Captain would have to go and use the bathroom giving him time to change the flight course. Did he make his terrible decision in the spur of a moment . Another question even though this area plane was shredded like confetti is there a way to retrieve the texts, emails, the videos that passengers likely took and wrote in the last terrible minutes . Heres one more. Whats the duty of a Mental Health professional to report on a troubled pilot . Our experts are here to break it down but first, to the very latest of whats happening right now on the ground. Cnns frederick is in germany with more. I know that the newspaper has spoken to a former girlfriend. What is she saying . Reporter well shes saying she was together with Andreas Lubitz for about five months last year. She said or described him as a very sensitive man, someone who needed a lot of care attention, who could also be quite flattering. She was an Airline Stewardess herself but he was someone who had a dark side. Someone who at night would wake up because he was having bad dreams someone who would go into rages when they had fights who apparently locked himself in the bathroom once for an extended period of time. She says ultimately the reason why they split up was she was starting to become afraid of him and she said that it was clear to her that he had some sort of psychological problems but it was certainly something she said he was trying to hide because of course hed always had this big dream of being a pilot and didnt want it destroyed by the fact that ehe had health issues. A gliding acquaintance says lubitz was familiar with the area around the crash site. What are you hearing about that . Reporter its interesting because he was part of an aeronautics and hand gliding club in his town of montabaur. Strangely that club quite frequently went to excursions down to southern france, to the foothills of the alps. So apparently lubitz was familiar with the terrain there. This acquaintance of his says that the club was there about ten times and he does recall at least one time that lubitz was there. There is another report saying that lubitz was obsessed by the alps that he loved the mountains there, and so certainly he would have known the terrain where he crashed and the acquaintance said he was very familiar actually with the crash site itself with that area around there. He says hes flown over that many, many times. Finally, todays New York Times says that thols physician notes found in his apartment were from different doctors, suggesting perhaps that he went for a Second Opinion as to his fitness, his relative fitness. Do you know anything about that . Reporter the New York Times is saying he went and tried to get a Second Opinion. We reached out to the University Medical center in dusseldorf which is a town that he lived in. They confirmed that he was there for diagnostics twice this year. It wasnt for depression they didnt say however, whether it might have been for some other mental problem. Certainly the doctors notes found inside his apartment, there seemed to be several of them and of course the state prosecutor said that they had been destroyed in attempt to try to hide from his employer that he had some sort of illness, that he was dealing with by the way, for an extended period of time the medical records show. But again, were trying to find out what exactly he was suffering from. There are many outlets reporting it was some sort of depression related thing. What exactly we dont know. Thank you very much. Lets dive into all of this now. Joining me is a psychiatrist dr. Gaels salts and safety analyst and former faa inspector david susie. Id like to cover a lot of ground. David, is this the way you would do it . Is this the way that a pilot seeking to crash an airplane would go about it by manually switching the auto pilot from 33,000 feet to 96 feet isnt there a faster way . Historically there has been and there has been done this way with egypt air and silk air, its violent movement. This is different. But it is also a different aircraft. This is designed to protect itself from that kind of thing. So to put it forward it wouldnt let you do that. Wouldnt let you just go into an uncontrolled descent. This was probably sick to ask but probably the most expeditious way. I suppose thats correct. Why doesnt a guy like this kill himself outside that aircraft instead of 149 with him . What was his motive . The vast majority of killing yourself if you are depressed. Only 2. 5 are really killing somebody else and usually its killing one other person a person that youre angry at. So this is vanishingly rare. And this is a mass murder. Which makes you think about things like sosyopathy rage, desire for infamy. Those things would be motivators. I heard many draw conclusions about his breathing, he was able to maintain normal breathing. It strikes me as a lay person that youre only able to evaluate the breathing in the context of other factors that we now know, like changing the flight altitude. The breathing alone he could have had a heart attack and maintained breathing. You can. You can lose consciousness and maintain breathing. It must have been a combination that made them think he was awake. Lets talk about the toggling of that lock switch. If the copilot toggled the door control to lock and thereby disabled emergency access for five minutes, is there anything that the pilot, who is trapped in the cabin, could do to gain access . Nothing at all. As long as he keeps his finger on the button in a lock position. And past five minutes he could discontinue to hold it down. There are reports after five minutes there is a burst of 30 seconds of opportunity that would allow the pilot to come back in. After the only after the five minutes can you enter the code which then triggers the 30 seconds period to notify the captain, if the captain does not respond by opening the door or locking the door the door actually opens for five seconds by itself. Doctor he would have had to main taken an amazing level of constitution to hear the pilot outside banging on the door trying to break down the door and then in the end, people screaming for as long as nine minutes, maintain that breathing, and continue to do that which he was doing. I think there are two possibilities. One is that you know this was premeditated this is a person whos thought a lot about this and does not have the empathy to be concerned about that. In other words, were talking about sociopathy. This is what they wanted so its not going to upset them. The other possibility is that you know they have suffered so much themselves that the relative suffering of others is not that disturbing to them. He is able to put on blinders for hearing purposes. And block it out. It doesnt mean it was blocked out. It may mean that it fit with whatever this is completely conjecture you have to realize. We dont know what was in his mind. When people internally suffer terrible depression or psychosis, i mean it is utter torment. And that kind of torment might really surpass the idea that other people would be screaming or frightened. David, the faa two tern in the cockpit rule was designed to address incapacitation on the part of a pilot. Is it appropriate in a circumstance like this will it thwart a pilot who has turned bad . We should clarify why the rule is in place. The only reason thats in place originally is the fact that there was there were no cameras to identify someone trying to get in. So they had to have a second person there because looking through a peep hole tool identify who that person is. That was the original. But the second part of your question sorry, kind of got side tracked. Twhil new method of requiring two individuals in the cockpit will that necessarily prevent a cockpit, a pilot who turns it will because since thats implemented and the airlines that it has been implemented in there has been no attempts not even attempts at suicide or any disruption in the cockpit since that rule. I add its very different to have people behind you that are anonymous in a plane youre killing and somebody that you actually take on in a cockpit. Deterrent than prevention. This is not going to stop an attack thats started. What it will do is prevent one from starting in the first place. Canopy lot treated for Mental Health issues maintain his or her career or is this a professional death sentence . Absolutely they can main taken their career. The issue is the beginning of treatment. So you want to stop them from being responsible for other people when they are in the depths of the illness. And when they are beginning medication which has some risk with it. We know that it may increase agitation or suicide risk at the beginning of medication. Thats why pilots arent supposed to fly then. These are lets put it this way. If it is depression it is a treatable il n and once it is treated somebody is like anybody else. One out of every ten people get depression. Are we going to say that those people should never be responsible for any one else . Then one out of ten should never drive, one out of ten should never it doesnt make sense. The point is when depression is resolved you are back to functional. One of the few cases i remember from law school i can cite by name is the terror soft case. What is the duty on the part of a Mental Health practitioner dealing with someone like him,ing we presume, but presuming he is unfight is there a durty to report him to the employer . So the duty to warn for a psychiatrist or Mental Health care worker is basically if the parent has in any way let you know that they are a risk to themselves or other people. So had he said anything about you know i have a plan or i want to do this or even i want to kill myself that psychiatrist would have a duty to warn Law Enforcement or whoever is deemed at risk. So if he says something about taking down a plane, of course that would be the employer or you know whoever he mentioned. If he said i want to get my girlfriend. That he would you would have a duty to warn the girlfriend. But this is a person who everybody is saying was secretive. And psychiatrists arent mind readers so if he mentioned nothing of any of this then actually the psychiatrist has a duty to keep confidentiality. I know people have said hey do we go too far . The question is this. This man probably would never have come into treatment at all if thats the issue really if you think you have no confidentiality, you say i have depression and now im going to report it to your employer youre never going to come in the first place. To a lay person it sounds frightening. Ive seen the list of medications that according to the faa standard that one can be on and still be working. Yes. You want to dissuade me from my discomfort . Yes, i do. Balls i think that you have to look at what are the specific side effects of those medications. If were talking about medical problems if the only person who could fly is somebody who is on zero medications, has zero medical problems then were probably taking out any one who has experience the very person that we want to be flying for us. So i think that what people have to understand is psychiatric illnesses can impair you in a shortterm but once treated not in the long term. Psychotic disorder like schizophrenia thats a different story. It troubles me, lets make the presumption and let the audience know this is based on conjecture and reporting. It troubles me to think Mental Health professional would have deemed him unfit, for what not to be a cnn host they knew he was a pilot. Unfit to take command of 149 other lives. We dont know. We dont know if thats true. We knew somebody wrote a note that said you may not work this day. Now, i dont know if that was permission not to work if that was by that doctor the times is reporting today that multiple physicians two or more that would suggest that he went for a Second Opinion. Did they know he was apy not have did they know he was a pilot . Im assuming that they do. There is no way to know. Unless you are a medical examiner designated by the faa, the european association, you wouldnt know. There is no if he doesnt tell you im a pilot how would you know . I would say this. If it was a Mental Health professional who said you are too depressed to be flying in my opinion, then yes, i would say that would be a duty to warn. Is this finally the instance that brings about real time transmission of cockpit data . I can hope so. Here is something really historical with this event. Theres already been action taken, there has been Safety Measures taken, they not only the airlines have taken measures to say we do need two people in the cockpit now as a mitigation but the Regulatory Authority themselves they totally skipped right over this part of figuring out what happened and then applying the regulation which is incredibly time consuming, flight 447 were still waiting on things to respond to that accident. But this is different. This is very different. There is a shift in the culture and i think partly because of all of the exposure that the airlines in this industry have gotten. The pilot union has stood in opposition to the idea of real time transmission of data. How in the face of this and all of the questions that remain can they uphold that . What they are really against, and have been which i think is not the case now, is that the transmission of real time video data. The transmission of actual data it happens all the time. Information from the aircraft. Now the audio and video is what they are objecting to. If i work at a 711 theres video recorded of what i do for a living. Surveillance from the time they drive to work. Can i make another suggestion. Shouldnt there be some means from the cabin of alerting forces on the ground that hey, there is something going on in the cockpit . There are in new aircraft. There is a way to do that. Its not regulated but part of a mains thing. It sends information. The seat back on seat 5 d doesnt work. They type it in. Straight to maintenance. By the time the aircraft lands the parts are there, ready to fix it. Thats the technology were looking at. On the ground they could unlock the door im saying right. If they knew there was a problem and a way to unlock the door. Something like this now were talking about Remote Control. Thats a big subject. A pilot who is a friend of mine an aviation attorney at home in philadelphia he said dont underestimate that biannual review of those who maintain the license to fly. He said that the interaction with the faa airmen there is a degree of Mental Health review that takes place in that process. Either of you want to respond . Very, very small. I think insufficient. I think that in the biannual review both a psychological and mental review. There is not a litmuls test. You cant say hey, this guy is okay and this is not. So what happens is with the faa we encourage them to say get a relationship with this person try to get in their head. Thats not a trained professional. There are rudimentary minimalistic reviews any primary care physician could do that would be somewhat of a check list. Dare i say it seems to me that the system that we have generally works, in this case this guy, if in fact he was washed out of training for a time period because of Mental Health issues he should have been gone. Thats the answer. He was brought back he should have at least there should be reviews like the six month reviews because we know someone had a history of depression can have it again. Thank you, you got through three quarters of my list. The rest of the program im getting to Everything Else. Thank you. We have so much more to get to. Coming up what if during the last minutes passengers were able to reach out to loved ones with emails, texts, videos there could be evidence out there. 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