Transcripts For CSPAN2 Rebecca 20240705 : vimarsana.com

Hello and welcome to the Commonwealth Club of california. Im Elizabeth Carney chair of the business and Leadership Forum and your host for todays, which is evening with Rebecca Solnit. An energizing case for hope about the climate. Also with us here on zoom, her coauthor thelma young, lieutenant lu, and to book howd i do . And her partner, fenton and a small one that is really the whole reason why we worry about climate. So thank. And theyll join us for the first part of this program from fiji and then they will have to stay around for the whole thing. Rebecca and ill have a conversation well have some question and time together. We want to give everyone chance to speak. So later in the program, please use the microphone. If youre coming up for a question or if youre on youtube, use the chat box feature. Your participation in the program is really important to us. So well try to get to everyone that we can can. And now its my pleasure to introduce susan haymer from biennials. Shell give some background about. Rebecca and the biennial conference. Hi everyone. Good evening. Thank you all for coming out. Very excited about this event. And i cooked this up a few months ago, maybe six months ago to kind of have preventable i dont know. You know that are Rebecca Solnit its going to be the keynotes at the pioneers conference which is happening in berkeley for the first time. As we said, april six to eighth. Lots speakers, in fact, a couple of speakers of people who wrote in this book. I know jade begley is one of them is also speaking its a its a wonderful conference about visionary speakers speaking about Climate Change, progressive politics of the environment everything that we care about going to be there is going to be three days and the mayor of there taking over berkeley so its going to be great. I hope youll join us. And by the way, we have a special Discount Code from the Commonwealth Club. Commonwealth 20. You can get a Discount Code can go all three days or just one day and then rebecca is going to be on the saturday. I first came across Rebecca Solnit on facebook of all places, and people were posting about her. I started reading her columns, the guardian, and i was so impressed i kind of went, wow, this is everything that i care about. I recommended. I read and recommended her book orwells roses for my book club. I im one of the people in my book club is here. We so enjoyed it. We so enjoy her work and were so thrilled that shes going to be speaking tonight and answering questions about hope for the climate. And its not too late, which im really glad to hear and i hope all glad to hear of some good news about, the climate. So im going ask rebecca if she would like to or know elizabeth. Would you like to introduce faten . Thelma i was hoping that rebecca would come up and join me and then maybe. And then maybe you would like to Say Something about fenton and salma before to kick it off. Well, first of all, im so excited to see them and is a dear friend and an inspiration at. Grew up in texas but now lives with husband in fiji. Hes indigenous fiji and thelma has been in the climate climate activists for a long time. She with three fifties, shes with the Solutions Project now. And we dreamed not too late as a project a couple of years ago launched as a website and social media about a year ago and. Then at a dinner party, i people i was not going to do more books. They had stopped doing books because i was trying to be a Better Climate activist. And we had this project called not too late and and everybody at the part this little kind of climate and writer dinner party looked at me and said that needs to be a book. So like emailed thelma whos in behind, depending on you look at the clock and she on board and we did a book in less than a year so her husband is all cofounder the pacific climate warriors and is also the i think the Pacific Islander regional director of 350 dot org and he is one of the authors in the book or rather hes an interviewee. Thelma coedited this and wrote several of the pieces and he is the author of. The famous phrase for the Pacific Island warriors. Were not drowning, were fighting. So welcome, thelma and center and the baby. I dont think i need to introduce the baby, but i will say and thelma writes about this in, the very last piece in the book, having a baby is a pretty big hopeful thing to do for climate activists. So heres their commitment. Yay. So fennell and thelma, thank you. Thank you so much for being here. Its kind of like, i think that if look that way youll be able to see me. So its if im looking in a funny way youll understand why the thing that im really excited about is that my understanding is that the pacific climate warriors have kind of done what it is that think were here to talk about tonight. I think that what we want to to do is the narrative change the story so that we dont have that same dark and dismal inside of us, but start to not to know, be a little bit more regenerative ourselves. So in that light, i hope that we will be able to talk with you guys about process your narrative that youve changed. But before we get to that, i, i was interested, thelma, and one of the things that youve written and both rebecca thelmas writing is throughout this book, its so fun because its almost like theyre having a conversation with, of these people in this book. And one of the things that thelma write is you mentioned something that intrigues me. You say instead of sacrificing, we have to drive less, eat less, etc. So the question comes up instead, what is our connection to . What is our relationship to connection you . Are you right . Are you getting to know your neighbors . If flood comes through tomorrow . Would you be ready to assist each other shifting our task list toward mutuality and also learning to know the patterns and the plants so that kinship would not have immediately been on my list. So thank you. Youre already really my consciousness. This so you want to start . You by talking about the commune, the aspect a little bit . Sure. Okay. And thanks for having us ventured and i met through doing climate storytelling work so makes sense that were doing this event together and with our son whos also been a part of the book from the very beginning. Yeah its. For so long the Climate Crisis also been a storytelling crisis and its been dominated so much by by the western media who talks about individualism so much, you know, and it also again like, like i was saying, it talks about those if want to solve a Climate Crisis, you to reduce your lifestyle you to create a mindset of scarcity you have to focus on the individual self. But if we shift that and we think about, you know, maybe through solving the Climate Crisis, we can actually build a better world if. We think about it in that way. And if we centered communities and how we solve the problem, then itll be a lot more fun along the way. Well have more joy. Well build again more resilient, happier, more beautiful places. And i think this is how, again, we want to shift the narrative of its about how can we all come together, find our power . And instead of thinking the Climate Crisis as scarcity, think of it. Think of it as abundance and rebecca and i talk about this in the book that we need to shift the story to abundance. Actually, we can create a better world through this process, you know, standing what is destructive, taking that down and then rebuild something beautiful and its place. Yeah maybe we even got a glimmer of that with the covid shutdown like the idea that we could see and feel more than we normally that was pretty to many of us. So maybe that your to something that weve sensed a little bit. Yeah exactly or reading if you to chime in. Yeah. I think only thing i love to add is is like this idea of connectedness both to each other well as to the Natural World and, how you really focus in on intentional and deliberate about how we build that connectedness. So much of that connectedness has helped us in the, in, you know in the wake of like a massive tropical. Its that feeling connectedness to a neighbor that helps the the rebuild happen and like thelma said so much of the work right now has been about the breaking right. How do we sort of break away from past habits that served us . How do we break away from, like you think, the capitalistic idea that the fossil fuel industry sort of pushes all us and how do we build . And so much of the way forward is how do we build that connectedness . How do we build relational with how do we build the sort of future that we all deserve . And so much of the work that weve done as a pacific climate warriors has really been in service to a story, is more nuanced, that is more complex that really sees the human value. And for a very long time a single story that was about my people Pacific Islanders in the face of this Climate Crisis was that were victims waiting to be saved. So it took away our allegiance, right. So as a collective of connected Pacific Islanders around the region, we started actually theres a fuller more theres a fuller truth that we have the opportunity tell this this larger story about who we are as as like, you know, as heroes in our own story connected to skills, traditional knowledge, indigenous wisdom and how do we use that to really build up this future that were all striving towards . And thats thats where the the the of slogan of the pacific war is, pacific climate warriors came from. Were not drowning fighting it were us to tell a full story about who we are. And fenton, as youve told that story, do you find that resonate with it . And you help us to bring that also into our lives so that we can heroes in that new narrative somehow . Can you give us any about that . Yeah, i definitely felt that it has more resonant recently. Resonant recently, i think more and more people are like theyre you know its that theyre looking at how do we build together moving forward and a lot of that can look like many Different Things for us in the pacific, on the frontlines of the Climate Crisis. You know, its its constantly just like reminding people that were here, that were not going anywhere, that we deserve to thrive. And i know you want to talk a little bit about what that means for you and yeah, i dont like this so much. This is so great great. Im so clear. For me, being pregnant was, an exercise in hope and bring a child into world is one of the most physical realities of i am not giving up i am shifting the narrative of my own life and my familys life to one of despair and gloom and, to one of hope and even even if the future isnt perfect, were not giving up and think thats where im holding in my heart is that the future is uncertain. And thats okay, because it gives us space to build the world that we want. And so when look at the future for my son and, i have no idea what that features. Some of like, but i know that its going to be what we make it to be and so were not giving up. Theres, theres clapping going on in the room and i want to share with you our own experience. Were sitting here in San Francisco, and this building is on the edge of the bay here on embarcadero. And yesterday we had seven mile an hour winds and and it floods this street when that happens. So experience of things changing and now is not something just far away. Its also right here for us. Oh yeah everyones weve hit the point with Climate Change where its no longer about polar bears. It is impacting every single one on the world. And its one of those things where its everyones by Climate Change. But every story is completely different, which also why we need so many new climate out there who can tell their stories a way that resonates with their communities. We need to drastically diversify our climate. I spoke to the world instead of just kind of the usual same voices. We need everyone talking to their neighbors in in ways that they will relate to. And if we build up those climate storytellers, then and more people can to you agree dont stop it. Well we have an intention of having all of us feel Like Neighbors and all of us feel like a local group that can start to build up our relations with each other. So thank you encouraging us because, you know, we always think were rugged and maybe time for us to get better at being connected. We the only way were going to make it through the Climate Crisis is we act together. And if we act as a community, theres no way to survive as individuals so definitely get to know the around you and that stronger bond will resonate down the road. Are there resources that you want to share with us that might be helpful for us for doing more of that . Are there or projects that you all are working on that you want to point us in that direction . Yeah. I mean, i absolutely adore the work of the pacific warriors there. Did know on facebook that just to 50 pacific instagram, their handle is at the site of the climate warriors. And i encourage you to just visit visit the instagram handle. They share a lot of stories about what resilience looks like on the un, on the sort of in the villages, the different villages around the pacific. They also are currently working a project where theyre trying china connect village to village and build resilient villages across, the pacific. And i think its inspiring. I think its innovative. I think theyre just incredible. I also have a very biased opinion of that, and you can also check out our website not to claim climate org. Im rebecca and i have a bunch of really great resources on there. Yeah. Hope you can check it out. Thelma, whats your intention with that what that website we just it to be kind of an ongoing kind of a touchpoint you know if you ever had that despair gloomy kind of day can just go to the website find one of the articles, read it and kind of be same thing with the book rebecca. And i thought of it as kind. The thing that you kind of keep in your backpack in your bag and you can pull out and read an essay any time that your that your spirit it thank you is there anything else that you guys want to say to us while youre while were all here together . Yeah, i just want to say i think its such a beautiful, incredible time to center for creativity art. I think in the world that were all building, that it has to be space for, but there has to be space for poetry, for music, and much of the folks that dont mind rebecca spoke through in the book also come from that, you know, they had that background and creativity and the commitment to to using creative until tell really beautiful stories. And so yeah, i just encourage you to think about how you want to bring outlet to light and the different ways that you look through this world. Yeah, i think rebecca is going to say a lot of amazing things, but just never forget the beautiful things, the world, you know, theres a lot of me to despair, but theres a lot to be joyous about. So never forget that. Yeah. Thank you so much for being with us, you guys and. Congratulations on the book. Thelma, one made you. See. Wow, im going to see if we can have that baby at all hours, all our sort of hybrid events. Oh, so precious. And the baby is mentioned in the book, so i might like before the baby arrives. Well, we finish the book before the baby born, but the editorial process allowed some updates and so hes in it. So great. And i just think its a miracle to be able to have these with each other that are International Conversations where we can inspire each other as needed and, also have it be super local like. Here we all are in this room. What can we do with that energy . Well, so congratulations on the book. Just you. Im. I just think its such a joyous and imaginative collection of essays. We were so excited. We asked. We essentially assembled a dream team. We asked the people we most wanted to be in this book and everybody. Yes, we have to intern. Intergovernmental panel on Climate Change top scientists. Weve got other geographers and other scientists. We have leaders in the Climate Movement, have people from frontline communities, have visionaries like adrian brown, our youngest contributor, i think was 26 when she wrote for us. Our oldest, 80 roshi, joan halifax, the buddhist leader, and you know, its an International Community of voices. It was wonderful to put together, wonderful to put out into the world. So and this is actually the first event for it. So thank yay. I am im struck yesterdays Climate Action being in the midst of a 70 mile an hour wind and a storm and what a reminder that is a priority. And that pushing the whole pipeline lines and destroying old growth forests is really not the way to go. Although yesterdays protest was really across the nation with more than 100 demonstrations about banks that are financing fossil fuel extraction, the big four are chase, wells fargo, citi and and b of a and you know, they are playing a huge in the destruction of the planet and the climate and it was an action for people to withdraw their money cut up their credit cards. I cut up my long time united miles card and you know tell the banks to stop doing that and to stop financing destruction and so San Francisco despite the incredible rain and wind and cold while we thought it was cold. People in other parts, the country want it. You know, we had more than a hundred people for a couple of hours, we shut down the street and. Some remarkable things happened. Remarkable speakers and so yeah, but it happened from maine to people did a rocking chair vigil in washington dc for 4 hours mixers led by third act Bill Mckibben, a new group led by people by Senior Citizens and people over 60. He felt the Commonwealth Club<\/a> of california. Im Elizabeth Carney<\/a> chair of the business and Leadership Forum<\/a> and your host for todays, which is evening with Rebecca Solnit<\/a>. An energizing case for hope about the climate. Also with us here on zoom, her coauthor thelma young, lieutenant lu, and to book howd i do . And her partner, fenton and a small one that is really the whole reason why we worry about climate. So thank. And theyll join us for the first part of this program from fiji and then they will have to stay around for the whole thing. Rebecca and ill have a conversation well have some question and time together. We want to give everyone chance to speak. So later in the program, please use the microphone. If youre coming up for a question or if youre on youtube, use the chat box feature. Your participation in the program is really important to us. So well try to get to everyone that we can can. And now its my pleasure to introduce susan haymer from biennials. Shell give some background about. Rebecca and the biennial conference. Hi everyone. Good evening. Thank you all for coming out. Very excited about this event. And i cooked this up a few months ago, maybe six months ago to kind of have preventable i dont know. You know that are Rebecca Solnit<\/a> its going to be the keynotes at the pioneers conference which is happening in berkeley for the first time. As we said, april six to eighth. Lots speakers, in fact, a couple of speakers of people who wrote in this book. I know jade begley is one of them is also speaking its a its a wonderful conference about visionary speakers speaking about Climate Change<\/a>, progressive politics of the environment everything that we care about going to be there is going to be three days and the mayor of there taking over berkeley so its going to be great. I hope youll join us. And by the way, we have a special Discount Code<\/a> from the Commonwealth Club<\/a>. Commonwealth 20. You can get a Discount Code<\/a> can go all three days or just one day and then rebecca is going to be on the saturday. I first came across Rebecca Solnit<\/a> on facebook of all places, and people were posting about her. I started reading her columns, the guardian, and i was so impressed i kind of went, wow, this is everything that i care about. I recommended. I read and recommended her book orwells roses for my book club. I im one of the people in my book club is here. We so enjoyed it. We so enjoy her work and were so thrilled that shes going to be speaking tonight and answering questions about hope for the climate. And its not too late, which im really glad to hear and i hope all glad to hear of some good news about, the climate. So im going ask rebecca if she would like to or know elizabeth. Would you like to introduce faten . Thelma i was hoping that rebecca would come up and join me and then maybe. And then maybe you would like to Say Something<\/a> about fenton and salma before to kick it off. Well, first of all, im so excited to see them and is a dear friend and an inspiration at. Grew up in texas but now lives with husband in fiji. Hes indigenous fiji and thelma has been in the climate climate activists for a long time. She with three fifties, shes with the Solutions Project<\/a> now. And we dreamed not too late as a project a couple of years ago launched as a website and social media about a year ago and. Then at a dinner party, i people i was not going to do more books. They had stopped doing books because i was trying to be a Better Climate<\/a> activist. And we had this project called not too late and and everybody at the part this little kind of climate and writer dinner party looked at me and said that needs to be a book. So like emailed thelma whos in behind, depending on you look at the clock and she on board and we did a book in less than a year so her husband is all cofounder the pacific climate warriors and is also the i think the Pacific Islander<\/a> regional director of 350 dot org and he is one of the authors in the book or rather hes an interviewee. Thelma coedited this and wrote several of the pieces and he is the author of. The famous phrase for the Pacific Island<\/a> warriors. Were not drowning, were fighting. So welcome, thelma and center and the baby. I dont think i need to introduce the baby, but i will say and thelma writes about this in, the very last piece in the book, having a baby is a pretty big hopeful thing to do for climate activists. So heres their commitment. Yay. So fennell and thelma, thank you. Thank you so much for being here. Its kind of like, i think that if look that way youll be able to see me. So its if im looking in a funny way youll understand why the thing that im really excited about is that my understanding is that the pacific climate warriors have kind of done what it is that think were here to talk about tonight. I think that what we want to to do is the narrative change the story so that we dont have that same dark and dismal inside of us, but start to not to know, be a little bit more regenerative ourselves. So in that light, i hope that we will be able to talk with you guys about process your narrative that youve changed. But before we get to that, i, i was interested, thelma, and one of the things that youve written and both rebecca thelmas writing is throughout this book, its so fun because its almost like theyre having a conversation with, of these people in this book. And one of the things that thelma write is you mentioned something that intrigues me. You say instead of sacrificing, we have to drive less, eat less, etc. So the question comes up instead, what is our connection to . What is our relationship to connection you . Are you right . Are you getting to know your neighbors . If flood comes through tomorrow . Would you be ready to assist each other shifting our task list toward mutuality and also learning to know the patterns and the plants so that kinship would not have immediately been on my list. So thank you. Youre already really my consciousness. This so you want to start . You by talking about the commune, the aspect a little bit . Sure. Okay. And thanks for having us ventured and i met through doing climate storytelling work so makes sense that were doing this event together and with our son whos also been a part of the book from the very beginning. Yeah its. For so long the Climate Crisis<\/a> also been a storytelling crisis and its been dominated so much by by the western media who talks about individualism so much, you know, and it also again like, like i was saying, it talks about those if want to solve a Climate Crisis<\/a>, you to reduce your lifestyle you to create a mindset of scarcity you have to focus on the individual self. But if we shift that and we think about, you know, maybe through solving the Climate Crisis<\/a>, we can actually build a better world if. We think about it in that way. And if we centered communities and how we solve the problem, then itll be a lot more fun along the way. Well have more joy. Well build again more resilient, happier, more beautiful places. And i think this is how, again, we want to shift the narrative of its about how can we all come together, find our power . And instead of thinking the Climate Crisis<\/a> as scarcity, think of it. Think of it as abundance and rebecca and i talk about this in the book that we need to shift the story to abundance. Actually, we can create a better world through this process, you know, standing what is destructive, taking that down and then rebuild something beautiful and its place. Yeah maybe we even got a glimmer of that with the covid shutdown like the idea that we could see and feel more than we normally that was pretty to many of us. So maybe that your to something that weve sensed a little bit. Yeah exactly or reading if you to chime in. Yeah. I think only thing i love to add is is like this idea of connectedness both to each other well as to the Natural World<\/a> and, how you really focus in on intentional and deliberate about how we build that connectedness. So much of that connectedness has helped us in the, in, you know in the wake of like a massive tropical. Its that feeling connectedness to a neighbor that helps the the rebuild happen and like thelma said so much of the work right now has been about the breaking right. How do we sort of break away from past habits that served us . How do we break away from, like you think, the capitalistic idea that the fossil fuel industry sort of pushes all us and how do we build . And so much of the way forward is how do we build that connectedness . How do we build relational with how do we build the sort of future that we all deserve . And so much of the work that weve done as a pacific climate warriors has really been in service to a story, is more nuanced, that is more complex that really sees the human value. And for a very long time a single story that was about my people Pacific Islander<\/a>s in the face of this Climate Crisis<\/a> was that were victims waiting to be saved. So it took away our allegiance, right. So as a collective of connected Pacific Islander<\/a>s around the region, we started actually theres a fuller more theres a fuller truth that we have the opportunity tell this this larger story about who we are as as like, you know, as heroes in our own story connected to skills, traditional knowledge, indigenous wisdom and how do we use that to really build up this future that were all striving towards . And thats thats where the the the of slogan of the pacific war is, pacific climate warriors came from. Were not drowning fighting it were us to tell a full story about who we are. And fenton, as youve told that story, do you find that resonate with it . And you help us to bring that also into our lives so that we can heroes in that new narrative somehow . Can you give us any about that . Yeah, i definitely felt that it has more resonant recently. Resonant recently, i think more and more people are like theyre you know its that theyre looking at how do we build together moving forward and a lot of that can look like many Different Things<\/a> for us in the pacific, on the frontlines of the Climate Crisis<\/a>. You know, its its constantly just like reminding people that were here, that were not going anywhere, that we deserve to thrive. And i know you want to talk a little bit about what that means for you and yeah, i dont like this so much. This is so great great. Im so clear. For me, being pregnant was, an exercise in hope and bring a child into world is one of the most physical realities of i am not giving up i am shifting the narrative of my own life and my familys life to one of despair and gloom and, to one of hope and even even if the future isnt perfect, were not giving up and think thats where im holding in my heart is that the future is uncertain. And thats okay, because it gives us space to build the world that we want. And so when look at the future for my son and, i have no idea what that features. Some of like, but i know that its going to be what we make it to be and so were not giving up. Theres, theres clapping going on in the room and i want to share with you our own experience. Were sitting here in San Francisco<\/a>, and this building is on the edge of the bay here on embarcadero. And yesterday we had seven mile an hour winds and and it floods this street when that happens. So experience of things changing and now is not something just far away. Its also right here for us. Oh yeah everyones weve hit the point with Climate Change<\/a> where its no longer about polar bears. It is impacting every single one on the world. And its one of those things where its everyones by Climate Change<\/a>. But every story is completely different, which also why we need so many new climate out there who can tell their stories a way that resonates with their communities. We need to drastically diversify our climate. I spoke to the world instead of just kind of the usual same voices. We need everyone talking to their neighbors in in ways that they will relate to. And if we build up those climate storytellers, then and more people can to you agree dont stop it. Well we have an intention of having all of us feel Like Neighbors<\/a> and all of us feel like a local group that can start to build up our relations with each other. So thank you encouraging us because, you know, we always think were rugged and maybe time for us to get better at being connected. We the only way were going to make it through the Climate Crisis<\/a> is we act together. And if we act as a community, theres no way to survive as individuals so definitely get to know the around you and that stronger bond will resonate down the road. Are there resources that you want to share with us that might be helpful for us for doing more of that . Are there or projects that you all are working on that you want to point us in that direction . Yeah. I mean, i absolutely adore the work of the pacific warriors there. Did know on facebook that just to 50 pacific instagram, their handle is at the site of the climate warriors. And i encourage you to just visit visit the instagram handle. They share a lot of stories about what resilience looks like on the un, on the sort of in the villages, the different villages around the pacific. They also are currently working a project where theyre trying china connect village to village and build resilient villages across, the pacific. And i think its inspiring. I think its innovative. I think theyre just incredible. I also have a very biased opinion of that, and you can also check out our website not to claim climate org. Im rebecca and i have a bunch of really great resources on there. Yeah. Hope you can check it out. Thelma, whats your intention with that what that website we just it to be kind of an ongoing kind of a touchpoint you know if you ever had that despair gloomy kind of day can just go to the website find one of the articles, read it and kind of be same thing with the book rebecca. And i thought of it as kind. The thing that you kind of keep in your backpack in your bag and you can pull out and read an essay any time that your that your spirit it thank you is there anything else that you guys want to say to us while youre while were all here together . Yeah, i just want to say i think its such a beautiful, incredible time to center for creativity art. I think in the world that were all building, that it has to be space for, but there has to be space for poetry, for music, and much of the folks that dont mind rebecca spoke through in the book also come from that, you know, they had that background and creativity and the commitment to to using creative until tell really beautiful stories. And so yeah, i just encourage you to think about how you want to bring outlet to light and the different ways that you look through this world. Yeah, i think rebecca is going to say a lot of amazing things, but just never forget the beautiful things, the world, you know, theres a lot of me to despair, but theres a lot to be joyous about. So never forget that. Yeah. Thank you so much for being with us, you guys and. Congratulations on the book. Thelma, one made you. See. Wow, im going to see if we can have that baby at all hours, all our sort of hybrid events. Oh, so precious. And the baby is mentioned in the book, so i might like before the baby arrives. Well, we finish the book before the baby born, but the editorial process allowed some updates and so hes in it. So great. And i just think its a miracle to be able to have these with each other that are International Conversations<\/a> where we can inspire each other as needed and, also have it be super local like. Here we all are in this room. What can we do with that energy . Well, so congratulations on the book. Just you. Im. I just think its such a joyous and imaginative collection of essays. We were so excited. We asked. We essentially assembled a dream team. We asked the people we most wanted to be in this book and everybody. Yes, we have to intern. Intergovernmental panel on Climate Change<\/a> top scientists. Weve got other geographers and other scientists. We have leaders in the Climate Movement<\/a>, have people from frontline communities, have visionaries like adrian brown, our youngest contributor, i think was 26 when she wrote for us. Our oldest, 80 roshi, joan halifax, the buddhist leader, and you know, its an International Community<\/a> of voices. It was wonderful to put together, wonderful to put out into the world. So and this is actually the first event for it. So thank yay. I am im struck yesterdays Climate Action<\/a> being in the midst of a 70 mile an hour wind and a storm and what a reminder that is a priority. And that pushing the whole pipeline lines and destroying old growth forests is really not the way to go. Although yesterdays protest was really across the nation with more than 100 demonstrations about banks that are financing fossil fuel extraction, the big four are chase, wells fargo, citi and and b of a and you know, they are playing a huge in the destruction of the planet and the climate and it was an action for people to withdraw their money cut up their credit cards. I cut up my long time united miles card and you know tell the banks to stop doing that and to stop financing destruction and so San Francisco<\/a> despite the incredible rain and wind and cold while we thought it was cold. People in other parts, the country want it. You know, we had more than a hundred people for a couple of hours, we shut down the street and. Some remarkable things happened. Remarkable speakers and so yeah, but it happened from maine to people did a rocking chair vigil in washington dc for 4 hours mixers led by third act Bill Mckibben<\/a>, a new group led by people by Senior Citizens<\/a> and people over 60. He felt the Climate Movement<\/a> was burdening the young with like, oh, you young people are so amazing. Why dont you do all the work . Is how it ended up sounding. So its time for older people as a powerful constituency because we have a lot of resources is and you know to take some leadership so bill whos 62 i think put not too late together right around when he turned 60 and its doing amazing not not not to late third act third act and its doing amazing. So keeping track weve already heard of three or four or five different organizations could be part of like as youre sitting here and youre thinking like, think about what are the things that are lighting up you like what are the things that you might want to do in the midst of that . And thats kind of the kind of conversation that we can be having. Its not just. A pleasant talk. Which of course it is, but its its also more and. Im aware of faces of narrative is that weve lived through things like climate denying which was like a whole narrative for ten, 20 years. Its been something and now its, oh, its too complicated. And we cant possibly do anything. Even the media to the internet, the, the Mainstream Media<\/a> is pretty powerful at keeping us confused and in despair. And im wondering, like how you i dont want to say consume the news. Youre youre a writer in that world in like you write in in essays and beautiful places that i think helped to change the conversation help us know a little bit about how to use media to like we have stay informed but yet on the other hand we dont really want be burdened by it you know what i mean i . Think for everybody particularly the age of social media and the addictiveness of the internet, figuring out your information, diet, what actually makes you feel empowered, purposeful, makes the world more coherent, is really important around all the issues. And there is a tendency of the mainstream and politicians to tell us a story that. Were just consumers or maybe we can also go vote. Theyre not going necessarily encourage us to become activists, to to organize, etc. So they fail us on that story. But there are other places you can go for that story. You can get information. Climate groups that are doing that, organize like third act 350 dot org. The sunrise movement, extinction rebellion. Dianas the group for jewish climate people so and then also i actually follow a bunch of smart people i respect on twitter journalists, climate scientists, climate. Etc. And you know, of course, im a journalist myself. So the raw data is something im to crunch. I wrote for the guardian, i think has done the best job on climate the last 20 years by far. And i just did a piece for the Washington Post<\/a> which has been often pretty good but i totally agree with you that the mainstream narrative live is off discourages partly by suggesting that it is too late. We dont what to do. Its too hard to do. Its all about sacro feis for example, when the when Lawrence Burke<\/a> Lawrence Livermore<\/a> labs kind of spun their about their fusion experiment to make it sound like an Energy Solution<\/a> rather than something that was actually about Nuclear Weapons<\/a> stockpiles security. They got a ton of newspaper and other media stories suggesting like oh god this could be the Energy Solution<\/a> we need. And it made those of us deep in the Climate Movement<\/a> just berserk because we already have the solutions and. Thats something a lot of people dont understand. We have the solutions we can supply all the energy we need with wind, sun, where we have an absolute revolution, an Energy Revolution<\/a> that might be the greatest technological revolution since maybe fire in wheels and, you know, a revolution against fire. Were going to get energy from not from burning for the first time and. You know often the story sometimes the stories are just wrong sometimes they have an attitude defeatist. So im just behind the curve and have the solutions and then was touching on something thats been really important the not too late project and to us personally which is were also constantly encouraged particularly by the but i think that the democrats and the mainstream play into it that whats required of us is renunciation and sacrifice and austerity. And i did an editorial in the Washington Post<\/a> this trying to stand that on its head. Were constantly told that we now live in an age of abundance. But do we really do we have an abundance hope to have an abundance of justice, economic justice, to have an abundance of community and social connection, do we have an a, but, you know, do we have an abundance of hope and confidence about the future. I think were living in an, you know do we have clean air or clean water etc. Do we have clean politics. We all those things, you know, i would say the answer is no and what we need to do for the Climate Crisis<\/a>, first of all, is exit the age of fossil fuel. But in decentralized energy, we can sort of leave the age in which fossil fuel politics, which have been so grotesquely corrupt as. We, you know, observe the anniversary of the invasion of iraq by the u. S. Government, but also a lot of, you know, we dont just have to change Energy System<\/a>. We have to change the culture i think we have to change our what we value, how we measure wealth and to think like, you know, do we have good friendships. Do we have time . Do we have meaningful work . Do we live in a community where everybody has enough . Do we have clean air and clean water . You the pandemic earlier and one of the shocking things about the pandemic was all the air pollution around the world that stopped recently. They had air pollution so bad from burning fossil fuel in thailand, i think 200,000 people were hospitalized. More than 8 Million People<\/a> a year die. Respiratory problems due to burning fossil fuels. But the pandemic happened suddenly in northern india. There were a lot of communities that could see the himalayas for the first time in decades. And theres subtle things like subtle losses, like not being able to the mountains that have been there for millions of years suddenly have become invisible because we burn fossil fuels, things like that, like you. And theres bigger things. But i think changing criteria, our sense of what wealthy, what matters, who we are, what need, even who we means may be, a we that includes people who are historically excluded in the global south, in the south pacific, maybe a way that includes all living beings. And so the story is also, as well as the Energy System<\/a> is of the work. And part of what thelma and i wanted to put a book together about an accessible book a book that unlike most of the books i see on climate would be really inviting to newcomers whether because youve overwhelmed by, you know, all the out there or because youre 17 and, you know, probably havent been reading the news for a really long time. Well, then the thing that i see is that so much of it has to do with changing inside us. Like i can remember when the epa was started and the epa being start was a by bilat by bipartisan bipartisan action. And it was because of things like the river in cleveland set on fire. Well that wasnt acceptable. Anybody who was living then and so we think its always been polarized but it hasnt and illustration that youve caused me to think about was an author that i think your fond of the dawn of everything david graber and david wingrove. Yes. And the thing that was so amazing about that was that using science, they seem to have upended the narrative of the myth of the stupid, savage and that like that that lives as though it were something in our collective experience. And he completely negated it. What a powerful of how changing story makes a really big difference i think were living in an era were huge number of stories are changing and im old enough was born into a world where women separate and unequal as were people of color and that was by both law and culture completely normalized and people kept you know, women kept out of the ivy leagues, black people out of most places, almost everything by white men. I was born an era where we almost didnt have a language for the environment. People didnt think about it. Im a year older than rachel. Silent spring. People thought the cold war would last forever. And im the same age as the berlin wall not to sort of anchor it all on me. But, you know, in even in the summer of 1989, people didnt think that the east countries and, you know, the berlin and then the soviet union a couple of years later would collapse and that binary organization of the world cease to be what it had been. And of speaking of binary, the way we think about and sexuality has changed radically in our time. The way we think about food and nature has changed. All the stories are changing. Were also living through a huge push back from right wing, you know, white supremacist, neo fascist and authority aliens who dont like the radical that is part of this, you know, the new stories, the new values, the new we have this era. So were in a story battle. What stories are we going to tell about what matters, who we are . Who should decide, etc. . And, you know, its the conflict is pretty intense right now. I think in many ways weve won. And what were seeing mostly is backlash. I dont know. They can take away reproductive rights example, but i dont know if they can take away the belief that we deserve the reproductive which we didnt have before 50 years ago on abortion became legalized nationally. So were in an era of, i think, so profound and so multifaceted. Its really hard to see. Its happened slowly. Its happened in almost every arena. Its created a world as thelma and i like to say, that would be unlikely noticeable to people from 50 years ago. Part of what gives me hope for the future is. You know, if we had a time and a bunch of people from 1973 showed up and we told them what the world looked like now how Different Technology<\/a> was how Different Energy<\/a> was. You know, the uk got almost all its from coal then it gets almost none of it now. And as my heading towards renewable you know my majority Energy Sources<\/a> and 2023 is unbelievable from 1973 which is why i think 2073 isnt imaginable to us but the unimaginable is not impossible though. And what we do now builds it. We can see what people did in 1973 and after for gay rights, for womens rights, for reproductive rights, for as you mentioned with the epa, the clean water act, the clean air act, etc. , for stuff as well as young people kind of inventing organic farming reaction against the pesticide. Rachel carson talked about. So we see a world unimaginably changed in 50 years. It will be unimaginably changed again in 50 years, depending on what we do now and which is why, as climate activists were so committed to fighting for the best Case Scenario<\/a> and trying to push back worst Case Scenario<\/a>, we are at least by agenda for this evening is is definitely includes these stories and how we can change this narratives and what those might be and i think thelmas and fentons point about having the artists us with our imagination and creating new pictures. Are there pictures in the book that are there stories . Is there something that youd especially like to to share with us as far that narrative success . I mean, there are literally we have five graphics by my brother david solnit who Bill Mckibben<\/a> today called the Climate Movement<\/a>s are activist with a sort of mashup of artist and activist, but theres also like very rich stories by a number of people in the book. So nicola jefferson, whos a young black climate, who was with the sunrise movement, talks about organizing a climate, a hunger strike, and how deeply distressing it was to watch these people who are close to starve themselves into, you know, incredible danger to their lives to try and face down. The foot dragging on what build back better and the Green New Deal<\/a> which became the ira that eventually passed yotam tells a beautiful story about what do we do when the world is ending . What do we do when we feel like the world were in is going to end . And he looks in the holocaust. Native American People<\/a> facing genocide to. See people whove been valiant and committed in the face of not the the earth ending, you know, in some kind of planetary apocalypse, but theyre worlds ending in deep ways to. Find inspiration for going forward, doing what you can matter what you know. We have a lot of stories like that. Jacqueline, whos a paleo ecologist and climate scientist in maine, tells an extraordinary story about going into an ice tunnel, siberia, where she see the world that ended 20,000 years ago. All frozen stuff that was alive then. That isnt now. I think mammoths and things like that to think about time and what kind of hope we can find from it. Adrian brown talks about and joy as part of activism. So theres, you know, theres so many stories in the book well and the thing that i think is that, you know where work we live natural creatures in a natural and you remind us with our imagination we can dream up different scenarios. I think that we are we have so much and the way people thought about nature even 30 or 40 years ago was nature was like half the picture was the other half. And theyre kind of coequal to nature when people in new york used to say, like, oh, natures in the past for us. And i used to to yell at those new yorkers in the eighties, you hold a cup of coffee. The coffee came from a tropical forest. The water came from, you know, the reservoir is north of new york city. The paper came from a tree. The milk came from a cow. Youre holding for, you know, your in your go cup of coffee. And people dont think like that anymore. And thats something in my own work. I try and map a lot a lot of stories have changed slowly and increment so that people dont often recognize how differently we think but we do think so about these things we didnt think about where food came from. We didnt, you know, cesar chavez and the farm workers made us think about, well, who picks that food in the 1960s . But that kind of thinking about what is the foods impact on the environment, how many miles did it travel . You know, all those questions. Were in a radically different world. So words, were in the middle of changing all the we need new stories is, thoman, fenton observed. But we also have a lot of stories that are pretty new compared to where we used to be. Something that happens to me regularly. It happened when i took a look for some reason at lord of the rings yesterday, is looking at something used to think was really fun or. You know, i really liked a great movie. It happened to me during the pandemic with rain and i find that my values have changed things that were even noticeable to me then with lord of the rings was like, wow, the dwarves and elves are white people. And with purple rain was how cruel prince is to the hes supposedly infatuated with and how thats played for laughs and how when that movie came out 30 years ago, probably everyone, including 21 year old me, laughed and i look at it now and like i made the movie to me. And i actually kind love going back to these things because im like, wow, our values have changed weve surface things that used to be invisible, rendered things intolerable or that used to be tolerable. And so were there were in the process of colossal change, which i think is terrifying, which is why some people are hiding out from it make America Great<\/a> again. I always called make america 1958 again. Trying to trying to roll the you know wall time backwards, which doesnt work or though in your book do some really fun things about being in the future and looking to hear or being here and back. And so you play with time and some really interesting we do, but we definitely dont try and make it 1958 again although the 1958 for like progressive taxation really awesome and the Republican Party<\/a> was a relatively Reasonable Party<\/a> but it was a terrible time to be anything but a very small percentage of the population. If you werent white if you werent straight, if you werent male, it was a really tough world. But the the thing that i notice in the way that youre speaking is not only do you have the bigger a broad timeline, but you also have self observe asian. Its like you notice how you feel about that movie or you notice how you feel about the reaction to something thats different than. It was and i think that that us, if we have the awareness of to be able to map that its its quite helpful so yes we all fall down the Mainstream Media<\/a> information for a while but then we notice that we have and we pull ourselves back out again or be witness to our own lives. Im not sure how much people do. And part of why we started not too late as a project and then did it as a book is because theres a lot of climate, despair, grief, anxiety. And it comes from two things. One, i think its bad factual information and people who think it is too late. We dont have the solutions. Nobody nobodys doing anything factual, misinformation and like that died. And you do run into people who announce, although those are the kind of weird people who seem to kind of be very excited to push despair on to everyone else that you know were all going to feel that civilizations to die or humanity is going to die or life on earth is going to die, which is not going to change a lot. But thats not going to happen. But what i also find is that people have not facts but frameworks. Their stories about how change works and, how power works, dont let them recognize what i think the. Reality of that change is what where power lies the power of changing the story as youve brought up multiple times the the power of ordinary people organize and create movements that can you know change regimes change change what corporations can do change the world and have over and over again. I write about the past a lot because the future is unwritten. We dont know what will happen, but we know and we know looking, learning from the past how to make it happen. Thats one of my favorite things about this book is you write about future is yet unwritten that the fact that from terminate and thats theres terminator three the future is not is unwritten terminator two no fate but what we make and theyre kind of fun you know the terminators and time travel let them look at the fact that what we do in the present makes the future and we can change that, of course, we dont normally get travelers to tell us like, oh, things going to be really horrible in 30 furs. I think were now living in the time of the terminator that the future of the terminator movies, which are like, you know, 30 plus years. What we will not go into the chronology of germany, although it could. But then youd all watch me scratch my head for what i do when i go into the chronology of evening and, i want to make sure that everyone knows that we want all of you to pipe up and come to the the microphone and ask ask questions of rebecca and make inquiries both here in this room and. Also, there might be some chat questions that are coming in. So please know that youre welcome to make your voice heard at this point, theres a microphone here. You can line up there if you would like. And while and well continue to to talk, but we want to we want to make your voices heard, too. And the the comment that i wanted to make about future is not yet written is i know youre involved with the ipcc and they have projections, but you remind us their project is not predictions. Exactly. And i wanted to just speak a little more to future is not yet written. One of the things that induces climate despair, the idea that the future has already been and theres no wiggle room and you see a certain kind of fatalism, talk of inevitability. Whats interesting for me is that thats often on the outskirts. If you talk to people who are deep in the Climate Movement<\/a>, activists as organizers, as scientists, thats not at all what they say. Thelma and i were delighted. See, the uns top Officials Say<\/a> in response to the report released yesterday or monday that simon still said its not too late. The ipcc clearly demonstrates that it is possible to limit Global Warming<\/a> to 1. 5 degrees centigrade with rapid and deep emissions reduction across all sector, all of the Global Economy<\/a> and would be that would mean radical change in this decade and and people think its impossible. Its why the first essay in the book is called difficult is not not the same as impossible. It is not impossible would be incredibly difficult, but for political reasons we know to do we know how to do it. We have all the technology, the obstacles have been for a very long time political. We have to overcome the power of the fossil interests, the inertia of the status quo and the politicians serving the fossil fuel industry in the status quo and the failure of the imagination of people who think we cant do it. Its hard, etc. Need to build movement stronger than the status quo and the fossil fuel industry. And ive been around the Climate Movement<\/a> since was pretty much a climate and i remember demonstrating the corner for Rainforest Action Network<\/a> 1988, talking about, you know, oxygen in the amazon so maybe longer. And the movement has grown incredibly its global, its powerful, its influential. The future much brighter because of what activists have done, including the way that the new deal which you know it was ridiculed when it started out, shaped bidens climate, which led to build back better, which, you know, kind of got whittled into the inflation act but did pass. You know, we have done nearly enough to bend the curve, but we have bent it from where it would be had we done nothing, had there been no paris climate treaty, had there been no organizing, etc. So we are making the future as i i. P. C. C which i will just throw out again is the intergovernmental on Climate Change<\/a>. The worlds scientists in the field come together to talk about where we are where we need to be, how to get so you know they tell us because i dont think people think in these big frameworks is enough we are shaping what the earth will look like for the thousands of years to come. We in this decade. Its an incredible. It requires all of us to be heroic. I think we deeply believe we the not too late people that we all have that capacity heroism that most of us have a role to play in the movement and. You know, finding that whether its joining something, donate, organizing, educating, keeping hope alive is the work all here to do and it matters more than anything that. First question. Yeah i to ask about the role of fear in changing the story of that hollywood story about the future and according to Climate Change<\/a> is you know dont look up that film that just came out where it was things were the asteroid about to hit theres this new show on apple tv extrapolations takes place in 2037 and the world look, things look really grim. And i was thinking back to when i when that the day after tomorrow came out and that story about nuclear a possible nuclear war or was nuclear war came out it seemed to shift the consciousness in way people got oh god this could really happen so im just curious about how you think about fear in relationship to all the wonderful things youre saying about how we need to have hope. I, i think as were on cspan, i cant use a lot of curse words, but hollywood is really good at two things which are really which really bad for life on earth. One of them is crash bang violence, and thats your version of the future. They find most imaginable. I think thats a broader problem . We dont have a lot of utopia stories, although we have some, including kim stanley robinson, ministry for the future, it and the other thing is they like lone heroes. You know, they very rarely can tell the story. The world gets changed, not somebody who is an action hero, which usually means whether the terminator or tom cruise or whatever, theyre really good at violence and you know, which is also not how the world gets change. I care how many muscles you have, thats not going to make you a good organizer. And being a good organizers, whats going to actually, like, make you a person who can change the world or a good storyteller, a good fundraiser, or maybe a good, you know, engineer working on climate solutions. So have created a kind of parallel reality thats simple and i think kind of ugly. They also find stories in which human nature is selfish and selfcentered, which might be true. A lot of hollywood executives and you know thats the story. I wrote a book about disaster. In 2009 and what really happens in disasters. Is that most people are brave all truest stick create of the rescue and take care of each other. They rise to the occasion. Those you who are in San Francisco<\/a> for the 89 earthquake might remember that the 1906 earthquake is full of stories like that. Im hearing stories coming out of turkey where theyve just had an earthquake like that i heard so many from hurricane. But katrina in particular in our time was when the Mainstream Media<\/a> told the story. Hollywood about raping, marauding, looting barbarians who need to be subjugated by law and order, which returns us to the lone hero narrative they like stories in which ordinary people are sheep and wolves a need some strong with a gun or muscles to control them so thats one of the places we need to change a story. I was actually with an amazing organization, the Solutions Project<\/a>, and they actually put out a template for climate and film and television to suggest how to weave climate what you tell. I think that not only do you need to literally talk about the Climate Crisis<\/a> when you do Something Like<\/a> that, but you also need talk about how does change happen. It doesnt with guns and muscles and car chases and things going bang and boom. So and you know what i feel like because i asked this question last week, we not only need to talk about climate per say, we need to figure out how to be the people who can address the crisis, what kind of values do we need, what kind of knowledge do we need . So i also fuels the we need the we need will give us a sense of who we are. And that goes back to what i talked about in the beginning do we live in an age of you know, abundance and we need to have austerity for the Climate Crisis<\/a> if we recognize and i say you see this in stories of disaster who are we, what do we want . What you see in disaster two over and over as people luminous with joy, even though their city just fell apart a lot people died. Things are in ruins. Theres no power because they Found Community<\/a> they found connection. They found meaning and purpose. They a kind of immediacy. And i think thats what we want most of all. We want these deep connections. We want purposefulness. We want meaningful work and meaningful lives. And thats what hollywood tells us about who we thats not what advertising tells us who we are. And so we need to tell the story climate, the climate and what we can do it. We also need to tell the story who we are in radical ways that i think are very present in a lot of old stories, traditional stories, indigenous stories, fairy tales, sometimes, but arent so present in sitcom forms and, you know, a lot of hollywood junk marvel movies. Oh, god, i cant believe i got through this without any bad. Next question question, manuel. Hi, manuel. No, thank you. I see you. Thank you. Yeah. First of all, i want to acknowledge that i like the when, as you said, a bottle of stories i work with a lot of with language and conversations and the power of language and the power of the type of conversations. I think we need conversation for designing the future. So i, i think you said that very well today. Thank you. And however, i also think that we need the time to have those conversations. And so and we seem to be so busy at least in this country, busy busy to make a living, to pay the rent, especially in the bay area, where, you know, we all busy, you you got to the rent keeps going up so i wonder also if not only the right futuristic type of possibility conversation its part of what we need to do as you said, to change this story, but also having the time to do it. So i was wondering universal basic income, for example i mean, you mentioned the minister of for the future, kim stanley robinson, and there was a lot of issues there in book about economy money. And so i just wondering about universal basic income. Okay was the time to have a cup of coffee and have great conversation about this in the future . So i just wanted your opinion. Yeah, no, i think youre absolutely right. About time. Universal. Basic income, which feel i havent studied enough to take a position, but i feel that insecurity drives this in the united states, a world where as a homeless people, you know, mere blocks from this building, its possible to be in Society Without<\/a> even a roof over your head or knowing where your next meal will come from, or access to health care and or a shower in a world where that can happen to you, how can you ever have enough . And i think that one of the things that people in social welfare states like have is a sense since can never fall terror the way down. You dont have to you there is such thing as enough and thats what a lot of those studies about happiness in scandinavia about scandinavia. To go on is dark, cold and dark. There are a lot of the time theyre there. You theyre lutherans. They drink lot. Theyre not happy in. You know, some senses they have a lot of security and confit ance in their lives and know that their societies are basically decent that way. So yeah, but i think the time thing i remember, you know, im old enough also to remember people having a lot more leisure. The 40 hour workweek. Thank you. Unions actually a 40 hour workweek, a lot of families could live or you know. Couples could live off one income. You know, i lived in San Francisco<\/a> when a lot idealistic kids, whether they wanted to write poetry or be active ists or whatever, were able to live off a Part Time Job<\/a> and devote the rest of their life to something that didnt pay and yeah, weve lost time and is part of where the conversation about and scarcity could change radically so i think you brought up a beautiful we are poor in time in so many ways we feel harried we rushed we feel like we dont have enough for pleasure, for joy, for wellbeing, for friendship for family, for a community. And so thats one of the things, you know, if we dont consume so much, we dont need to produce so much we dont need to produce so much. We dont need to work so much. And suddenly time reappears. So thats another way. I feel like the story be upended. So i have a little story. May i offer you just just on a date myself quickly. You mentioned 58 hours and 68 paid ashbury spent eight months there in haightashbury a lot of free time, a lot of experiment. So thank you so. So my little my little story was about the first days of covid. And i was on my exercise bike and pedaling away when my knee went out. And im used to being a horse galloping through life and all of a sudden i had this sense that it was like i had a turtle on my knee. And that turtle was saying slow down. And listen. So thats my offering from this time is. How can i or any of us have that taking time to listen to ourselves, listen to each other, listen to nature and the wisdom of nature. So thats my little story for this evening. Slow down. Listen, i invest in for so many people theyd like to. But time is money and theres immigrant parents here working 3. 3 jobs to keep a roof over their kids heads. And its not because they love work so much. Its that because they love their kids so much. And we really have with know terrible wages and you know, the up the cost of living housing in the Bay Area Health<\/a> college etc. A a world thats you know, a country thats so much harder and much less equal than it was 30 well, really before ronald reagan. Thats the beginning of the great regression from the relative economic equality and ease of earlier era. And Somebody Just<\/a> talked about being in the haightashbury in the 1960s. What the sixties, the socalled sixties was about by which people usually mean what white kids did in the late sixties is was about people being able to drop and live off the fat of the land because theres lot of fat on the land, on the land. And there was a lot of room to take chances. Do differently and that i dont think young people feel like they could do now i two people who are wanted fugitives with fbi posters about who then like came back into the system and actually became professors with tenure and did four did very well and i dont think that works that way these days. So we really change the economy to force, to take away peoples time, take away their quality of life and we mostly the Republican Party<\/a>. But i am bill clinton and welfare reform, etc. Went along it. And one of the things we could do and should do or not, its universal basic income is just remember we dont even to talk about socialism or scandinavia. Yeah. Just the world in which the system was tuition free as it was for my father, in which you know, the social safety net was so much stronger, which living wages were so much better for working people and weve had that world in this and i think it peaked the sixties and seventies. We could have it again, but wed have to vote for some pretty radically different economic policies. So weve reached the point in our where we only have time for one more question. So sorry, ill try to get a good one, guys yeah, i actually think thats a perfect segue way to the question that i was going to ask. You were talking earlier about it i dont want to block people. You were talking earlier, a story shifting, right . Yeah. Like gender, race sexual assault, like all these like big topics. Right. And another conversation thats happening recently is around wealth. Right. And you have these big events like davos and theres a huge climate focus and these alist billionaire go. And they talk about how theyre saving the world and kind of piggy back on on your question earlier its sort of like the hero. Right. But of muscles they have money. And i just kind of curious to get your perspective on that because for a long time was it was they were kind of thought of as saviors because they have all this access in a way. Right. And so im but as someone whos been involved, this im just kind of curious to get your opinion on that. One of the things i love, i we keep talking about ministry for the future, a great book id recommend to anybody who likes chunky novels of the near future. One of the great things about is they decide billionaires are a threat to the climate and eliminate them. I think thats actually smart and. You know, one of the shocking statistic people often suggest that were all equally for Climate Change<\/a> almost nobody in bangladesh is almost everybody in Beverly Hills<\/a> is. And you know, the bottom the 50 of humanity produces about same amount of Carbon Emissions<\/a> as the richest 1 of humanity. So theres people having 50, 50 times the impact of other people. At a minimum, you know, you look at private jets versus, you know, farmers in bangladesh and youre about a much larger scale than that so. I think that nobody needs to be that rich. And one of the things we all in the bay area see the time is people get rich doing that are pretty sketchy theyre not necessarily improving humanity. Im looking at airbnb and lyft and facebook and twitter and its okay. Twitter didnt make anybody rich. It is making the richest man in the world a lot poorer. So maybe, maybe, maybe it has some some value. After all and you know, they have not they have made the bay area dystopia not a utopia. You see cultural institutions die, you see desperation, you see a housing, you see Public Transit<\/a> falling apart, etc. And theyve contributed to all that. They also tend to think solutions have to be like that. They need to be some big, heroic technological, super duper wonder thing. Bill gates certainly that way, even if hes only the third richest person in the world. And and so they tend to be they tend to use their power mount obstacles to what the Real Solutions<\/a> to Climate Change<\/a> are, which are modest and dispersed. Know we dont need some you know Carbon Sequestration<\/a> and geoengineering and things like that are kind of excuses for continuing burn fossil fuel. We have solutions. Its renewable energy, its electrifying. Everything. We know how to do it. But i think the world looks too alien to them you. Do you literally decentralize if you no longer have these corporations profiting hugely off power that centralized where fossil fuel is produced and controlled . You know, wind and sun are basically everywhere. And so their failure of imagination, their decisions and their money makes their decisions influential, which is why billionaires are a climate problem and some progressive taxation would be really. Im a big Elizabeth Warren<\/a> fan and the fact that she wanted to tax the hell out of a lot of the big tech corporations as well who are all tax cheats as well. Well, you know, in this room theres a lot of Rebecca Solnit<\/a> fans. So thank you so much for you being with you. So happy to end on an anti billionaire note youve youve really us lots of food for thought if any of you in this room are billionaires its not too late give it all away i recommend the Climate Movement<\/a>. Thank you to all of you for us today. Thank for the online audience for also being there. If youd like to. Support the Commonwealth Club<\/a> and encourage our programs. Visit club dot org slash events to do that. Thank you all for coming. 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