Transcripts For CNNW At This Hour With Kate Bolduan 20170522

Committee for information about his contacts with russia. They had subpoenaed him. They wanted him to testify. A source close to him is telling manu raju that he does not flynn does not intend to comply with the request and would invoke his fifth amendment right against prosecution. Keep in mind, you know, for months, we have been talking about flynn and the scrutiny that hes been under by federal investigators, by the fbi, and recently prosecutors in the Eastern District of virginia have subpoenaed records of his business transactions before the campaign, before he joined President Trumps administration. So, all of this is ongoing, and the investigation into him, the criminal investigation is really in full swing and its still moving forward, so, its not unreasonable. A lot of us had thought this would happen. Just kind of surprising that it came so soon. And shimon, before i bring in paul on the legal side of this, can you lay out for us, because there are so many investigations. Obviously, congressional investigations on one side. But when youre looking into kind of the federal investigation and looking into kind of where the fbi is in terms of their investigation, how long its been going on, flynn has been at the center of much of this. Thats right. He really has been at the center. You know, as far as we know, since july, perhaps, even. Things didnt really start to escalate with the fbi and federal prosecutors until his conversations with kislyak, the russian ambassador, came to light and was revealed that he had lied to the Vice President about those conversations. The fbi has been spending months really looking at this whole thing, and recently prosecutors joined the investigation and grand jury subpoenas were issued. We know of at least one business whose records were subpoenaed, a request by the department of justice. They want to look at all of his different business dealings with the russians, some of which he never reported to u. S. Officials. And also, keep in mind there were some business dealings with turkey that theyre also looking at. I mean, theres a whole bunch of things. And also, as we reported on friday, theres all these communications that were going on during the campaign in russia about russian officials boasting how they can use flynn, bragging sort of, is what we were told by sources, how they can use flynn to try to infiltrate the campaign, use him to get to trump. All of this is part of the investigation, because i really think the fbi from what weve been told want to know, you know, what exactly was he involved in, what was his relationship with the russians, and if there was anything that was perhaps missed. And finally, if i could just say, a lot more is now known. You know, federal investigators know a lot more than they did six months ago because the investigation sort of has extended, has expanded, and theyve been able to get records, financial records, business records, look at some of the communications that he was having. So, there is a lot more on the federal investigation that is now known. And of course, all of this, shimon, this now falls under the purview, the responsibility of bob mueller as he takes over the investigation . Thats correct. Okay. So, bob mueller this is exactly it. He will look at some of this. You know, prosecutors in the Eastern District of virginia attached the National Security division have already been looking at this. Lots of subpoenas have been issued regarding this investigation. So, he will once he steps into this, he will be briefed on all of this, and he may say, hey, you know, this is bob mueller, we may need to go in this direction, we may have missed this, we now need to look at this. So, yeah, i mean, this is definitely, will be part of his investigation and part of what hes going to be looking at. A very important moment. Shimon, awesome job, as always. Thank you very much. And manu raju in his reporting always bringing it to us. Paul, let me bring you in. On the most basic level, because i know it can be complicated, what does pleading the fifth on the part of Michael Flynn mean right now . Well, it means that he cannot be compelled to testify under oath before a Senate Intelligence committee. He may sit in the chair. They probably could get him that far. Right. But then he will assert the fifth. They cannot compel him to give oral testimony. Now, this is a privilege that protects you from being forced to testify. Its not so clear that you can protect documents, personal documents that you may have. So, you may see a fight here as to whether or not the Senate Committee can force him to produce documents or whether they may be protected in some way by the fifth amendment as well. And thats an interesting distinction, because part of manu rajus reporting is that the Intelligence Committee had asked him to produce all records of his communications with russian officials by this wednesday and that he was expected to, it appears, at least, from what were seeing right now, hes not going to comply with that. Hes not. And his lawyer this gets into the weeds a bit, but the courts have held that the act of producing the document might, in fact, be incriminatory, as opposed to whats the content of the document, so thats where theyll be having a fight. So, paul, as shimon laid out, how many investigations are under way and that now you have bob mueller coming in and he could change the direction of things, and hes about to really get his hands on this. As legal counsel, as an attorney, would you advise your client to do exactly what Michael Flynn did, plead the fifth, when youre facing this many investigations and what youre doing . I would say probably yes, that would be the advice that i would give him, but his counsel knows one thing that i dont know, and that is, is he really guilty of some kind of criminal offense . Now, clearly, if he is guilty of a criminal offense, hes going to plead the fifth and try to impede the investigations. And of course, we go to an old precedent here, the oliver north case in the iran contra investigation. Paul, just pause one second. Im going to jump in for a second. Were seeing right now President Trump sitting down with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of israel. Lets listen in. Amazing two days and their feeling toward israel is really very positive. Tremendous progress has been made. I think a lot of that progress has been made because of the aggression of iran, and its forcing people together in a very positive way. And if you look at bin salman and saudi arabia and others that i was with [ inaudible ] so many others. It was very historic what took place over the last two days. But i can see a much deeper path to friendship with israel, and i think a lot of thats spurred on by whatever it takes, but a lot of its spurred on by iran. I think the fact that youve taken a very strong position on iran, a different position, not only helps security, but also helps repel the possibility of reconciliation of peace between israel and [ inaudible ] and that will help reconciliation for israel and the palestinians. Of course, not all [ inaudible ] but i do look forward to our discussio discussions. [ inaudible ] with iran, iran should be very grateful to the United States, because iran negotiated a fantastic deal with the previous administration, a deal that is unbelievable from standpoint. Some people dont understand even how he even thought of it. And instead of being thankful and saying thank you, because they were in serious trouble, i think they would have failed, totally failed within six months. We gave them a lifeline, and we not only gave them a lifeline, we gave them wealth and prosperity. And we also gave them an ability to continue with terror and with all of the things theyve been doing, because no matter where we go, we see the signs of iran in the middle east. Everywhere. No matter where we go, whether its syria, where were forced to shoot the missiles. No matter what area were in, we see yemen, iraq no matter where we are, we see the signs, every sign, whether its soldiers, whether its money and guns, its around. And instead of saying thank you to the United States, they now feel emboldened. Maybe they figure the deal was so good, we can do another round. They cant do it, believe me. But it was a terrible thing for the United States to enter that deal, and believe me, iran will never have a Nuclear Weapon. That i can tell you. Thank you, press corps thank you just so you understand, i never mentioned the word or the name israel. Never mentioned it during our conversation. So, you had another story wrong. Never mentioned the word israel. How is the visit so far . Intelligence thank you. Lets go. Please, everyone. Lets go, out, lets go. All the press, lets go. All right, a fascinating we call them a pool spray at the top of a bilateral meeting between these two World Leaders, President Trump and israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Theyre going to be sitting down for their bilateral meeting, very much looking forward to and expecting full joint statement from the two men after the meeting. That was just the pool spray going in. The president and the Prime Minister spending the bulk of the time taking aim at iran and the iran nuclear deal. The president saying, as we have heard him say, iran will never have a Nuclear Weapon while i am president. I want to go right now to jerusalem. Cnn White House Correspondent sara murray is there. Shes been traveling with the president. Sara, i dont know from your perspective, the audio was a little rough at parts, so it might have been a little tough to hear pieces of that, but at the very end, the president , he kind of stopped the media, waiting for everyone to kind of calm down so he could make one more statement, and he said, i want to make sure you know, i never mentioned the word or the name israel. That has to do with the, i guess we have to assume that that has to do with the meeting that the president had with russian officials in the oval office . Reporter i have to imagine that was the context there and that those were the questions being asked of him. Obviously, well wait to turn that tape around and listen to it a little bit more closely. But this is, you know, one of the sort of awkward undercurrents of these meetings here, the fact that President Donald Trump shared highly classified information with russian officials in that meeting they had together in the oval office and that that information came from one of our allies, israel. Now, if you look back at the reporting of that, the reporting never says that in that meeting trump says, oh, we got this information from our friend, israel, but it basically says, look, its not very hard to figure out where this information came from, as evidenced by the fact that a number of news organizations, including sources telling cnn that israel was the intelligencesharing partner that that came from. So, thats sort of one of the awkward backdrops playing out here. I think that you will still see President Trump and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu after this meeting give more remarks saying that it went very well. I think theyll turn the conversation back to the notion of mideast peace. We saw President Trump there essentially saying he feels optimistic about this because israel and the palestinians have a common enemy, which is iran. You know, when you were talking to experts leading up to these meetings, they basically said all sides of this want to have good meetings. President trump wants good meetings. Prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu and president abbas of the palestinian authority, all of them want good meetings, and so they are going to come out of this saying that everything went well and everything is moving in the right direction. None of these leaders want to be on President Trumps bad side at this juncture so early in his presidency, but it will be very fascinating to see if the president and the israeli Prime Minister have more to say on this this evening. On many of the key issues that key sounds even small when you talk about key issues that have been standing in the way of mideast peace for so long. It will be fascinating to hear what both the president and the Prime Minister have to say when they come out of this bilateral meeting. Well get back to you, sara. Saras in jerusalem. A beautiful backdrop there behind sara. I want to discuss what we just heard from the president and the Prime Minister and also what were expecting coming out of this very important meeting between the United States president and a key ally. With me now is cnn Global Affairs analyst whos advised democratic and republican administrations on middle east and mideast peace, Aaron David Miller is here. And cnn chief international correspondent, host of amanpour, christiane amanpour. Christiane, before we get to what were expecting when they come out of this meeting, i want your take on kind of what we just heard and saw there, that moment when President Trump took, wanted to take care to make sure everyone understood, he said, i never said the words, said the name israel, which we, again, are just assuming that the context is when he, as reports are, shared highly classified intelligence with russian officials in the oval office. Yes, well, its just piling more words on and making it more and more of a story, where as you know, the israeli officials have been studiously quiet about this. They have refused to talk about it ever since the story broke. Obviously, former mossad and other intelligence and other Security Officials have been quoted as saying that this talk in the oval office to the russians could probably put the damper and should put the damper on israel sharing very Sensitive Information with the United States. So, there is a big debate in israel over this, but the Prime Minister, his cabinet and the government have said absolutely zip about it because they dont want to talk about it and make it more of a deal than it is. Now, on the other issue that he said, and he went over and over, we will not allow iran to have a Nuclear Weapon on my watch. Yes. Essentially, every president has said that. That is standard american policy, that the United States will not allow iran to develop a Nuclear Weapon. Hence, the nuclear deal. And although President Trump spent a lot of time there criticizing the deal and playing into what obviously is the israeli position, the saudi and the other persian gulf states position that the deal is bad, the fact is that President Trump has, in fact, continued to honor it. The state department signed iran off as having abided by it, as they do every six months, and the United States has not put any more, you know, reimposed nuclearrelated sanctions on iran. So, thats where it stands right now. And also an Important Note as we started this conversation about israel being the source of the intelligence that the president shared with russian officials in the oval office, it is just taking a moment to, now that im thinking it through President Trump, as sara well pointed out there was never any reporting that the president actually said israel. The reporting was that h. R. Mcmaster came out and said in the reporters room that the president wasnt even briefed on the source of the intelligence, that he wasnt aware of the source of the intelligence. So thats an important bit of context when you hear what the president says there. But aaron, let me bring you in on this. On this note, when it comes to this kind of sticky, awkward moment now that has become a wrinkle in this trip, as of course, theyre talking about iran, theyre talking about their shared goal of mideast peace, but this wrinkle with regard to sharing intelligence that was shared first by israel to the United States, the secretary of state, Rex Tillerson, was asked if the president would offer an apology behind closed doors with regard to that, and secretary tillerson said this morning that there is nothing to apologize for. It kind of seems that might be the case when you see the body language between the two men there, right . The president actually may, given the sensitivity of the information, want to make some amends to the Prime Minister if its four eyes. If it goes beyond that with no takers, im not so sure. Theres a lot of broken crockery among professional Israeli Military and intelligence officials over this, but on the political level, theres absolutely no doubt that both netanyahu and trump have no desire to make an issue of this. In fact, the president may well believe that a beleaguered Prime Minister may believe that a beleaguered president at home may need his help, and i suspect hes prepared to give Eastern District<\/a> of virginia have subpoenaed records of his business transactions before the campaign, before he joined President Trump<\/a>s administration. So, all of this is ongoing, and the investigation into him, the criminal investigation is really in full swing and its still moving forward, so, its not unreasonable. A lot of us had thought this would happen. Just kind of surprising that it came so soon. And shimon, before i bring in paul on the legal side of this, can you lay out for us, because there are so many investigations. Obviously, congressional investigations on one side. But when youre looking into kind of the federal investigation and looking into kind of where the fbi is in terms of their investigation, how long its been going on, flynn has been at the center of much of this. Thats right. He really has been at the center. You know, as far as we know, since july, perhaps, even. Things didnt really start to escalate with the fbi and federal prosecutors until his conversations with kislyak, the russian ambassador, came to light and was revealed that he had lied to the Vice President<\/a> about those conversations. The fbi has been spending months really looking at this whole thing, and recently prosecutors joined the investigation and grand jury subpoenas were issued. We know of at least one business whose records were subpoenaed, a request by the department of justice. They want to look at all of his different business dealings with the russians, some of which he never reported to u. S. Officials. And also, keep in mind there were some business dealings with turkey that theyre also looking at. I mean, theres a whole bunch of things. And also, as we reported on friday, theres all these communications that were going on during the campaign in russia about russian officials boasting how they can use flynn, bragging sort of, is what we were told by sources, how they can use flynn to try to infiltrate the campaign, use him to get to trump. All of this is part of the investigation, because i really think the fbi from what weve been told want to know, you know, what exactly was he involved in, what was his relationship with the russians, and if there was anything that was perhaps missed. And finally, if i could just say, a lot more is now known. You know, federal investigators know a lot more than they did six months ago because the investigation sort of has extended, has expanded, and theyve been able to get records, financial records, business records, look at some of the communications that he was having. So, there is a lot more on the federal investigation that is now known. And of course, all of this, shimon, this now falls under the purview, the responsibility of bob mueller as he takes over the investigation . Thats correct. Okay. So, bob mueller this is exactly it. He will look at some of this. You know, prosecutors in the Eastern District<\/a> of virginia attached the National Security<\/a> division have already been looking at this. Lots of subpoenas have been issued regarding this investigation. So, he will once he steps into this, he will be briefed on all of this, and he may say, hey, you know, this is bob mueller, we may need to go in this direction, we may have missed this, we now need to look at this. So, yeah, i mean, this is definitely, will be part of his investigation and part of what hes going to be looking at. A very important moment. Shimon, awesome job, as always. Thank you very much. And manu raju in his reporting always bringing it to us. Paul, let me bring you in. On the most basic level, because i know it can be complicated, what does pleading the fifth on the part of Michael Flynn<\/a> mean right now . Well, it means that he cannot be compelled to testify under oath before a Senate Intelligence<\/a> committee. He may sit in the chair. They probably could get him that far. Right. But then he will assert the fifth. They cannot compel him to give oral testimony. Now, this is a privilege that protects you from being forced to testify. Its not so clear that you can protect documents, personal documents that you may have. So, you may see a fight here as to whether or not the Senate Committee<\/a> can force him to produce documents or whether they may be protected in some way by the fifth amendment as well. And thats an interesting distinction, because part of manu rajus reporting is that the Intelligence Committee<\/a> had asked him to produce all records of his communications with russian officials by this wednesday and that he was expected to, it appears, at least, from what were seeing right now, hes not going to comply with that. Hes not. And his lawyer this gets into the weeds a bit, but the courts have held that the act of producing the document might, in fact, be incriminatory, as opposed to whats the content of the document, so thats where theyll be having a fight. So, paul, as shimon laid out, how many investigations are under way and that now you have bob mueller coming in and he could change the direction of things, and hes about to really get his hands on this. As legal counsel, as an attorney, would you advise your client to do exactly what Michael Flynn<\/a> did, plead the fifth, when youre facing this many investigations and what youre doing . I would say probably yes, that would be the advice that i would give him, but his counsel knows one thing that i dont know, and that is, is he really guilty of some kind of criminal offense . Now, clearly, if he is guilty of a criminal offense, hes going to plead the fifth and try to impede the investigations. And of course, we go to an old precedent here, the oliver north case in the iran contra investigation. Paul, just pause one second. Im going to jump in for a second. Were seeing right now President Trump<\/a> sitting down with Prime Minister<\/a> Benjamin Netanyahu<\/a> of israel. Lets listen in. Amazing two days and their feeling toward israel is really very positive. Tremendous progress has been made. I think a lot of that progress has been made because of the aggression of iran, and its forcing people together in a very positive way. And if you look at bin salman and saudi arabia and others that i was with [ inaudible ] so many others. It was very historic what took place over the last two days. But i can see a much deeper path to friendship with israel, and i think a lot of thats spurred on by whatever it takes, but a lot of its spurred on by iran. I think the fact that youve taken a very strong position on iran, a different position, not only helps security, but also helps repel the possibility of reconciliation of peace between israel and [ inaudible ] and that will help reconciliation for israel and the palestinians. Of course, not all [ inaudible ] but i do look forward to our discussio discussions. [ inaudible ] with iran, iran should be very grateful to the United States<\/a>, because iran negotiated a fantastic deal with the previous administration, a deal that is unbelievable from standpoint. Some people dont understand even how he even thought of it. And instead of being thankful and saying thank you, because they were in serious trouble, i think they would have failed, totally failed within six months. We gave them a lifeline, and we not only gave them a lifeline, we gave them wealth and prosperity. And we also gave them an ability to continue with terror and with all of the things theyve been doing, because no matter where we go, we see the signs of iran in the middle east. Everywhere. No matter where we go, whether its syria, where were forced to shoot the missiles. No matter what area were in, we see yemen, iraq no matter where we are, we see the signs, every sign, whether its soldiers, whether its money and guns, its around. And instead of saying thank you to the United States<\/a>, they now feel emboldened. Maybe they figure the deal was so good, we can do another round. They cant do it, believe me. But it was a terrible thing for the United States<\/a> to enter that deal, and believe me, iran will never have a Nuclear Weapon<\/a>. That i can tell you. Thank you, press corps thank you just so you understand, i never mentioned the word or the name israel. Never mentioned it during our conversation. So, you had another story wrong. Never mentioned the word israel. How is the visit so far . Intelligence thank you. Lets go. Please, everyone. Lets go, out, lets go. All the press, lets go. All right, a fascinating we call them a pool spray at the top of a bilateral meeting between these two World Leaders<\/a>, President Trump<\/a> and israeli Prime Minister<\/a> Benjamin Netanyahu<\/a>. Theyre going to be sitting down for their bilateral meeting, very much looking forward to and expecting full joint statement from the two men after the meeting. That was just the pool spray going in. The president and the Prime Minister<\/a> spending the bulk of the time taking aim at iran and the iran nuclear deal. The president saying, as we have heard him say, iran will never have a Nuclear Weapon<\/a> while i am president. I want to go right now to jerusalem. Cnn White House Correspondent<\/a> sara murray is there. Shes been traveling with the president. Sara, i dont know from your perspective, the audio was a little rough at parts, so it might have been a little tough to hear pieces of that, but at the very end, the president , he kind of stopped the media, waiting for everyone to kind of calm down so he could make one more statement, and he said, i want to make sure you know, i never mentioned the word or the name israel. That has to do with the, i guess we have to assume that that has to do with the meeting that the president had with russian officials in the oval office . Reporter i have to imagine that was the context there and that those were the questions being asked of him. Obviously, well wait to turn that tape around and listen to it a little bit more closely. But this is, you know, one of the sort of awkward undercurrents of these meetings here, the fact that President Donald Trump<\/a> shared highly classified information with russian officials in that meeting they had together in the oval office and that that information came from one of our allies, israel. Now, if you look back at the reporting of that, the reporting never says that in that meeting trump says, oh, we got this information from our friend, israel, but it basically says, look, its not very hard to figure out where this information came from, as evidenced by the fact that a number of news organizations, including sources telling cnn that israel was the intelligencesharing partner that that came from. So, thats sort of one of the awkward backdrops playing out here. I think that you will still see President Trump<\/a> and Prime Minister<\/a> Benjamin Netanyahu<\/a> after this meeting give more remarks saying that it went very well. I think theyll turn the conversation back to the notion of mideast peace. We saw President Trump<\/a> there essentially saying he feels optimistic about this because israel and the palestinians have a common enemy, which is iran. You know, when you were talking to experts leading up to these meetings, they basically said all sides of this want to have good meetings. President trump wants good meetings. Prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu<\/a> and president abbas of the palestinian authority, all of them want good meetings, and so they are going to come out of this saying that everything went well and everything is moving in the right direction. None of these leaders want to be on President Trump<\/a>s bad side at this juncture so early in his presidency, but it will be very fascinating to see if the president and the israeli Prime Minister<\/a> have more to say on this this evening. On many of the key issues that key sounds even small when you talk about key issues that have been standing in the way of mideast peace for so long. It will be fascinating to hear what both the president and the Prime Minister<\/a> have to say when they come out of this bilateral meeting. Well get back to you, sara. Saras in jerusalem. A beautiful backdrop there behind sara. I want to discuss what we just heard from the president and the Prime Minister<\/a> and also what were expecting coming out of this very important meeting between the United States<\/a> president and a key ally. With me now is cnn Global Affairs<\/a> analyst whos advised democratic and republican administrations on middle east and mideast peace, Aaron David Miller<\/a> is here. And cnn chief international correspondent, host of amanpour, christiane amanpour. Christiane, before we get to what were expecting when they come out of this meeting, i want your take on kind of what we just heard and saw there, that moment when President Trump<\/a> took, wanted to take care to make sure everyone understood, he said, i never said the words, said the name israel, which we, again, are just assuming that the context is when he, as reports are, shared highly classified intelligence with russian officials in the oval office. Yes, well, its just piling more words on and making it more and more of a story, where as you know, the israeli officials have been studiously quiet about this. They have refused to talk about it ever since the story broke. Obviously, former mossad and other intelligence and other Security Officials<\/a> have been quoted as saying that this talk in the oval office to the russians could probably put the damper and should put the damper on israel sharing very Sensitive Information<\/a> with the United States<\/a>. So, there is a big debate in israel over this, but the Prime Minister<\/a>, his cabinet and the government have said absolutely zip about it because they dont want to talk about it and make it more of a deal than it is. Now, on the other issue that he said, and he went over and over, we will not allow iran to have a Nuclear Weapon<\/a> on my watch. Yes. Essentially, every president has said that. That is standard american policy, that the United States<\/a> will not allow iran to develop a Nuclear Weapon<\/a>. Hence, the nuclear deal. And although President Trump<\/a> spent a lot of time there criticizing the deal and playing into what obviously is the israeli position, the saudi and the other persian gulf states position that the deal is bad, the fact is that President Trump<\/a> has, in fact, continued to honor it. The state department signed iran off as having abided by it, as they do every six months, and the United States<\/a> has not put any more, you know, reimposed nuclearrelated sanctions on iran. So, thats where it stands right now. And also an Important Note<\/a> as we started this conversation about israel being the source of the intelligence that the president shared with russian officials in the oval office, it is just taking a moment to, now that im thinking it through President Trump<\/a>, as sara well pointed out there was never any reporting that the president actually said israel. The reporting was that h. R. Mcmaster came out and said in the reporters room that the president wasnt even briefed on the source of the intelligence, that he wasnt aware of the source of the intelligence. So thats an important bit of context when you hear what the president says there. But aaron, let me bring you in on this. On this note, when it comes to this kind of sticky, awkward moment now that has become a wrinkle in this trip, as of course, theyre talking about iran, theyre talking about their shared goal of mideast peace, but this wrinkle with regard to sharing intelligence that was shared first by israel to the United States<\/a>, the secretary of state, Rex Tillerson<\/a>, was asked if the president would offer an apology behind closed doors with regard to that, and secretary tillerson said this morning that there is nothing to apologize for. It kind of seems that might be the case when you see the body language between the two men there, right . The president actually may, given the sensitivity of the information, want to make some amends to the Prime Minister<\/a> if its four eyes. If it goes beyond that with no takers, im not so sure. Theres a lot of broken crockery among professional Israeli Military<\/a> and intelligence officials over this, but on the political level, theres absolutely no doubt that both netanyahu and trump have no desire to make an issue of this. In fact, the president may well believe that a beleaguered Prime Minister<\/a> may believe that a beleaguered president at home may need his help, and i suspect hes prepared to give President Trump<\/a> the benefit of the doubt on the israeli intel matter. One additional point. You know, rightminded president s do not go to the middle east during their first forays abroad for one simple reason, because the middle east is usually a place, a region where American Dreams<\/a> and schemes and ambitions come to die. And the fact that this president decided to choose saudi arabia and israel as his first two stops i think is a testament to the fact that he absolutely believes and hes been right so far in what has proven to be an extraordinarily wellscripted trip, in riyadh and so far from what ive seen, and jerusalem, believes rightly that hes going to get an enormous amount of positive attention and perhaps make some progress. Well, on the progress or on the historymaking front, christiane, we now see that the president , those images that i hope we can show our viewers once again of him going to the western wall, if you would believe hes the first sitting u. S. President to visit the western wall. Why do you think he was the first . I saw this moment and it made me wonder, why didnt obama do it . Why didnt bush do it . Well, certainly, obama did it before he was a president as a senator, but it makes more of a statement, you know . It certainly does, and the president has made a statement. But to be honest with you, these are very important pictures, if you like, and aaron will know this much better than myself, very important symbolism. Its important what the president did today at the western wall. But the real issue is not that. The real issue is can he deliver what he has said in public to make the ultimate deal . He has gone to the middle east, raising massive hopes that he will bring peace, because hes the dealmaker that no other president could do, actually. You know, the actual parameters were laid down when aaron was there helping president clinton, and those are the parameters that still exist. And in fact, a previous israeli Prime Minister<\/a>, ehud barak, laid down his parameters and said that he would be willing to even share jerusalem. There all the work has been done towards a Peace Process<\/a>. The question is, can an american president get both the israeli Prime Minister<\/a> and the Palestinian Leader<\/a> to make, im afraid that hackneyed phrase, the incredibly hard and brave choices for peace and compromise . And as yet it hasnt happened. There are lots and lots of complications, not least the palestinians, which are embroiled with a whole hamas side of the equation, and the israelis that are going further and further to the right. Bibi netanyahus government is a very far right government. Its Coalition Allies<\/a> are far right. Since President Trump<\/a> has been elected, the government in israel has simply put more and more settlements into the occupied territories. That makes it more difficult. And we know what the parameters of peace are if its going to be a twostate solution land for peace. Its there. The arabs did it. King abdullah laid out in 2002 the arab peace plan. Thats why on the most basic level, aaron, i do wonder, have you yet seen a strategy emerge from the Trump Administration<\/a> side of how they plan to take it any step further, how they plan to reignite these peace talks and get one foot ahead of the other . Right. Its clear they believe deeply in this notion of outsidein, that in fact, the gulf arabs in particular can play a facilitative role in exchange for certain israeli concessions to palestinians and the resumption of a process. The gulf states will take certain steps telecommunications, overflight rights, perhaps expansion of commercial interests. And the reality is, and i think christiane has laid it out extremely well, the reality is that there may well be an opportunity, if aspirations are kept in check, to begin a process, but ill be unmistakably clear, and i wish this administration all the luck in the world in trying to broker this deal, but if were talking about an ultimate deal, a conflictending agreement between israelis and palestinians that resolves border security, refugees, jerusalem, recognition of israel as the nation state of the jewish people and end of claims and conflict if that is what were talking about, not only have i not seen a shred of empirical evidence that that right now is possible, unless abbas and netanyahu are prepared to make the kinds of decisions required, chances of that happening, frankly, are slim to none. And so when the president comments very recently, saying that mideast peace is something that, frankly, may be not as difficult as people have thought over the years, he might be thinking very differently once he leaves once he leaves the middle east and israel. We have to loeave it there righ now because were waiting to see what comments come from the joint statement when the two leaders emerge from their bilateral meeting. Thank you both. Continuing to follow more of our breaking news, the president s fired National Security<\/a> adviser, Michael Flynn<\/a>, now saying he will plead the fifth, not testify for the Senate Intelligence<\/a> committee as they have issued a subpoena for his records. What does this all mean now for the investigation . Plus, the white house is trying to defend the president calling fired fbi director james comey a nut job, saying that it takes the pressure off the russia investigation. So, what is the administrations defense on this one and are members of the president s own party buying it . Well be right back. The best simple veggie dish ever . Heart healthy california walnuts. The best simple dinner ever . Heart healthy california walnuts. Great tasting, heart healthy california walnuts. So simple. Get the recipes at walnuts. Org. Where are mom and dad . saved money on motorcycle insurance with geico goin up the country. Love mom and dad im takin a nap. Dude, you just woke up im goin up the country, baby dont you wanna go . Im goin up the country, baby dont you wanna go . Geico motorcycle, great rates for great rides. We believe in food thats anaturally beautiful, fresh and nutritious. So there are no artificial colors, no artificial flavors, no artificial preservatives in any of the food we sell. We believe in real food. Whole foods market. Manaits a series of is nsmart choices. And when you replace one meal or snack a day with glucerna made with carbsteady to help minimize blood sugar spikes you can really feel it. Glucerna. Everyday progress. President trump is overseas on his first trip abroad, but the hits keep coming at home in the investigation into the Trump Campaign<\/a>s ties to russia. Michael flynn is expected now to invoke his fifth amendment rights and deny the senates subpoena to testify and to produce documents regarding his communications with russian officials that they had requested. Well, now a new date to put on the calendar for you all. Former fbi director james comey, his first public comments, testimony in a public hearing before congress, that is expected to come after memorial day. So, this is all in the wake of a New York Times<\/a> report that President Trump<\/a> told Russian Diplomats<\/a> that james comey was a nut job and that firing james comey would relieve great pressure. With me now is thomas ricks. Hes been covering the u. S. Military International Affairs<\/a> for decades and his new book Churchill Orwell<\/a> the fight for freedom comes out tomorrow. Thomas, great to have you with me. Thanks for coming in. Youre welcome. On this breaking news from the top of the hour, kind of adding a new wrinkle to the investigation into russias meddling in the election and Trump Campaign<\/a>s ties to russia, this subpoena, Michael Flynn<\/a> denying the subpoena by the Senate Intelligence<\/a> committee, now pleading the fifth, what do you make of this . I think ultimately general flynn is going to be seen as a side character, not a central figure in the troubles the white house has. I think he doesnt want to go to jail, but i dont think he has that much to trade with prosecutors. He really was never on the inside on the russia stuff. He saw putin, he dealt a bit with the russians during the transition, but i think the trump russia connections precede flynns presence around trump by years evened a decade or so. But then, you know, after those interactions, right, hes hired as the president s National Security<\/a> adviser. Yeah. I mean, its significant that he was the president s National Security<\/a> adviser, that he was under investigation, that he seems to have misled people. And you can kind of smell obstruction of Justice Charges<\/a> down the road. Nonetheless, he is a kind of a naive guy, and i think not really a central figure in the deep troubles, i think, that the Trump Administration<\/a> has about ties to russia. So, what do you make of also this latest reporting coming from the New York Times<\/a> that President Trump<\/a> called james comey a nut job, according to the times, and then also said that he faced great pressure because of russia and with that firing, thats taken off . A lot of interpretation of these words, right, since this has come out . Do you think this is maybe a simple negotiating tactic or another very damaging leak . I think it was Wishful Thinking<\/a> on the part of President Trump<\/a> that he is going to get out of the russia problems that easily. I think these russia problems are deeper than people understand, and i think what ultimately comes out will be far worse than anything we know now. Heres how both secretary of state Rex Tillerson<\/a> and also the president s current National Security<\/a> adviser, h. R. Mcmaster, how they explained this. They did not deny this report, but this is how they explained it over the weekend. Listen to this, thomas. I think what the president was trying to convey to the russians was, look, im not going to be distracted by all these issues that are here at home that affect us domestically. Im not going to let that distract from our efforts to see if we can engage with you, engage with russia. Gist of the conversation was that the president feels as if hes hamstrung in his ability to work with russia to find areas of cooperation because this has been obviously so much in the news. And that was the intention of that portion of the conversation. Again, neither of them are denying that the nut job exchange took place, but im struggling with this one. When you hear that, are they saying the same thing . How exactly are they explaining it . I think theyre both whistling past the graveyard in their own ways. Tillerson really i think seems to not understand what his job is. Mcmaster seems to interpret his job as National Security<\/a> adviser, is also speaking on behalf of the president because the president s own spokesman, sean spicer, has no credibility anymore, so mcmaster is up there expending a little bit of his own hardwon credibility. Ive known h. R. Mcmaster for a long time. Yeah. Since he was a major. I wonder how long hes going to get up there and defend the president on camera in a way that amounts to quibbling. And quibbling is a military term for appearing to speak the truth while not really speaking the truth. Remember here that h. R. Mcmaster has remained on active duty as a general. He has not retired from the army. And he remains subject to the uniform code of military justice. That makes what he does a little bit more difficult than it would be for the average washington bureaucrat who gets a job like National Security<\/a> adviser. So, thomas, are you saying that you see h. R. Mcmaster leaving the job . I think i saw h. R. Mcmaster sell a little bit of his soul over the last ten days or so. Ooh. And he is a man of great soul. When you talk to him and he gets emotional, his voice thickens, his shoulders roll. Unlike david petraeus, who kind of always presented a hard, shiny facade, h. R. Mcmaster is a very sort of emotional guy. I think he must feel under enormous pressure, and i think he must be staying in the job so they dont get some bannonite to replace him, some yahoo from that side of the Trump Administration<\/a>. So, i think hes doing the country a good duty by staying on as National Security<\/a> adviser. But you can see these peoples souls leaving them the longer theyre into these difficult jobs. I dont think that Kellyanne Conway<\/a> or sean spicer has much soul left. Well, i mean, i appreciate your commentary, but i can assure you that, i would assume h. R. Mcmaster, Kellyanne Conway<\/a> and sean spicer would take exception to that description, but i will ask for them to come on so we can continue that kind of a conversation, though, but thank you so much, thomas, for coming on. I appreciate it. Youre welcome. Coming up, more on our breaking news. An awkward moment as the president and israeli Prime Minister<\/a> as the president and the israeli Prime Minister<\/a> face the media. President trump commenting on the reports that he revealed classified information to russian officials inside the oval office. Well have much more on this coming up. Thanks for the ride around norfolk and i just wanted to say, geico is proud to have served the military for over 75 years roger that. Captains waiting to give you a tour of the wisconsin now. Couldve parked a little bit closer. Its gonna be dark by the time i get there. Geico\u00ae. Proudly serving the military for over 75 years. Ready or not, here i come. Ek. anyone can dream. Making it a reality is the hard part. Northrop grumman command and control systems always let you see the complete picture. And were looking for a few dreamers to join us. Some republicans are now publicly creating some distance with President Trump<\/a> over the constant cycle of crisis over the russia investigation. Republicans latest fears come as special counsel robert mueller, he begins his investigation into the Trump Campaign<\/a> and takes over the investigation. Take a listen here to marco rubio, senator marco rubio on cnns state of the union. If any president tries to impede an investigation, any president , no matter who it is, by interfering with the fbi, yes, that would be problematic. It would be not just problematic, it would be, you know, obviously, a potential obstruction of justice. And Rick Santorum<\/a> here saying he could see republicans breaking from trump. Unlike democrats, who will never break with a president , no matter what they do i mean, i dont care, you can find them with a smoking gun and a picture, they wouldnt break with him. Republicans will. And so, i would say this to President Trump<\/a> this cant continue for a whole lot longer. With me now, the panel today, angela rye is here, cnn political commentator. David drucker, cnn political analyst and senior Congressional Correspondent<\/a> for the Washington Examiner<\/a> and paris dennard, cnn political commentator and former director of black outrage for the george w. Bush white house. David, youve been doing some reporting on this. How real is the fear, trepidation or fear right now amongst republicans with whats going on with the president . I think theyre very concerned and i think theyre frustrated. And i think the way to look at this is to understand that theyve seen President Trump<\/a> survive a lot of scandals or a lot of, lets just say challenges. Yeah, sure. That would have felled a more conventional politician. And so, theyve learned to roll with it and theyve learned to expect that what would kill them wont kill him. But i think over the past couple of weeks theyve reached a point where they no longer have patience for his unusual way of conducting himself from time to time, and they think that this is the kind of behavior and the kind of problem when you wrap up comey with the meeting with the russians in the oval office and so on down the line, that could really cause him problems that he cant get out of and them problems that they cant get out of. They were initially pleased to see the Mueller Appointment<\/a> because they thought, all right, people will stop asking us about this, mueller will take the investigation and we can move on. And now what theyre worried about is you never know where a special counsel investigation goes, and this could lap right in their lap right before the 2018 elections. Be careful what you ask for paris, the russia investigation so clearly is not going away. From your perspective, what do you think the president can do in the meantime as the Investigation Continues<\/a> to unfold to try and reassure republicans . I think the president needs to do exactly what hes doing, and that is having a successful foreign trip that for all intents and purposes, the trip to saudi arabia was a success. Former congressman jane harman said so, a democrat. And many others have praised that trip. Hes going over right now as weve seen the images coming across cnn in israel, and these are tough things that hes doing. He could have just gone, it would be easy to go to canada and mexico, but he goes to the middle east, israel as well as the vatican, the three major religious centers in the world. And so, he needs to focus on that, focus on trying to broker peace, trying to eliminate isis. And then when he comes back, focus in on the budget, focus on things that are positive that can be wins for him. The president is a winner, and he wants to have wins. He just needs to focus on his agenda, stay on message, and not be, you know, sidetracked by this russia investigation which a lot of it is just perpetuated by the media. The American People<\/a> are looking for him to be a leader. I mean, come on. Come on, paris. Perpetuated by the media . We just have news that Michael Flynn<\/a> is going to plead the fifth. Thats not perpetuated by the media. Thats reporting the news. And we could also report on other things in the news, like the positive things that are going on in saudi arabia that the president has done. There was extensive coverage of this, paris. Lets not get into like editorial judgment on the rundown of my show at this very moment. No, no, im not talking about editorial judgment. What im saying is the American People<\/a> are looking for this president to stay on message and for us to highlight the things that are positive. That is how he can win over the confidence of the republicans that are running for congress in 2018, because they know that this negative Media Coverage<\/a> 24 7 news cycle is not going to help them in the long run, so he has to stay on message and stay focused on the positive things, and hopefully, those things will be reported. Angela, whats your take on this . So, a couple of things. One is i dont think that the American People<\/a> are looking for donald trump to stay on message, paris. I think you corrected yourself later and said that is the hope of folks on the republican side of the house who are running for congressional seats in 2018. But i think right now, the American People<\/a> are looking for an opportunity to get to the bottom of everything russiagate. If you look at polling numbers, they indicate very clearly that most americans do not approve of how donald trump is handling this scandal. If you look at the numbers of even white men who supported him in the election, theyre actually very frustrated with how hes handling this overall and his job writ large. If were talking about this latest trip, and were going to start calling this success, what i think in the back of my mind is something, paris, you know very well, which is that big Mission Accomplished<\/a> sign behind president george w. Bush when he was president. Theres no mission and theres no accomplishment now for donald trump. Theyre somewhere in between. I think donald trump, in his defense, theres no Mission Accomplished<\/a> banner behind him so far. So, what im saying is it is a figurative banner that paris just painted. Im not saying thats a real thing. Im actually saying its a fake thing. So, theres fake news coming from the mouth of my good friend, paris. Theres no fake news happening on this show, though. And my whole point is this, the only person who can steal Donald Trumps<\/a> thunder on his middle east trip is him, and he just did it in the presser with netanyahu. He said, nobody said israel. Nobody said that you did. So, its like that little kid argument, where its like, well, nobody said that i said that, well, nobody said that you said that you said that its crazy. Hes doing that himself. Okay, lets go to the news that i did bring up about Michael Flynn<\/a> now. Cnns reported that Michael Flynn<\/a>s expected to invoke the fifth amendment, his fifth amendment rights, and not testify before the Senate Intelligence<\/a> Committee Regarding<\/a> all of the subpoena that they have issued to him. So, the fifth amendment, this is something that we have heard before, not so long ago with regard to the campaign trail, right . We have President Trump<\/a> who said that absolutely Michael Flynn<\/a> should ask for immunity. I do wonder what President Trump<\/a> will say about Michael Flynn<\/a> invoking the fifth amendment after he said this on the campaign trail she has people taking the fifth amendment. Four people, plus the guy who illegally did the server. You know, he put in the illegal server. So, there are five people taking the fifth amendment, like you see on the mob, right . You see the mob takes the fifth. If youre innocent, why are you taking the fifth amendment . Added to the file of if there is a tweet to a sound bite from the campaign trail. Something for everybody. Dont forget when lois lerner took the fifth in the irs scandal during the obama presidency, republicans were quick to point out, and probably correctly, well, there must be something there or shed talk more. Look, this is going to, you know, for the time being, perpetuate the news in that there appears to be something going on with the russia investigation. And i wonder if it doesnt all get back to Michael Flynn<\/a> as the cancer in the Trump Administration<\/a> that he was forced to fire and still seems to regret it, because everything about russia that we know of, at least, really gets back to flynn and what he did and what he didnt disclose. There were some other things with Jeff Sessions<\/a> and things like that, and he was forced to recuse himself from the investigation, but we now have comey coming to testify. Right. Next couple of weeks. We now have this flynn matter. And so, this is going to go on for a while. And angela did make a very good point. Trump has always been his own worst enemy. Most of what we think we need to look into in regard to russian meddling in the election has come from what trump has said himself or has been reported to say over the past couple of weeks. And every time he has a good moment, he fouls it up with some kind of tweetstorm that messes him all up, and so its on him. We have some very big moments that are going to be coming up. David, paris, angela, thank you guys so much. Were waiting for President Trump<\/a> and Prime Minister<\/a> Benjamin Netanyahu<\/a>. Were keeping our eye on jerusalem. They will be speaking live from jerusalem after their bilateral meeting, coming out to make a fuller joint statement todgethe. Well bring you that live as soon as it begins. Well be right back. At red lobsters seafood trios you dont have to choose just one thing. Choose your trio with any 3 of 9 selections for 15. 99. Like new creamy lobster pasta toasted parmesan shrimp and southernstyle crab cakes. Come create your trio before it ends. Wont replace the full value of your totaled new car. The guy says you picked the wrong insurance plan. No, i picked the wrong insurance company. With Liberty Mutual<\/a> new car replacement\u2122, you wont have to worry about replacing your car because youll get the full value back including depreciation. Switch and you could save 509 on auto insurance. Call for a free quote today. Liberty stands with you\u2122. Liberty mutual insurance. Wheyou wantve somto protect it. E, at legalzoom, our network of attorneys can help you every step of the way. With an estate plan including wills or a living trust that grows along with you and your family. Legalzoom. Legal help is here. All umm. Ed. You wouldnt want your painter to quit part way, i think you missed a spot. So when it comes to pain relievers, why put up with just part of a day . Aleve, live whole not part. You want this color over the whole house . Fmy doctor recommended ibgard. Abdominal pain and bloating. Now im in control of my ibs. Nonprescription ibgardcalms the angry gut. Moments from now President Trump<\/a> and israeli Prime Minister<\/a> Benjamin Netanyahu<\/a> will be giving joint statements in jerusalem and we will bripging that bringing that to you live. On sunday the president delivered a major speech to a room full of leaders from the muslim world imploring them to step up the fight against extremism. Listen here. Religious leaders must make this absolutely clear. Barbarrism will deliver you no glory. Evil will bring you no dignity. If you choose the path of terror, your life will be empty. Your life will be brief and your soul will be fully condemned. With me now, the founder and president of the cordoba house and the author of defining iscl isclammic state hood. Overall i would love to get your review, your impression of the president s much anticipated speech to the muslim world sunday. Well, i think this is a very big story. Not only to the muslim world. This story is a trick to the homeland of three faiths and he used the term. Of faith, christianity and judaism. He has met in riyadh 50 of the muslim World Leaders<\/a> representing the 1. 5 billion, almost 25 of the worlds population. And his visiting isreal, and the vatican and the pope. Im hopeful that this is a sign of a big story that is being cooked. There are many hands involved with this, not just trump, jared kushner, mcmaster, the people in the u. S. Administration. Theres no doubt the hand of not only king salman, his son, the crown prince who visited him, the Prime Minister<\/a> played golf with him a couple years ago. What do you hope the big story is, though . What do you think what do you see in that speech that gives you hope . First of all, as someone said, number one a few things. The difference between trump the candidate and trump the president in terms of his discourse around muslim and islam. Secondly, the recognition that he needs the corporation of muslims, muslims around the world to combat isis and that while the battle has to be confronted on the military level, which definitely has to be done, it also has to be done in terms of intelligence, in terms of very important point, cutting the funding that the terrorists have access to and how to access arms. This is what sustain the conflict. And then the more work which has to be done which he alluded to, which is where our work lies, is the ideology. In afghanistan did a report where it says we are winning the battle but we are losing the battle for hearts and minds. Its that battle that has to be raged. In that do you welcome that call that he made to religious leaders to step up and to engage maybe more in the fight against the extreme ideology . Absolutely. Thats what theyre already doing. Prime minister is cooperating with king salman to advance moderation. Its not a oneperson fight. You have to shift the discourse. The battle is not between christians and muslims. The battle front is between moderates and all faiths against the extremists t. Its very hard to fight. His most difficult battle is internal. The most difficults we have as muslims is internal. You mentioned the stark difference between kentucky trump and President Trump<\/a>. We have examples on example but i dont have time to play them. I think islam hates us is candidate trump. Then you heard this is not a battle between different faiths. Two very different messages. Which one do you snbelieve . I believe the latter. I have no doubt at all that this is the result of his interaction with people like of jordan who have informed him that this is not a battle between islam and the west. We have to go to the extremists. Great to have you. Thank you so much. I would love to continue the conversation. Soon President Trump<\/a> and Benjamin Netanyahu<\/a> will speak live from jerusalem. Well bring you that moment live to you when it happens. This is cnns continuing special coverage. Well be right back. Did you know 90 of couples disagree on mattress firmness . Fortunately theres a bed where you both get what you want every night. Enter sleep number and the semiannual sale going on now. Sleepiq technology tells you how well you slept and what adjustments you can make. She likes the bed soft. Hes more hardcore. So your sleep goes from good to great to wow bari only at a sleep number store. Oh, and right now its our lowest price ever on our temperature balancing i8 bed. Save 700. Go to sleepnumber. Com for a store near you. Welcome to inside politics. Im john king. Thanks for sharing your day with us. A busy hour ahead as President Trump<\/a> moves through a day of diplomacy in isreal. Hes having dinner later this hour with Benjamin Netanyahu<\/a> and the president is enjoying a very warm welcome despite several thorny issues. Already in isreal, a bit of history. Mr. Trump the first sitting president to visit jerusalems western wall, one of the holiest sights in judaism. Earlier in a meeting with isreals president , he said he hoped his president might give a boost to the longderailed Peace Process<\/a>. I also look forward to discussing the Peace Process<\/a> with palestinian president abbas. Young israeli and palestinian children deserve to grow up in safety and to followhe","publisher":{"@type":"Organization","name":"archive.org","logo":{"@type":"ImageObject","width":"800","height":"600","url":"\/\/ia801407.us.archive.org\/2\/items\/CNNW_20170522_150000_At_This_Hour_With_Kate_Bolduan\/CNNW_20170522_150000_At_This_Hour_With_Kate_Bolduan.thumbs\/CNNW_20170522_150000_At_This_Hour_With_Kate_Bolduan_000001.jpg"}},"autauthor":{"@type":"Organization"},"author":{"sameAs":"archive.org","name":"archive.org"}}],"coverageEndTime":"20240617T12:35:10+00:00"}