Use propaganda and the ability to reach out as terrorists are doing and try to incite, and match that up with the tremendous power that Social Media Tools allow to make that easy and simple and effective and broadly applicable. So, given that this is a strategy, and given that its aimed not just at the United States, particularly with respect to interference in our elections, but at Western Europe and eastern europe, for that matter, is there an effort underway to work with our allies through nato or otherwise . Ive been to the Cybersecurity Center in estonia, but there didnt seem to be a nato agreement that this is something we should be working on together to respond to. So is this an effort that is underway . Speaking from my lens on things, there is a lot of interest in doing that and doing it more effectively and more comprehensively, but we have not cracked the code on doing it effectively yet. And so we need to keep the pressure on ourselves and our nato allies, who are likeminded in this regard, to keep improving our approach. And its also got to be much broader than just cyber. Thank you. Director clapper, my time is almost up. But before you go, since this is the last opportunity we will have to hear from you, can i just ask you, do you think the dni needs reform . There is always room for improvement. I would never say that this is the ultimate. I do think it would be useful, though, if we are going to reform or change the dni or change cia that some attention
be given to, in our case, the legislative underpinnings that established the dni in the first place, and then have added additional functions and responsibilities over the years, that congress has added, two hour kit bag of duties. To say that theres not room for improvement, i would never suggest that. I appreciate that, and i certainly agree with you, i think that if there is going to be this major reform, hopefully both legislators and others who have been engaged in the Intelligence Community will be part of that effort. I certainly agree the congress, no pun intended, gets a vote here, i think. Thank you. I know that our time has expired, and i apologize to our new members that we wont have time because you have to go. But director clapper, since this may be, hopefully, your last appearance, do you have any reflections that youd like to provide us with, particularly the role of congress or the lack of role of congress in your years of experience . I have to be careful here. I dont think you have to be. I was around in the Intelligence Community when the Oversight Committees were first established, and have watched them and have experienced them ever since. Congress does have, clearly, an extremely Important Role to play when it comes to oversight of intelligence activities. And unlike many other endeavors of the government, much of what we do, virtually all of what we do, is done in secrecy. So the congress has a very
important and crucial responsibility on behalf of the American People for overseeing what we do, particularly in terms of legality and protection of Civil Liberties and privacy. At risk of delving into a sensitive area, though, i do think there is a difference between oversight and micromanagement. Well, we thank you. We think the witnesses, and this has been a very helpful and director clapper, we will be calling you again. Really . [laughter] this meeting is adjourned. And with that, capitol hill they are getting ready to get up from the table there, that is the director of the National Intelligence, and James Clapper has been sitting in that seat for the better part of two and a half, almost three hours,
answering Questions Bread we have been watching the intel Chief Standing behind claiming that russia did indeed metal with our elections. So what exactly is the hard evidence . That was the central issue at this hearing on capitol hill, and we watched them leave now. This is outnumbered, im harris hock wagner. Kennedy, National SecurityCouncil Staff member, right on time, under president s bush and obama, gillian turner, and todays oneluckyguy, cohost of Americas Newsroom , bill hemmer. Glad to have you. Bill happy new year, happy to be with you. Harris 2017, all right, lets get to the news. The director of National Intelligence and the head of the National Security agency testified about russias meddling in the president ial election. All of this as President Elect donald trump, who will be sworn in 15 days from now, continues to express doubts about russias interference. And amid a report which the Trump Transition Team denies, the President Elect is looking to revamp the intel community
once he takes office. A short while ago, Armed Services chair senator john mccain asked chief James Clapper if he stood by the previous assessment that senior russian officials were behind the hacking. Based on the scope and sensitivity of these efforts not only that only russias seniormost officials could have authorized in these activities, general klapper, clapper, is that something you stand behind . Actually we stand more resolutely on the strength of that statement and we made on the seventh of october. Harris Chief Intel Correspondent joins us now live from capitol hill, good to see you, catherine. Thank you, harris. Witnesses testified this morning that the u. S. Intelligence community is more confident today than it was back in october that the interference was directed by senior russian
authorities. And they also testified that it was part of a Multifaceted Campaign that included the theft of emails, as well as disinformation and the use of state news. They also emphasized that they never found any evidence that any of the vote tallies were changed, but other issues were harder to measure. They did not change any vote tallies or anything of that sort, and we have no way of gauging the impact that certainly the Intelligence Community cant gauge, the impact that it had on the choice of the electorate made. There is no way for us to gauge that. Witnesses consistently testified to the senate Armed Services committee that the campaign was directed by senior russian authorities. There was only a single mention of Vladimir Putin by name, and that came within the last hour, and it was given by dni James Clapper, who said something of
this political sensitivity, the interference and meddling in the american election, could only have happened with his blessing. In time, three Transition Sources have confirmed to fox news that the trump team is considering a restructuring of the u. S. Intelligence community, a kind of streamlining, in an effort to deal with what is described as the bloat in leadership and a politicization of the intelligence itself, as described to us as something that is very preliminary. Though this morning the Incoming White House press secretary said the report that was carried in the Wall Street Journal was false. In effect, though, this did come up at the hearing a short time ago. Yesterday the Wall Street Journal indicated that the President Elect is considering changes to the Intelligence Community. Have you at all as the experts in this field and engaged in any of these discussions . No, we have not. Based on our reporting, we
understand that the Intelligence Report that exceeds about 50 pages, the classified version, has been dropped off at the white house, and that if the president wishes to be brief, that will be happening today. Then the President Elect will get his brief tomorrow, friday. A key question to really be following though in the next few days is that if this Intelligence Report was just finished this week, on what basis did the Obama White House make the decision to impose sanctions on russia and then to expel 35 diplomats . All right, thank you very much, catherine, for setting us straight on many of the fact that we will talk about right now. So bill hemmer, i want to start with you. Just basically with this hearing, i think we were all perched thinking that we would learn lots of new details. It might be contentious. This was friendly. Bill i thought the biggest headline was from john mccain when he said, we have no strategy. Heres a guy who just came from eastern europe, and they feel a threat on behalf of moscow all the time. What senator mccain said was,
our nation has no strategy to deter Cyber Attacks bid we have no strategy. Talk about radio free europe, and Lindsey Graham almost made fun of it, suggesting it was outdated. Harris he did make fun of it. Lindsay was in a mood. Bill answer this, russia and china present the greatest Cyber Security threat to the u. S. , but iran is trying to increase and spend more on its capabilities. One was that written . April, 2016. That was nine months ago. What are we doing as a government if they have already recognized that this is an issue, what are we doing to catch up . I thought that last part was very well taken. Are we going after capacity or intent . Probably should go after both, because if they are doing a toss, we should return favor. Harris you know whats interesting, senator Lindsey Graham was in a mood. And he was, and he brought up the point of hitting russia back with what he called the rock. He said that he feels like President Obama has just thrown a pebble. But that is not to stay the same as to label what is going on as espionage. He went back and forth with clapper about that. I understand, and i understand that Senators Graham and mccain are hardliners when it comes to these issues, and i said it before and i will state again, my worry is that if we keep focusing on russia, we are not going to focus on what is most important, which is our vulnerabilities and our Cyber Security, because if we are only looking in one place that means we are not looking everywhere else. Harris or anywhere else. Kennedy i thank this is a very valid time to have the conversations about our National Security apparatuses and while Hillary Clinton bragged about 17 Security Agencies and Intelligence Agencies agreeing that russia was interfering with the u. S. Electoral system, my question is, why do we have 17 Intelligence Agencies . Harris okay, so i understand what youre saying about not necessarily just focusing on russia, but its interesting that there are reports i may be some in the transition team, particularly the top National Security picks that are getting ready to be deposed on capitol hill next week, for lack of a better word, Defense Secretary nominee, general james mattis, said
russia could be the most dangerous rival that we have. So is it true or not . Mitt romney said so. Gillian i was just going to bring that up. Remember when mitt romney said that in 2012 and he got laughed out of the room. Well, he was right. A couple of things on the cyber front. One is the United States is much better on offense than on defense when it comes to cyber. Weve got some of the best folks who are able to penetrate systems around the globe, but for whatever reason, the government has been lagging behind for many, many years now. And in spite of all these efforts, in spite of millions, maybe billions of dollars spread across all these different Intelligence Agencies over the last decade, we havent made a lot of progress. There was a cyber czar appointed that was supposed to help manage all of that, dear member at the beginning of the administration . Sometimes its not adding another layer of bureaucracy that cures the problem, and we do it with all of these problems. Weve seen it with the va. Harris how do we square this with the idea of what thePresident Elect has said about russia . He has a healthy skepticism, we learn today that the fbi i would welcome some more skepticism from the President Elect on russia. Because James Clapper, heres what he said. I think there is an important distention here between healthy skepticism, which policymakers should have, but i think there is a difference between skepticism and disparagement. Which i think was a really key thing. Bill i think two major points on this, watch to see what the President Elect says tomorrow. Watch his words after he gets his own briefing at trump tower. The second thing, am i the only one that thinks this hearing today may not be the best idea . Where the foremost democratic government and the entire world. We have a new administration coming in in 15 days. And you allow in open public hearing to be the center of a partisan debate. Perhaps not in the witnesses, but may be in the questions that were asked. Is this the time to be doing that . Cant you take some of this, if not a lot of it, behind closed
doors and achieve the same end . And why are we speaking in absolutes . Why is the director of National Intelligence saying things like it can only be members at the highest level of the russian government. Why . Bill he said it did not change vote tallies. He said there is no way to gauge the choice that voters made. Okay. As an american but it has to be at the highest level bill let me just make the point. Show me some evidence. I havent seen it. It hasnt been made public. At what point will we harris the very public nature that we are always talking about is coming back to the very first thought that i was expressing, it was decidedly friendly. You really cant tear into each other right now, we are talking about the same thing that we agree on being safe. Well move on. Republicans win the first battle in their effort to repeal obamacare. What their Replacement Plan may look like, and whether the Repeal Effort could backfire. And just two weeks from tomorrow, President Elect donald trump will be inaugurate
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first battle over obamacare. It came in the form of a vote to fasttrack procedures allowing lawmakers to kill the 2010 health care law. Without having to face a democratic filibuster in the senate. Heres reaction from Senate Minority leader chuck schumer. The republican plan to cut health care wouldnt make America Great again, it would make america sick again. You cant keep the good parts of the aca and remove the rest of the law and still have it work. Sandra President Elect donald trump tweeting that its time for republicans and democrats to get together and come up with a Health Care Plan that really works, much less expensive, and far better. Meantime, President Obama reportedly told federal fellow dem