this is a rare meeting that happened last week in moscow in the defense ministry. russia and the u.s. have had a deconflicts line when it comes to the ukrainian but hasn't been put to use aside from daily tests. so in-person meeting especially with the defense ministry in moscow is rare indeed. we got a read out of the impressions of the meeting, so only a partial view of what happened in there, not a complete picture but it's fascinating the meeting with russian major general who has dealt with americans before and known for being stoic, he brings notes and hits is talking points, and doesn't stray far from that, this time he did according to the read out. that's what makes this unusual, towards the end of the meeting, according to the read out, one of those in the meeting casually asked about the general's ukrainian background and that is where i want to bring up the graphic so you can get a sense how quickly it went sideways