Transcripts For CSPAN2 Homeland Security Officials Testify O

This is just over one hour and 15 minutes. [silence] good morning, welcome to the subcommittee on oversight and management and accountability. Senate Ranking Member is okay with this proceeding, hes on his way. Federal Building Security protection of the facilities the employees and visitors a very important part of the department of Homeland Security daytoday work. Tensions have risen recently in response to the irate on maralago the passage of the inflation reduction act. We have all seen a rise in threats directed towards federal employees and federal officers. Just last month a man attempted to with violence gain entrance to an fbi office and unless wellknown are the increasingly letting threatening language that is threatened employees and those working to preserve government documents at the National Archives and records administration. While not typical those highsecurity facilities are government buildings and the men and women who work there to visit them every day are now facing Security Risks. With threats to federal facilities on the rise we look to the first frontline of defense the department of Homeland Security federal protective service. Also known as fps. It ensures more than 959,500 federally owned and operated buildings across the country are safe and secure from Government Agency headquarters here in washington d. C. To world courthouses in field offices across the country and across the 50 states. If youve ever visited federally owned building youve noticed thousands of fsb officers and contract cards providing onsite security. Fsb or fps role extends beyond the posted enters and exits fps helps Government Agencies prevent any Security Risk that result from a changing threat environment for aging infrastructure. Fps performs Facility Security assessments for all federally owned buildings and makes recommendations for improvements to ensure buildings meet the required Security Standards. These Facility Assessments and recommendations are very important to ensure the security protocols keep up with the types of threats we are seeing on a daytoday basis. Suggested recommendations can range from replacing security cameras and alarms to a date security guidance of them policies. However despite the good coordination between fps and other Government Agencies all too often these recommendations leave huge gaps in our security system. According to the Government Accountability office gao customer agencies have described fps Facility Security assessments as comprehensive, timely and useful that they have rejected about 70 of fps recommendations. Again good recommendations are awesome, 70 of the time not heated to. Gao found a variety of factors of the majority of fps recommendations not being implemented including incomplete information and of course lack of proper oversight. We can and we should do better in mitigating the risk to facilities, federal employees and citizens that visit those buildings. Today we will have the opportunity to hear more about interagency cooperation that goes into developing Building Security standards as well as the challenges of meeting those standards and with that i thank you again for joining us today. Our witnesses. I will reserve time for the Ranking Member pete mayor from michigan for his Opening Statement when he gets here. And with that members are reminded the committee will operate according to the guidelines laid out by the chairman and Ranking Member connect every third colloquy regarding remote procedures and without objection members shall be permitted to sit at these questions. Mr. Mayor i call on you for an Opening Statement. Thank you mr. Chairman for holding this important hearing today. I appreciate the subcommittee diving into this topic and are witnesses who are here today to shed light on this important issue. The federal Committee Held a hearing in june of 2019 and is importantly followup on that today. Fps is an agency has experienced multiple transitions within the department of Homeland Security formally established by the General Services administration in 1971. At this as a primary Agency Responsible for the protection of all buildings grounds and property on the occupied are secured by the federal government. Theres an enormous responsibility for an agency that often goes unnoticed and is taken for granted. Fps employs 1300 federal staff approximate 944 Law Enforcement specialist criminal investigators were k9 handlers all trained as federal law complexity. Fps relies on the team thousand contract guard staff will protective Service Officers are psos conduct security screenings at more than 9000 Federal Buildings across the country. They are the backbone of the fps operation without the help of his guard that this would make real the transmission perfection of her Federal Buildings and properties about of utmost importance. Violence against federal government buildings property and personnel is not in the norman has become more prevent in recently years and its disheartening that we must worry about things and we must and therefore conversation today is added importance and relevance. We need to ensure that he is has the tools and authority to operate as effectively as possible. If not it ps in jail the Government Accountability highrisk list since 2003 j. Ellis found its not assessing risk at Federal Buildings consist with standards under the protection plant recommended in the free market yes plan. This is worrisome because failures by fps could have catastrophic results. My focus of todays hearing is on the security assessment process at ts provides recommendations every federal facility in accordance with the Interagency Security Committee standards. The standards are housed within the Infrastructure Security Division and establishes monitors enhances Security Protection at federal facilities. As we hear from our Witnesses Today a large majority of the recommendations have come out in those assessments had not been implemented which make the excel does question why not . The id like to hear their perspectives from other witnesses on the following questions number one is fps position correctly within dhs and how this fps work with fights and how corporate it is that relationship . Why is there a large majority of assessment recommendations go on implemented in turn is there a better way we can do this process and ford is at guess at the right force structure with most of their workforce and contract accordance in is that the structure appropriate and effective for the role of fps today . Mr. Chairman im grateful we are holding this hearing and this is a sometimes overlooked even see and place an ever Important Role in protecting our government. If we had to take our oversight responsibly seriously and i look or do hearing from our witnesses to determine what actions we can take moving forward. Thank you and i yield back. Thank you mr. Meijer and now id like to welcome our panel of witnesses. Versed we have mr. Cline Deputy Director for the federal protective service. Mr. Cline has worked with at ps4 20 years where he coordinates federal state and local officials to ensure the protection of buildings grounds and properties that are owned occupied or secured by the federal government. Mr. Cline previously served 20 years with the u. S. Army military marine corps regiment. A second witness mr. Scott brower associate director for security programs for the Infrastructure Security Division at the cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency or so separate he secures the nations Critical Infrastructure in coordination with government and private actors. He has over 30 years of military and Senior Executive experience in the u. S. Government. Our third witness is latham acting director of the physical and for structured team at the Government Accountability office or gao. She has worked for gao for nearly 20 years where she oversees gaos work on federal Property Management including Facility Security and personal assets. With the chechen the witnesses full statements will be inserted into the record and i now ask each witness to summarize his or her statement in five minutes. Beginning with Deputy Director cline. Welcome sir. Aborning chairman correa Ranking Member meijer im honored to be here today represent the federal Protection Service or at ts. To testify that the essential role we play in protecting employees to thank you for the opportunity raise awareness about the physicality of our mission. Fps employs nearly thousand dedicated Law Enforcement officers to protect the people and property of the federal government and her Services Provide retractions in to deter threats at thousands of facilities across the United States and territories and protects millions of employees. Our highest party is the safety and security of them will wear the 1. 4 million employees working in the facilities that we protect. We cannot achieve this mission without the dedication of focus of the men and women of this service but i believe they are the most dedicated professional employees in the federal government and its an honor to represent them here today. In a recent act of violence is continuing across the nation remains in a heightened seven prime to according to the latest bulletin central targets include government personnel. Theres an increase in threats first departments most notably the federal bureau of investigations the Internal Revenue service and National Archives and record administration. You think these are protection efforts of those facilities occupied by these agencies and remain prepared and response activities. On a given day a single fps protected this 1000 of security working together protect the integrity of buildings to closely monitor buildings to ensure facilities are secure. Our Law Enforcement officer and protective Security Officers highly trained and prepared to deter attacks recently demonstrated the cincinnati field office. Those perfections took action and are typically the first line of defense. We celebrate the dedication and selfless commitment and recognize their efforts this week as part of the National Security officer appreciation week. From federal courthouses were highprofile trials take place Daycare Centers and federal facilities we protect the most innocent. Fps is time and time again proving their Dynamic Dedicated Law Enforcement agency. Fps directly protects 233 Congressional District offices located in buildings across the protection portfolio. We have a responsibility for protection efforts of these facilities to work closely and have strong relationships with United States Capital Police and senate armed step to ensure the safety of all members. Established over 50 years ago fps is made remarkable progress as organization and is an integral part of the department of Homeland Securitys mission to save hard the american people. Our Law Enforcement officers administer lifesaving medical treatment conducting yearlong investigations and can be injured in line of duty protect teen federal employees. Our officers are among those who responded to the Law Enforcement january 6 of 2021 to help secure the capitol. Fps aesthetics rarely successful when called to defend the protect various institutions of our government to function in first with a sincerely appreciate the subcommittee holding this important hearing and asking me to testify in fps Important Role in id be pleased to answer any questions you may have. Please summarize your statement for five minutes. Welcome sir. Members of the subcommittee. The structure Security Agency and Infrastructure Security Division i appreciate the opportunity to appear before you today to discuss the interagency security call of the protection of Federal Buildings in its effort to improve preparedness coordinator and with partners. On october 19, 1995 sixmonth after the obama said owning president clinton issued an executive order creating the interagency security to adjust the quality and effectiveness of federal facilities. Members of the isc seniorlevel executives from 66 federal Department Agencies to this collective security subject matter allowed them to develop toptier Risk Management resources and coordinate an area for solution of poems that cant be solved by the agencies involved. If you collect the work by with through its members with the primary Governance Framework and subcommittee working together. These working groups which are provisional or established by isik with clear objectives in mind. In march of 2003 he was transferred to dhs. Dhs delegated this facility in light of its role to help protect and secure the nation. Its the stewardship of the isc ensures the workforce leverages state local territorial tribal organizations as well as the private sector all central partners as we work to ensure the continued protection of federal facilities and assets across the nation and around the world. Executive order 12977 gave the isc three key responsibilities. These include established policies with security and the protection of federal facilities developing and evaluating Security Standards and strategy to ensure compliance and to take action to enhance quality and effectiveness of the Security Protection of federal facilities. The isc fulfill these responsibilities in multiple lines including the risk process standard. The standard provides an integrate physical security countermeasures in guidance and customization for all nonmilitary facilities. Iac members created the standard to provide a common method for all federal facility stakeholders in a standardized way to help facility owners identify levels of protection needed to mitigate that risk. Further the oc validates number Risk Assessment Training Programs as needed to process data. This helps build individual organizational capabilities to implement isc guidance and conduct fps Risk Assessment tool of validated by the ic. Additionally fps physical Security Training program located at the federal Law Enforcement Training Center similarly is allocated by the ic for this Training Program trained fps person on how to conduct Risk Assessment using their validated modified facility. The main drivers of threats the federal facilities are targeted by violent threats. As noted in the most recent dhs advisory bulletin. These threats are becoming more varied and complex. It will remain a top priority at fps fps. Dhs is committed to using every resource available to protect and mitigate threats of violence directed at their old buildings. Thank you again for the opportunity to appear before you today and for this committees continued support of secession or department but in the war to working closely with you and other members of congress to keep our federal facility and those who work there safe and secure. Thank you for your testimony nonnow recognize ms. Latham to summarize your statement in five minutes or less. Welcome. Thank you good morning. Chairman correa Ranking Member meijer members of torres thank you for the opportunity to discuss the federal protective service and Ranking Member<\/a> is okay with this proceeding, hes on his way. Federal Building Security<\/a> protection of the facilities the employees and visitors a very important part of the department of Homeland Security<\/a> daytoday work. Tensions have risen recently in response to the irate on maralago the passage of the inflation reduction act. We have all seen a rise in threats directed towards federal employees and federal officers. Just last month a man attempted to with violence gain entrance to an fbi office and unless wellknown are the increasingly letting threatening language that is threatened employees and those working to preserve government documents at the National Archives<\/a> and records administration. While not typical those highsecurity facilities are government buildings and the men and women who work there to visit them every day are now facing Security Risk<\/a>s. With threats to federal facilities on the rise we look to the first frontline of defense the department of Homeland Security<\/a> federal protective service. Also known as fps. It ensures more than 959,500 federally owned and operated buildings across the country are safe and secure from Government Agency<\/a> headquarters here in washington d. C. To world courthouses in field offices across the country and across the 50 states. If youve ever visited federally owned building youve noticed thousands of fsb officers and contract cards providing onsite security. Fsb or fps role extends beyond the posted enters and exits fps helps Government Agencies<\/a> prevent any Security Risk<\/a> that result from a changing threat environment for aging infrastructure. Fps performs Facility Security<\/a> assessments for all federally owned buildings and makes recommendations for improvements to ensure buildings meet the required Security Standards<\/a>. These Facility Assessments<\/a> and recommendations are very important to ensure the security protocols keep up with the types of threats we are seeing on a daytoday basis. Suggested recommendations can range from replacing security cameras and alarms to a date security guidance of them policies. However despite the good coordination between fps and other Government Agencies<\/a> all too often these recommendations leave huge gaps in our security system. According to the Government Accountability<\/a> office gao customer agencies have described fps Facility Security<\/a> assessments as comprehensive, timely and useful that they have rejected about 70 of fps recommendations. Again good recommendations are awesome, 70 of the time not heated to. Gao found a variety of factors of the majority of fps recommendations not being implemented including incomplete information and of course lack of proper oversight. We can and we should do better in mitigating the risk to facilities, federal employees and citizens that visit those buildings. Today we will have the opportunity to hear more about interagency cooperation that goes into developing Building Security<\/a> standards as well as the challenges of meeting those standards and with that i thank you again for joining us today. Our witnesses. I will reserve time for the Ranking Member<\/a> pete mayor from michigan for his Opening Statement<\/a> when he gets here. And with that members are reminded the committee will operate according to the guidelines laid out by the chairman and Ranking Member<\/a> connect every third colloquy regarding remote procedures and without objection members shall be permitted to sit at these questions. Mr. Mayor i call on you for an Opening Statement<\/a>. Thank you mr. Chairman for holding this important hearing today. I appreciate the subcommittee diving into this topic and are witnesses who are here today to shed light on this important issue. The federal Committee Held<\/a> a hearing in june of 2019 and is importantly followup on that today. Fps is an agency has experienced multiple transitions within the department of Homeland Security<\/a> formally established by the General Services<\/a> administration in 1971. At this as a primary Agency Responsible<\/a> for the protection of all buildings grounds and property on the occupied are secured by the federal government. Theres an enormous responsibility for an agency that often goes unnoticed and is taken for granted. Fps employs 1300 federal staff approximate 944 Law Enforcement<\/a> specialist criminal investigators were k9 handlers all trained as federal law complexity. Fps relies on the team thousand contract guard staff will protective Service Officers<\/a> are psos conduct security screenings at more than 9000 Federal Building<\/a>s across the country. They are the backbone of the fps operation without the help of his guard that this would make real the transmission perfection of her Federal Building<\/a>s and properties about of utmost importance. Violence against federal government buildings property and personnel is not in the norman has become more prevent in recently years and its disheartening that we must worry about things and we must and therefore conversation today is added importance and relevance. We need to ensure that he is has the tools and authority to operate as effectively as possible. If not it ps in jail the Government Accountability<\/a> highrisk list since 2003 j. Ellis found its not assessing risk at Federal Building<\/a>s consist with standards under the protection plant recommended in the free market yes plan. This is worrisome because failures by fps could have catastrophic results. My focus of todays hearing is on the security assessment process at ts provides recommendations every federal facility in accordance with the Interagency Security Committee<\/a> standards. The standards are housed within the Infrastructure Security Division<\/a> and establishes monitors enhances Security Protection<\/a> at federal facilities. As we hear from our Witnesses Today<\/a> a large majority of the recommendations have come out in those assessments had not been implemented which make the excel does question why not . The id like to hear their perspectives from other witnesses on the following questions number one is fps position correctly within dhs and how this fps work with fights and how corporate it is that relationship . Why is there a large majority of assessment recommendations go on implemented in turn is there a better way we can do this process and ford is at guess at the right force structure with most of their workforce and contract accordance in is that the structure appropriate and effective for the role of fps today . Mr. Chairman im grateful we are holding this hearing and this is a sometimes overlooked even see and place an ever Important Role<\/a> in protecting our government. If we had to take our oversight responsibly seriously and i look or do hearing from our witnesses to determine what actions we can take moving forward. Thank you and i yield back. Thank you mr. Meijer and now id like to welcome our panel of witnesses. Versed we have mr. Cline Deputy Director<\/a> for the federal protective service. Mr. Cline has worked with at ps4 20 years where he coordinates federal state and local officials to ensure the protection of buildings grounds and properties that are owned occupied or secured by the federal government. Mr. Cline previously served 20 years with the u. S. Army military marine corps regiment. A second witness mr. Scott brower associate director for security programs for the Infrastructure Security Division<\/a> at the cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency<\/a> or so separate he secures the nations Critical Infrastructure<\/a> in coordination with government and private actors. He has over 30 years of military and Senior Executive<\/a> experience in the u. S. Government. Our third witness is latham acting director of the physical and for structured team at the Government Accountability<\/a> office or gao. She has worked for gao for nearly 20 years where she oversees gaos work on federal Property Management<\/a> including Facility Security<\/a> and personal assets. With the chechen the witnesses full statements will be inserted into the record and i now ask each witness to summarize his or her statement in five minutes. Beginning with Deputy Director<\/a> cline. Welcome sir. Aborning chairman correa Ranking Member<\/a> meijer im honored to be here today represent the federal Protection Service<\/a> or at ts. To testify that the essential role we play in protecting employees to thank you for the opportunity raise awareness about the physicality of our mission. Fps employs nearly thousand dedicated Law Enforcement<\/a> officers to protect the people and property of the federal government and her Services Provide<\/a> retractions in to deter threats at thousands of facilities across the United States<\/a> and territories and protects millions of employees. Our highest party is the safety and security of them will wear the 1. 4 million employees working in the facilities that we protect. We cannot achieve this mission without the dedication of focus of the men and women of this service but i believe they are the most dedicated professional employees in the federal government and its an honor to represent them here today. In a recent act of violence is continuing across the nation remains in a heightened seven prime to according to the latest bulletin central targets include government personnel. Theres an increase in threats first departments most notably the federal bureau of investigations the Internal Revenue<\/a> service and National Archives<\/a> and record administration. You think these are protection efforts of those facilities occupied by these agencies and remain prepared and response activities. On a given day a single fps protected this 1000 of security working together protect the integrity of buildings to closely monitor buildings to ensure facilities are secure. Our Law Enforcement<\/a> officer and protective Security Officers<\/a> highly trained and prepared to deter attacks recently demonstrated the cincinnati field office. Those perfections took action and are typically the first line of defense. We celebrate the dedication and selfless commitment and recognize their efforts this week as part of the National Security<\/a> officer appreciation week. From federal courthouses were highprofile trials take place Daycare Centers<\/a> and federal facilities we protect the most innocent. Fps is time and time again proving their Dynamic Dedicated<\/a> Law Enforcement<\/a> agency. Fps directly protects 233 Congressional District<\/a> offices located in buildings across the protection portfolio. We have a responsibility for protection efforts of these facilities to work closely and have strong relationships with United States<\/a> Capital Police<\/a> and senate armed step to ensure the safety of all members. Established over 50 years ago fps is made remarkable progress as organization and is an integral part of the department of Homeland Security<\/a>s mission to save hard the american people. Our Law Enforcement<\/a> officers administer lifesaving medical treatment conducting yearlong investigations and can be injured in line of duty protect teen federal employees. Our officers are among those who responded to the Law Enforcement<\/a> january 6 of 2021 to help secure the capitol. Fps aesthetics rarely successful when called to defend the protect various institutions of our government to function in first with a sincerely appreciate the subcommittee holding this important hearing and asking me to testify in fps Important Role<\/a> in id be pleased to answer any questions you may have. Please summarize your statement for five minutes. Welcome sir. Members of the subcommittee. The structure Security Agency<\/a> and Infrastructure Security Division<\/a> i appreciate the opportunity to appear before you today to discuss the interagency security call of the protection of Federal Building<\/a>s in its effort to improve preparedness coordinator and with partners. On october 19, 1995 sixmonth after the obama said owning president clinton issued an executive order creating the interagency security to adjust the quality and effectiveness of federal facilities. Members of the isc seniorlevel executives from 66 federal Department Agencies<\/a> to this collective security subject matter allowed them to develop toptier Risk Management<\/a> resources and coordinate an area for solution of poems that cant be solved by the agencies involved. If you collect the work by with through its members with the primary Governance Framework<\/a> and subcommittee working together. These working groups which are provisional or established by isik with clear objectives in mind. In march of 2003 he was transferred to dhs. Dhs delegated this facility in light of its role to help protect and secure the nation. Its the stewardship of the isc ensures the workforce leverages state local territorial tribal organizations as well as the private sector all central partners as we work to ensure the continued protection of federal facilities and assets across the nation and around the world. Executive order 12977 gave the isc three key responsibilities. These include established policies with security and the protection of federal facilities developing and evaluating Security Standards<\/a> and strategy to ensure compliance and to take action to enhance quality and effectiveness of the Security Protection<\/a> of federal facilities. The isc fulfill these responsibilities in multiple lines including the risk process standard. The standard provides an integrate physical security countermeasures in guidance and customization for all nonmilitary facilities. Iac members created the standard to provide a common method for all federal facility stakeholders in a standardized way to help facility owners identify levels of protection needed to mitigate that risk. Further the oc validates number Risk Assessment<\/a> Training Programs<\/a> as needed to process data. This helps build individual organizational capabilities to implement isc guidance and conduct fps Risk Assessment<\/a> tool of validated by the ic. Additionally fps physical Security Training<\/a> program located at the federal Law Enforcement<\/a> Training Center<\/a> similarly is allocated by the ic for this Training Program<\/a> trained fps person on how to conduct Risk Assessment<\/a> using their validated modified facility. The main drivers of threats the federal facilities are targeted by violent threats. As noted in the most recent dhs advisory bulletin. These threats are becoming more varied and complex. It will remain a top priority at fps fps. Dhs is committed to using every resource available to protect and mitigate threats of violence directed at their old buildings. Thank you again for the opportunity to appear before you today and for this committees continued support of secession or department but in the war to working closely with you and other members of congress to keep our federal facility and those who work there safe and secure. Thank you for your testimony nonnow recognize ms. Latham to summarize your statement in five minutes or less. Welcome. Thank you good morning. Chairman correa Ranking Member<\/a> meijer members of torres thank you for the opportunity to discuss the federal protective service and Security Risk<\/a> assessment. As you mentioned we have decimated federal Property Management<\/a> is a highrisk area since 2003 in part because of the physical security challenges at federal facilities. My Statement Today<\/a> will focus on the prior and ongoing work. First i will cover the stakeholders views on fps facilities silagy assessment and security recommendations. Next i will discuss the primary observations of fps Law Enforcement<\/a> deployment. First reported in june of 2021. Stakeholders were satisfied with fps security assessment process however many of them expressed concern with the content fps provided in these reports as they Important Information<\/a> that could help agencies make decisions. Stakeholders supported their concerns about and discourage them from implementing security measures intended to reduce security threats. In that report we recommended the drug are of fps document the assumption and sources used to develop the cost estimate each recommended security measure. As of august of 2022 fps has taken steps to address the recommendations in part by updating its directives and manual for conduct needs assessments. We are now in the process of analyzing with fps actions are fully responsive to our recommendations. Next fps data indicate security recommendations are generally not implemented as the chairman mentioned and show between fiscal year 2017 and 2021 fps made more than 25,000 security recommendations at 5000 federal facilities. These recommendations range from physical vulnerabilities to ensuring policy guidance documents. Furthermore fps data shows it did not receive a decision as to whether agencies approved or rejected more than half of the 25,000 security recommendations. The data also shows agencys approval of the recommendation does not necessarily mean it will be implemented. 6800 recommendations only 200 have been implemented. Sps officials also noted that some recommendations stayed open for years as they take time to secure the funding and implement some of the more costly recommended security measures. In our ongoing work we look for and identify factors in an agencies decision to approve or reject security recommendations and we also look at why fps has not received information on those decisions to be expected report in early 2023. In addition to conducting Facility Security<\/a> assessments sps provides Law Enforcement<\/a> support other federal agencies to eliminate the secretions from ongoing work so the number these fps will deploy Law Enforcement<\/a> officers has increase and the year 2020. These officers are deployed to augment security at fps facilities to support other agencies home in security operations. Sps deployment for example has help in securing federal facilities during protests in and housing for migrant. As a final point staffing is also an important consideration so fps can be staff. When fps was in the Cybersecurity Infrastructure<\/a> Security Agency<\/a> we reported sbs have difficulty obtaining good staff. Sps had not filled 20 of its authors positions including 200 Law Enforcement<\/a> positions. We are currently conducting work on these changes since if he is moved the Management Directorate<\/a> and collaborating on Staffing Shortage<\/a>s. We expect this work right into 2022. Members of the subcommittee this concludes my statement. Thank you very much. We thank the witnesses for your testimony and nevermind the subcommittee that each one of us has five minutes to question the panel and i now recognize myself for five minutes for questions. Your testimony is very important. 70 of the fsb fps recommendations not implemented. Ms. Latham you cite a number of factors. You cited the challenges of the southern border. Is this 70 nonimplementation something by you or something thats been going on for a number of years . Thank you for the question. The work we are doing now is to further some of the recent we had heard in our prior work were due to not having proper estimates as i noted in the needed these cost estimates to further understand the scale of whats needed to address them. They also said they needed the information for example if they were in a building that was older. Let me and robbed. We only have a few minutes as these questions. Again is this something new or has this been going on for three, four, five years or decades . I dont know the time period. Mr. Cline could you help the out here . Absolutely chairman correa. Its been going on for a good while sir. I ask this because first of all let me say thank you for the good work you do for building citizens and federal employees. Your job is like finding a nail in the haystack yet failure is unacceptable. The Oklahoma City<\/a> bombing and 9 11. We had failures that were big. Its not you, its us and what im trying to do is figure out a way to help you do your job that are. 70 . Help you out here. Give me a little bit of a roadmap welcomed the event and tell me what we need to do prayer is because 70 of your recommendations are not being implemented and thats not something im comfortable listening to today. Mr. Cline plays please. Thank you sir and representative breor recommended we looked at the countermeasures and thats an approach we have corrected and its very difficult. Typically a lack of resources from agencies to take countermeasures. Albeit in season facility have to agree to that countermeasure recommendation and never took up they have to fund their share of that cost for that countermeasure recommendation. My counterpart at isc the recently established a program to observe the compliance by agency of the countermeasure recommendation. I think it might be worthwhile to have mr. Breor talk about how we are doing that. Mr. Breor please. Under the process which initially came out in 2131 of the key aspects of that is you have a standard in compliance to that standard. We are working with their interagency partners. At the end of that its that agency that risk. What we rolled out in 2019 we are now receiving reports from departments and agencies with respect to this process standard at shooter and prohibited items to these facilities. Im happy to say this year and going long with gao best practices we actually finished the pilot of a verification program. There was nothing to verify that complaints of Going Forward<\/a> will be a live verify it to the compliance system. I have further questions. Im not a time so id like to recognize the Ranking Member<\/a> of the subcommittee mr. Meijer for further questions. Senate mr. Chairman obviously its in difficult decision you find yourselves in because you are making recommendations and trying to get those recommendations and trying to present it in a way thats going to be most conducive to them ultimately being adopted while the same time having at vs personnel standing and not in the interim. During the george floyd protest and acceleration is group took advantage of that chaos and shot and killed mr. Underwood and whether this partner. I dont want to dwell on that one tragic incident but how does f. Ps balance the desire to have those recommendations being implemented with the fact that fps personnel are protecting specially on the pso site protecting him potentially made vulnerable it does recommendations are not openly implemented. Mr. Cline . Thank you sir. This is a difficult situation when countermeasures are not implemented. The balance are staffing requirements and we worked with local city county and state and federal partners to demonstrations that may occur at those facilities and we balance our deployment effort and staffing efforts based on what we hear. Im with you on pat and her words, hero. I went to his Memorial Service<\/a> in oakland and in that situation we had 17 fps officers at the Federal Building<\/a> at the time of that incident. Total chaos and very violent demonstrations occurring at the time. And bad actors took advantage of the situation. For us its a balance on how we deploy her cells. We know by facility where the highest raskar and where we need to put people so for instance the facilities on campus is our field offices and are very secure. We observe that in cincinnati during the attack. Theres no way anyone would get inside that building. Her protective Security Officer<\/a> sounded the alarm and the fbi agents in the building responded. Working to get the other agencies to reach that level of awareness and preparedness is our issue. Like was mentioned before primarily comes down to the funding. They are working with the Department Agencies<\/a> in washington d. C. And it could be 20,000 project and given that 20,000 back to ames, iowa is a difficult situation that they find themselves in. I want to followup with one thing you said but i dont want you to have to answer it. Ms. Latham mr. Cline mention the fbi is the Tenant Organization<\/a> that is both aware of the presence of a face in the wellequipped understanding the balance versus the cost of countermeasures. Are there any agencies that you think are particularly less inclined to adopt countermeasures on the opposite end of the spectrum and is fbi the better practice . I would say in terms of the question they are less inclined but the agencies i reviewed had more recommendations that were not addressed which can be understandable and may be due to some of their challenges but we will further develop. I would say the smaller agencies had more that werent addressed. I want to get back to you real quick with the broader question. Sbs has been transferred to three departments under dhs. You think the Management Directorate<\/a> will be a permanent home for fps or as another home within dhs more our transition of management has been wonderful. We are taking advantage of the expertise. Cfo rso you name it we need to mature our programs within a vs they are helping us do that. Ultimately the decision is on fps and as we grow and mature we would be ready to prepare ourselves within dhs. Right now our alignment with management specifically and in the leadership and guidance of acting secretary has been a good place for us right now. Thank you mr. Cline and without my time has expired and i yield back. Thank you sir. The chair will now recognize a member of the committee for questions that you may want to ask the witnesses in accordance with the guidelines laid out by the chairman and Ranking Member<\/a> in if every third colloquy but i recognize members in order to alternating between majority and minority members. Members or might it to meet themselves will underneath himself some recognized for question. Id like to recognize mr. Payne from new jersey for five minutes. Welcome. Thank you for having this timely hearing. Mr. Cline according to the Government Accountability<\/a> office and the federal protective services facing a Staffing Shortage<\/a> approximately 21 of its positions arent filled including 200 Law Enforcement<\/a> personnel. How are you ensuring fps is still able to respond to threats to federal property and perform security assessments and execute its other Core Missions<\/a> while working with a reduced number of Law Enforcement<\/a> personnel . Thank you for your question congressman payne. We are experiencing a 21 sure if all of staffing needs. A variety of reasons for this. Like most other businesses and agencies within the United States<\/a> we are dealing with market challenges the same as everyone else. We also are responsible for same agencies and we are looking for that same person to join their agencies in the come along for an officer. We contained work with dhs and achieve human capitol officer in our recruiting team will be at the military military base to continue with our recruiting efforts would restart the class of the Training Center<\/a> last monday with 24 new students and other classes scheduled for this year. Its a continued challenge for us. Our goal in fy23 is to fill our vacancies including Law Enforcement<\/a> and support. Okay. Given what we have seen in the aftermath of art the january 6 investigation that uncovered military and Law Enforcement<\/a> personnel involved in the insurrection what is the vs doing to weed out the potential nature of the ideological folks amongst your ranks . Thank you for question congressman. When we recruit and hire a new officer, they code through the process through the office of chief security office. A very regular detailed and thorough analysis of the background of that applicant. Once they come on board a program and i dont know the exact name but its Continuous Monitoring<\/a> so that individual like take me for instance i was arrested for some reason i continued the Monitoring Program<\/a> with the office of the chief Security Officer<\/a> would know about that tomorrow and would take action on it based on what the circumstance of the rest was pretty to make sure the people we hire are not involved in the activity and we hire a large number of veterans and 80 of our Law Enforcement<\/a> or veteran today. The process they used to do that background investigations for the perspective employing Continuous Monitoring<\/a> of employees at goodies is helping us to make sure we weed out those that act jars. Okay and i think thats a focus on new hires. What about officers that are in the organization . Yes sir thats a process that the chief Security Officer<\/a> uses on a Continuous Monitoring<\/a> program and with their relationships is to take a count and state Law Enforcement<\/a> as you are aware the Law Enforcement<\/a> agencies monitor different types of media looking for individuals that may be associated with extremism and if we receive notification or aware of the dhs or fps officer and that will be turned over to our office in the turn of affairs to investigate. Thank you in mr. Chairman we ask you to stay vigilant in this area because as you know we have done an incredible job stopping foreign fighters but is the internal issues that we have with domestic terrorism that plagues our nation today and without i yield back. Thank you mr. Payne i recognize the gentleman from north carolina. Thank you. Mr. Cline i want to focus on something that slipped from National Consciousness<\/a> thats struck me as strength in Portland Oregon<\/a> over june and july of 2020 there were 52 consecutive nights in which antifa and other radicals carried out violent. A lot of the focus on the federal courthouse in portland. But one thing that sticks in my memory about that was the federal officers that were blinded or injured by lasers. How widespread was that and have those officers recovered fully . Thank you congressman bishop. Portland was a very chaotic unprecedented event that we hadnt seen before. Within fps 363 officers were injured and i think roughly a total of 800 injuries to not only fps officers that the ice officers. Green lasers and molotov caught health and slingshots mrsa grade cannons that were thrown and dhs officers are to my eyes the heroes. They showed a level of restraint. Their goal was to ensure the courthouse and the federal facilities were protected and they achieve that goal. Theyd stayed inside the courthouse until someone attempted to cause damage. When they did come out they were hit with a barrage of violence. All those officers have recovered from his injuries we did havent fps officer who did die of heart attack not during the events. As he was going to work in fort wayne other officer to commit suicide but we dont know but was related to those activities. What an excellent summary of that mr. Cline and you started with the term unprecedented. That is how it struck me and i think Many Americans<\/a> have never seen anything like this in terms of the continued that to the overlong period of time. One thing thats remarkable is the Portland City Council<\/a> voted as i understand it to prevent the Police Require<\/a> with federal Law Enforcement<\/a>. Ted wheeler set one point dhs officers quote are leading to more of violence and vandalism and mayors from a number of cities like the attorney general acting dhs secretary sent the deployment officers protect the facility. If i understand gaos report on dhs strategy in portland is suggested there was an assumption you received support from local Law Enforcement<\/a> but that wasnt the case. The gao recommended implementing a new strategy to account for that. I hardly believe that im reading words like that in a congressional hearing and certainly if it were true what were true what can you offers about that issue and how are you intend to respond to the fact that mayors and City Councils<\/a> have supported that lawlessness and refusal to help . Thank you congressman bishop. Throughout the country rely on city county and state Law Enforcement<\/a> to assist us in the protection of our facilities. In a large city typically if there is some type of violence or criminal act of a Federal Building<\/a> local Law Enforcement<\/a> may be the first to respond and the majority of federal facilities we protect the local Law Enforcement<\/a> agencies have the ability to respond. Within portland the fact that the Portland Police<\/a> who we are tight with whom we Work Together<\/a> with were prohibited from assisting us and that was the exact reason we had to depoy more officers. Typically dated a they will provide assistance. During the timeframe they were resistant. It seems to some of us this kind of attack is something that can spring up in lots of places in the United States<\/a> and there somebody out there organizing it. Does that need to be looked into by congress that people have the ability to bring this kind of attack against the federal facility at any time they choose . Congressman bishop between the summer of 2020 not just fps but a lot of Law Enforcement<\/a> officers and agencies were dealing with largescale demonstrations in some cases some violence. You all experience that on january 6 and we experienced in portland. I think we have done well working with our Partner Agencies<\/a> in the federal government and city county and state. We have all learned lessons that we need to work Better Together<\/a> to make sure where we are of incidents that pop up and that has really increased over the last year. Thank you for outstanding service. Thank you very much. Now i call on the gentlelady from ms. Titus. Say thank you very much mr. Chairman. As the previous chairman was talking about portland being an unprecedented and lets talk about another unprecedented event and that was a storming of the capitol on january the sixth. Nobody could have anticipated it would be as as it was but there were certainly warning signs including the radical commentary on the internet for several days leading up to the events of that day where people tried, they didnt try, they did storm the capitol and tried to overturn our elections. It was hyperpartisan and it was neofascist and pro violent and it was racist. It should have been a hint that this had been festering on line for several days and we are not seeing that kind of incendiary language to that extent right now but there are lessons we could learn on how to spot potential events like this. I would ask mr. Cline how is your Agency Working<\/a> with others to keep apprised of misinformation on line to stay aware of Credible Threats<\/a> to Federal Building<\/a>s as a result of that in conjunction with that and how does it actor in the environment when youre conducting your Risk Assessment<\/a> . And if you dont, why not . Thank you congresswoman titus. We have dramatically increased our communications with city county stayed in Law Enforcement<\/a> officers. We remain an active indication with their Law Enforcement<\/a> partners dhs and centers around the country the federal executive board throughout the country that have a level of oversight over federal agencies and their operations and with continued to maintain awareness of threats. As you mentioned sharing of information is critical to make sure we are all prepared to actively respond to a situation that may come up. As you mentioned the january 6 on that day our job was to protect the Federal Building<\/a> in the area of the ellipse and thats what we are focused on. We did provide u. S. Capital Police Support<\/a> as soon as that now. Sharing of information the preparation for an event like this has genetically increased and i think its in a really good place now. We certainly appreciate your help on that day in trying to keep all of this in the building member staff press, everybody safe so thank you for that. Can you talk specifically about the protective Investigations Program<\/a> and how your members work and train their and cooperate with them . Its a laymen. So far this year we have opened up 201 protect the agencies and made 19 arrests at this point. We will make more arrests as those investigations continue. Most of these red investigations we werent formed from an agency of an employee who received a threatening communication whether an email, a phonecall text message whatever it may be. The information is provided to us and our special agents are terminal investigators who conduct investigations and work with city county and state partners federal partners and a background check on the person making the threat and coordinate with the u. S. Attorney within that area where the threat is coming from before making an arrest. Thats typically how the process works, maam. What thank you so much. We appreciate the job that you do in the eye understand at hard to get people working to recruit and maintain a force. So be sure to let us know what resources you need if we need to provide additional funding or assistance in any way so you can do your job effectively. Thank you mr. Chairman and i yield back. Thank you mastitis. Now id like to recognize the gentlelady from tennessee ms. Harshbarger for five minutes of questions. Mr. Chairman questions. Senate mr. Chairman Ranking Member<\/a> thank you to the Witnesses Today<\/a> and i want to thank Law Enforcement<\/a> for the job they do. You dont get enough thank yous these days. My first question is for mr. Breor. We heard about the process for assisting security but many federal civilities that are not under fps perfume my question is what is isc doing to make sure all these agencies have assistance that complies with fps standards . This goes back to 2019. The 66 departments that make up the Interagency Security Committee<\/a> part of their compliance and everything that was framed around it was created by them through our compliance subcommittee. They are part of the process and now they must report on what they are doing both at the organizational level headquarters and the security level with respect to meeting the standards of the Security Committee<\/a> and im happy to say this year we were able to run a pilot and Going Forward<\/a> we will be able to work with the department to verify with tears submitting into the compliance system. Its all about tracking what they need and measuring those outcomes. If a question for ms. Latham. Facility security has been on gaos since 2003 and what are the issues that are keeping these facility securities on that risk list and what are the actions that fps can take to address compliance . Thank you for your question. It has been on our highrisk list since 2003. There are two remaining items that need to be addressed. Fp is currently has two systems in place that theyve been developing over time and the systems first focused on what they are learning activities are for officers as well as the officers that have completed training as well as time and attendance. We are looking for f. Ps 21 fully implement oath of these systems and in addition make sure the systems are interoperable and coordinate together so they know who meets the requirements of more importantly who should be ready. Absolutely. Fps is a feeforservice organization. You believe that is the best way for them to operate, maam . Sorry can you repeat the first part . Fps is a feeforservice organization and with that you believe thats the best way for them to operate . Thank you. We have components of these structures for fps and dared advantages and disadvantages to the structures and plans. This is in the full view but we have made positive comments regarding that. Those are my questions mr. Chairman with questions mr. Chairman with that i will yield back. Thank you ms. Harshbarger an hour recognize the gentleman from new york for five minutes. Let me understand the process of Security Standards<\/a> of the federal protective service fps making security assessments based on those recommendations in the Federal Building<\/a> is still the Security Committee<\/a> must decide whether to comply. Is that how the process works . That is right congressman. If i scored 30 on an exam i would get a failing grade. And my right to see compliance rate of 30 is failure . Mr. Cline . Sir 30 is typically a failure. They are a variety of factors involved in those decisions. If its a failure rather than tinker at the margins should we not rethink the model of voluntary compliance for security assessments . Sir the new compliance implementation the Interagency Security Committee<\/a> is doing i want to call it a stick at thats making the agencies that oversee an office in ames iowa making the agency more aware of what those countermeasure recommendations are making them comply with the executive order. The executive order came out in 1995 requiring countermeasures to get the facility the necessary level of protection. So its ultimately a model of voluntary compliance of my question to you is there any circumstance under which security assessments can be binding and what about the level level 5 building for the Security Risk<\/a> is higher . Would it be binding under the circumstances . We deathly need more influence. Requiring it to the requesting a. If we did the same thing over and over and expected different result you said earlier if i understood correctly countermeasures to be implemented we need all the tenants to agree. Its not simply enough to have a majority. There could be scores of tenants in a single building. That strikes me as a process that leads to inertia and failure. How could we possibly defend that . Thats the Facility Security<\/a> committee that we talked about earlier agreeing because they all have to fund their portion of that countermeasure. The 10,000dollar. Minart. One can imagine a model of which the majority of this committee agreed and everyone is required to thats a much more rational system, right and then expecting unanimity in every case . The way to votto committee is based on there is a way to wait so we have more. Present and they have a stronger both. Would the bee in favor of substituting a majority requirement for unanimity requirement . That something we could look at three of it seems to me that would facilitate compliance. What about 1000 Law Enforcement<\/a> Security Officers<\/a> responsible for portfolio 9500 buildings. Seems to me the scale of your responsibilities are disproportionate to the scarcity of your resources. You have the staffing needs in sufficiently secured 95 buildings. They are current goal is to get those done and as a threat in burma continues to escalate as it has. Lets assume theres no escalations theres no escalation sinew at 90 sinew at 9500 buildings yater protects. It seems to me of thousands of small number given the size of your portfolio. Rfr rfr is strength for Law Enforcement<\/a> is 1131 and they are placed throughout the country based on the number of facilities and the population of the federal employees there the highest tourist facilities would have more people. We have more officers here in d. C. Than we have in ames, iowa are merely because its needed here. The capitol lays out thousands of officers for one complex, you have 1000 officers for 9500 buildings . My time has expired. Thank you mr. Torres. I want to go through second round of questions i want to follow up on mr. Torres concept here. You got tenants that are supposed to pay you their fair share. And ms. Latham one of the big issues you said this money to implement and mr. Torres at 30 compliance and 70 none. Do we have to mandate that other federal agencies pay their fair share and would you prioritize this needs to be done for two secure these buildings . Thank you mr. Chairman. There is no mandate and there is no law that requires it. Do we need one . And if the f. A. I if other Government Agencies<\/a> have x number of dollars and you just said you need to invest the polling to protect the building personnel and citizens come to visit your buildings is this thing going on for a number of years. This is unacceptable. What do we need to do to mandate that the financing be there and be reallocated to make sure there are parties to secure these buildings and thats actually addressed. Its a critical issue for us. My counterpart from the isc working directly with those departments and agencies. Mr. Breor . We are seeing compliance. We are seeing an improvement each year but a couple of issues that do arise and what we are working on now is the internal guidance of the department and agencies on how to implement the isp standards within their organizations and a followon to that guidance and policies from headquarters. I hear your words. Im still concerned. You have not alleviated my concerns. All of you are out there doing a good job protecting our citizens. Yet now essentially the threats are turning on you, on us and im trying to assess in my mind to hear from your statements whether you played defenses while . Im not getting a good vibe out of your statements today. That . I think where we are with respect to the multitenant facility we have rolled out training and workshops and we now have regional advisers across the United States<\/a> that accompany fse so i think the facilities that have tenants i think there is work that needs to be done so that they better understand it is him and hearing your words in that fight to get morbid assurance that we will move to better complaint here and there priorities need to be done to heart these buildings to make sure they arent vulnerable to these senseless attacks. Action takes place. None of us here, none of us here condone attacks on a federal officer or federal personnel as well as u. S. Citizen. Let me shift real quick mr. Cline mr. Bishop talked about oregon. He talked about coordination and that was an situation unprecedented in your words something that none of his condone and i dont like seeing it and i disagree and i would do everything i can to stop or federal officers and being attacked talk about coronation. You extended your authority to cpb and i. C. E. To help in that situation. Law enforcement officials didnt want to see that happen because of the controversy in the local elements that essentially in my words may be in claiming the situation. How can we move forward to make sure theres better coordination here . You are at the fed and they are at the local. We have to figure out the situation and the situation before it gets out of control. Lessons learned. Thank you chairman. We have learned a number of lessons out of portland. We rely on city county and state Law Enforcement<\/a>. Mr. Torres mentioned we are a small agency. For us to, we dont want to create a federal police force across the nation. We rely heavily on our contracts for the security offers the protect our facilities through right now there are 6200 cfo posts that are staffed. Xray machine magnetometer Perimeter Security<\/a> that we rely happily on. We have made a lot of changes in portland. Our public order policing doctrine in june of 2021 a new directive how we approach public order by policy directives with the director for the signature right now. That was coordinator with civil rights and Civil Liberties<\/a> in the office of policy. We have managed to change the process and how we approach it. As far as utilizing it that was necessary because the local Law Enforcement<\/a> and the Police Bureau<\/a> who we work handinhand with during that instance they were from assisting us. The potomac county Sheriffs Office<\/a> and the Oregon State Police<\/a> they came in to assist and they were. We dont see that anywhere else and we think it was done in port blonde and we no longer have it. Thank you very much. Mr. Meijer. I want to followup on mr. Torres to clarify any assessment or possibility for the security countermeasure shared on a pro rata basis but for the fps it has to be unanimous to adopt the recommendation correct . Fps members if you have facility with three members and one of those members reported 66 their vote would be the driver. To build on that line of questioning it is the authority of the fps . I think there was a misunderstanding about unanimity versus opinion. And getting back to the reasons why they are not implemented and their explicable recent spike agencies planning to move in if youre only going to be in the facility for two years it doesnt make sense to make sufficient upgrades. I think the other one was obviously the implementation cost. You have a range. Building on that prior question some of those sections situations may be a facility that is a smaller facility and oftentimes in our minds we have the conception of the main Federal Building<\/a> with the social Security Agency<\/a> outpost or couple hundred or couple thousand square feet facility. We are talking about a bland. A guess my question is to what extent and i recognize this is more of the gsa question but to what extent ive been making recommendations for a Smaller Agency<\/a> a smaller footprint as these are not affordable or costeffective up rates given our legislative circumstances. Are there ways that they choose that location because those are relatively less expensive with a more secure facility than leasing on a per square foot races. If you understand what im getting at here fps is an advisory role in recommending each recommendation is dependent on the agency but they are making costbenefit analysis in a separate individual leasing side. Does fps offer recommendations prior to gsa approving or suggesting a location towards agency . Thank you Ranking Member<\/a>. Lets say in agency decides they want to move to a new location in dallas. They will make contact with us and we will go with the agency. This is to look and here are some offerings from less these entities. You have these many people on this much where footage in this space and then well go out and look at it and we will nail that down to the top three and gsa will work or the agency to establish the east and we will work to establish the necessary level of protection. We want to get in there first before they move in. To get established before people are here to get the project in place. And a number of businesses is the agencies that i can afford to do 20 cameras around my building so can we do cameras at every angle . We can see whos coming in the building and report the security that goes on there. Lets come up with something. Lets not leave it where you can afford anything but try to do something that makes sense to help the facility. To be clear prior to that wasting time they understand maybe its a facility that is in compliance already with what fps may recommend at 30 a square foot facility thats 25 a square foot. If we are going on a cost basis i dont want the agency taking the lower cost one. They may have to add another 10. Square foot so they get you are doing that prior to it . Absolutely. A number of facilities offering to be leased to the government have that already. Thats one less countermeasure we have to implement and put in place. Thank you. I yield back mr. Chairman. And the other members wish to ask questions of our witnesses . Seeing no further debate and so i want to thank our witnesses for your testimony and members for their questions. Members of the committee may have additional questions for the witnesses and we ask that you respond to those written questions expeditiously the chair reminds members the committee record will remain open for 10 days and without objection this committee stands adjourned. Thank you. 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