Suarez. Arseniy yatsenyuk was named interim Prime Minister of ukraine, as demonstrators clashed with police. In the dramafilled games, president Viktor Yanukovych left the country, Russian Forces landed and took control of the crimean peninsula, and now that part of ukraine, formerly part of russia is heading towards a referendum in its future status. If crimea declares independence, its assumed its an interim status before it lines up with russia. The u. S. , britain, france, germany, italy, canada and japan promised to take action against russia if it happens. Whats at take for the United States. What American National interest is on the line. When people in other countries argue over a territory and International Border changes. Prime minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk comes to washington hoping the u. S. Will back its threats with action. President obama hosted his yatsenyuk. The interests of the United States is making sure that the people of ukraine can determine their own destiny. That is something that here in the United States we believe in deeply. I know its something you believe in deeply as well. And you can rest assured that you will have our strong support as you move forward during the difficult times. The two leaders discussed ways to peacefully end the Russian Military intervention. The goal get russia to recognise ukrainian sovereign government. They cannot have a country outside of ukraine dictate how they should arrange their affairs. Thats not something that can be done with the barrel of a gun point at you. Mr president ,its all about the freedom. We fight for our freedom and independence. We fight for our sovereignty and will never surrender. As the diplomatic wheels turp, the situation is tense. The world waits to see what the people in crimea will do at the ballot box. The referendum will ask whether crimea should breakaway and russia. We reject a referendum patched together in a few weeks with Russian Military personnel basically taking over crimea. We reject its legitimacy. It is contrariy to international constitution. The crimean government expects the vote to go russias way. [ speaking Foreign Language ] after crimea joins the russian republic, all the the military will be given the opportunity of leaving the military and leaving their weapons behind and moving to continental ukraine. Ukrainian forces say the number of troops doubled over the weekend, approaching 30,000. No shots have been fired. We cannot launch a military operation in crimea as we would expose the eastern border and ukraine will not be protected. The Russian Military is counting on that. N. A. T. O. Sent reconnaissance planes over poland and ukrainian to monitor the borders on wednesday. Russian forces controlled the roads leading into crimea from ukraine, along with a fairy crossing. Border controls says 100 military trucks and launchers were set in. Secretary of state is set to meet foreign minister in london on friday. We will offer certain voices to foreign minister sergei lavrov, and to president putin, through him and to russia, with hopes and i think the hopes of the world. Well be able to find a way forward that diffuses this. The u. S. Has limited options, pressuring russian leader, compared to european allies. Europe has strong economic ties, and they go both ways. More than a quarter of europes natural gas comes from russia. The European Union acted cautiously but threatened the possibility of sanctions. For now the american strategy is to help the Ukrainian Government in ways symbolic and substantive, by pledging money sanctions. Besides loan guarantees and denunsiations is the u. S. Ready to back the government and strengthen ukraine. American leverage on this program. We wanted to begin with White House Correspondent mike viqueira. Privately and publicly is the white house talking as if they really believe that the situation that now exists in crimea can be rolled bark, that Vladimir Putin and his allies would leave it and it would we main part of ukraine. If we act on a carrot and stick approach, providing an offramp, sending the monitors in, the russians showed no interest. Talking about loan guarantees. Theres no guarantee that the congress will pass that. They are bogged down, a billion dollar package. The Senate Passed one. They disagreed with the structure of the i. M. F. Nothing is certain domentisticly here in the domestically here in the United States or internationally. Russia is part of the w. T. O. And we see an integration with russia and europe. We have been told russia is a tool, because no one will want to broach the economic ties or break them. Its a case where no one wants to break theme after one member country, because everyone is tied together to closely. We saw the same kind of hesitation with libya, action in syria before the guarantee of removl of chemical weapons, is collective action the only action or is a country like the United States ready to move on its own. Its an interesting question. We talk about a billion dollar loan package. United states has sent ukraine some 3 billion. It was seen as vital go politically. They have been trying to pry ukraine away from russias orbit. That illustrates why this is a controversy, a crisis over the last days. Ukraine is important. White house correspondent thanks a lot. We are going to take a short break. When we come back, well talk to experts about the way forward. In is inside story. My message to mr putin, tear down the walls. Lets talk. Lets calm down. Welcome back to inside story, im ray suarez. Ukrainian Prime MinisterArseniy Yatsenyuk wrapped up a meeting with president obama at the white house. You saw him there. As the United States pledges support for the new government in ukraine, it is pushing a diplomatic solution to the Russian Military action in crimea. On this edition of our program we discuss the american strategy, and the leverage the United States holds as we move board. Joining us now from new york thomas graham, special assistant to george w. Bush for russia from 2004 to 2007. Lien fine stephen, u. S. Ambassador poland to 2009 to 2012, and from london, a senior policy fellow for the European Council on foreign relations. Thomas graham, let me start with you. What american vital interests are at take, and how par is the United States willing to go to defend them. The vital stakes is one of world order. The question is whether another country should be able to use military force to seize territory of the state and annex it. It goes against principals guiding european security, global security, over the past decades if not longer. The United States wants to send a signal that there are rules that have to be honoured. If a section of a country wants to succeed, there are rules. That is not the case in the circumstances with the with crimea. When Vladimir Putin uses the camp of kosovo, prying itself away from serbia, is that a valid comparison to ukraine. I dont believe so. The situations are different. You will remember that in a case of kosovo. There were, in fact, negotiations that occurred over seven or eight years, but with the help of the u. N. , other organizations, and they went back and forth between the dont go to the cosmetics counter without me, and the serbs over resolutions of the differences between them. It was only when it became clear that there was no possible resolution that the raits or european allies backed the unilateral independence. This is different to the situation in crimea. This is different were there hasnt been a framework. Initially, its not been in this process, and when you look at the referendum, the thing that is disturbing is beyond the question of legality. You are talking about a weighty matter that has longterm economic and cultural consequences, geopolitical consequences. There has been no deliberate discussion of this before a decision is taken. The referendum on sunday, if it, indeed takes place is not going to be a considered voice of any set of people. Ambassador, you heard tom graham talk about how over the last decades you tried to knit companies into an disagrees alts agreements, covenants presenting this thing from happening. Dont countries that fancy themselves big powers reserve the right to act in their interests when they see fit. Isnt putin doing what pig power of the countries have done for a long time honour the agreements until you dont want to honour them any more. Look, its hard to know previously what Vladimir Putins motivations are. In his longterm interests, it would seem to have accomplished what to avoid, which is to unify a majority of the people in an orientation, in any case, towards the west and closer to europe. The key thing now is to reinforce the principles talked about. To be able to violate the principles without a strong response would be to create strong instability. You heard everything leading up to the conversation, from the White House Correspondent, and president obama. How far do europeans think america is willing to stick it neck out for the ukraine . Well, in europe theres a big debate going on as to what europe can do. Europe sees the seriousness of the situation. And there are many similar potential dangerous points in europe, that could see the president. Europe is trying to find its own way. Today in the media, the project of sanctions, no names yet, but it was it was tough by european standards. Doesnt mean it has the potential to reverse the situation on the ground. But i think europe has learned the lesson. Russia got away too easily after an incursion into georgia, and if it gets away again it faces grave consequences some years down the road. Mr ambassador, youll wonder when you hear Vladimir Putin and other members of the leadership speaking and youll here president obama today. Whether their positions now, this late into the crisis are so mutually excusive that someone will have to calm down. President obama has been firm and tough. And the meeting in the oeble office with the interim Prime Minister of ukraine sends a strong message of support for ukraine and the people of ukraine. At the same time the president said hes prepared to use sanctions. It was referred to as important because it shows the United States and europe were prepared to speak in one voice and act together. Everyone wants to avoid the circumstance, find an offramp and resolve the issue diplomatically. We talked about time. First of all, secretary kerry is meeting with the russian counterpart. We hope the referendum can by avoided. If it cant be therell be additional time for dip loam as which so long as its coupled by positions, by United States. Because russia has to take additional steps before any annexation of crimea into the russian frigs. President obama was sitting across from an interim ukranian Prime Minister. The welleducated talented tech no accurate. A guy that understands the financial system. He wouldnt have been sitting across from ukrainian leaders of similar talent. Does it weaken americas hand. Ukraine has been pretty badly run since the breakup of soviet union. The problem that the United States and europe faces is that ukraine at this point is pretty much a basket case economically and fiscally, and it needs a tremendous amount of monetary assistance in the first instance to deal with the problems. I think you put a finger on the broader issue. The elites that have spent much of their time in corrupt practices, stealing money from the state, not building the institutions of power that would make ukraine governable. In a sense we came to the crisis over the past three or four months for that reason. People did go out into the in the square initially because of Viktor Yanukovychs decision to back away from an agreement with the e. U. , but quickly, the protest moved beyond that to questions about the government, corruption and so forth. Viktor yanukovych fled, but ukraine is left with the same elite that has performed so poorly over the past 20 years. One of the questions going forward, one of the questions for the United States and our European Partners is what, if anything, we can do together to encourage the formation of a ukrainian ruling elite, governing elite that was the interests of its country ahead of their own personal interests. How do you answer that question . What can the United States and european part administers do for a country in a weakened state and financially weaker than it was when this started in the maydan three months ago. Yes, i think tom pointed out the right thing. Thats what ive been wondering about ukraine. They have fantastic people, wonderful people who have not managed to produce elite worthy of them. Now theres a strong determination to change your that and come up with economic policies et cetera. Wish for reform, is stronger than ever probably the first time seriously so. So i think what the United States and europe could do and should try to do is provide reasonable amount of security for that traps formation transformation to be able to take place. There is one danger ahead that i see. We have discussed Vladimir Putins motivation. I do not think Vladimir Putin went lightly. Vladimir putin, deep inside, is legalistic and in a peculiar way we wouldnt agree with him. Hes actually conservative and legalistic. To violate International Agreement must have been a big deal. I do not know what his planned end game is. I wonder if he wants to join crimea to russia. But he might back down, ask him to have leverage in the ukraine. Over ukraine political life, status in the world, membership of different organizations et cetera. Russia is unlikely to use that leverage for the purposes that would be combatable with ukraines good development. We are going to take a short broke. When we come back well talk about the new post cold war calculus whether a russian win in crimea is necessarily an american loss. This is inside story. Welcome back to inside story, im ray suarez. Sunday therell be a referendum for crimea. On sunday john kerry will be in london to meet with Russian Foreign minister sergei lavrov. There has been so much concentration in domestic political circles on president obamas alleged weakness, and Vladimir Putins alleged strength. With all the concentration on whether putin is winning in crimea, are we losing site of the fact that he lost in ukraine, that this action might be pushing ukraine into the arms of the west. I think its an excellent point. First of all, this is a very difficult crisis. And i think that president obama and secretary of state john kerry handled this well. Making it very, very clear that they are prepared to apply sanctions, already applying sanctions. While working with the europeans more reluctant to take the action that we get with the g7. I think the president has been very clear and made it clear that this is a no kidding situation. Yes, the calculation for Vladimir Putin is hard to imagine. The president ial election in ukraine is scheduled for the 25th. If crimea is not part of ukraine, and the russian speaking majority in crimea is not voting. And the outcome that Vladimir Putin would want to see or the influence in parliament is missing, its hard to see, as president obama said, this is as much a sign of Vladimir Putins overall weakness than it is anything else. Tom graham, do you believe that the United States administration used what they had available to it to their advantage. The point i make is Vladimir Putin will do what is best for the russian population, than it is for the United States. Technical difficulties snoop it is about the government in kiev, and they believe that the United States and europe at the end of the day will not make a decision to bring a ukraine state into the european institutions. Thats the outcome he would like, to keep ukraine in play. We have little time left, but i want to hear from you about the outcome of the referendum. Most of the relevant countries in the region, and across the world said they wont recognise the outcome of sundays welcome to ooilz. Im del walters. 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