Supreme Court JusticeRuth Bader Ginsburg will soon be the subject of a biographical movie Starring Natalie portman. She discussed the upcoming movie also participating, her former law clerk and current california supreme Court Justice goodman loop. This is just over an hour area place good afternoon, im a partner in the Supreme Court and appellate practice. I believe that laws should be a force to improve the lives of all people. Over the years ive developed a deep appreciation for everything my membership is given me including countless professional Development Opportunities and a fantastic network of colleagues and friends. At this particular moment,. Before her appointment to the u. S. Supreme court for the d c circuit, prior to becoming a judge she was a law professor at rutgers and Columbia University she served as general counsel and on the National Board of directors are nearly a decade area i had the extraordinary honor of clerking for Justice Ginsburg which was as amazing and lifechanging and. Does you would back. Among my fondest memories of that year were the champagne and cupcake birthday parties that the justice with host for each of her birthday each of her cards. So fully aware of how crazy it is to have a Birthday Party with fruit eater against her, we would plan with dave for days in advance to come up with the perfect list of questions to ask her. We learned about her summers in sweden where she was learning about sweden swedish civil procedure. Her confirmation hearings, and her beloved husband marty, a distinguished tax attorney and show supreme whose love and support for the justice is legendary. If tumbling that existed before he passed away, no doubt he would have started the notorious rpg blog health. Himself. But even when the clerkship and then, i had a deep sense of remorse about the stories that i didnt get to hear. So this next hour is a dream come true for me area is facilitated by the best interlocutor i can imagine california supreme Court Justice live in loop. Like Justice Ginsburg, he was a lot professor before joining the bench. Hes widely published expert in constitutional law, education policy and the supreme work. He was a popular and acclaimed teacher winning the uc berkeley acclaimed teaching award, and he eventually became the board of directors the dean. But long before all that, just as lou was a law clerk. A longtime friend of acs for my also clerk. And then for Justice Ginsburg. He is perfect for this job because i know that he too has a long list of questions left over from the chambers birthday parties. I am so excited to listen and as he asked them. Please welcome our please join me and welcoming the justices. [applause] welcome everybody. Thank you all for being here on a saturday afternoon. Most especially, thank you to Justice Ginsburg. Its obviously a busy time of the court. As you and often is. Thank you for spending a few minutes with us. You are now finishing your 22nd term on the Supreme Court. A lot of people have noticed that in recent years you have had quite a substantial public presence. You have a huge fan base everywhere you go. People call your rockstar, an icon, theres an opera about you and Justice Scalia. And an emoticon that looks like you. There are the tshirts, some of them also say i love rpg and my personal favorite which is you cant spell truth without ruth. And then theyre even the young women that had tattoos of your likeness. Thats love. Thats real. All of this i think is pretty unusual for a supreme Court Justice. Justice scalia get that a lot too, but i dont think theres anyone with the Justice Scalia have to, not even if the federalist society. I guess i just want to start by asking you, how did this happen . Its amazing to think of me and icon and 82 . I gave it to one law student who thought of the tumbler, and the notorious rpg. At first, i did not know quite what to make of this, because i didnt use them know who notorious b i was but then one of my lawyers explain to me, you do have something in common, youre both born and bred in brooklyn new york. I should explain right away, a number of my feminist friends agree, ginsburg comes before scilly alphabetically, so why is it Scalia Ginsburg . Also im sure you know, how important it is in our workplace. So leo was appointed some years before ginsburg. So theres also going to be a biography of you in the near future called the notorious rpg. And then theres also a biopic scheduled called on the basis of sex with family portman. Starring is you, are you in on these projects . Do you know much about them . Are you a cooperative conspirator . I can claim credit for notorious rpg. But i like it instead of my grandchildren. On the basis of sex, is that with a biopic assault, i have a nephew who is a scriptwriter. And he asked if he could write a script about a case in which marty and i were involved, in 1971. And i said yes if you would like to spend your time doing that. The case is interesting account it was the case that i hoped would be paired with roe v wade is the turning point case in the Supreme Court the case was Charles Demos who took good care of his mother though she was 92 at the time, he argued the case in the 10th circuit, this is his story. Was adoption available to a woman or a widowed or divorced mom . Laws did not get the deduction because he was a married man and he had been left out, so he appeared in the tax court and it was the soul of complicity, it was simply if our daughter would get this deduction, and makes docents. So one day, marty came into a room where i was working on something was writing, and said bruce, read this. And i turned and said marty that the tax advance, you know i dont read text cases. He said read this one. And it told the story of charles moss and he said lets take it. Marty would write the tax part and i would write the constitutional law part. Part of it is about the case, and a bar about our argument in the 10th circuit in denver, and then it includes the aclu and some women who are saying the same things that i was saying and summary but at a time when no one was prepared to listen, i think it will go into production in the beginning of 2016. Maybe by the end of the year, it will be out. Natalie came to talk to me about it. We had a very good conversation. She said, i want the director to be a woman. There are not enough women in this industry, there are many talented out there, and they do have a woman director. We look forward to it. You mentioned marty. He has been mentioned many times. Let me take you back a little bit. For many years i think, youve been described as shy and reserved. Especially compared to your gregarious and very loving husband marty who was as kelsey said an outstanding chef and always very quick with a joke. Some people called him a serial wise cracker. But first of all, do you think marty would be surprised that your celebrity . I think he would be delighted. He was always my biggest booster. The audience just saw a picture of you and marty not long after you are married. You met him during your First Year College at cornell. You said in the past that he was the first boy you ever dated who cared that you had a brain. The two of you had two kids, you also have a two career marriage. Some lawyers in fact which was unusual at the time. Can you describe a little about that. And what kind of social pressures faced with respect to your marriage and your family life and your career . Well it was a big change. And the time area for my first ill born in 1955 to the second one in 1965 when jane was small there were very few women who worked outside the home. At the time, it wasnt unusual to have a two income family. And what was it like . Its hard for todays students to imagine what it was like for women all not all that long ago. In 19 six e3, maybe 3 of the lawyers in america were women. When i graduated from law school they didnt want any lady lawyers. Until you saturday oconnor story. She graduated from law school. She was a few years ahead of me. She could not get any jobs, so she went to work for a county attorney and said if you think im good enough, after four months you can put me on the payroll. Thats how she got her job. My first job was as a District Court clerk. How did i get that job . It was a lawful at the time. He called every judge in the Eastern District and in the Southern District of new york. The answer was, will win might take a chance on a woman, but we cant risk a mother. So joe called edmond home year he who always took his calls. The judge explained her record is good, but sometimes we working on sundays. Joe said give her a chance and if she doesnt work out the measure young man of her class who will leave his law firm and finish up the clerkship. So thats the caret. The stick was if you dont give her a chance, i will never recommend another columbia law student to you. I got the job. And other women of my generation you did as well are probably better than anyone else. The second job wasnt hard, but opening up for store was tough. Now of course, you have had many clerks yourself who were parents at the time. Is that unusual . Not today. I had a number of clerks with two children, the first one i hired who was the primary custodian was a man. In his application, he explained that he was going to georgetown at night because his wife was an economist i think for the military firm of the world bank. So she had a fulltime day job he took care of the children during the day. Thats my dream for the world is that fathers take her children as much as mothers. It was Something Else about him that made him irresistible. It was his first year writing section essay and it was on the theory of contracts as played out in wagners ring cycle. So, thats actually good segue to the next question. You seem you have seen feminism change and go through many transformations from the time you were from the time you cofounded the aclu womens rights project for decades later today. Because of the work you did there, we now have the elimination of most overt forms of gender discrimination. From your vantage point, what do you think are the most pressing challenges left now . First, i dont think the meaning of feminism is change. It has always been that girls should have the same opportunities to dream, to aspire, and achieve and do whatever their godgiven talents enable them to do as boys. And that there should be no place where there isnt a welcome mat for women. People misunderstand what feminism is. I know in some corners its called the ford. Its all abouts women and men working together should help make a society a better place than it is now. Current challenges . As you said, all of the overt gender discriminations are almost over. There are a few last standing, thats unfortunate. But for the most part, the statutes that were once riddled with overt classifications almost all of them were gone. It was a combination of legislative change, tax litigation, the percent change along. Whats left, and is harder to get up, is what i call unconscious bias. Sometimes its a device that works. To overcome unconscious bias. My example of that is the symphony orchestra. When i was growing up, you never saw a woman except playing the part. Someone had the idea of dropping a curtain so the people who are conducting the auditions didnt know if it was a woman or man. And with that simple change, almost overnight, women started to show up in symphony orchestras in numbers. I was telling the story, the castleton festival a young violinist said to me you left something out, not only do we audition behind the curtain, but we audition shoeless. That device cant be duplicated in every area. Its hard to get at, my favorite case and that law of the title vii case, my colleague at columbia, it was against at t for promoting women to middle management jobs. There were several criteria, that women did at least as well as men up to the last test and that was called the total person test. It consisted of an interview, meeting the candidate, and then doing evaluation. Women felt disproportionately at that stage. And why . Because the person conducting interview was generally white male. And anyone who was different making interviewer feel quietly uncomfortable. If he had personally looked look like him, he was comfortable. If it was a Minority Group or woman they were strangers. And it wasnt the case of deliberately setting out to avoid promoting women, it wasnt that at all. It was this unconscious bias. That operated. You announced you now sit on a court that has three women on it area i sit on a court that has a majority of women on it including a woman is chief justice. Do you think that the law would be much different if there were safe for five women on the u. S. Bancorp . I think its pretty good we have three now. Three makes a big difference because theyre all over the bench. I sit in the middle because of them around so long, and Justice Kagan is that my left just as some of the mayor at my right and then if you have come to watch the show at the court you know that my colleagues are not tripping back. Theyre very active in the questioning. At the end of the day, a wise old man and a wise old woman will reach the same judgment. And yet, there are some cases which i think with it come out the other way if they were five women. Or more. Another is carhart case, the poncho case. Another, the two cases involving children whose parents were not married and they could become citizens at their mother was a citizen, but not the father. The Supreme Court was wrong about that twice. There are issues where it starts to predict the result wouldve been different, but for the most part we wrote more light than any two other justices. Even more than Justice Thomas and Justice Scalia. I look forward to the suitor ginsburg opera. Couple of months ago, you appeared on time magazines 100 most influential people in the world list. Which is quite an honor. You should see this lovely picture they have the from your first year cornell which is just a beautiful picture. The inscription that accompanied your listening, was written by your colleague Justice Scalia who said this, Ruth Bader Ginsburg has had to distinguish legal careers either one of which alone entitle her to be one of times 100. The other is your career as a professor and a lawyer. I guess i now ask you what did you learn from your experience as a lawyer . The importance of having a sense of humor. Some advice ive told many audiences is the advice that my motherinlaw gave to me on our wedding day, buddy and i were married in his home. His mother said dear id like to tell you the secret of a happy marriage, and that is its not that thats sometimes to be a little hard of hearing. Such good advice. Especially in dealing with buddy who was a very funny fellow, but in dealing with my colleagues. So president clinton nominated you for the Supreme Court in june of 1993. To fill the seat that was vacated by Justice Byron white. Some pictures of that. And you are confirmed by the senate exactly 57 days later on august 10, 1993 by a vote of 96 to three. Mustve been nice. Im just saying. Anyway other than the happy outcome, what do you consider the most memorable art of your confirmation process western mark the bipartisan spirit that existed in that congress. Probably my biggest supporter was orrin hatch. My biggest problem the white house handled preparing me for the confirmation process, they would for questions like you were on the aclu board and the year so and so, and that year they passed resolution ask. How did you vote and would you defend that position today . And my answer was stopped, there is nothing that you can do to persuade me to that mouth the aclu. But not a single question was raised about my aclu connection, i was very fortunate, the next year, how do we get back to that . I dont know what the magic will be. I was a beneficiary of what it happened in the Clarence Thomas nomination. The committee was embarrassed they added to for mine. They had a meeting with the committee before the public hearing. It was those of you that if there was anything battle my record, they would bring it out and however chance answer before he went public. And all of my record, that only the fbi files, there wasnt one thing questionable. So they said what do you think we should do to improve the confirmation process . And i said i havent yet been confirmed, so im somewhat hesitant. I still have to this day of supply of drawn thurmond teaching that he gave me. He was in my class the spring court nomination. So since being on the bench youve been a very vigorous voice on a whole range of equal protection cases, not only sexist donation, but its in the Racial Discrimination area, and disability cases, most recently in the Shelby County case, you can do very lively dissents about the Voting Rights act. I wanted to stop and ask you you have at times compared the interesting progress thats been made so rapidly on questions of discrimination based on Sexual Orientation contrasting that with our more enduring difficulties with racial inequality. What you think explains the difference in how sticky the issue of racial inequality has been . I think that when gay people began to stand up and say this is who i am, when that happens people look around and its my nextdoor neighbor of whom im very fond, my child is friend, even my child. They were people who belongs to our community. It wasnt and still today there is an there is a high degree of segregation. In schools so i think the d