Transcripts For CSPAN2 Book Discussion On A Curious Madness

Transcripts For CSPAN2 Book Discussion On A Curious Madness 20140216

As well as work on this book. I might as well mention that we started dating shortly to mess meeting here and now we work together. So hopefully this meaning does is cause that that one day. [laughter] though if it does say could be a little trouble later at home. [laughter] the book is a curious madness an american combat psychiatrist, a japanese war crimes suspect, an unsolved mystery from world war ii. Im going to work my way back from the psychiatrist in the war crimes suspect in an touch on the mystery just a little bit more at the hand and take any questions you may have. Should you bother the nuremberg trials that followed world war ii, but you might not be aware there were several trials in japan after the war. Because of the tokyo tribe. Some people refer to them as japans nurnberg. There were 28 classy defendants who are part of the tokyo tribe. These were former Prime Ministers, heads of state, military leaders. Really consider it the 28 individuals most responsible for japans rice to board. The imperial rise. Started than it was tojo hideki who was Prime Minister when japan bombed pearl harbor. The only civilian among the 20 classy defendants as an ideologue and a writer named o. Pala shoot me. This is okawa here. Okawa is considered to be a good civilian brain trust. He was kind divine that directed the military might. Even if you didnt know that okawa was the lone civilian trial that day, you would have immediately realized from the first day of the trial that he didnt quite fit in with the rest of the crew. They described as rather eccentric entrants of the first day of the trial of the first page of the book. Okawa shuemi arrived looking every bit the madman. Mayfair company to 46. The best for drop that the defendant could have had 3 00 in the morning. Okawa entered the courtroom wearing traditional japanese cacti, with clouds and a wrinkled light blue shirt that looks pajama top. He took his place at the center back up to two row prisoner talk to face the International Panel of judges and a front of them was the former general who recognize the road over for his bald head and rants but goals. Yet the expression of a man to his execution. Of other defendants, on the okawa lacked the short formality demanded of him. It gives the impression Wesley Barker having wandered into a funeral icon into a church. Now, this eccentric behavior that okawa display began after the trial began. He was reading a statement against the classy suspects. Okawa became fidgeting and muttering gibberish. It is bothering defendants to his left and right. He takes the inappropriate pajama top and start sliding down her shoulder, x is the next test in an even more inappropriate way and suddenly, out of nowhere, he thenceforward come takes his hand and he slaps him on the spot but had to the courtroom erupted into a bit of a commotion and what has okawa do in response . He slaps a 10 again. At that point they had to settle down the court. They took a recess. When they reconvene, did they moved okawa the courtroom. One from the lsa. To evaluate okawas legal competence to see if he could stand trial. A couple days later the psychiatrist come back and theyve reached an agreement. Okawa clearly cannot stand trial. Hes incompetent, doesnt know right from wrong. In a word, he had gone insane. So what the court did was they moved okawa to a Mental Hospital to convalescent hopefully get better. As the trial proceeded and eventually the verdicts were handed down, seven of the japanese classy suspects were picked up at, including tojo. The rest began prison sentences they ranged up to life in jail. And when should know the couple days after that, okawa shuemi leaves the Mental Hospital, looking fine, says hes feeling fine domain gets to go home. In fact, as the Associated Press were at the time coming in is the only one of the original 28 defendants to go free. You might be wondering what my interest in this is in its very simple. My grandfather was the psychiatrist who evaluated okawa for the tokyo trial. That is this man here, daniel jaffe,a, psychiatrist or in the war the tour to japan for the occupation. My grandfather didnt talk much about his lawyer. He didnt talk much at all as i will explain in a few minutes. Right before he died he wrote up some memoirs of his time in the service in these memoirs circulated throughout her family and i got my hands on them and was able to read them. I was really mesmerized and riveted by his description of this evaluation he can get in of okawa for the tokyo trial and the most fascinating part of that section of these memoirs. Some historians doubted his conclusion, which is to say sun has taureans believed okawa soaked his insanity see if my grammar either escape justice. I never got to ask my grand father about this before he died, but after he died, i took my math or unhealthy obsession and it and started researching into the life in washington d. C. One day. I pulled the file on okawa and im flipping through it and i come to a very interesting page draft as cia and the late 1950s. The cia had considered the case at the tokyo trial me to believe my grandfather had been deceived. The final words on that page were suspect that insanity was stained. This is like an official state denial. Over time i came across more and more doubters. There were more articles from the tokyo trial same people on the courtroom were whispering okawa had stage and act. An interview given by one of the justices on the panel who said he had quote, unquote defeats the court in psychiatrist. There is an interview from okawa himself that he or he had been able to go home, seeing as i look like theres nothing really ever seriously wrong with my mind. At this touched off i mean, there are these voices and opinions coming out on okawa said in his historical controversy, historical mystery. I thought there was anybody speaking for my grandfather say. There were a few people, the least of which my grand father didnt get a chance to tell his side. He died before it the chance to publish his memoirs. I made up a mission if you will to vindicate his evaluation and a sense they make it his legacy in our family. This touched off the three plus years of research and writing that went into the book. I was pretty sure if they started researching that i would indicate my grand father because when i was growing up, all anybody told me about him is hes a brilliant man. Ill ever heard was he at this enormously retentive mind and could kind of observe anything and everything in his environment. I have a cousin tell a story one time is taking a book off the shelf, saying the page number in my grandfather sitting on the other side of the room starts reciting as if hes holding the book himself. My cousins a bit of a wiseguy. He would do things like he would take a leaf and know exactly what species of tree it was from and tell you exactly what kind of bird that was. He was sick of living, breathing iphone at. The toughest thing about writing and learning about my grand fathers life as they did know anything about it other than the fact he was reportedly brilliant, he was extremely quiet. He never talks. In fact, he kind of fulfilled the selfeffacing mantra he had come in which he, which was it is better to keep your mouth shut and be considered a fool than to open it and remove all doubt. He really tried to live up to that. Talking about landscaping, gardening, chess, martinis. He was so good at not talking that ultimately he made a career out of it, which is to say after the war he became a psychoanalyst. Now when i did finally start to dig into my grandfathers history and piece together that part of his life that none of us really knew about, i got the impression it was almost like his entire life had been kind of planned out and meeting him directly to that moment in the courtroom when he had to evaluate okawa shuemi. What i mean is from an early age he had been surrounded by matt s. Facetoface. He came home one day to find his mother had suffered a complete mental break down. She had been moved to the first of many asylums that would be her home for the rest of your life. Rather unexpectedly his mother his father died salish 22 he was effectively, along with his siblings orphaned. It is even a little harder than if hed actually been more fitting because he had to manage a lot of his mothers affairs. My grandfather had to deal with the Brooklyn Court system to manage finances since that was enabled to manage and around. He had to do with that or is that whatever sanitary and she called home at the time because he had to make sure she got the best possible treatment. Medical school he was facetoface with madness there, too. He studied under walter newman. Its probably because you know the man introduced and popularized lobotomy. Much of that is much deserved. Seen as a package of both psychiatric treatments were trying to replace the passivity and sort the problem not of society at all. We replaced it but back to intervention. The intention was to relieve suffering. After all this, my grandfather was facetoface once i was the word began when he served as a combat psychiatrist, treating casualties up at the front line. Im going to read your bit about what the job entailed in world war ii. At the start of the war, the American Military believed it could screw out mental weakness. After two years of brutal conflict, psychiatric casualties remarkably high, officials came to terms with the fact that ahmed pushed hard enough in combat had a psychological breaking point. So in november 1943, dear me arrange for a single psychiatrist in action. They were responsible for the Mental Health of troops over the full course of service for morale during Training Camps to treatment on the front lines. They were blown protectors for every 15,000 active soldiers. During combat the division psychiatrists cared or mental casualties in the medical battalion. Company. This is a makeshift Treatment Centers situated miles from the front lines. His primary task was to relieve combat fatigue. The updated term for what during world war i have been called shell shock. That moment i am a name when the sound of artillery inside of shrapnel with the smell of blood in the memory of all that matters far midcentury signal to scramble the young mans nerves. Extremely debilitating, malcolm required evacuation to a General Hospital back the United States. For when treated by the combat psychiatrist, quickly made the battlefield with a heavy dose of sedatives and simple reassurance , recovery rates were high in world war ii and many soldiers return to action within days. My grandfather performed this role the combat psychiatrist for the 97th infantry division. The 97th Began Service in europe at 91845, chase determined thieves, favorite is officially the final shot of the european theater. Since the war in japan was still going on in early may 1945 to 97 razorback Christ Europe and the atlantic ocean. And got on troop ships to go to japan only to find out that the japanese surrender had gone through so they be going on for occupation duty instead. Do not assume i grandfather found himself in may 1946 when the tokyo trial began and okawa shuemi slapped tojo hideki on his fat bald head. Which brings me back to okawa. He is an easier time writing and researching about okawas lifetime good about my grandfather. My grandfather was this very reticent man. He keep your outlines of the details of his life, that made it hard to shield his emotional core. No such problems for training. He wrote voluminously across his life and never miss a chance to tell you what he was thinking and feeling and what you should be thinking and feeling. The only limitation is. The best overview it can give you okawas extraordinary and influential ive comes from a description i have in the first chapter of the book. At the time of the tokyo trial, okawa shuemi was happy or shy of 60. He was smaller than most japanese, saving roughly 60 and pencil thin and frail. He wants like it is so monkey figure 2a quote, unquote jerrybuilt shack. He normally had an aristocratic tastes were closing and present it is awkward for you with the professorial dignity. At the same time, his teeth are crooked and ears are big enough faces maryland cant and its easy to see one american was once described this quote, unquote, decidedly un attract it. His facial features took his own countrymen have something vaguely other than japanese. His dark eyes covered by thick lenses fit in perfectly circular frames could just as soon see wild. But other okawa like the monks he recovered endurance for you from an early age he written books a prolific pace on the stunning breadth of topics. He completed an exhaustive analysis of western colonialism, a survey of 26 senators of japanese history and a translation of the quran. He wants her to 600 page autobiography and feeling satisfied with the ncp drawn, probably destroy the whole thing. He was less conversant has been confucius and spoke at least eight languages for english and into sanskrit. When he wasnt banned books, he was lecturing us a professor. He wasnt doing either of those things. He was working at one of japans most important think tanks. When he wasnt doing any of those things for me was organizing radical activist groups to see that his ideas achieve some tangible impact on japanese society. For years it nears the day. In the mid to late 1920s, okawas challenged global western hegemony. Psychological for war in the eyes of the tokyo trial accusers. In the early 1930s, resulted in the assassination of Prime Minister and signified the moment when japans aspiring democracy effectively ceded control to the military. In the late 1941, days after pearl harbor he broadcast the Popular Series of radio lectures that outline the history of western political oppression and reminded listeners of the prophecy he made in 1925 to japan in the United States would meet in a quote, unquote lifeanddeath struggle for world order in japan would win. His exceptional intelligence came at a quick temper, and an explicitness aspired descriptions as now content or brilliant madman. One contemporary city had too much education to be peachtree opposed to hotblooded to be a scholar. He was imprisoned twice and covered her close ties with the military in even closer ties with geisha girls. In fact, he married one. Hes been called an oriental don quixote for his peculiar antics. This ideology, this idea of uniting east asian nations of the japanese leadership in opposing the western power, western force Company Called this asian miss him and he often referred to as japans divine mission. He thought it was written in the stars for japan to leave this asian union against the western powers than in the process reconfigure world order. The tenants of asian miss him alternately set japan on a collision course with the united state. A few years before the war broke out, japan asked as its official policy what it called the new order in east asia. This is bad idea of ordering east asia around japan in the center, japan making this united block. Once the war broke out in 1941 from an america most people call the pacific war. In japan it was referred to as the were parisian liberation. This is the second component of the ideology with a asian union but then oppose the western forces. And hopefully if you are in japan. As it turned out, this new order is every bit as impressive as any old order had been because in theory, asian miss them had hoped to liberate east asian nations from western journalism, but in practice would have and most of those nations under the guise of liberation and simply replaced any western presence had been there with rather brutal japanese rule. So when the tokyo trial came around, asian miss him played a role and allied argument against the war crimes suspect. The point being that if okawa had stayed on trial and not been removed to the Mental Hospital, he did not row can down the court were to seize my grandfather by seeking a come he wouldve received the possible punishment. The best comparison would make us tooth and not the ideologue who after the nuremberg trials was hanged. So the book really reads back and forth, talking about the lives of these two men as they approach and it and to assist climactic historical encounter. But i liked about this structure and point of view as an author was that it reduced the immensity of world war ii county to individualize. We often talk about the war and write about its history duties very broad alliances in large groups. Army against army, nation against nation. But in truth, its the individuals who populated those armies and nations that really were doing the confrontations on the battlefield and advice and personal histories are every bit as profound and influential. Now, so i traveled the United States meaning veterans that served as my grandfather, learning everything i could about combat pay tree. I traveled to japan coming meeting relatives of okawa, asian scholars. I got to meet tojos granddaughter. I learned everything i could about asians. In the process of coors, i was always trying to learn about this mystery at the core of the book. What i can tell you about the mystery without giving too much away is that it is very much alive and kicking. I met a very steep tokyo trial scholar in japan who remains convinced that okawa must have deceived the court because the timing of this insanity beyond such the recovery, the timing was too perfect. I met a very influential writer who believes that okawa must have deceived the court and probably did so intentionally to expose the hypocrisy of a wartime cryo by the victorious nation. I told you about meeting the tojos granddaughter. She remembers hearing a method to see the core, but she thinks this is part of a larger allied scheme to remove okawa before he can discuss imperialism in a negative light. Now, these probably sound like conspiracy theories to some of you and you wouldnt be wrong. They certainly sound like that to me. What of that to suggest is theres a little more to it than that and ill explain what i mean reading this passage from just after may meeting tojos granddaughter. When you stop to think about it, considers the near east history to make sense of the confusing world. Maintaining a sound mind often requires us for better or worse to reject inconvenient information. If we accepted every conflicting piece of data we encountered in the chaotic fury at the site would break our no time. Starting as it is to see someone deny a fact we can that are undeniable or e

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