Adjacent to the cemetery location is eric leonard, the chief of the historical site. He will be with us for the next hour to talk about the history of andersonville and why does consider the most notorious site of the civil war. We are joining our phone line so you can join the conversation. If you want to join the conversation, 2027488900. That is for eastern and central time zones. If in the pacific or Mountain Time zones, 2027488901. You can also post questions and comments on our facebook page. Facebook. Com cspanhistory. Mr. Leonard, thank you for him joining us this afternoon. Mr. Leonard it is my pleasure to be here. Host lets start with where is andersonville . For someone who is not aware of andersonvilles significance, where does it fall . Mr. Leonard it is important to it is important to start with this idea that military prisoners and prisoners of war are often left out of the mainstream telling of the war. Quite friendly, there are no winners in the story. This is not a battlefield. It is something entirely different. It is a valor and honor. Those concepts take a different form here. And many respects, in a standard guess, they are prisoners of war, and then you move right back to the battles. Often, and addressing the story, there is an and knowledge of that, and then no detail, and you move on. Andersonville has a name brand recognition. The public often doesnt know any of the details beyond the name and that something unusual took place there. Host lets start with the basics. When was it built . What was its purpose . Mr. Leonard in the fall of 1863 as the Exchange System of the previous two years falls apart, due to the presence of black soldiers in the field, and the question over how to treat like soldiers black soldiers. With afederacy is faced problem. There holding the mostly in the richmond area. Thousands, 10,000 prisoners in richmond it has a drag effect on the community. Resources are going in to maintain the prisoners. If you are in the Confederate Army, or the government, you are looking at those resources, they should go to the army to fight the war. If you are civilian, you are thinking, my family is hungry, why am i having trouble getting food . And then, prisoners in Richmond Richmond is one of the primary targets of the war, there is a lot of fighting having unionity soldiers in richmond makes that target even more attractive. The solution was to move the prisoners away. That63, there is this idea southwest georgia is a very safe, insulated place, very far from the fighting. It is serviced by the Railroad System of the south, and it is an agricultural breadbasket, food should be readily available. Officers come here and find a site. Some of the concepts that we consider this idea of not in my back yard. They specify an area that is essentially 100 miles north and south. You will notice, the president did not prison did not end up near a commr big communities. Want the prison close to them. There are 20 People Living at the andersonville station train stop. Those people do not have political power. There are willing landowners who are absolutely ready two of them make the deal. On paper, they are supposed to receive a rent of about 50 per year from the confederate government for leasing their property to build this massive facility. 1600 acresioned as a square design for a capacity of 60008000 prisoners, essentially those being held in richmond. The intention is to move them from richmond here. Construction begins in early 1864, and by the end of february, prisoners are en route and arriving here. The prison comes into being. 600010,000 prisoners was the original intent, how many ended up there . Mr. Leonard at its height, the one time capacity in august 1864, there are over 32,000 u. S. Thisers being held inside present. By that time, the original stockade had a 10 acre expansion. That is both in the month of june and open on july 1. Host also, could you follow up, if you have that many people in such a confined space, what is living like their . Give us a sense of the conditions and what ends up happening with the prisoners there. Mr. Leonard this is the forest a part of south georgia of southpart georgia. The original 1600 stockade was built of posts that were square and fit tightly together. The first prisoners that arrive described as a place where their construction debris is clearly everywhere. It is a very disturbed place. There is no shelter. Prisoners improvise shelter out of the degree that is present debris that is present. Were gathering details are allowed out daily. When youre gathering that would, you are looking for two purposes. Obviously, all this fire wood for cooking, but larger pieces debris and castoffs of is shelter making material. Dont forget, if youre watching a home and want to contribute to the conversation, again, now is the time to do so. If you want to call, 202 7488900 for those of you on in the eastern and central time zones. If you want to tweet at us, you can do so. You can also post on our facebook page. Mr. Leonard, lets pretend i am a prisoner coming to the prison, what is my day like . In the 14 months of the present operation, the answer to a question changes to radically. For those initial prisoners who arrived in late february 1864, it seems strange when you know what comes later. They see andersonville as an improvement. It is better than other prisons. It is an improvement. The weather in south georgia seems nicer. They have a change of venue. They are kind of excited about the opportunity. , everyoners arrive prisoner that arrives here and leaves here does so on the train. The train is integral to the story. When you are offloaded at the train station, the train itself, the train tracks, and the train station are almost half a mile to the west of the main prison compound. Prisoners referred to it as. Hundred paces to hell outside of the gates, closer to the main compound, you are intoed out, assigned detachments and squads. Part ofl is a critical the daily experience of the prison. Roll call is how the confederate command determines how many prisoners they have, and what their disposition is. They are counting the number of prisoners in the hospital, in the stockades. Theyre making daily lists of the number of prisoners that arrive, the transfer out, and that die. They separate that out from the number of people who die in the hospital and die in the prison itself. Host as far as the way people, give us a sense of Health Conditions where their clean facilities . Give us a sense of what living was like in that front. Mr. Leonard one way to start with that is the hospital. A 14 months, theres always hospital. It is in three different locations, and there is a fourth adjunct to that. Just for prisoners, there is a separate hospital facility close to the train tracks. That was a compound with two frame stone structures. Where the hospital starts is inside the hospital itself the prison itself. That, by may, the confederate command has realized is not a good idea, it is not working very well. The hospital downstream of the prison to the southeast. Their perception is living next to the stream will be a healthier space. It is important to note that the stream that they move it next to is the stream that flows through the prison compound itself. , the, as originally built enters the middle and west side of the compound, flows through the wall, and the creek is the single most important feature of the present. It is the plumbing. The prisoners will collect clean Drinking Water in the middle section of the prison, perhaps bathe and clean themselves in the creek. The creek is channeled into a. Tructure that is a toilet the intention of all of this is the flow of the creek will flush the toilet. The success of that is designed on an understanding in the 1860s of germs and bacteria, which is to say, no understanding of that at all. But they dont know is they have created the perfect breeding ground for dysentery. Host we can engage in this later, only because we have calls lined up for you. Lets start with paul and tennessee. You are on with eric leonard, go ahead. Caller my question is why does andersonville have such a Bad Reputation with another that had a rate. Ow survival andersonville did such a batter reputation. Ad mr. Leonard andersonville is the deadliest place on american soil. Here and 14s die months. That is a dental they cannot be compared to any other place. The percentages have been used to create a sense of false equivalency. Parish in onend is aa there complex reason of why that occurs. In one single month, 3000 people died at andersonville. The scale was stunning. Survivors spend the rest of their lives trying to come to them to what happens to and their friends. Families struggle with what was it for. While 13,000 men die here, nearly 13,000 live. That is the bigger number. The survivors of this experience come to an end. They struggle with what does it. Ean there is not this sense of valor. In fact, prisoners of war, until the late 20th century were considered to be cowards and failures as soldiers. Guilt, isst survivors something that Union Soldiers struggle with. Connieur next caller, from north carolina. Caller mr. Leonard, i have a question. I recently watched the ken burns documentary on the civil war. They stated in the document that the superintendent of the warden of andersonville was convicted of war crimes and hanged. I would like to know what his name was. Can you verify that for me, please . That is absolutely true. Urtz. Is captain henry wo he serves the command structure of the prison is in byy respects dysfunctional design. It makes no sense. There is a kernel that commands the entire military complex there. This is a really big plays with, at times, thousands of confederate soldiers either by you have a or colonel in charge of that. Under him, you have a serious of. Epartments there is a chief surgeon who oversees the hospital operation. Captain you have a whose job is to oversee the operations of the prison. Second to that, the guard forces are georgia reserves, a form of militia. These are not combat ready troops. These are teenagers, old men with little training. When they are assigned, the. Aptain has authority over them when he is off duty, the authority falls to the commanders. Z is often absolutely frustrated. He complains constantly. His hands are tied. He is dependent on the quartermaster for supplies, the commissary for food. The roll call that they do every roll call,hey call the commissary officer has to provide food into the prison. Food was delivered every day. Henry wurtz is still on blownn as the prison is to the wind. The kernel gives the last command of the complex. He fled to florida the week before. On may 2,o his arrest 1865. Heat is transferred to washington, d. C. After his arrest and the transport, his escort, at one point in chattanooga, turned him over to the guard house, the federal guardhouse in chattanooga. That was a mistake. When the captain, who is escorting him, comes back, he has been recognized by the men who were once in his care. During his transport to washington, d. C. , the end of shaving the beard off of his face so he is less recognizable. 30,000 men live through this, and they recognize him immediately. Toy are the ones, and try figure out who to blame, there is a larger command structure, but prisoners do not see that. Z every day. Nry wurt they tell stories about the dutch captain, one of his many nicknames. He is tried in a military tribunal in washington, d. C. From august 1865 to the end of october. November 10, death 1865. He is often described as the only confederate soldier to be put to death or tried for war crimes. That is not true. He is absolutely, positively the most famous. By the time of his institution, he is the third confederate captain to be tried and executed for war crimes in 1855. Host mr. Leonard, we are asking people to give comments and questions on facebook as well. Writes and on facebook saying there was a movie called andersonville and asked if it was an accurate perch rail portrayal. Mr. Leonard there are sort of two films. Miniseries about the present. It focuses on prison life and dramatizes a fairly early infamous moment in the prison operation. Iding,mp ra prosecution, and later execution of a group of prisoners known as the raiders. Separately, there was a stage play turned into a film, calledg William Shatner the andersonville trial. The play and then the film about the trial are inspired and drawn out of the trial transcript that by the u. S. D government in 1869. The tnt miniseries was a threehour miniseries that explored the prisoner experienced by drilling down to in 14 months of the drill down to something that is over and done in one month of the prisons history. It is a very dramatic story. The story of the raiders ultimately has a very nice, neat dramatic arc. Beginning, a middle, their capture, and finally their execution. The Confederate Army come all thatay from richmond, okd. It has a nice beginning, middle, and end, but the truth is the true prisoner experienced, no one wants to watch it. You are dirty, hungry, you have to go to the bathroom there is a lot of sitting around and waiting on a fate that is very uncertain. The tnt film, the background detail is stunning. When i watch that, that is what into. Into i key it is a very accurate for tail. Portrayal. Host our guest is entered eric leonard. You can call and enough questions. The numbers will be on the screen. Lee in winchester, virginia, thank you for holding on. Aller thank you mr. Leonard i had a great great uncle who was brought to andersonville. Im wondering, its an open part, i believe. The dates and times you are able to go to andersonville, and, are you able to get records and copies of your ancestors and and the being there burial sites . As a u. S. National park site, andersonville is open to the public daily. It is closed only three days a year thanksgiving, christmas day, and new years day. The grounds are open in a clock to 5 00. The museum hours are from 9 00. O 4 30 daily inside the National Prisoner of war museum, the part maintains a database park maintains a database of people buried in the National Cemetery, including the andersonville dead. There is a listing of the andersonville prisoners, the debt and the survivors. There also partial listings of prisoners of war. We do not have original records here. The original records are at the National Archives. The most important historic document for documenting union theirers of war is th Service Record. Again, the National Archives has that. Some of the records are becoming accessed and easier to than going to the National Archives. , especially the survivors, but the dead, the record was done well after the war. It is a memorandum. It identifies the captured day of the individual, often the circumstances of the capture. Lists the various places where they were held prisoner. With most prisoners held andersonville, this is one of at least three, sometimes as many as six, prison facilities that they are held at in the space of one year. It is the biggest and most famous, for a lot of reasons, but it is not the only one. Those National Archive records. Re the first source during a visit, you can use the database to look of a person. Often, we do have copies of the Service Record or other items. This was an enlisted prison. What is extraordinary about these prisoners, theyre not famous people. Are the workingmen of the u. S. Army, the marine corps, the navy. Their privates, corporals, sergeants. What is extraordinary about them is how ordinary their lives are after this thing that the experience. Host from california, this is david. Go ahead. Caller good morning. I was told that there was a medical doctor who would examine the prisoners before they were admitted to the cap, and its , andted to the camp supposedly he was a freemason. If there were any masons, and they made a note to him, he would extract them. As that possible story possible story . Changenard the surgeons over time. However, it is clearly documented this actually makes the story better georgia officers who are freemasons, they recognized the ,ing and the sign, these men who under normal circumstances, their job does not bring them to the stockade, they walk in with care packages and names. There is a masons large improvised in the stockade, against the south wall of the prison. diary accounts prisoners notice this, and after the war, they want to be a mason. That fraternity is one of a very small number of routes in which mercy is being allowed in the prison. Thank you for bringing that up. Host that was david and california. Mr. Leonard, as far as safety within the prison walls, how did that work as far as having so may people combined in one space . Mr. Leonard there is little to no internal policing. They the cards do is sa man the gates. That in their relationship to the creek. One of it is north of it, one of it is south of it. There are 52 towers around the stockade wall. What the guards do is keep you in. And so, internal policing is left to the prisoners. And if that sounds like a recipe for trouble, it is. Constanting is almost part of the prisoner experience, where early in the prisons operation, raters or rating is a raiders raiding or is a verb before camp robbing. Thea prisoner, the more more friends or have, the closer your stay together, the more no one is going to steal your stuff and you are going to survive if somebody else is walking watching your back. Host lets go to charles and virginia. Go ahead. Caller yes, i have a question about andersonville. Prior to andersonville existing, the north and the south had Prisoner Exchange agreements. The north had unlimited supply and the north had more troops, and the south had a limited supply of future troops. And what it was a war maneuver strategy brought to lincoln by his generals. The south doesnt have the troops to replenish these. Andersonville wouldnt have existed, neither would have chicago, or others, if not for lincolns war strategy. It is not lincolns war strategy. The system ties into the evolving nature of the war. Following the emancipation ,roclamation, the United States the union army start enlisting africanamerican men not simply by the thousands, but by the tens of thousands. And this creates a question. It is a cultural change. How do you treat these men . And in the spring of 1860 around the same time of 1863, the army, the Lincoln Administration are struggl