that nfl teams or executives within those teams are racist is a generalization that will always be wrong because you can't just say that based on what history has shown us as far as hiring is concerned. and you know this, anderson, because i'm sure you studied it like everybody else. the rooney rule is not working for head coaches, but it is working for other parts of nfl hiring. a few years ago there was one black general manager in the national football league. now there are seven. and i think the process is working on the executive level. it still has a lot of work to do on the coaching level, but it's -- i think it's too harsh and too incendiary to say that just because there aren't enough black head coaches that teams in the league is racist in general. it's just too generalized. >> one of the points that kareem abdul-jabbar was making earlier was that he believes the nba over the last many years has done a much better job of increasing the level of diversity the higher you go in