Congress returns later today for legislative wor f the First Time Since the midterm elections. The house is bkt 2 p. M. Eastern republican whos elected us we deserve out the remainder of the late indian republican congresswoman Jackie Walorski rm will be sworn into the house. Incoming house members will also beapitol hill this week for orientationraining sessions for their start in cogs in jaar the Senate Returns and will continue debe on a u. S. District court judge for puerto rico. Watch live coverage of the house on cspan, the senate on cspan2. You can als wch on a free deapp cspan now or online at cspan. Org. The u. S. Special envoy for iran robert mali talked about u. S. Policy and the Nuclear Negotiations with iran. Good morning, good afternoon, good evening wherever you are in this Wonderful World of ours. I hope youre safe and above all healthy. I am Aaron David Miller senior fellow at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace and welcome to carnegie connects. Issues of critical importance to american into the world. Today im especially pleased to welcome back to carnegie connects rob mali, a friend, a former colleague and now the Biden Administration special envoy for iran. Rob, first what to welcome you back. Its great to see you, and one day hopefully we will be able to do Something Like this actually in person. I guess id start off by framing alleys my view a great deal has changed since we spoke last, but one thing seems to remain the same, and that is there really are no good or easy options for the Biden Administration or for the United States frankly with respect to iran. U. S. Policy is kind of betwixt and between. Protesters want regime change, the administration is unable, unwilling, perhaps as aa good idea maybe not to basically articulate that strategy. The jcpoa is seemingly increasing less, and presently less although how you constrain and restrain Irans Nuclear capacity without it come some sort of diplomatic arrangement is unclear. And we may well be confronting a post jcpoa world. Maybe we could talk a little bit about that later. And finally iran is not a formal informal combatant and perhaps the greatest Foreign Policy challenge that the administration or in many respects the International System has faced since the end of world war ii. Vladimir putins invasion of ukraine. Theres much to discuss but i first want to ask you how your holding up. The iran Nuclear Negotiations are in abeyance and we were returned to those in a bit, and the focus has shifted to whats happening on the streets in iran. Youve come under a good deal, great deal of criticism larger from the iranian diaspora about your role, including calls for you to resign. I just wonder first, how are you handling all of this . And is or anything you would like to say i want to say to your critics . So first, aaron, thanks for having me. Its always a pleasure to be with you. Particularly in this forum and its great opportunity at this time to try to clarify some things and to get into an indepth discussion as im sure we will in the course of the next 45 minutes or so. So listen, you raised the attacks. Yes, theres a lot of emotion, a lot of passion what was going on in iran and its legitimate. Its very legitimate. So many in the Iranian American Community have suffered for so much at the hands of this regime. They are not here by choice, a number of them. They would prefer to be back on but they cant because of the nature of the regime and because the violence that it is the exercising against its own people. What interesting today at this moment which is this Popular Movement, Grassroots Popular Movement which is so aweinspiring in terms of its courage, its determination, its persistence. And on other hand forget wrenching violence, brutalityf regime thats going after people on the street, particularly women and girls, young girls are at the forefront of this movie. So i get it it. I understand that everything we do everything we say is going to be scrutinized, and people are going to feel very strongly. Critics are going feel very strongly about what we do, the policy visit administration is and will we have to take that into account. Now the particular issue over which people are most upset at me in the last couple of weeks was a tweet that i put out in which i characterized the aspirations and the demands of the people of this Popular Movement in iran, and it was a mistake and owned up to the mistake. Its not something that i should do particularly because it was viewed as diminishing the demands of the protesters here and so what i said and what ill say again today, its that up to us. Its certainly not up to me to characterize what the people on the streets of iran, particularly the women who are demonstrating what they want. They are doing a very good job themselves expressing their demands and their aspirations. What we as you as compared to do what the Biden Administration has to do and has been doing is supporting the fundamental rights of iranians and taking action which im sure we will be getting into to make sure that the region is held to account, and that iranians can continue to express themselves and to communicate with the outside world. So thats what we need to do and accept, we are in a country where you should be legitimate debate and strong debate. I would try line just to my last comment on this and this doesnt have anything to do with me. But there have been some attacks against iranian americans of mena, the diversities and some of these attacks particularly against women have been borderline threats, harassment, sometimes in a very sexualized way against women, and thats wrong and thats always wrong. Its particularly rock today when the moving in in a raind by women, when the slogan is women life freedom, to see attacks against women, members of the iranianAmerican Community in particular in such a violent way, and harassing way. That should stop. Thats not the best way to defend the cause of the iranian people. Raab, thank you for that. I also want to point out i feel a certain kinship here. We worked the arabisraeli issue for a number of years. I worked at for a good deal longer, and we were attacked and hammered from all sides. Its a thankless task. Its worth pointing out, however, the notion that your singlehandedly responsible for shaping, formulating and executing u. S. Policy toward iran is a fundamental misunderstanding of the way our systems works. And i think your critics may have legitimate grounds based on the tweet but they should internalize that issue. Because singling you out for the kind of ad hominem to what you been exposed is wrong and it makes you look bad and, frankly, u. S. Policy as well. Lets continue to talk a little about your critics. The broad critique of the Biden Administrations policy is that the administration has been far too focused, obsessed, tethered to an agreement which many see its not only flawed but fundamentally illequipped to deal with the realities of Irans Nuclear program, and that the protests on the streets, Vladimir Putins receiving iranian drones, maybe even surface to surface missiles require a broader look for the United States in our iran policy. Policy. Is that a fair critique . If yes or no, could you let out for us in the broadest sense what the administrations policy is towards all of these elements . Aaron, youre right that is been one of the criticisms. I think part of it is just the prism through which our policy has been presented. It has focused heavily on the talks in vienna on the revival of not of the nuclear deal but thats only one piece of a much broader policy which perhaps we have not or the media has no present a solid so want to take this opportunity to present it because its been all the government policy led by the president when he first appointed me laying out what he wanted our strategy towards a rent to be. So if i can take a few minutes to express it. Number one was to try to reconstitute an alliance particularly with our close allies, our european allies on iran policy. During the years other ofp administration particularly after President Trump withdrew from the deal, the nuclear deal in 2018, European Countries are closest alice been about as much time criticizing u. S. Policy on iran than they did criticizing iran itself. That was not good for us. Now guess what, we now are about two years in. We and europe are completely on the same page when it comes it reacting to Irans Nuclear program, reacting to irans policy in Ukraine Company irans support for russias aggression in ukraine and for standing together shoulder to shoulder in expressing support for the arena people at this time when there confronting the violence of the regime. So that was critical and thats what weve done for the last 18 but at a think we really have succeeded in recent kitchen what is a crucial if want to have a common front to push back against irans destabilizing activities, human rights violation or nuclear program. Number two, and you mentioned it, it is to prevent iran from acquiring a Nuclear Weapon. And that, this is not something we will walk away from. Weekly and the president made that clear commitment he would not allow iran to acquire Nuclear Weapons. We are using many tools to get that. The preferred tool and bass that just our view i think its the view including of people who are very different ways of addressing Irans NuclearProgram Including the israeli government. They all admit they all say there is no longterm sustainable solution other than a diplomatic one. So there are other responses to Irans Nuclear program which ill get into but diplomacy is the preferred way. Its the preferred way to try to resolve it and thats what yes, we without apologies weve been engaged in an effort to try o defend u. S. National security interests. Because an iran with the Nuclear Weapon would make the entire world more unsafe, and u. S. Security or unsafe. And so thats what weve been focused on it among many other things. Now, there are other tools, sanctions, pressure and just as the president has said if all of the need to fail as a last resort he would keep the military option very clearly on the table if thats what it would take to prevent iran from acquiring a Nuclear Weapon. So thats number two. Number three is pushing back against irans destabilizing activities in the region, its proliferation of drones, ballastic missiles, its interference in other countries, its attacks against some of its neighbors. And we have together with our partners and allies and all the agencies in our government try to make an effort to combat encounter those activities whether its through sanctions, interdictions, hardening the defenses of our allies and our own defenses and funny other ways to push back against irans destabilizing activity. We had not predicted would take place including that iran would expand that destabilizing effort to europe and will get to the unsure in this conversation but were also focus on that. Thats a very strong pillar of our policy in which we meet real advances. Number four, at the president again made this clear not just about iran but about a Global Policy which is to put human rights and the defense of human rights back at the center of our Foreign Policy. We have done that across the globe. We are doing that and weve done that when it comes to iran. Think you are seeing that today and every step we take in everything that we said since the outbreak of the protests in iran but that goes back to earlier in terms of our denunciation irans Human Rights Violations and try to get other countries around the globe to unite in defense of irans, iranian peoples basic human rights. Again, im sure well talk more about what steps we are taking now particularly at this moment to make sure that we could stay true to that commitment which as acip is a global commitment. We do our best to be consistent. It is not a perfect science but in the case of a rant i think we have been a very strong in trying to push forward for respect for the iranian peoples human rights. And last but not least is to try to get and to make sure that we get the three remaining hostages in iran back home and reunited with their families as soon as possible. Thats been a priority of the administration President Biden, secretary blinken your finances could advise and, of course, my team and myself to get them home in my all three deserved to be home. They should never have been in prison. Its an outrageous practice the iranian government has had which is to use these dual nationals as pawns. They need to be home and were doing everything we can to make sure that day comes as soon as possible. Thats our policy. Its not a nuclear policy. It supposes tries to bring all elements of u. S. Power, of u. S. Diplomacy to bear to achieve those objectives. Its complicated, its complicated. Usually the choices available to the president on complicated Foreign Policy issues are not between good and better, between bad and worse. You think strategically, and before we get to the issue of the demonstrations, the protests, the Extraordinary Events that are happening in iran, i want to ask you this issue, this question. The jcpoa initially was designed as a sort of transactional, not transformational, agreement. It was a transactional effort, and armscontrol agreement if you will to restrain constrain Irans Nuclear program, and presumably to preempt an israeli strike and to make an American Strike which four american president s have declared would occur, a military option in order to prevent iran from obtaining a weapon. But it remains because of nature of the regime in large part and their need to turn the United States as an adversary into an element of regime mobilization and iranian nationalism, the whole approach towards Irans Nuclear program very much remains transactional, even adherence to the jcpoa would not guarantee that after a discrete period of time iranians could not if they chose to return to enrichment and even the production of a Nuclear Weapon. Does that reality, or how does that reality influence and the fact and shape the whole notion of american policy toward iran with respect to the nuclear first, we make no apology for having tried and still trying to see come to do everything we can to prevent iran from acquiring a Nuclear Weapon. Again, preference for diplomacy if i can work with tools of pressure, sanctions in particular, but also keeping very much all options on the table and case diplomacy were to fail. Such a will get back to that in particular but it do want to address one of the points that a think some of her critics admit is that because are still trying what we then tried to pursue a nuclear deal that we both of the elements of our policy on the shelf. Thats not true. Its simply not true. We have not self deterred because of the pursuit of a diplomatic agreement. I think youve seen any actions of the Biden Administration including and when i mentioned countering irans destabilizing activity i should mention for some for most president s decision to use force on at least two occasions against iranian affiliated militia in syria for which were they were going after used to. So defending the u. S. Interest, defending the stability of the region, that takes place regardless of whether the Nuclear Negotiators are succeeding not succeeding, regardless of whether the jcpoa are not all of the other elements of a policy, p will conduct and we have conducted regardless of the fate of the nuclear deal. I want to make that clear when people say why dont you walk with from the negotiations . It would give you more ability to do other things. We have been doing this other things. We havent waited to see what happens to the nuclear deal. Any more that iran has whitaker iran has continued its destabilize activities, continuous support of out groups and terror scoops across region. Is can do to develop its Ballistic Missile to repress its people and to talk and to plot against america and by the way which is another of their completely unacceptable forms of behavior. And if they could do that even as theyre trying, they claim to try negotiate a nuclear deal, we can do the same. We can take action against those destabilizing activities. We can mobilize countries around the globe. We could count irans activities, even as we are seeking to reach a diplomatic solution of the Nuclear Front but again will come to that because theres been no movement on the negotiations now for two months. Right. We can return to the issue. Its troubling and im not sure youre anyone else has an answer, which is how to deal with the strategic reality that even with a without the jcpoa once sunsets expire unless they were renewed or followon agreement negotiated,