And we expect to have you know, its a recordsetting crowd. Weve never had an empty seat and we certainly wont in oklahoma. That was a lie. There are usually empty seats at his events and there were lots of them in tulsa. Trump set out to produce a television show. He fell short. Partly because folks are rightly concerned to be in a room with thousands of others during the coronavirus pandemic. And it seems that one of the other reasons why there were so many empty seats is a noshow protest. A noshow protest. This all started with a video on tiktok created by Mary Jo Laupp who is effectively a tiktok grandma. She made a video more than a week ago urging viewers to go to trumps site, sign up to attend the rally but not show up at the rally. Her video was showed thousands of times, and younger tiktok videos showing different videos, kpop fans were trying to sabotage trumps rally. Look, it seemed to work to some degree. We dont know exactly how well but Trumps Campaign manager was out there talking about how many people were signing up. Trump was bragging there were a Million People rsvping, they were gathering all this data about people they can use for the campaign. Apparently it was a bunch of kids, a bunch of teenagers signing up as a protest. Clearly not everybody showed up in tulsa. Maybe people heard the huge numbers and said they didnt want to go through the hassle of the crowds. Its unclear exactly what happened. There are multiple factors. Were going live to tulsa in a moment. First i spoke with Mary Jo Laupp about her role in whats being called a noshow protest. So, mary jo, what happened . I had educated myself on black wall street and understood why black content creators on various platforms were upset about the juneteenth rally. I post add video late thursday night, the 11th, that was sort of meant to be a frustrated rant. I had 1,000 followers on tiktok at that point. Most of my videos were seen a couple hundred times maybe. And then this went viral on multiple platforms . Yes. By 7 00 the next morning it had been seen hundreds of times, and then the kpop fans jumped on from twitter. When they get involved, you know its getting serious. The idea is everybody is going to sign up for tickets, claim they want to attend the rally and, of course, not show up. How much of an impact do you think this online prank actually had in tulsa yesterday . I honestly cant tell you because this is these social Media Systems are generational. So, when i shared a video, lets say my video was shared 700 times but each of those people would have people sharing their copies of it so thats 700 more people i never saw. So, its impossible to tell for sure just because of this generational impact that both twitter and tiktok have. All i know is i was at a Birthday Party for one of my grand kids and my phone started blowing up with friends saying, i had seen what was going on and i started paying attention. This is how its going to be from now on, whenever the president holds a rally theres going to be this attempt to prank him, to troll him, to trick him . I dont think it was just an issue of pranking him. Youve got a lot of kids in the younger generation, 20yearolds and teens, who are very aware theyre much more aware and selfeducated when it comes to things like black culture. Yes, theyre tweeting it not as a prank but a lot of messages i got from parents and their kids were, i never knew this much about black wall street. This is so sad. So, theyre excited about the impact it had, but i also think its theyre becoming much more aware of the marginalized communities and theyre learning to speak out. A form of protest, what weve seen as a protest. We dont know how much of an impact it had but it clearly had some impact in tulsa. Now, Going Forward youre the socalled tiktok grandma. How are these platforms changing the way you interact with the world . How has this changed your life . I have had a lot of teenagers reach out and say that they dont feel supported by their parents because they have different political ideologies than their parents do, so theyve asked me as an adult how would i how should i talk to my parents to get them to understand where im coming from . Which i think thats a powerful question for teenagers to be able to ask, someone thats not emotionally invested in their relationship. But i think social media has made it very clear i posted one video and it got shared way more times than i could have done anything with it. And i think thats a very careful lesson we all need to be aware. Number one, i had no intention of going viral. Theres the lesson, be careful what you post because you never know. But i also think it definitely has created this huge sense of community. Theres a lot of posts all over my social media of, we did it. Kids who arent even old enough to vote in this upcoming election feel theyve had a voice and say, we dont approve of some of the things happening in our country and this noshow protest was a way to make our voices heard. Their voices were heard, indeed. Lets get the latest from tulsa, reporter for the new york times, well bring in Jasmine El Gamal in a moment. Youre in tulsa. You saw the crowds, you saw the lack of crowds. What to you is the biggest headline from trumps attempt to campaign relaunch in tulsa . Yeah, i think what the the expectations that the campaign had set, which were admittedly sky high, were simply not met. Not in the enthusiasm, not in the crowd size. And really not in the kind of intimidation that they were trying to give to joe biden and to democrats. I was struck earlier in the day by how the response from black tulsa, from liberal tulsa, was to just let trump have his day. Not to have the protests, not to start that many clashes because they didnt want to give him the spectacle he desired. It turns out as that day went on, that looked like a fairly smart play. We were not seeing the type of clashes conservatives have come to expect and we didnt see the crowds they came to expect. That caused the focus to be intently on what was happening inside the arena, both the lack of enthusiasm that we saw in there and the message. As you wrote in the new york times, he played the hits. He played all those usual, you know, kind of narratives. Did you take precautions . Tell me about the precautions in the age of covid19. Yeah, the times has been vigilant about us reporters out going through training around wearing masks. I had an n95 on. We had training about how to keep that on and i was trying to keep distance. At the same time, these precautions arent going to be held up to when the person youre speaking to is not wearing a mask and theyre not doing that also. I remember looking at some surrogates who were shaking hands, kissing babies, that politicking i havent seen in a long time. Not only there havent been events but even the oneses ive gone to, ive seen republicans be in georgia and South Carolina recently, they have taken some precautions. That was not true because the president made it such a political act to do things like wearing a mask and social distancing, some of his supporters were saying when they received the free mask, they threw it right in the trash when they got it. One more question for you. Did you encounter a lot of covid denialism, a lot of people in denial about the danger . Uhhuh. There was some. I mean, i think it ranged on a spectrum. There were some who ak nonled the reality of the virus but said they did not think it was as real or built up as they blamed the moo edia or others t do. Some who flat out said, i dont think this is happening. One man told me about a kind of conspiracy of hospitaling being paid to inflate the death numbers. You heard bill gates come up a number of times. The denialism ranged but universally they stuck with the president saying the country should be opened, at the minimum. I wanted to bring in jasmine, whos in london. Jasmine el gamal, about how the rest of the world sees these events. Because when trump holds a rally it is a worldwide event. The whole world watches these things. Jasmine, how do you think these events are seen outside the u. S. . Thanks, brian. One thing that truly struck me in watching these rallies and watching everything thats unfolding in the u. S. Is how different it feels watching it from the outside than actually being in it. And watching it from the outside, whether its myself or whether its anybody here in london or in other countries, it feels kind of surreal. It doesnt actually feel like youre watching the United States. This idea that everybody has of america, of the way american president s behave, of the way narratives unfold in the country, its been really shocking to see how its devolved over whether its the last few years or just the last few weeks in terms of what the president is saying, both two americans but also about americans. It kind of feels being here in london like i could be watching any other country, honestly. Thats whats so disturbing about it. I could be watching the president , whether its in venezuela, egypt or syria, the types of narratives are being used to kind of pit people against each other. I think its something we havent really seen before to this extent and its incredibly vivid watching it from the outside. And the reason thats so disturbing, i think, to me and to many others as well watching from the outside, is the types of narratives the president is using. Even his son, eric trump yesterday, called some of the protesters animals. The type let me read the quote. Heres the exact quote. Were going to keep the moral fabric of this country because when you watch the nonsense on tv, when you see these animals literally taking over our cities, burning down churches, this isnt america. Thats not what americans do. Hes using the word animals in relationship to some of the antiracist protests that have gone on. Of course, there was sporadic looting weeks ago. We saw that in a number of cities. I guess thats what hes talking about in this quote. But the use of the word animals, the dehumanization thats going on, i feel like that sounds you hear that differently than maybe even some folks in the United States do. I do. I hear it differently for a couple of reasons. Not least of all, i worked at the department of defense for eight years. And we our job was to kind of, whether it was at the pentagon or white house or state house, to look at other countries and monitor unrest and look at how, you know, leaders were speaking to their populations, what they were saying about their opponents but also how people are speaking about each other and what affect that had on the events that were unfolding. One of the things that, you know, time and time again that really aggravated the situation in any of these countries that we would look at, is the use of these dehumanizing terms like animal. You know, you could talk about looters in a number of different way. You could talk about protesters in a number of different ways. But when you say the word animal, it kind of creates this sort of space between the person and the opponent to where you dont even as human anymore and that makes you do things to them you would normally never do to your neighbor, to your coworker or even to your political opponent. Once you have that word animal in your head, once that dehumanization kind of sets in, thats when the really bad stuff starts to happen. I think so far weve always thought, especially i mean, as americans that we were kind of immune from that. That wasnt something that happened to us. But again, from the outside, i do see it now as something thats happening to the u. S. And i feel like its something i havent really seen before. Its really worrying, to be honest. We have to stay on guard when we see those authoritarian impulses. Real quick, is there another rally scheduled . Has trump announced another rally or is this for now . We dont know kind of whats next. We know this was billed as the restart of the campaign. Where he pivots to now is unknown. We know the president was looking for this weekend to lift his mood, particularly after several bad polls had come out with joe biden. I dont think the scene yesterday is going to do that. So, theres intense focus on the white house right now, what comes next and what does the president do next to give the life to his campaign that he was expecting this weekend to do. Thank you both. Up next here, Carl Bernstein on the president as the viewer in chief, reading tea leaves about his own presidency via the tv. Ways stop for a fingerstick. With the freestyle libre 14 day system, a continuous glucose monitor, you dont have to. With a painless, onesecond scan you can check your glucose with a smart phone or reader so you can stay in the moment. No matter where you are or what youre doing. Ask your doctor for a prescription for the freestyle libre 14 day system. You can do it without fingersticks. 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Lately hes been the viewer in chief. He just watches and reacts. And watches and reacts. Cnn reports that trump was watching cable yesterday watching to see massive lines in tulsa and he was disappointed when he saw the coverage in Southern District of new york and then he found out six Campaign Staffers in tulsa tested positive for covid. Trump initially dismissed that revelation. Then when the positive tests were reported in the media, trump erupted. Thats according to a source familiar with his reaction. I wanted to bring in the legendary Carl Bernstein. I remember a time not that long ago when a president s moods were not newsworthy, but now they are. Your reaction to this reporting that hes watching, hes erupting, the cycle repeats and repeats. I think the big underlying story about donald trump in many regards are what his moods, his closest advisers, his former chief of staff, his former National Security advisers, mcmaster, general kelly, secretary mattis, all concluded that hes unstable. That he aaccounts in an authoritarian way, his authoritarian impulses come into play, particularly as a result of his moods and its all one story. His mood, his physical health, which we dont know about either because of his visit to Walter Reed Hospital earlier in the year that has been covered up and why he went there, looking at the president s mental state, especially what his friends are seeing now. Theyre very concerned about his conduct. They say hes out of control. Some of those i talked to, thats their words, out of control. This is a danger to our security in this country if, indeed, the president is unstable. There are different examples on different fronts. Let me ask the control room to pull up a list we made this week. Its about a minute long. But the point is the length. This takes a while just to go through all the examples of unhinged or inaccurate comments from the president this week. Among many, he threatened the protesters ahead of the tulsa rally. He promised helping seattle, which doesnt need help. He said making juneteenth famous because no one had heard of it before. He didnt know the white house had put out an annual statement about the holiday. He said no one put tariffs on china. There were tariffs for centuries. He said bolton disagreed with the china travel restrictions but bolton wasnt in the white house anymore. He said coronavirus is dying out when its not. He claimed covid testing is overrated and a doubleedged sword because it makes us look bad. He said polls that make joe biden winning are suppression polls. He was so troubled by critics that made fun of his walking that he defended his walking at length. You can see the rest of the list there. How is the press supposed to convey all of this when you can barely read the size of the font and it takes time to get through all the falsehoods that came up in a week. I think we have to point out the falsehoods but i think theres a different story underneath all this. That is the president s words and actions. We need to get through the room with him. We need to get as reporters to his chiefs of staff and those he serves with, who serve with him and lets get their accounts of what