York times, poll lizzer prize winner said it will sell off hundreds of billions of dollars worth of American Asset ifs our Congress Passes a bill to allow the saudi government to be held responsible for the attacks on september 1 11. The article states the Obama Administration has been lobbying on the side of the saudis and this comes four days before president obama travels to saudi arabia and raises a concern i have often spoken about. An inexcusable lack of transparency. Here is what you need to know. The 2004 report of the 9 11 commission concluded there was quote no evidence that the saudi government as an institution orsen your officials funded the organization of the 9 11 plot. But two 9 11 commission members, former senator bob carry and former Navy Secretary john layman have told me that the commission did not exonerate saudi arabia and before the work of the 9 11 commission, there was a 2002 joint congressional inquiry into the attacks perpetrated by 19 hijackers, 15 of whom were saudis as was the mastermind Osama Bin Laden. 28 pages from that report have never been publicly released and some who have read them say they site evidence saudi officials living in the United States played a key role in the plot. The allegation is that a saudi government agent named omar provided assistance to 9 11 hijackers. President obama long promised to unseal the documents but hasnt and thats a disgrace. Never forget thats the refrain we repeat with regard to events of september 1 1 but until there is full disclosure, the words are an empty promise made to the victims and families. Im joined by a key player, bob gram the former governor of florida and chair of the Senate Committee and cochaired the congressional inquiry. Would you react, senator, to the news the saudis made this threat . Michael, im outraged but not surprised. The saudis have known what they did in 9 11, and they knew that we knew what they did, at least at the highest levels of the u. S. Government. And they have been acting because we have taken no response to their complicity in the murder of 3,000 americans with a sense of impunity they could do anything they wanted to with no sanction and now, that impunity has expanded to their trying to lobby the highest levels of the white house and the congress to preclude their being in a court of law determination as to whether saudi arabia was a coconst coconspirator. Complicity is an awfully strong word for you to use. Why would the Obama AdministrationLobby Congress on the side of the saudis in this dispute . I cant answer this question and thats a question that should be asked. I hope that this disclosure, as well as the statement that was made earlier in the week that they were are in the final stages of reviewing the 28 pages to make a determination as to whether that should be disclosed will motivate administration to change its policies and say our primary responsibility is to protect the citizens of the United States of america and in this case, the citizens who suffered the grievance loss of 9 11 for which they have received no justice. Senator, you know that the saudis have said we, too, want the 28 pages released. Ive always thought that was a smoke scene. Doesnt this story today where they are threatening to sell their assets in the United States, doesnt that show that they are doing so because they dont want the 28 pages released . I think what the saudis had was an understanding with the United States that whatever the saudis indicated they wanted was a sham, that what they really wanted was to keep this matter away from the American People and that they would use the commitment of the United States government to do so as their cover to say we want to have the full information disclosed and let me say one other thing, michael please, go ahead. We talk about the 28 pages. They are important but there are thousands of other documents, which relate to the role of the saudis in 9 11, which have also been with held. I think the president ought to make a commitment to release all the information to be totally transparent with the American People as to what the saudis did so as we go through a rocky period, at least all sides will be dealing with the level of truth as to what actually happened. I expect that if i, as an american citizen should be afforded the opportunity to read the 28 pages, that i wont see a smoking gun but its a principle of transparency thats driven mied a va my ed a va advocacy for this. I agree with your first point, transparency but there is material in the 28 pages and volume of other documents that would indicate there was a connection at the highest levels between the kingdom of saudi arabia and 19 hijackers. I believe that the plot would not have occurred but for the support and protection that they that the hijackers were voo receiving wow. Primarily from saudi a rain ya. That is quite a statement. Did they cut a deal to try to keep terror outside their border . Yes and part of that deal was to spread that extreme form of islam through mosques and through schools and the result of this is that they have been supplying to terrorists organizations now for three decades a constant flow of particularly young male saudis and others from places like pakistan who have been trained in jihad, who have been have seen concepts like tolerance and compromise be smerched and therefore the terrorist organizations have had the dual benefit of saudi money and saudi trained recruits. Senator gram, thank you for being here. Thank you for your courage. I appreciate it. Thank you very much, michael. Terry stradas husband worked in the 9 11 center and they have been pushing to punish the saudis. This did not come as a surprise because you were questioned for this story, is that fair to say . Yes, i was interviewed. React to it. Im shocked. Do the saudi haves that much influence on the government and calling the shots in washington d. C. . Are we really not able to past legislation in the congress because of the saudis. Its unbelievable. I said at the outset that president obama has on a few occasions said that he would release these documents. Back me up on that. Yes, thats absolutely true. Shortly after he took office he made a promise to the 9 11 Family Member and when Osama Bin Laden was taken out, he made a promise to the second Family Member he would release the 28 pages. It makes you wonder if they are going to play hardball with us on this issue, how loyal a supporter are they in our fight against isis . Thats a good question. You know, thats a second threat they are making beyond taking billions of dollars out of our economy and threatening to not assist us in the fight with isis. Thats ludicrous. They need us more than we need them. Its the morning of september 11. Tom is on the 104th floor of the north tower. Hes working for canner fitzgerald and actually called you. Yes, he did. And said the building is on fire. Weve been hit by an airplane and were going to go to the stairwells and try to get out and there is a lot of smoke and said things that are personal and it was horrifying. Ever thereafter, many of us not personally impacted with the loss of a life, you know the refrain, never forget but i said its an empty promise. If there are documents out there that we still havent seen and aspects of this story that we havent been told, whats the pitch you want to make to the white house . Absolutely. First of all, stand by your promise and release the 28 pages. The 9 11 families have a right to know and so do the American People. We cant get a full understanding what is going on right now with terrorism unless we know what happened prior to 9 11 and how it came about and the network existed and money was being transferred. Really, please, stand by your promise and get the truth out there like senator gram said and we can deal with it on a truthful level. Right now were dealing with secrets and things being hidden and they are trying to block legislation, which all our legislation does is give the courts jurisdiction to hear our case. Thats all it does and look what they are doing, they are freaking out. Final question. Im about to pivot to the 2016 election which is the dominant story around us. Right. Do you have a champion among this field on this issue . Have any of the five remaining picked up your cause and said terry strada, im releasing 28 pages if president obama doesnt. Trump has said that. Senator cruz is a sponsor of our bill, the justice against sponsors of terrorism act, so im sure hes supporting our legislation lets get them all on the record. All five of them on the record so we can bring this to some conclusion. Yeah, id like to hear what Hillary Clinton i want it from all five. She signed a letter in 2003 asking george bush to declassified as she been supportive therefore . Nothing. Hold they are feet to the fire. 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Thats the accusation being made about the complicated state by state rules of delegate selection on the democratic side by the guy in second place, Bernie Sanders and on the gop side by the front runner donald trump. In fact, trump wrote an op ed on friday coal planing about manipulation in colorado. Responsible leaders should be shocked by the idea and cancel elections in america if they dont like what the voters may decide. It sounded defensive and saying each process is easy to understand for those willing to learn it. Ultimately falls to address questions i have, the author of the memo chief strategist and Communications Director sean spicer. Hey, sean, it seems like you have a mute knee on your hands. Its a process weve used for more than a decade and the rules each state and territory would follow last october and there is a latchup sometimes sam pacampa haves to do. He said its rigged. The front runner wrote typically a republican or kill and said the process is rigged. No question, its complicated but fair and transparent. For decades going on the century, abraham lincoln, its a process that worked for diagnostic eisenhower. Donald trump got 37 of the vote and 45 of the delegates and doing pretty well. He went into a state like florida with 99 delegates. He won them all because he was the highest vote getter and the state was winner take all. If you talk about fairness, a lot of these candidates dont complain about the states until they lose him . What he sees is the party sure planting the will and role of the electret. Doesnt he make a legitimate point . No, he didnt. The Republican Party is more democratic. The democrats have superdelegates, onefifth are unelected party bosses. Shouldnt a candidate who arrives in cleveland with the most wins, the most votes, the most delegates lead as your nominee . Well, i think traditionally thats been the case but again, thats like shouldnt the person who gets five out of the six numbers win powerball . No. You need 1237 delegates to win our nomination. A majority wins, not plurality. This isnt horse shoes but sean yes. Its just us talking. If you come out of cleveland and dont have this guys constituency, you lose in the fall. Well, first of all, we dont do anything. This is the will of delegates. There is 2400 plus delegates that are elected at the grass roots level. Its them. All this talk about party boss in the establishment. People have to understand the people getting elected from coasttocoast are people that were elected at the congressional level or statewide to represent the people of their state and county. Our job is purely as a faci facilitator to make sure we have a process open and transparent and up to the delegates and majority of the delegates at every single vote to decide what we want as a platform, what rules we want as a committee and what nominee we want as a party. Those delegates and their will carries the day in every circumstance. Okay. But to my point, you need the trump constituency to win the white house. Sure. We need the cruz constituency and rubio we need the kasich. We need the paul. We need all of it. There is not a constituency. We lost the last two elections, in politics you win by addition, not subtraction. We need that plus to win. There is no question we need to be unified. I get it. This isnt a game of horseshoes. If the delegates select an individual with the majority of the vote, thats who that nominee will be, plain and simple, no ifs, ands, and buts. Its up to the delegates that come together and make their voice heard. Sean spicer, thank you, as always. Thank you, michael. So, i just heard sean spicer tell me the nomination is up to the delegates. Thats why delegate math is the overriding issue for the campaigns and behind the scenes maneuvering could make the difference. Joining me now, the man working the case for ted cruz, the former attorney general of virginia now cruz delegate operations director. You would concede, i hope, that ted cruz cant get there on ballot number one. He cant get to 1237 on the first ballot. No, youre thinking of bound delegates. There is an awful lot of bound delegates in the convention. Pennsylvania, West Virginia for instance and from other states, as well. There are going to be a bach of unbound delegates and were going to go after those immediately. Were not going to wait until later ballots. Right. Thats my point. I do understand the rules because im a pennsylvaniaen. Let me ask the question differently. Do you believe ted cruz on ballot number one can receive the requisite 1237 votes . Yes, that is possible. Do you believe delegates have an obligation where its a beauty contest and unbound, do you believe a delegate how old have the obligation to vote the will of their Congressional District . I think they should vote as they campaign. There are people running and saying im a cruz delegate. If you vote for me, im voting for cruz. There are a lot of other people running in pennsylvania saying if you vote for me, im going to vote the way my district votes. If thats what you want, there are people saying that. The most important thing to me as an american citizen is they tell the truth and do what they say they are going to do. Thats what i want to see. Mr. Cuccinelli, you know in a state like mine on the republican side, there is no designation. Maybe the guy leaf letting saying im for ted cruz, when you close the curtain, there is no indication how they will cast the ballot. I think youre saying you dont have to necessarily follow who wins the Congressional District in your eyes. You want to pick up the support, none ttheless nonetheless. Dont put words in my mouth. I think pennsylvanias system is a lousy system me, too. We agree. I really do because its awfully hard for a voter to implement, you know, to make a decision and know its what they want. They have to do an awful lot of research and do an awful lot of preparation and frankly, we expect them to do that because thats the system youall have and its the one we all have to work with. So were going to, you know, support those delegates running who say they are supportive of ted cruz like donald trump will do the same for those who say they will support donald trump. Its perfectly legitimate and fair. Is it chaotic . It is. Broader based, not just pennsylvania and of course, new york is this coming tuesday. You would agree the nomination if you win it is worthless is a legitimate process. Do you have a concern Donald Trumps comments in the past couple of days are