Transcripts For ESPRESO 20240703 : vimarsana.com

ESPRESO July 3, 2024

Internal attacks, we see more extensive the network of these attacks and we see that, in general , this trend is intensifying among the russians, and why is this necessary, why and what exactly are they doing, well, it seems to me very well, said such a russian propagandist raguzin exhaustively, he was once the head of the Russian Space agency there , and now he gives lectures there from time to time, as a future russian diplomat in migimo, he. Tells how it is necessary to create fakes in order to actually act inside the country that russia is trying to attack. Lets see. Victory in the war is achieved first of all due to the fact that to discredit the political and military leadership of the enemy, to present them in the eyes of the population as unworthy people who happened to be at the top of power in this country. These are people driving their population to certain death, to slaughter. This is a very important way. The second way of discrediting the military and Political Leadership of the enemy country is accusations of corruption. When a significant amount of deepfake is used to prove that a specific person on the adversarys side is simply a fraud and corrupt. And thats why you cant trust him. Its mostly idle. Uncompromisingness of the army, his own achievements and many other things, well, it is interesting how he, as a diplomat , directly says that in order to discredit someone, just use fakes, but create fakes and everything will be fine, you are such diplomats, and we here wonder why not benzya. But something in the un tells some , you know, absolute fantasies and lies, well , you see, they are taught this right away, they just havent had time to graduate, they are already being told how to create fakes, and almost in all these areas and about what we have now, what methods and what topics is used by the enemy, lets talk now with oksana moroz, she is the founder of the initiative, how not to become a vegetable. Hello oksana, so congratulations to you, you talk a lot on your Youtube Channel about all these nuances, and i really encourage our viewers to watch, because you literally consider each case separately, and it is very useful and so visual, but lets talk now in general, well, first of all, what methods is currently being used by russia to convey to the ukrainian domestic audience some of its views. This is exactly what ragozin said, because it is clear that the ukrainian audience, ukrainian citizens, well, in general, do not believe russian propagandists, those who speak on russian telegram channels, when i say salavivaeva or simanyan, then most likely a normal , average ukrainian will understand that this is a lie, that it is about ukraine. Just aggressive propaganda, and he wont believe it, so the russians must have some other tools, what are these tools, tell me, in fact, they go in a very simple, but unfortunately effective way, they monitor our Information Space is very meticulous and reveals all the points where the attention of ukrainians, the emotion of ukrainians is sharpening, and now in the period when there are a lot of complex. Processes with western aid, and war fatigue is, unfortunately, forming among ukrainians, and massive rocket attacks and in fact became more frequent. Corruption scandals and this list can be continued for a long time, the enemy monitors the points where this discussion takes place and tries to strengthen them as much as possible, so that if there was a single precedent, such as when the campaign for discrediting mobilization, there were specific cases of some, lets say, illegal detentions of people, this was back in the distant 22 , thats what russia did, it monitored these occasional moments and pretended. And dispersing this information in various social networks, that there are not one, two, three, 10, hundreds, thousands and so on of such cases, in fact, they apply absolutely the same approach to all of them, for example, to the same topic of corruption or to the the same stem as the possibility, the impossibility of holding elections, that is, if there is no such position, they need to infopolies, they push people to them, well, for example, as now there is dissatisfaction with the authorities, we see it. Sociology, they are all dissatisfaction with the authorities, they add that the authorities need to be displaced, because this authority will not change, and they emotionally twist people that despite everything, for example, elections must be held, so it is very difficult for people to distinguish, because it is true, you are right, if russian propagandists were saying that, everything would be much simpler, it could be clearly marked, and ukrainians have learned this marking, clearly already to distinguish, but when it is said by people like ukrainians, if it is also said by ukrainian bloggers, and even if they are allegedly called rights defenders or some lawyers, well, it sounds much, unfortunately, more convincing from their mouths, and actually the enemy achieves his goals in the Information Space with such hands of ukrainians, well, lets just look at a few cases, well, first of all, the case of mobilization, well, you already mentioned that in fact the russians began to deploy this antimobilization network in mayjune 2022, then all these channels appeared, where subpoenas are distributed, where subpoenas are served, and well, without any verification, without anything, just some statements were put out, which very often were completely fake, but well, it was massively, again due to the fact that the same person led to the channels in several places at once, you can say that probably someone needed it, because to finance the people who do it, well, someone needs it, yes, it is not done without. And if we understand what they can say russian propagandists, well, they have been saying the same thing for two years, well, lets see a fresh case, how they talk about it, about the collapse of the front in the summer, that the ukrainians have nothing to defend themselves, but the reduction of our ministry of defense, of our soldiers, in general, nothing like that foresee, at least for the time being, what such. Panic articles are connected with, but in order to mobilize most likely those people who are still hiding, so to speak, in big cities, because they mostly dug up the villages of small settlements, and now, after the way the Energy Infrastructure has been destroyed, its very difficult for people to stay in big cities, and they try to move, move out, and move again. The kashniks catch them and send them to the front, well, this, you know, this is a constant thing, that they are caught, sent to the front, these are all endless videos that are unknown with whom and how, and when some ukrainian bloggers who also create these Networks Talk about it, they certainly cant, well, they avoid doing so in the style of ruslan katsaba, who in the 14th year thought that working for the russians. He its just that if he calls, well, they will give more money, apparently, he then directly said that i was antimobilization, antimobilization movement, he was put in prison very quickly, because it is, well, essentially a criminal offense, and now they dont say that, for example, there is such a wellknown antimobilizer, lets say, osab stakhiv, look, he already operates with such, you know, as if explaining why a person should not join the army, listen. A state of war has not been introduced, therefore we have not informed anyone that there is a war in our country, so the world calls that in in ukraine, what is the conflict, many people walk around and the tcc calls it a military committee, there are such, there are such, although the military committees in ukraine are liquidated, and the tsc are not registered by anyone, at least i do not know this, the tsc are not registered, in particular, there is a decision of the Supreme Court of ukraine for december 2022 , well, or they directly spread fakes, well, the last one is about the fact that tsk is there. Tortured someone, and ill add, for example, Ihor Mosiychuk also talks a lot about it , and, well, Ihor Mosiychuk lives abroad all the time, so its very strange. If you are like that brave, why are you abroad, so he sits abroad and constantly writes Something Like that, but now he is spreading a fake that they will mobilize young people from the age of 18 and throw them somewhere there, well, first of all, this is absolutely stupid, well secondly, well, yes, he is constantly writing and talking about it, and my actual question is, how do you feel . This entire network of these people now has, what are their main points in the mobilization theme and these messages and what are they wrong about . This one is very different this network is very diverse and varied, if we talk about who spreads these messages on a systemic basis, that is, not once and by chance, but really from day to day, and it is clear that they are actually coordinated, i would say. Yes, because one particular vector is chosen, or several vectors are chosen, they work on them, these are very different people, these are former antivaccinationists who were and actively promoted it even there during covid, these are pseudolawyers, these are pseudolaw enforcement officers, these ordinary bloggers who always published something there about children, dogs, cats, and now they are already taking care of the fact that the population of ukraine has been turned into slaves there and they are not being released abroad. To talk about the fact that it is some kind of Single Network there, of course, it is impossible, we do not have such evidence, we can connect them only on the basis of this sign that they are sufficiently systematically spreading what discredits the mobilization, and what are they spreading . Everything starts from the very beginning, that is, from the fact that they say that the war, the war in our country has not been declared against russia, the state of war itself has not been declared, and accordingly, all kinds of coercive actions, that is, including mobilization. They are not make sense, that is, they are illegal, then they go to the second stage, what we saw on the video that tsc they are illegal, accordingly, you cannot deal with them, they do not have any actions to take and so on, and the third is very important vector is the fact that they cover all the precedents of wrongful detention very meticulously and massively, and here it must be said that the very process of discrediting the mobilization in ukraine. It is very complicated, because russia contributed a lot to it, and it is really there , as you said that from may to june there was a very intense, in fact, discrediting of the mobilization, the second important point is that ukraine itself did not conduct any Communication Company or explanatory company, or any other company, to counteract these hostile influences, and accordingly everything that spread, it fell on such and such a vacuum. Or on some very specific points that by chance someone somewhere or from the Public Sector or from experts spoke in the information field, and actually there is a very important third vector, which is that this so called the antimobilization movement, it is very well coordinated among themselves, they have a lot of different chats, which are still left over from the days of covid, when the same scheme was used, and there it actually works according to the principle that if. Someone, someone was detained on the street by a representative of the tsc, but they write in this chat, and the closest activists from this often go to the place and create the maximum publicity of this situation, it was straightforward that the detention was illegal, they begin to bury tetskashniks, they begin to go their own way methods, and by the way, the methods are taught in special courses conducted by certain people there from this movement and. This is how it gets into social networks and spreads in the same way in social networks, that is, they themselves create these cases of unlawful detention , not always, of course, this is only their contribution to it, unfortunately, there are many facts when we see, indeed, that the employees of the tsc, they, well, lets say, do not behave very correctly, sometimes they behave very incorrectly during detention, and this is a separate pain and with which they work and are armed. Forces and a number of other bodies, well, but their task is to make it visible so that there are no other cases, and this, by the way, is another pain in terms of how it is covered in the media, because in the media, as soon as such cases arise, the media focuses on this, because, in fact, it is necessary to focus on illegal things, but on the other hand, there is not enough balance for those processes that go in a different way, that people really mobilize themselves, people really come and stand in queues. And until now they are under the tcc, they not as big as they were at the beginning of the war, but they exist, and so on and so forth, thats why this situation is so complex and multivector that. That not only this antimonization movement, not only it is a problem, although, of course, they create, probably , the biggest contribution to the information coverage of this situation, well, i would say, another goal of this movement, as paradoxical as it sounds, is not even just to reduce the number of people who get directly into the army, how many to create there is some kind of atmosphere of horror around this, that you will be killed, you will be sent somewhere right away, and this is rather the main such message, which, as a result, creates all this chaos, moreover, i noticed that those the people who are engaged in this antimobilization rhetoric, they very timely and very successfully play along with the russians and in this atmosphere of creating terror, well , for example, now such a Russian Company is going to intimidate. Literally kharkiv, kharkiv will be destroyed, and if, for example, in a russian studio, we understand why they say that, well, this always pleases their population and thats all, well, they have been engaged in this, directly, lets say, genocidal rhetoric for a long time, look at this, for example, why, why am i in favor of putting pressure on kharkiv . The city has a very great moral significance for ukrainians. I will not compare kharkiv and odesa, but it is very important. Are you not in the sense of military importance . I mean moral meaning. The capture or destruction of kharkiv will definitely have a depressing effect on ukrainian society. Demoralizing, demoralizing. And i think that i want this. The people must be broken at the knee, there is no other way out, if they have already started, well, in parallel, this is only one fragment, and i have already shown you about the same thing before, bomb kharkiv, there is a nightingale, well, they all talk about it, and in parallel, for example, the same ihor masiychuk broadcasts a little not every day, but lets just look at a screenshot from it, where he constantly says about the fact that kharkiv is being bombed, Everyone Needs to leave there, kyiv was hit, the drg will work, well, that is , and these are not singular, but here he is, well, literally nonstop all the time, they are talking about the need to leave, someone said that children are dying and so on, of course they are children dying, but to say that lets evacuate kharkiv is not what we are talking about now, no, he is talking about it after all. Every day something new appears in it, the russians made such a strange story, when it was as if some drone flew to the zaporizhzhia station in black, from somewhere, they started talking about the fact that it got into the power unit there, that is exactly what masiychuk says about the fact that he damaged the reactor shell, later about the fact that something blew up in zhytomyr and we had to literally leave. To save everyone from danger, and this is what he is promoting now, and what is the final conclusion from this, in fact , he does this regularly, not directly speaking, but also in his broadcasts, lets keep it small, lets also see, neither the country nor the economy will survive , not the world, no one, so you need to make a decision now. And now decide how to live on, think. Well, that is , yes, suddenly, it turns out that all this we, we cant stand it, and something needs to be decided. Well, its also, i think its kind of, you know, the push element that were seeing now by the individual company is the same individual company that has now intensified. Yes absolutely, and actually, if we are talking about the same mr. Mosiychuk, then this is not his first, and certainly not the last, such playing along with russian propaganda, because he, as soon as we have any critical situations, or simply difficult situations, or with shelling or Something Else, this line is clearly traced in him, when he even sometimes says information that should not be said, for example, when they beat the army. Infrastructure and it is absolutely logical, there is no official information about where they were hit, what was destroyed, and so on, because this is a war and this is military infrastructure, mr. Masichuk comes out and starts talking both about the number of victims, and about where they were hit, and so on, and despite there are some objections, refutations of the military, because very often what he says is generally exaggerated or made up, but he continues to say it anyway, and there was an interesting period when the russians sanitized strikes, massive strikes, and russian methods, they said every time that it was necessary to focus on the fact that all the Defense Forces were destroyed, that the entire infrastructure was destroyed, and so on and so forth, and thats exactly what he said. It is difficult for me to say why he does it, consciously or not, whether he is under russian influence, but unfortunately, this is his tendency, actually working in this vector, it raises, well, at least questions, and what he is doing now kharkiv, this is simply a logical continuation of all his, unfortunately, previous actions, and i am actually studying the case with kharkiv in the same way, and there, for example, one of the key vectors is that that the russians are distributing alleged videos on. In which kharkiv residents are leaving the city, that is, if you open and look at these videos, then this video is from the year 22, they simply wrote on them that there is now an evacuation and now kharkiv they are supposedly leaving the city, and they emphasize that everything needs to be evacuated, but instead the kharkiv residents themselves, i thank them very much for this, they record a video of the response, and say that you are saying that the whole of kharkiv has already left here, whether please see what is really happening, that

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