In forum and the commonwealth club. Im sure ill evans davis the executive director of the San Francisco human rights commission, and im pleased to be moderating. Todays program. I am beyond honored to be in conversation with renown Civil Rights Activists host of msnbcs politics nation founder of the National Action network and author of the new book righteous troublemakers Untold Stories of the social Justice Movement in america. Reverend al sharpton paying tribute to those members of the Civil Rights Movement whose stories have not been given due recognition. The book is a testament to the connections relationships and individuals that the movement was built upon and sustained by so with that lets get started first. I just i cant state enough how much reverend sharpton im grateful for the opportunity to talk. To you and to be in your presence and to have this conversation. So, thank you so much for your time today. Well, thank you cheryl, and im very happy that youre hosting it and i look forward to a very robust and informative conversation. Yeah, i have to tell you. I recently a dear friend of mine. Who is the assessor recorder in San Francisco at Joaquin Torres told me about not told me ive heard of james cone over the years, but he talked to me about some of the some of his books that ive been reading them and i just im going through your book and im having flashbacks of you know, the gospel is black power black power is gospel or the the pedagogue, you know this idea of the press so i have so many questions and at the same time i recently read some of the the sermons and strength to love by dr. King and so to know that you are rooted and grounded in that truth is just all throughout this book. I cant tell you times i wanted to just i did have moments of emotional just feelings and and and as we start i just wanted to ask you even the process of writing. This was this in some way therapeutic or cathartic. This is just so rich with stories. Yeah. It was cathology. Oh in the sense that id say in the book that early in the book that we had in the middle of the george floyd movement. I was actually do oh the eulogy at both his funeral in minneapolis and in houston when it happened his family and attorney ben crawford reached out to me and id gone into minneapolis because some of the marches and reality and then they actually what i come back and do the funeral and in the middle of the eulogy of cheryl for whatever reason it just came out of my mouth we need to go to washington. We need to watch we need to deal with this now you have to remember when the middle of a pandemic he really had the funeral people had to be distance or they were so stars from hollywood. Kevin hart was there you name him was there and i Just Announced his mind on king the third was on the front. And i work together. They are cooperative with nash actually network and we work with his oh group and from me just to and he looked at me like what is he talking about much to watch . We have no plans. We have no budget now does land have the ability to do it, but i announced we pull it off inside of 60 days. We had 200,000 people in a pandemic. We took temperatures as they came in around Lincoln Memorial. And they came to get me out of the tent where we had the families. We had ahmedabris family there. We had George Floyds family there. We had aragondas family about 15 families. Theyre in the 10 and theyre gonna walk with us to the stage where im gonna speak on the steps of Lincoln Memorial and as i was walking, you see all these hordes of people and there was an old man look like hes in his eighties that kept jumping up and down in the crowd with something in his hand. And for whatever reason it caught my and i looked at this pretty guy. Lets look at that old man. What is he trying to tell us and they said, oh she moving revenue. I said no get that old man, and they brought him over to you. And he showed me it was a button. And the button said march on washington freedom. He said theres a button from 1963. I was here in 63 for the march on washington with dr. King and i want to be here with you today. And i hugged the man and he went back into the crowd and it haunted me cheryl i said its guys like that. I dont know how they paid to get to washington. I dont know how even they stayed a hotel. I dont know whether they ate its people like that that make movement and nobody ever talks about them. And thats why i developed this idea that i wanted to write about people that i know that notable thing but never got limelight and thats why i call them righteous troublemakers many of us are troublemakers, but we get me we get some not right. Righteous people that are those that go and know no one is gonna call their name. They dont go home to see if they dont even lose. They dont pick up the paper the next day and see if they on the San Francisco chronicle their for the cause and i wanted to tell some of their story. No, i was moved by that description right . Like i can see you walking into the crowd and and as you were describing that in the book, i just had that moment too of like when you talk about the hundreds of thousands of folks over the years right that have been in those spaces whose stories but the part where you talk about sustaining the work and moving the work and the line where you say we came to stop trouble right like that idea of righteous troublemakers like that. That is trouble right when you are trying to stop it you cause in trouble for somebody else. Its good trouble is john lewis would say right and see i think you know the the whole way of naming people trouble me. Is like saying putting your knee on a mans neck for nine minutes and 29 seconds is not trouble, but if i come to town and say lets march. Thats true. Thats you know got jogging in brunswick, georgia and killing him. Thats no trouble. But if we come in force a trial thats trouble so even idea. What is a troublemaker and in many ways. Were trouble breakers call trouble makers on a righteous call. Its really a narrative shift of sorts right like you are changing how we see that how we do that and how we respect it in so many ways right the idea of it. So the other piece that in the beginning one of the stories the as you talk about Darnella Frazier and you talk about just so much of this just as you get into it you unpack it and you just see the humanity of people but also the vulnerability and how they put themselves out there right for the good of the people and that challenge and that people are doing that every day and it just has gone unnoticed. You look at daniela frazier. For example, i write about in the book the young lady who filmed the original video did not come from the Police Body Camera came from dunnella frazier who was taking her lonely to the store and she saw this. Police officer with his knee on George Floyds neck and started filming in us started filming it and not cell phone made other stop and stop filming it. She just innately felt this is wrong. What is going on here . She didnt study Political Science somewhere. She wasnt a member my Group National network or the naacp. She just an ordinary girl. Thats the way this is wrong. Let me record this. I dont even think she knew what she was gonna to do with the record. I remember when we came up to the repast after the funeral in minneapolis, and i met darnell and her mother. They had to move out of their house. And to a motel because they were under threat. Can you imagine this young lady . Film the policeman who ended up convicted of murder and they threatened her like she did something wrong. I wanted to tell her story because it showed a real courage that this young lady had and she stood up. I dont believe there would have been a george floyd case conviction if it wasnt for dunnell afraid. And you talk a little bit about the changing of the ties and and i do want to say this part here. This is where like really struck me when you say, you know, god lifted up these sacrificial lambs so we could do his bidding in their names and in their honor just how heavy that weight is and how these people stepped into that and to do that and you talk about there have been people that did the videos and filming before without necessarily the same support that darnella ended up with exactly right . For example when when turning chrome and follow this floyd who was one of georges brother. Oh right about also in the book when they call me right after that happened actually what i go to minneapolis and try to help organize because they want to see the violence and it was only a day or so after that. Georgia been killed. Immediately. I thought of eragonas mother because eric garner who was choked by new york city policeman and killed they never indicted those cars. They never got to court and there was a film there was a video there 12 times. But eric garner said i cant breathe then the policeman kepler in that chokehold and i thought erics mother and i said man is a pandemic. I wish. Accurate president go with me to connect how these stories are together because i by then it seemed on ellas video where eric was saying. I mean where george was saying with eric said i cant breathe. So i called miss grand car and i was a mother of eric gone, and i said gwen did you see this video out of minneapolis . She said i saw it. I said, im trying to find a way to get there because its the pandemic a lot of flights have been canceled airport. She said my bags already packed. Let me know and i said, i know, you know about what happened in minneapolis. Would you do me a favor and let me use your private plane . He said itll be there 10 in the morning and take you where you want to go and she and i flew in his plane to go do the first rally and dog that night. And again we are risking because everybodys like locked down. Were literally in august now doing a lot and we flew back he gave it to us to put a funeral and tyler perry gave us a bigger plane to bring the family and from houston because with a lot of people didnt know is that george was the only Family Member in minneapolis all the brothers and sisters lived in houston on north carolina, so we had to bring them as we had the logistics of were moving in a panic. Were doing all of this as people are all over the world starting to march and were trying to stay focused on taking care of the family the what one thing people dont understand and i talk a little bit about that in the book is that a policeman is accused of a crime or violating policy. They have the union to back them up in the union provides them with resources and lawyers and if they need therapy, whatever they need. The victims dont have any of that. So when that selection network tries to do is be that institution for the victim help move them around help them if they need somebody to give them some advice on how to handle interviews and book them logistics help them with many of them have take off work. So we try to give them funds they can pay them bill. You cant fight an institution like a police union as an individual you need another institution to do that. So people think i just come in and jump on tv, and thats that we do all thats why the families remain so lawless we do everything for them that the unions do for the police but one of the things that i really appreciate it was you making this distinction about your own self worth right and this idea that at some point in time you you arrive to a place where other folks think that you know, theyre validation now make you feel like you are more important and i love your response to them like you havent decided whether know theyve arrived whether you want to be accepted by them, and i think that that is important in this work the selfvalidation and selfworth that you bring to the space. No you youve got to figure out early in your life. What are your values and whats important to you . I remember leslie mcspide. Who was the mother Michael Brown who was killed by police and ferguson, missouri. She got up at a rally one night and stunned me. She said that she never will forget mark. Twain said the two most important moments in your life is the moment you born in the moment you find out why you and i told her i teaser because we all like i said i work with these families even now im new diallos family and i talk all the time and lets have 20 years ago because you become family. I know their kids they know mine all of that and i tease lazy i said, i never thought id hear you in the middle of a rally in ferguson quote mark twain, but its appropriate quote because people that shunned us as active as much about Police Brutality marching about racial violence marching about affirmative action martial art lgbtq, right . Once asked grand for president became those of a tv showing all that they show well, you know, we can accept certain things with you now revenue now, well, first of all, im still watching. Im still doing the rallies. Im still doing the eulogy. Im not stopping anything. I did and what makes you think i need your acceptance. The question is what i want to be in. Europe and i said i intelligent people could be faced with these kinds of. Social crisis and not be involved and have this elitist attitude like they can judge whos accepted. Well put keep me on unacceptable list if thats the price i have to pay. Its you know, you go through and you talk about that in the same the same spirit with with colvin and parks right this idea of whos acceptable whos a were able to kind of use to advance the work and even when you talk about Hosea Williams this idea of were all needed in this work. Yeah, you know when i wrote the calvin called. Many people if i eventually say most people. Dont know that there was this young lady in montgomery, alabama. That refuse to give up or see the front of the bus nine months before rosa parks did in montgomery. And the black Community Leadership many preachers i might have passed. Did not want to fight and make a symbol out of claudette. Because she was dark skin, and she was pregnant. It wasnt married. So in came the class thing and i dont think a lot of times cheryl we want to talk about some of the class stuff that we have in our own community. The rosa parks was inspired by clark. They did it nine months later. She was light skin married. She was the model fred gray was a lawyer for rose apostles. Also the lord for claudette. He was beyond that and one reason why that story hit at home to me. I didnt come. From a family of preaching many of the ministers that have been in civil rights are the second third or fourth generation preachers. My father was not that and my father left when i was 10, and my mother had to raise me on a wealth and food stamps my sister and i so i didnt have the pedigree and the lineage of a lot of the high profile civil rights preaching leaders had before me and you face class things there. I remember when i was 18 a guy joined my youth group. He got killed his daddy was a big entertain his daddy took me like his son. He was james brown the godfather so of a lot of the ministers i was around civil rights look down to with james brown this gut bucket and they win this refined thing but james brown was who we like so i think that what i wanted to raise there was all of this you got to qualify to be a victim have to qualify to be a leader. You know, we want our way to washington one day. Oh james, brown has made an appointment to go to white house to lobby for modern things birthday to be a holiday 1982 and on the plane james brown said to me reverend i say yes, they never call everybody by this. Certainly. He never called him by the first name. He was very much into you know, you got to be respect and i said, yes, he said i want you to do your hair like mine. I want people see you you like my sunday correction to me and i did and i kept my like this all my life since then because this is the first man in my right then validated that i was worth something. He wanted me to be like him one of the biggest entertainers in the world. He gave me with my father did so which is why they didnt like people man why you called your head . It was my personal body with james brown and i sell that to say that it was getting beyond this leading for acceptance and validation for others that also inspired me to write this book about Claudette Coleman who is important as rosa park. Pauly murray who was an attorney that wrote some of the most insightful legal stuff that Thurgood Marshall used and they would not exalt them because she was gay and a woman i won the right a book about them cause i was them because i didnt fit the prototype of what a quote civil rights leader was supposed to fit, you know, come here out of the law out of the hood didnt go to you know that i believe school. That should not qualify you are not. Ified be afraid of fighter it is whether youre committed whether youre discipline and whether youre gonna fight for the people i know plenty people that are i believe train got the right pedigree in the right lineage and dont do anything you hit on some of this and that was part of what i took you you refer to Kimberly Crenshaw and the idea of intersectionality and one of the things that i i really appreciate it, especially in this this era that were in now is that you call out right like these pieces of the intersectionality like you just said the classism colorism, you know, the the sexism all of these Different Things that do exist that almost create the Division Within within the race that makes it complicated to advance some of the work as well and share people play in those division to divide us to politically break us down so they can make us uncomfortable with each other. Oh feeling oh superior to each other based on these fictitious walls or then they can through the gap do what they have to do. So, im a baptist minister been a boy preaching and all the way now to them in my 60s, but that doesnt mean i cant work with people that are most people that atheist because if we believe in the same values and principles how we get there is our business how we intersect as crenshaw say thats the strength we have on the right way on the right. I should say they are not all monolithic. They dont have the same faith the same belief the s