It is simply not fair, regarding the thousands of ukrainians who died in the fight against the russian invasion, and it certainly does not mean that the ukrainians would stop in their struggle, i have not heard such conversations that ukraine wants to stop, and how about who is there aristovych predicts that we , together with. Russia, will attack the western world, but this is his private opinion, a person who is currently outside ukraine. And i will Say Something else in the west unfortunately, the world is not aware of one simple thing the future accession of ukraine to nato will turn nato into a universal deterrent mechanism. War in europe, because the accession of the largest power of the continent with unique military experience, it will simply create conditions under which a new war will, well, have absolutely no sense. I understand that when talking with russians , it is difficult to talk about some logic, some arguments, but this is reality, we are the largest country on the continent, without us there is no european, no euroatlantic project. Will be complete, and instead of realizing this and instead of the necessary help for the defense of ukraine, we are told that our military cannot master the technology, we have, sorry, civilians, but. Russian tanks almost with bare hands, the first weeks of a largescale invasion in those days when western aid consisted mainly of antitank and portable antiaircraft missile complexes, so it is not for western politicians to talk about how and where to beat ukrainians, you know, it reminds of. The position of a victim of robbery or a victim of beating, it is better to substitute the right cheek, or the left side of the liver, so that it would be more convenient for the attacker to kill us . Against this background, the Foreign Ministers of france and Great Britain, Stephane Sejournay and david cameron, wrote a joint column for the telegraph in honor of the 120th anniversary of the signing. The agreement between the two countries, which is known as the cordial agreement, or the entente, however, the entente was still there and russia was still in the entente, at that time, it was the fourthseventh year of the last century, its leaders before the exit from the first world war, so in this column, which is published the heads of the ministry of Foreign Affairs write that dark times have come in the world, so both countries must take responsibility and act. Even more for ukraines victory over the Russian Federation. I will quote. We are both completely singleminded. Ukraine must win this war. If ukraine loses, we all lose. The price of failure to support ukraine now will be much greater than the price of repelling putin. Mr. Yevgeny, it looks like france and Great Britain are taking the lead in supporting ukraine at the current stage, as scholz is afraid to launch an attack. Taurus, longrange missiles, the United States of america is still delaying the allocation of aid to ukraine, in the amount of 61 billion dollars, and the french and. The french are saying that we should give support to ukraine, and ukraine should win this war, but here there is no other sentence that russia must necessarily be defeated, because to fight back against putin and russia must feel or be defeated, it is or lose, these are completely different concepts, in my opinion. Or not, let us not expect from western partners that they cant say anyway according to the laws of diplomatic etiquette, neither france nor Great Britain is at war with russia, so they cant say that russia must lose, well that will cause a corresponding reaction, i understand that now is a time when no one reacts to diplomatic. Notes, but anyway, it is we who must promote the algorithm of russias dismantling to the world, it is we, ukraine, who must talk about the fact that the russian empire, which pretends to be the Russian Federation, must will surely lose, a its peoples must get the right to selfdetermination, this is our duty. Because we bear the brunt of the war with russia, and only in this way can we influence something, accordingly, this is a situation that does not fit into the formula of both honey and spoon, and do not forget that britain, for the most part, is a maritime state , im afraid that the british are now on. Their military aid to us, france has a more powerful military industry, it is gradually expanding, but we need other countries and interaction with other countries, so we have to talk about lendlease by the United States, so we should restore relations with poland and build cooperation with them in the military sphere, so we should be grateful for. The ammunition found for us and understand that the war will not last two or three weeks, no one can say for sure today , when this war ends, the war , unfortunately, will continue for a long time, and we must focus on our own national interests, comparing them, of course, with the position of our partners. Thank you, mr. Yevgeny, for the conversation, it was the executive director of the World Institute politicians evgeny magda, friends, we work live on the espresso tv channel, as well as on our youtube and facebook platforms, for those who are currently watching us live on these platforms, please subscribe to our pages and take part in our survey, we today we ask you about mobilization, whether you support Mass Mobilization in ukraine, yes, no, everything is quite simple on youtube, if you watch us on tv with a smartphone or phone and vote. If yes, 0800 211381, no 0800382. All calls to these numbers are available free of charge vote, at the end of the program we will sum up the results of this vote, and we will actually see whether you, our dear friends, are in favor of strengthening mobilization in ukraine. Next, we have oleksandr khara, a diplomat, in contact. Expert on issues of Foreign Policy and Security Policy of the center of Defense Strategies. Mr. Oleksandr, i congratulate you, thank you for joining the broadcast. Good evening, mr. Sergey, thank you for the invitation. First of all, mr. Oleksandr, what do you think about mobilization, about strengthening mobilization, since we are asking our tv viewers, so it would be absolutely logical to ask you what you think about these processes taking place in the Verkhovna Rada regarding adoption. Of the mobilization law regarding how the mobilization system is built in ukraine . Well, of course, this is a difficult question, and there are hardly two answers, i support or do not support, since what other options could be, this is the first point, the second point, i understand, actually there is certain, lets say, skepticism in society, against the background of the fact that that we see a delay in the aid of our westerners partners, against the background of the fact that we, well. By and large, do not understand a clear new strategy in such conditions, on the one hand, europe has consolidated, supports us, on the other hand, we hear about crazy plans for the future, a possible future. Of the president of the United States, that is, under such general conditions, this is one story, and another story, of course, that russia is not going anywhere, and its goal remains the same, it is the destruction of ukraine as a state, and in fact the ukrainian nation as such, so from one side there are no alternatives for strengthening mobilization, with on the other hand, i understand that there are these issues, and of course, that there is criticism regarding the content of. The draft law and certain exceptions from it, and that is, in the eyes of society, certain points may not look very fair and cause such criticism that we simply have there are no options on how to defend the state further, but in what modality, it is clear that there can be a discussion, and it seems that this discussion is already being developed by the secretary of defense of the United States of america, lloyd austin, who at a meeting of the senate committee. Of the United States of america on armed forces, advised ukraine not to attack russian oil refineries, and focus on military objectives. Lets hear what lloyd austin said. Of course, these attacks could have consequences for the Global Energy situation. I think it is better for ukraine to focus on strikes on tactical and operational targets that can directly affect the current hostilities. Mr. Alexander, what is lloyd dostin afraid of . I do not think that he personally, i these theses were definitely formed and agreed in the white house, strategies, in fact, lloyd austin was and remains one of the biggest, most such powerful engines in the administration, who understand the dangers of ukraine, want to help, and what he voiced, well, in principle, this is a truism, it is clear that russia is, in terms of energy. Quite an important country for the global market, and of course, any which fluctuations in the price of oil globally can certainly affect the ability or willingness of our partners to help us, and most importantly, now during the election in the United States, you can imagine that a few extra cents per gallon of gasoline in american gas stations, they are definitely not will add positivity to the current administration, by and large he says these things, as part of the strategy, the failed strategy of the biden administration, which is that you cannot push russia to escalate, to use nuclear weapons, or to attack a nato member country, and then accordingly can be, lets say, not predictable consequences, and the second is the failure of russia, that is, the collapse of the regime and possibly the disintegration of the Russian Federation, and all the forks are helping us so that we cannot use western weapons russian territory, the first moment, and the second moment, of course, so that we do not transfer the war to russian territory, but on the other hand, what can they do to us now, when we are fighting for our survival, and at a time when, on the one hand, ukraines deterrence strategy has failed, we can see it, and the main thing is that this administration is not able to provide ukraine with other things, such as air defense, to protect our skies, and, well, continue somehow. Therefore, he simply said, well, stated an absolutely understandable thing, but on the other hand, he did not denied our right, in fact, from the point of view of international law, these refineries that supplied fuel for the armed forces of the Russian Federation, they are a legitimate target, that is, it is not a civilian, purely civilian object, well , by and large, you know, which is very reasonable by our forces. The targets were not chosen, we are not destroying, well, actually the oil infrastructure, they can Sell Crude Oil to the foreign market, and thus the price does not fluctuate much, but we are destroying processing capacities that can be used and are actually used for the purposes waging this aggressive war, i am not talking about the history of warriors involving the United States, where they also struck the oil infrastructure, and it is clear here. Because without top fuel it is impossible to use airplanes, tanks and cars, and it is clear that this is problematic for the continuation, if not of the war, then at least in certain directions of some operations. Could what lloyd austin said be one of the conditions for ukraine to open the financing that we expect from the United States congress. No, unfortunately, it has its own dynamics and, actually, according to the visits, according to the results of the visit of the minister of Foreign Affairs of the united kingdom, mr. He met with the possible president of the United States, donald trump. According to the results of this meeting, there was information from Trumps Office that they discussed the issue of ukraine and trumps plan or efforts to stop the killing in ukraine. That is, it is very consistent with what we read in the Washington Post recently about his plan to pressure ukraine to give up part of our territories. In exchange for. It is not known what, and the second point also eloquent, this is what, so cameron was going to meet with the speaker of the house of representatives, in order to convince both the United States and europe of the need for america to help ukraine, but such a meeting did not take place, and it was understood, this is understandable, you know, a rather bold hint, i am not talking about the presence of one of the key trumpians in the house of representatives. And actually the sabbath that is happening now, if you read the twitter accounts of these mages, that is, these trompians, how they oppose, to things, a very good article by the financial times, which actually says that the republican party, well, is actually prorussian, it has become not only just broadcasting the propaganda theses of the kremlin, but. It actually protects the interests of the kremlin, so in these conditions, it is not the same , that the administration does not want, on the contrary , it wants to accept this bill, and they are even trying to find some kind of understanding, because it is clear that the congressmen are not going to vote on the same law that was voted in the senate a few months ago, and now we expect which option, there is Brian Fitzpatricks option, somewhat less defense. Aid and there is no economic aid to ukraine, there are two competing bills that would allow it to be put to a vote, the bill that was voted in the senate, and mike johnson himself says about a brilliant idea trump, about the loan to ukraine, and actually this means that someone has to write this bill, so far it has not been submitted for consideration by either the committees or, of course, in the hall, which means that this. Process is being dragged out for an unknown amount of time , but with on the other hand, well, in fact, time is running out for these delays, and mike johnson will have to make a decision whether to hold on to his position and actually go down in history as a person who helped an aggressor country, who blocked aid, whose conscience is partially responsible for the death of ukrainians , will he find some kind of compromise, fighting with. Some of the trumpians in the house of representatives in order to unblock this process. Well, by and large, the majority of votes will be found there, of course, democrats, plus there are republicans who, despite trumps pressure, trumpians, they support ukraine and are ready to vote for such a bill. At the same time, mr. Oleksandr, information appeared in the Washington Post about the details of trumps socalled peace plan, which. Allegedly provides for the transfer of crimea and donbass to russian control. Advisor to trumps election campaign, jason miller, called this news fake, but president zelensky , in an interview with a politician, criticized the expression by the candidate for the presidency of the United States of america, donald trump, of the idea of handing over ukrainian territories to russia in exchange for ending the war. To quote mr. Zelensky if the deal is that we just give our territories and. Thats what the idea is, its a very primitive idea, i need very strong arguments, i dont need a fantastic idea, i need a real idea, so that peoples lives are at stake. At the same time, zelensky noted that he seeks to build a Constructive Partnership with trump, and recalled that he invited him to ukraine, that he conveyed messages to trump. Zelenskyi has a long history in communication with trump. We remember how they were in 2019 talked by phone, the result of which was the investigation and the beginning of the impeachment procedure of the then president trump, which did not reach a logical conclusion, but judging by todays rhetoric and trump and zelenskys answers, is it possible to predict now, and what will trump be like in the second presidency, and will they. Find a Common Ground with zelensky or the United States of america under trump, will they find a Common Ground with ukraine, which does not want to cede territories to russia, well. You know, i probably agree with trumps representatives that this is not trumps plan for the simple reason that im sure trump doesnt have a plan, he has approaches, and we saw that in his first term, how he tried to solve the north korean issue, he felt that by virtue of his charisma, you know , mats, he can scare kimchinin away, and more precisely, move away from his hair. Interest in the survival of this regime and the possibility of threats, well, primarily to the neighbors, but also to the United States itself, and it seems to me that this is trumps plan, to put pressure and be unpredictable, and of course, what in the case of the Russian Federation, ukraine, it is unlikely that he can achieve any success by putting pressure on putin, so in his mind, most likely he will try to do it with zelensky, but i dont think that it will work out very well for him. For a simple reason well, first of all, zelenskyi constantly repeats his own peace formula and the fact that we cannot give up our own territories, this is absolutely understandable, but the second point is that the vast majority of ukrainians are not ready for such concessions , as we understand it will be a pause before the next stage of the war, it will definitely not be peace at all, especially since we can get membership in nato and the European Union in return, well, it is clear that this is impossible. In the short term, if it will be in the long term, well, lets imagine this, im not saying that we have to agree to any territorial claims, but just imagine, we a