Welcome to our viewers in the United States and all around the world. This is new day. It is monday, april 20th, 6 00 here in new york. The death toll in the United States is now nearly 41,000 people. When john and i came on the air last monday, that number was 21,000. In the space of a week, the casualty number has almost doubled to 41,000 americans. Thats a number that a few months ago would have been unthinkable. But on a positive note this morning, the white house says several hotspots, including new york, connecticut, rhode island and detroit and new orleans are stabilizing. They say theyre seeing progress in stopping the spread if those places. Over the weekend, the hospitalization rates in connecticut and new york dropped after weeks of a steady climb. So which places are next to be hardest hit . Chicago, boston and philadelphia are being closely monitored as areas of concern. So are we on track to reopen parts of the country soon . Well, thats hard to say because of the continuing problems with testing. But now you are familiar with the terms test being and tracing. Now you can add the word tension to that. Over the weekend, thats what we saw between the white house and a group of governors. Many of the nations governors from both parties say theres not enough tests. Things like swabs are in short supply. Researchers from harvard estimate that testing rates must triple, triple before the u. S. Can safely reopen. The president disagrees. He does now claim, though, that he will use the defense production act to push the manufacture of more swabs. A new wall street journal nbc news poll shows nearly 60 of americans are concerned about reopening too quickly. Nearly 60 , keep that in mind when you see the pictures of the small pockets of protesters calling for an end to the stayathome orders. One bit of key Economic News this morning, word is that a deal on additional Small Business aid could come as early as this morning. Were watching that very closely. A lot to get to. Cnns Brynn Gingras is live here in new york. Brynn . Reporter hey, john and alisyn. Good morning. There continues to be a push to reopen the country. At least parts of the country. Major warnings, particularly from governors to proceed with caution as you guys laid out the nationwide death toll nearly doubled just within the last week. Here in new york, hospitalizations are down. But Governor Cuomo says, listen, were only at halftime here and that these strict measures are still vital. President trump eager for states to reopen. Theres one major component needed to even move into the white houses first phase. Testing. Hour testing is expanding rapid rapidly, by millions and millions of people. In reality, only 150,000 americans are tested daily according to harvard researchers. State leaders say they do not have nearly any of resources as the president claims. But the testing has to improve here and in every state. To try to push this off to say that the governors have plenty of testing and they should just get to work on testing, somehow we arent doing our job is absolutely false. Weve been fighting for testing. For the National Level to say that we have what we need and really to have no guidance to the state levels is just irresponsible. Trump insists its up to the states to figure out their own testing programs. Testing is welcome. You cant have it both ways. Testing is local. Its very important. Its great. Its a local thing. New york state appears to be past its coronavirus peak and Governor Andrew Cuomo warns residents now is not the time to relax. Its only halftime. We still have to make sure that we keep that beast under control. We keep that infection rate down. We keep that hospitalization rate down. While some florida beaches like this packed one in jacksonville begin to open up, leaders in hotspots highlighting data how it shows social distancing are working. Were in a much, much better place than we thought we would be. Its because of the citizens of louisiana taking the stayathome orders seriously. We want to work. Open our state. Meanwhile, in a handful of cities from auston, san diego and denver, people are protesting stayathome orders. According to President Trump. These are great people. Youve heard the term cabin fever. Theyve got cabin fever. They want to get back. They want their life back. Their life was taken away from them. In states like michigan which faces the third highest number of deaths. Governor whitmer says she can withstand Harsh Criticism for keeping strong restrictions if it means saving lives. Weve got to be really smart about the actions right now to protect life, as well as the actions to reengage. As tough as this moment is, it would be devastating to have a second wave. Reporter and about testing, today new york will be the first state to roll out Antibody Testing. 3,000 tests across the state to hopefully get a true percentage of how many people had the virus and may, may be immune to it. Chg inching toward the goal of we will be talking about the antibody tests and immunity, what we know and dont know with about it. Joining us now is an Infectious Disease specialist at school of Public Health, bloomberg. National security analyst, juliette kayyem. She served under president obama. Great to see both of you. Dock torques i want to start with you. Of course, its good news that some of these highprofile hotspots, new york, connecticut, new jersey, are seeing a decline in hospitalizations, intubations and the death rates, but if we loosen the stayathome orders, should people expect, even in these hotspots, for it to go back up, those numbers . We know this. It is a fact, if you allow people to social distance, youre going to get more cases. It spreads the case is are we going to be able to find them, isolate them and Contact Trace them so we dont get a rate of cases that exceed hospital capaci capacity. We want to keep it at a low clip. The way we do that is with a multiprong strategy in which testing is a crucial part of that. Talk to me about the numbers as far as testing goes. Were testing 150,000 a week right now. This harvard Study Suggests we need 500,000 to 700,000 per week. Were seeing about 20 positive tests in testing. Harvard says we need to be at 10 or lower, why . Were trying to test enough people so we know where it is and isnt. If you have a number of testing done throughout the country. The average rate is 20 . That tells you youre not testing enough. When it gets lower and the w. H. O. Numbers less than 12 or so, you start so youre testing enough people where you have a handle where the cases are and arent. It may be that there are cases in the country that are at that. Its not going to be homogenous. But in the hotspots, they need to get the number of positives down. You test wider so you have a better idea where it is. Juliette, i do not understand the disconnect between the white house and the governors about testing. This is head spinning. The president says that testing is a local issue. Okay. Its done locally. But the governors say they cannot procure the ingredients needed, the reagents, the nasal swabs without help. Theyre crying from the rooftops for this help. The president , i dont understand he could be a hero if he could help secure the nasal swabs that are needed, but he has resisted doing that until yesterday where said that he will, i think, briefly invoke the defense production act. He called it a tremendous hammer that i suppose he didnt want to use. Why not get the nasal swabs that people need . It is so true. It is one of the oddest of many odd things about the white houses approach to this. [ inaudible ] as to what the white house is saying, they say words like, the states have the capacity, they have the infrastructure and the capabilities. Its all sort of future tense. Its like weird language. Theyre not saying they can do it. Theyre saying they have the capabilities. Well, i have the capabilities to test. What they need is the swabs and the tests. So finally, the president invokes or lets be clear here. He says hes invoking the defense production act. To get the swabs to the states and to get businesses to begin to produce. It will be a delay. Companies do not switch on a dime. It should have been done months ago. We knew that the sufficiency would be here. The governors are right in the sense that they will execute on the testing. Of course, they will. Its their hospitals, their local Public Health officials. But you need the federal government, as you do in every disaster to monitor and assess what the supply chain looks like to drive the resources to the states that they can begin to test. The white house can say they have the capability and the capacity. Those are nothing words. The other thing, were talking top to bottom here. Top down as opposed to bottom up. So much of this. The president can say he wants parts of the country to reopen. About 60 in the wall street journal poll, people say theyre concerned about reopening too soon. Youre talking to Business Leaders around the country. What are they telling you . Theyre saying the same thing. Nothing would be worse to bring employees in. Have one of them get sick and close down again. They are thinking through a layer sort of security approach. The first question is do i need to bring them back . A lot of people have gotten used to this. Productivity is not low. You dont want people on public transportation. Thn we think architecture of everything from offices and cubicle spaces. Do we need to travel as much as we used to . Theyre not going to say go until a lot of them, until they can protect the employees. We are now in what ive been calling the preparedness para x paradox. Things have gotten better, although lets be clear, 40,000 people plus are dead and more to come. We have done better because weve been successful at flattening the curve. People who are critical of social distancing say, look, those people overreacted. Lets open up. Thats the opposite of what you want right now. You got to keep lowering the curve so that you can drive the resource toss protect our hospital capacity. Dr. Adalja, i want to ask you about immunity. Dr. Birx said we dont know anything about the immunity of people who have had this. Listen to dr. Birx this weekend. In most Infectious Diseases, except for hiv, we know that when you get sick and you recover and you develop antib y antibody, that antibody often confers immunity. We dont know if its for a month, six months or six years. How can we learn that quickly . We can extrapolate from other coronaviruses. When we do that, we realize that immunity isnt ironclad in the coronavirus. What it means over time and sometimes you can be reinfected in the laboratory setting. I think theres reason to believe this immunity may be fleeting and it may not be completely durable. Its an important question to ask. We still need to do serology test to go understand where its been and where its going. Thats a big deal if its fleeting. Correct . It is. What we know with other coronaviruses, you can get reinfected experimentally. But you dont have any symptoms r they still contagious is the question. Thats an important question to ask. You likely have immunity as measurable by antibodies, and its complicated and we havent worked it all out because they havent been considered that important to figure these things out because they were common cold viruses. This is important from an operationalized serology testing to be able to say youre going to be a frontline worker. We have to know what the immunity is and what level of antibodies and how soon do they decline. Were so early in understanding this virus. Thanks so much to both of you. The push to get the country back open again is sparking the small pockets of protests around the country. Makes for pictures here. But 60 of the country says theyre concerned about opening up too early. The president seems to be egging them on as well. Well discuss next. vo at sprint, our priority is keeping our customers, employees, and communities safe. During these Uncertain Times we want you to get Great Service without leaving the safety of your home. Shop at sprint. 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He served under president obama. Dr. Ee mer is, i want to start with you. Not just because we saw these pictures, small groups from around the country. But we saw the president egging them on with tweets saying liberate michigan, liberate minnesota, et cetera. As a public official, as a doctor, as someone who treats patients, when you see Something Like that, whats your reaction . Thanks for having me. I think youre right that some of those statements and those images [ inaudible ] from a Public Health standpoint, theres i mean, if we look at the virus task forces recommendations, youre supposed to have a decrease in cases for 14 days, influenza luelike cas before you lift [ inaudible ] weve talked a lot about testing. The truth is that we havent [ inaudible ] even if we can test these people, we dont have a way to trace them and their contacts after that. The third thing, weve also underfocused on other critical things and not a lot of emphasis for what we do with children and education. What are we going to do with these folks . I think its dangerous to say that we are not going to coordinate those activities across the state and even though organizations can step in to fill that void, when we have the president say were going to lift those, when the criteria arent met, it makes it difficult to coordinate those things from a Public Health standpoi standpoint. David gregory, i just want to be cognizant that the four of us as we sit here today are approaching this from having lived in a hotspot and from having jobs. So that, of course, colors the feeling of how desperate and dire the staying at home is. If you lost your job or are at risk of losing your job or in a place where it doesnt feel as acute as here, i understand them saying lets get back to our lives, were desperate to work, we want to get back to our lives. Obviously, were some sort of National Vision or voice, i think, might help quell some of that anxiety. Your thoughts . Yeah. I think thats totally leg legitima legitimate. We have to recognize that the president , even when he goes over board, he feels it. Its total economic ruin that hes seeing every day from the Vantage Point of being president of the United States. What people are feeling around the country. And that has to be balanced here. The Public Health officials, though, that it has to be balanced. Dr. Fauci hears that every day, feels that every day. So thats real. Whats disturbing about this is not only is it wrong to egg protesters on because its not responsible from a health point of view. It also raises the specter, too of the partisanship. That youre egging on states where youve got democratic leaders. Somehow not having a national response, having a more broken up response based on ideology which is completely wrong. The last point is, this issue of when are we safe to go back is very much in the hands of individuals and families. You dont live through Something Like this without stepping back and saying, hey, when do i feel safe taking my family to