one, done a study that next time you come up here you can come and say, theyve added 10 food trucks and the impact was x number of dollars . And have you gone to dpw and said, okay, you started this program. Can i have some help . When did the Food Truck Program start . 2014. 2014. Have you gone to the governing bodies with respect to food trucks and asked them obviously, theres been a change. There were zero and now there are a lot. And whether theyve reviewed the impact of those and if theyre in a position to start changing their legislation or their the rules. Yeah. Have you done that . To answer your first question with the study, California Restaurant Association and golden state Restaurant Association do similar things. I handle the bay area counties. When things like this come up, unless you golden gate Restaurant Association is not getting involved, we would step in. Attempts to reach out and be a part of this were not getting along, not happening for them. She called upon me last week. I was really sick last week, so i was only able to talk to her on monday. As far as approaching the Public Works Department and discussing this, this is something weve discussed in our offices that could be useful later on. My personal knowledge was a few days ago. I dont have any specific numbers to provide to you, which you are right, that would be helpful. But in this case, i wanted to come and represent the cra and say its perked up our ears and something of concern to us. And, therefore, have not gone back to the city and asked them for a review of their legislation . No. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Any other questions . No. Thank you. Any other Public Comment . Please step forward. Sir, if you are going to speak, if you could step forward, great. If there is anyone else, come forward and stand on the far side of the room. Were running out of time tonight. Is there anyone thats going to speak after this gentleman . Okay. Thank you. If you are going to speak, line up to the left here. Thank you, sir. Welcome. Im the owner of oasis grill sorry. Your business with the appellant . Yes. You can use rebuttal she will have, but as a member of the same business, your time to speak is then. How about to correct some information. In the rebuttal if she wants if she wants to allow you to use her time. Come on up. Welcome. My name is joseph abugosh. I own a Small Business. We share the same issues and the same problems. I think that they covered everything they need to cover on the issue. The food carts are able to offer cheaper prices and it makes it easy for the customers to choose the vendors at the food carts over us. That went to the point. Thank you. Is there any other Public Comment . Seeing none, well have rebuttal from the appellant. 3 minutes. Please step forward. Mohammed zagir, owner of oasis grill. So i opened this business, it was a 300squarefootrest rant called oasis grill. Its at 91 drum street. After huge effort, we became very, very popular at the embarcadero. People love our halal food and we provide super Friendly Service to the people in the embarcadero. I feel that my business is being targeted. They want to do exactly the same way we do it. Same menu. Same style how we do our wraps and this kind of stuff. So they came at 425 market, two blocks away from us. And we felt like, okay, one halal cart. We can deal with it. When we find out that they want to surround us everywhere, north, east, west, targeting us from every building that our customer will come. For example, he was not right at all about the distance. 10 of my business comes from one market, which is very close to us. Hes in front of one market, which the distance is a half block or one block maximum. And on this block, there are three operations. There is one that has gyros and falafel. And another, kabobs and chicken. 90 like the menu. Hes at 425 market, which is two blocks away. Hes at bush and california. Not sure, but hes around there. Two blocks. Maybe bush why, i think bush and california. And he tries to be just right in front of us, which is one california. Its on one california and market. And drum. He tried to be there. If he succeeds, he will be in front of my door. And he has more plans. He wants to surround me with 50 starts. This is the only carts that come. I never see hot dog carts. Thank you. Your time is up. Thank you. We can take rebuttal from the permitholder. Please step forward. Hi. The appellant said that i was wrong. Overhead, please. Put it down above the picture. Thank you, sir. You can see that here is the one front street and this is the distance. Its like 5 miles from there. The location is 711b sorry. Im sorry, please. Nobody can speak from unless you are at the podium, please. So this is the location, 711b market street, to our location at one front street. And the other is 532 market. Thats almost 1 2 miles away. And were not trying to surround anybody. Were just trying to do the business in San Francisco and i dont think our menu is similar and it will not impact them. And the distance is not that close. I would like to request the Board Members to uphold our permit without any additional conditions. Thank you. Thank you. Anything further from the department . President brent cone, public works. I wanted to clarify a couple of things. One thing is, regarding the restaurants and the review, and that they have to have verification for their employees to use within a certain distance. And the other thing, when the ordinance or code was enacted. Prior to 2011, San FranciscoPolice Department permitted the food carts. I think the latest one was 1975 or so. And then in 2011, they the city handed it over to public works to permit and code was revised in 2013. I think partly because of the likefood concerns. 2013 is the current code that were reviewing from. Can i ask you some questions or maybe raul wants to step up. Youre so shy back there. I know you are an outstanding speaker. Is there a detailed guideline the question was asked, where is the nearest food truck to this or how many food trucks are across the street or down the street and the answer was, unclooe. Is there a specific guideline, a specific map, that identifies exactly where the food trucks, food carts, can be located or is it willynilly, helter skelter and you say yes or no because the storys good . Good evening, folks. This is multifaceted question. I will try to answer it as best as i can. We do have a current map that identifies current locations of food facilities. The locations of them are stipulated by article 5. 8. And theyre in commercial zones, not residential zones. In terms of the maximum number of food trucks, theres no specific guideline on that. However in 10821, if it it states if it goes to a hearing if there are three or more food carts within the same block food truck and food cart the same . You said food truck. Food facilities. Location guidelines show the sidewalk widths. Its larger for food carts. So theyre constrained by that minimum width as well. Other than that, there is no maximum in terms of the food trucks that can be on a permitted permitted on a block, but theres a consideration taken into account. Next question i heard a little bit of pass the buck. So you authorize permits and theres a propane tank. Its not your problem. Its the Fire Departments problem. The Health Efficiency of the facility is questionable. Thats not your issue. Its the Health Departments issue. Is there any consolidation of effort or coordination of effort to ensure that when an individual wants to put a food cart on a Street Corner that maybe you all come together as opposed to the separate well, the propane is not my issue, even though a car could drive into it and it could blow up. Real opportunity do you envision that that might be an idea and forthcoming . Thats a valid point, commissioner swig. What weve tried to do to mitigate this is weve worked with the applicants and the office of Work Force Development and Small Business office, excuse me, to try to Health Department, Fire Department and public works coordinates to get the information at the fore front before application. Were trying to do that as a preliminary step to this. From our understanding, the mobile foods are regulated standard are set by fire and health. Im jumping around. Let me start over. These facilities from our understanding are allowed to have propane tanks as part of as long as it falls under the definition of mobile food facility. In that sense, our understanding is that all of these can have propane tanks as a method of heat. Therefore, theres not much public works can do to push for different methods. It really just falls under the defined use of the facility and what is found under that defined use. Between 2013 and 2017, theres been a proliferation of mmfs of all kinds. With that, next time maybe you can come up with how many we had in 13 to now. That with be interesting. With that, the pressure on the restaurants, which are brick and mortar, the pressure has grown, lets face it, or we wouldnt be here talking too and having an appeal. When do you anticipate that dpw will be reviewing this issue so that it will be clearer and setting guidelines so it will be clearer to individuals looking to apply for mmf and their expectation of getting it granted and protecting the brick and mortar guys that are feeling the heat, every pun intended . Sure. Im not i cannot pinpoint a definite time. We can good to our Leadership Team and see if we need to set more criteria. The ordinance urges public works to take things into consideration. Well go back to our Leadership Team to discuss how it should be consolidated. Until a revision of 108101. I cannot speak to policy or for my fellow commissioners, but although we love to see you on a constant basis, it would consolidate our issues together to make it a smoother path for applicants and constituents in the marketplace. Thats my feeling. We do understand the hardships incurred, but were following the guidelines. Understood. And to reiterate what commissioner swig said. Ive been pretty consistent in my message in orders to brick and mortar versus food truck. Especially after hearing tonight the inequality of safety, health, its a double standard. And to me it doesnt seem fair. When we talk about policy and laws for mmfs, is it the same for food truck and food cart . I believe this is better suited for Health Department, but that said, i believe there are different standards, because they do have different facilities and power sources. And the carts have different power sources, different ventilation and sizes. At this point, i personally cannot speak for my fellow commissioners feel that i will not be able to render a decision or vet on this. Duly noted. Your permits are conditioned on receipt of the certifications from health and fire, correct . So there is coordination on that point. Correct. We go through our process to determine if the location is suitable. Once thats done, the permitholder has 90 days to secure the permits. If theyre not able to do that or not able to get the verification, when its denied automatically. Do you have the information tonight on other food carts and mobile food facilities in this area, lets say, owithin a oneblock radius . We do not. We can bring it back. Perhaps we should continue this case. At one front street, theres one approved mobile food facility within 300 feet. And at 532 market street, there are five approved mobile food facilities within 300 feet. It would be helpful to have a radius. Sure. We can work on getting that information. And a map. Maps. Maps are really good. Especially for us old folks. Not a problem. Thank you, mr. Shaw. Could i ask, what is the radius you would like to see . From the corner is one block. So one block, a Standard City block . Yes. Okay. Okay. Commissioners, the matter is submitted. I would like to hear from health and maybe even fire. Would you like to make a motion . Im going to vote against that. And i think this permit was issued with current regulations. If we have concerns about those, think its a separate issue. Its in our jurisdiction. Its not in our jurisdiction to change it, but Neither Party i dont even know where the the registrations say now. The point is, they cannot get the permit unless fire and health sign off. I want to see the regulations so i can tell what criteria theyre using and whether the permit was properly issued. I agree. Its the a variance. You dont meet the five criteria, you dont get the variance. We dont have clarity with regard to the deal points and couple fi criteria. I will move to continue this case, involving the Health Department to join us, with the information on the radius and other food facilities and a copy of the most current regulations. Vice president , do you want to specify what the want the Health Department to address . Ask them to present their review process for mobile food facilities. And i would also like them to contrast the different standards that they apply to a brick and mortar its his motion. Thats fine. Thank you. Im sorry. A friendly amendment is fine. As a friendly amendment, i would like them to address the different standards and potential imbalance or balance for the criteria between an mmf and brick and mortar. Health department . Yes. Okay. Do you have a date . What would you recommend . January 10 or 31 . That is a very full calendar, but it is at your discretion to have a long meeting. Its after three weeks off well do a long meeting. You a