Is kenneth fine berg, from the Victim Compensation fund and author of the book what is the life worth . The unprecedented effort to compensate the victims of 9 11. Kenneth fineberg, why did you call the book that you just wrote what is life worth . Because congress in setting up this program after 9 11 delegated to me and really to me alone the requirement the obligation to try and calculate what each death caused by 9 11 or each physical injury should be paid out of public funds. What were you called . I was called a rather judicial term a special master. That connotes in the law somebody who is sort of delegated authority. Usually by a court. To act as some administrative arm of the court to administer or design a settlement and then to allocate the proceeds of the settlement. How many people did you award money to and how much . I awarded 7 billion dollars of taxpayer funds, all public funds, to approximately 5300 people. 3,000, roughly, 2,900 families who lost a loved one on 9 11 and the remaining claims were physical injury claims to survivors of 9 11. What was the largest award, what was the smallest award, and what was the medium . The largest award was 8. 6 million, tax free, to an individual who survived the World Trade Center collapse with thirddegree burns over 85 of her body. Who came to see me. The smallest award was 500 to somebody who broke a finger escaping from the World Trade Center. The average award, tax free, in this program, was 2 million, and the median award, half got more, half got loss was about 1. 7 million. What was the hardest part of your job . Clearly, the hardest part was the decision i made in designing the program to meet with any individual family or any individual victim who survived who wanted to see me personally to discuss their plight, why they felt they were entitled to more money, why they felt that 9 11 was an unfair, unjust curveball thrown at them. And accordiaccordingly, over a h period i met with 1,500 individual family members and that was harrowing. Which meeting i know youre reluctant to give names in this, but which meeting do you remember the most . The very first. A woman came to see me, 25 years old crying, sobbisobbing. You have awarded me about 1 million to take care of my two little children, six and four, who lost their father. I need more money and i need it fast. And i said to her, why . Why do you need more and what is this request that you make for speed . Well, you see, mr. Fineberg, i have terminal cancer. I only have two months to live. My husband was going to survive me and take care of the children. Now, theyre going to be orphans. Can you please help me quickly . And we did. I substantially increased the award, accelerated the payments and she died two months later. But at least knowing that a structured program, Financial Program had been set up for her two surviving small children. Hundreds like that. Give us another meeting that you remember. Mr. Fineberg, i lost my husband. He was a fireman, and he died at the World Trade Center. And i just want you to know that there is no god, mr. Fineberg, because my husband rescued 30 people from the World Trade Center and brought them to safety. His battalion chief said stay here, too dangerous, dont go back, and he said, im sorry, there are 10 more people trapped in the mezzanine of the World Trade Center. And then she said, while he was running back across the World Trade Center plaza, he was killed by somebody who jumped to their death from the 103rd floor and hit him. If he had been one step either way, mr. Fineberg, he might have survived. But like a coordinated missile, somebody leapt to their leaped to their death from the 103rd floor and hit him, killing them both. And i want you to know, mr. Fineberg, that no amount of money there is no justice, why me, why me . Why my husband . Stories like that. Did you ever get mad at somebody . Never. Never. I think its critically important and the public understood this, the public understood, these people were in grief. The victims of lifes misfortune, traumatic deaths, perfunctory goodbyes that morning, never saw their kid or spouse again. Vaporized. Frustration, not anger. Not i never got mad at anybody. Frustration sometimes. Did anybody ever threaten you . No. Well, there were some pretty difficult moments. Anger, invective, epithet, but never threatened. How long did they meet with you, where did they meet with you and were there other people in the room . We first met over a year i thought it very important to walk into the lions den. I met groups of families. Firefighter widows, servicemen widows at the pentagon. We filled up the marriott marquee ballroom with the survivors of roughly 850 Cantor Fitzgerald victims who all died at the World Trade Center. A whole ballroom filled with angry, grieving people. I spent a good year and a half probably going around the country, around the world, meeting with groups of families who needed to understand the program. Then, i also met with individual families over the course of 33 months. You talk in your book about the different reaction you got in different parts of the country. New york versus california versus london. Explain. Its interesting. Its sort of a cultural phenomenon. When i met with families in new york in groups, angry. Wheres my money . The government causeded this. This should have been prevented. And youre the visible representative of the government. And you better pay. Virginia, the pentagon, the servicemen, very respectful. Thank you for coming, mr. Fineberg. We appreciate youre here. Wed like to present a plaque for your service. Anything you can do, we appreciate what our government is trying to do. California, sort of a public outpouring of grief. Hold hands, lets say a public prayer. And london . London, disbelief, skepticism about not the wisdom, skepticism about the program itself. You mean to tell me, mr. Fine berg, that my son, an english citizen died at the pentagon, and your government is going to give me 2 million tax free . Whats the catch . Do we have to give up our citizenship . No. Do we have to surrender our passports . No. Do we have to come to the United States to get the money . No. Whats the catch . Why is america doing this for us . Undocumented families who lost a loved one in america at the World Trade Center you said there were 11 of those . Seven. Maybe 11. Yeah, 11. 11. Mr. Fineberg, why are you giving us this money, are you going to deport us if we apply . No. Are you going to put us in jail . No. Are we going to be fined . No. Im even going to give you a greencard. Skepticism, distrust. Gradually, all of these groups came into the we had 97 that ultimately ultimately opted into the program rather than stay out. Which they had a right to do. How long did you work on this . 33 months, from the time i was appointed, i began the design of the program right up until we cut the last check. Why did you not take money to do this . Couldnt. I dont think any american doing this in post9 11 world could get paid for this. First of all, i cant think it was right to get paid, to serve the people of the United States in an unprecedented, unique task like this. Second, there was, also, a practical reality i confronted. If i ever got paid for this, they would have been after me, youre getting paid on the blood of my lost wife . How dare you. I had enough foreidable challenges without dealing with that problem. A lot of people did get paid to help you. Oh. How much did you spend in those 33 months . We dispensed 73 billion at a cost to the taxpayer of under 100 million. If there was ever a program in the history of our nation where the overhead was kept low, relative to the amount of money that was disseminated, this is it. Price Waterhouse Coopers was awarding a contract by the department of justice to administer the program. Different offices, Branch Offices of mine, calculating awards, opening up files for each and every claimant. Massive task. They had about 450 people working on this project, at its height. At a total cost, overhead, everything, less than 100 million. How many people did you have on your staff . My staff was very small. I had about 18 people, all lawyers. Some worked pro bono, some were brought to me on detail from the United States department of justice, or other branch agencies. To assist me. Very lean, very small. Where were you located . We had an office at the department of justice, but my main office was my law firm, where i sort of worked out of, my law firm, where i had the support staff. But we also had Branch Offices throughout the United States in areas where there was a substantial group of claimants. Which experience in your own life probably had the biggest impact on your ability to pull this off . This proved unique. The closest that analogy, i would say, when i did, acted as a special master in the agent orange case, involving Vietnam Veterans, who claimed injury from exposure to agent orange, dioxin, while serving in vietn vietnam. Judge winestein, federal judge, imminent judge in brooklyn, had that case. And appointed me. But even that didnt prepare me for this. What did you do in the agent orange case . I first acted as a mediator to help resolve the dispute between a class of Vietnam Veterans claiming injury. And the Chemical Companies who manufactured the product. After i settled, helped settle that case, under judge winesteins auspices, we established a claims program to allocated funds, 180 million, which grew to about 300 million over 10 years. And we allocated that, and targeted that to eligible veterans. Did you have a time in your 33 months where you said ive got to get out of this, this is driving me nuts . Never, never. There were some rough times. But the roughest, what were they . At the beginning, the families. Never the American People. The American People, the politicians, the media, solidly behind this program. Even families from other terrorist attacks, who werent eligible, like oklahoma city, or from the first World Trade Center in 1993, very supportive of the program. The toughest part was convincing the 9 11 families themselves of the wisdom and the bona fideness of the program that. Was tough. Especially the first year. So close to the 9 11 disaster itself. What would have happened, we know how feelings are now, what would have happened had this program not succeeded to the airlines . I dont know. The airlines pushed this program ras an alternative to litigation. The airlines were concerned that if thousands of people sued the airlines, and the World Trade Center, and the port authority, and boeing and the security companies, that this litigation would inhibit, or undercut, any the willingness of anybody to fly. So they felt this was an important diversion out of the court system. I think, probably im not sure how successful it was in preventing bankruptcy. The airlines seem to have enough difficulty, as you say, as it is. That was the genesis. There are a number of names in your book. Chuck hagel, senator from nebraska, a republican. Senator hagel is the reason i really was appointed by the attorney general. As a former chief of staff to senator kennedy, i wasnt exactly the person who everybody would automatically assume would be assigned this task, by the attorney general and the administration. Chuck hagel, who i have known since agent orange for over 20 years, personally pushed at the white house and at the department of justice, claim that i was the right man to do this. You wanted this job, you say. Oh, yes. I think millions of people would have wanted this job. Did many people apply for the job . Of no idea. To this day, i dont know if the administration sought out others. Or offered it to others. What were you doing at the moment you decided you wanted the job . I was feeching at the university of pennsylvania law school, i was teaching. And i read about the program. I was coming back on the train, and i said to myself, i think this is something that i want to do. Because you step back. Where were you the moment of 9 11 . At the university of pennsylvania law school. I had just come out of a class that i was teaching. Up in the Student Union television, i saw the first plane, the results of the first plane hitting the World Trade Center. And while i was in desire belief saw the second plane hit. Then i headed back from pennsylvania to washington. Were you on the train when you headed back . I was on the train when the plane hit the pentagon. And the train, amtrak, stopped in wilmington, and announced that was it. I knew a couple of people on the train, heading back to washington. And we went outside, we negotiated with the cab driver to drive us the remaining hour and a half. And we drove back together in a taxi. What did you talk about on that taxi ride . Just that this was something that is hard to believe. That it could happen in america. Disbelief, like everybody else. We discussed about how it could happen, the implications, was there more attacks that would be in the next few hours, would we suffer more attacks. I was worried about my two children at least, one was a student at new york law school, near the World Trade Center. Another was a student at georgetown, across the river from the pentagon. We worried about their safety. Not as concerned about my third, who was an undergraduate in ver ront, at middle bury, rural area. Still you worry about the family members. If we asked your kids today about your job for 33 months, what would they say . I dont know. I think theyre very proud. I think theyre very proud. I think that they were concerned about my physical and mental well being doing this job. But i think they beam with pride that i did it. And that i did it well. Now my wife, who, i dont want to leave her out, was incredibly supportive of the whole process. There wasnt a time when she said, ken, or some people call you, kenny, its time to get out of this . No, to the contrary, very, very supportive. My wife is was a stalwart in not only urging me to do it, but more than anybody else, sort of being there, every night, when i came home, at my side and reinforcing my resolve to get it done. You forget, until you read your book, the time between september 11, 2001 and the time they decided to do this was minimal. 11 days. That was the problem, you see. The emotion of 9 11, was so pronounced, so recent, so real that explaining to family members the wisdom of the program fell on deaf ears for a long time. Mr. Fine berg, youre here offering money, they havent even found my husbands body in that rubble. And youre here, like some lawyer, with a release and a check . How dare you. And that pervasive obstacle to success, ees, venting, ranting about the unfairness of life greatly inhibited my ability to succeed during the first 12 to 18 months of the program. Did you ever ask them why they were so strong in the reaction . Didnt have to. They offered. Either they were they played away at the failure of the government to protect their loved one, they, sobbing, would vent at the unfairness of life, why my husband, why my wife, why my son and not him and not her. Great concern expressed about how theyre ever going to move on with the loss of a loved one who was the glue that kept the family together. All of these religious complaints, how could god ever allow this . I was the, sort of, the target for all of the emotional trauma. You say that two things in your past impacted how you went about your job. One, you came from a blue collar family. And your jewish heritage. Explain that. I think that had obviously everybody is influenced by their heritage. My respect for the underdog, my respect for those who are not at the pinnacle, but are trying to improve their lot. My respect for the vagueries, the uncertainries of life, are part of my jewish heritage. I think all of that helped formulate some of an approach that i took where the program couldnt have been more nonadversarial. I was a fiduciary for these families. Whats that mean . I was really there as their supporter, to help them, not to question, not to antagonize, not to undercut. To the contrary. I was there asking them, help me give you more of an award. I have rules i have to follow. But im here to really help. Over time, over the 33 months that i was the special master, i think that view became well entrenched in the families perspective about the program. Your blue collar background was what . My father had been a tire salesman, a retail tire salesman in massachusetts, a blue collar town, brockton. And striving, everybody trying to improve their lot. He was the son of immigrants from eastern europe. And i just think that respect for the unfortunate, for the underdog, had a lot to do with it. What about your mom . My mother, the same. Very loving homemaker. Very loyal to her three children. My sister and my brother. And also eager to help the less fortunate. Explain more about the jewish heritage, what is it about the jewish world that you its different than, say, other worlds. I dont know how different. Maybe other religions have similar characteristics. In my case, i think a very healthy respect for the less fortunate. The minorities. Those who are not mainstream. Also, part of my heritage, i think, a recognition that there are no certainties in life. I think the jewish heritage acknowledges that there are always situations you cant anticipate, that dont always assume, where is it written that life is fair. Where is it written . Its not written that life is fair. Its not written that you automatically can control all aspects of your destiny. And i think in the course of this program, if i ever learned anything, that reinforced that, it was learning how one person survived and another didnt, based on the most sern into us reasons. Mr. Fineberg, i would have been in thatting for the first time, i wasnt there, i had to take my kid to the first grade, to school. Otherwise i would have been in the building. One family from a foreign country, the husband had never been in the United States, ever. He flew in the night before, first time in the United Stat