Of the victims on the second floor. So far the recovery has been pain staking. In the last 12 hour, only 20 of the building has been searched. Stephanie elim is in oakland for us. Stephanie, as we wait for the update, we are hearing from one of the survivors. What is he saying . Reporter yes, definitely. We were just listening because they were telling us they were going to have a press run and just delayed it. But they gave us more information, joe. And what they are saying is that it is really painstaking. They are using buckets and shovels to go through the space to look for people. Some of the people are easily identifiable. And some of the people who lost their lives, it is much harder for them to identify them. And that is part of the reason why its taking so long. But when you take a look at the stories coming out of the people who did survive the fire, theres one man, bob malay, he did not go to the party and was in his space preparing to paint when the fire broke out. Listen to his recount of what happened. When i ran back to get my camera, i saw pete who is a larger fellow. I guess as he was climbing down from the loft in his space, he had fallen and broken his ankle and was calling out to me. And hes like, i broke my ankle, i need you to pull me out. I need you to pull me out. So i just immediately took his arm and was pulling him out. And i just got to a certain point where it was there was all this stuff blocking my path with him. And i wasnt able to just, like, pull him out. And the fire was just getting too hot. And the smoke was getting too bad. And i had to i had to leave him there. And i wasnt able to get him t out. Just a harrowing detail there for him on getting out of the building. At this point, we know they have only made it 20 of the way through this building. So still a lot more to go, but because the roof collapsed onto the second floor and all of the debris that is there, it is slowing this process down. Were hoping to learn more. They say they potentially could have some names of the victims after they notify the next of kin. We may learn some of the names today, joe. Stephanie, looking at those pictures, it looks like a very large space. And the authorities have always been very specific about the number of people they think were inside that space. Do you have any idea how they come up with estimating about 50 people inside . I think a lot has to do with the people that were in there that got out. They have been looking for people and trying to did certain how the people were there. But just knowing people who were using the space and were frequenting the space. And then on top of it, the fact that had a party. Someone that they know was at the party, thats how they are figuring out who was inside at the time. Just a horrific story developing there in oakland, california. Well be checking back with you, stephanie elam. Joining me on the phone is james mcmullen. Chief, only 20 of the burned building has been searched. 80 to go. Request you tell us what the crews are facing as they try to search for victims in this fire . Well, as you search a building that has been burned such as that, you have to move very slowly and cautiously for several reasons. One is falling debris. One is building collapse. One is the fact that you dont want to disturb evidence thats critical for the fire investigation. You want to ascertain that you dont miss bodies or critical matters that could be used as evidence. So the key thing is, you have to move slowly and you have to preserve the scene at the same time so that the fire investigators can, in fact, determine the area of origin and subsequently the point of origin. And then determine the cause. Its critical to know that before you determine what caused the fire, you have to find out where the fire started. And so once you determine generally where the fire started, called the area of origin, you hone that down to the point of origin where the fire precisely started. And at that point, then you determine what are the causative factors within that point of origin and go through the process of elimination to determine the cause. And in addition they are still searching for bodies. They still have hot spots. And they have a real task and are moving cautiously and slowly, which is what they should be doing. So lets back up a little bit as we look at some of the pictures of the smoke and the fire and the flames from overnight. Look, one of the things we know is after the fire was out, it was not safe enough for emergency workers to enter. Does that in and of itself tell you something about the structure they were dealing with . Quell, theres no question that the fire will always damage structural supports. So whether the building is sound is something we have to make sure that investigators know before we make entry. Because we certainly wouldnt want a building to collapse that had a fire on the workers trying to solve the crime or rescue the people. Also, there have been past concerns raised about this space, the warehouse building. Among them, there have been reports of the tip call thing like trash, which i think is understood and pretty clear. But there are also reports out there about internal illegal structures. Apparently that sounds like things inside the building that enforcers deemed a potential problem. What does that mean . Well, it means illegal occupancy. It means use of the building according to the building and fire code. What you do inside the building is its occupancy. And when you have an illegal occupancy, it means you have occupied it without the proper permits from the agencies that issued the permits, such as the building department, the fire department. When you have people that are living inside, that becomes a residential occupancy. When you have a business, that becomes a different kind of occupancy. And then when you go in and you have an assembly such as this gathering people, thats an assembly occupancy, which is a third type of occupancy. So ive heard im sorry, i was just going to say, that ive heard that they were in there occupying, living there. Thats what the news accounts so far have said. And it wasnt clear that it was a residential occupancy. It sounds like they had a lot going on there in that building. At the News Conference earlier today, heres what the battalion chief had to say. Take a listen. And i would like you to weigh in. Our goal was to work collaboratively with public works to breach the b side, the left side of the warehouse building, the fire building, in order to gain access for our firefighters and sheriffs. To be able to remove debris systemically from the building to the vacant lot next to the building, literally, bucket by bucket in a methodical, thoughtful, mindful and compassionate way. We had firefighters with basically coveralls and buckets and shovels taking bits of debris out into the vacant lot to then be loaded into dump trucks and removed to the offsite location. So you listen to that and its a picture of rubble being taken out bucket by bucket. There are also reports that the stairs were incinerated. And it sort of begs the question, how is it that you can have so much fire without people discovering it and starting to try to get out of there, any idea . What is important to remember is all fires, no matter how big, such as this one, that became a gigantic fire. No matter how big they become, they start very small. Short of a molatav cocktail, you will always have a fire in the incipient stage, which is the beginning of the fire when it is very small. At some point in that area, if you see the fire and you can get to it soon enough, you can put it out with a fire extinguisher. And i understand that one of the witnesses had attempted to use a fire extinguisher and he couldnt get the extension wisher to operate. And that is also potentially a violation of the code. And need for maybe improving what we do in the way of fire extinguishers. But as soon as you can get the fire extinguisher on a fire in the fire service, putting the wet stuff on the red stuff, the sooner you can do that, the sooner you can put the fire out. Once it begins to extend, it burns in what is combustible loading. And this, i understand, the building had a lot of combustible loading. Where people brought in combustibles and had artist displays and so forth. And it will move very rapidly. The code also requires that you have interior finished materials that mitigates fire spread. And you have probably heard about the fire in east warwick,rwarwick, rhode island, make it west warwick, rhode island, where we had materials that burned very rapidly. Polyurethane is one of those. Stay with us, we want to get more information. Turning to politics in just a little while and keeping our eye on oakland, donald trump is expanding his list of potential secretary of state picks. Well tell you who he is now considering and perhaps why. Stay with us. Every day starts better with a healthy smile. Start yours with Philips Sonicare, the no. 1 choice of dentists. Compared to oralb 7000, Philips Sonicare flexcare platinum removes significantly more plaque. This is the sound of Sonic Technology cleaning deep between teeth. Hear the difference . Get healthier gums in just 2 weeks vs a manual toothbrush and experience an amazing feel of clean. Innovation and you. Philips sonicare. Save now when you buy Philips Sonicare. Trumps top aides are telling cnn they will interview more candidates this week. Meanwhile, the president elect is announcing more proposals, which he hopes will save american jobs, doubling down on that threat hes made against companies that move operations abroad. In a series of tweets, trump writes, quote, any business that leaves our country for another country, fires its employees, builds a new factory or plant in the other country, and then thinks it will sell its product back into the u. S. Without retribution or consequence is wrong also, this morning, Vice President elect pence is revealing more details about trumps controversial phone call with the president of taiwan. Well go to cnns ryan noble live in new york outside transition headquarters of trump tower. Ryan, what is the latest . Reporter yeah, joe. Vice president elect mike pence spent the morning defending the president elects decision to take the call from the president of taiwan. He said it was no different than the 50 other heads of state that the president elect has talked to across the world. And he also said that to a certain extent the media is driving this question of whether or not it was a major Foreign Policy blunder. He said, its Standard Practice for the president elect to talk to foreign leaders. Listen to the argument he made on nbc. I think the conversation that happened this week with the president of taiwan was a courtesy call. She reached out to the president elect and he took the call from the democraticallyelected leader of taiwan. It is more than one of 50 telephone calls. The president elect has taken from and made two World Leaders in the midst of a historic pace and cabinet appointments and senior appointments, building a legislative agenda. Even traveling the country and saving a thousand jobs in the state of indiana. Its a reflection of the Tremendous Energy and the kind of approach that youre going to see him bring to challenge his at home and abroad. Reporter of course, that phone call a little bit different than the more than 50 phone calls made to other foreign heads of state because its the first time a phone call like that has occurred since 1979. And thats when or why so many people are concerned in washington. The Chinese Government is also alarmed by it and filed a formal complaint with the white house and the Obama Administration has responded by saying theres been no change in that policy where the United States recognizes the one china policy, essentially, that taiwan is part of the Chinese Government. But joe, this shouldnt be that big of a surprise because, of course, donald trump was very tough on china on the campaign trail during this election. And that relationship with china is going to be something to watch very closely in the early days of the trump administration. Joe . He sure is Getting Started out of the blocks on that. Lets switch gears here a lit bit, ryan. Team trump is still looking for obviously one of his most important cabinet positions, secretary of state. And theres actually a new name being floated and a name a lot of us have heard before. Want to talk about that . Reporter yes, its an interesting name in light of what has happened over the past 24 hours in japan and taiwan. Its the former ambassador to china, john huntsman. A candidate for president not too long ago and the former governor of utah. Huntsman is different than many Establishment Republicans in that he was not critical of donald trump during the campaign. And is someone that trump could tap for secretary of state. Now, even though huntsman is being considered for secretary of state, this is not to say hes emerged as a frontrunner. We do know this morning that trumps top aide Kellyanne Conway said the list expanded. Essentialy they were down to four finalist, mitt romney, rudy giuliani, David Petraeus and others. Now the field has expanded. We thought the appointment would come soon. Trumps transition saying the president elect is going to take his time because it is such an important decision. Reading the tea leaves, that could be important. Some talk about it being up to two weeks. It doesnt sound like they are very close. Well be checking back with you. If you think about it, huntsman may not be the only new candidate for trumps secretary of state. With interviews for the allimportant role coming this week, well ask our panel of experts who can best help the president elect build on u. S. Relationships abroad. Coming up. Cu roducer at. Marvel studios. If my office becomes a plane or an airport the. Surface pros perfect. Fast and portable but also light. You dont do this 14 hours a day, 7 days a week. If you dont feel it in your heart. Since we started shopping at way bfingerhut. Com. First down thats because with fingerhut. Com we can shop over 700,000 items go to fingerhut. Com to get low Monthly Payments and the credit you deserve. Thats a touchdown, buttercup oww generosity is its oyou can handle being a mom for half an hour. Im in all the way. Is that understood . I dont know what shes up to, but its not good. Cant the world be my noodles and butter . Get your mind out of the gutter. Mornings are for coffee and contemplation. That was a really profound observation. You got a mean case of the detox blues. Dont start a war you know youre going to lose. Finally you can now find all of netflix in the same place as all your other entertainment. On xfinity x1. Okay. You probably heard his name before, hes the former ambassador to china, he speaks chinese and is floated as a possible nominee for secretary of state. The trump transition source tells cnn republican jon huntsman is the newest name being considered for the job. So lets get some insight into this with julian sulitzer. And you have tim notali, the former director of the nixon president ial library. Julian, starting with you, is it a coincidence . Are we supposed to read something into the fact that Jon Huntsmans name is being floated one day after the controversial donald trump phone call with the taiwanese president . No, i dont think its a coincidence. Obviously, this was a phone call that although some conservatives are defending and almost making the argument it was strategic decision, has also elicited a lot of criticism. So to float what might be the person with the most expertise and the most confidence in the competence in a pick, its the decision by the president elects team to give confidence in what is going on in this area of policy. And so weve talked a little about this, and now im going to play the sound, the trump Senior AdviserKellyanne Conway weighed in on the secretary of state selection. Listen. The secretary of state is an incredibly important position to fill. And hes very fortunate to have interest among serious men and women who all of whom need to understand their first responsibility as secretary of state would be to implement and adhere to the president elects America FirstForeign Policy and be loyal to his view of the world. So he continues to talk to different people. I think you have seen the list before that already existed. This week hell have additional interviews with other candidates for secretary of state and other cabinet positions and deputy cabinet positions as well. Tim notali, they continue to mull around on this, and it sounds like they are no closer to making their pick for national diplomacy. Who do you think is number one, the best choice for this role among the names we have known out there, and what does this project, the idea that this administration tobe is taking time with this selection . Well, first of all, to be fair to the administration tobe, they are doing this recently and reasonably fast. This whole process continues for two weeks well into december, but what is interesting is that the trump administration, the trump team is a lot more unified on what military policies should be Going Forward than what on diplomacy is Going Forward. A lot of president s or president select coming in to think they could be their own secretary of state. Thats not going to be the case of donald trump. He doesnt really know much about Foreign Policy. So this key decision, the choice of the secretary of state, looms larger for him than for a lot of president select that we have had in history. Who will be the best . We have two candidates that have real experience in interacting with foreign leaders, in representing the United States on a world stage. Jon huntsman would be superb. Hes fluent in mandarin and has lived abroad. He understands one of americas important trade partners. And mitt romney did a remarkable job in pulling together the Salt Lake City olympics of 20002. Hes respected overseas and he, too, would be an excellent representative of our country. So either of the men has the skillset required to be